Do people prefer fewer cavities or is it just about cost?

[Aloxite]

I'm curious why some people buy molds in the group buys that are only two or three cavities when it is only a little more money to get four or five cavities.

So for the people who prefer smaller molds, why is that your choice?

Do you feel the molds with fewer cavities cast better boolits?

Are they easier to use?

Is cost the reason?

Anything else to consider?

Thanks,
Aloxite

[Hickory]

Arthritis has taken it's toll on me,
I have a hard time casting a long session with a heavy mould.

[Reload3006]

the larger molds are
1) heavier
2) take longer to get to operating temp
3) if you have a habit (like I do) of dropping the sprue in the pot the larger sprue has the tendency to cool off your mix

I have both and I Like both and I do admit that the big molds are faster. But they have their draw backs too.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I personally don't need a bazillon boolits. I like 2 cav moulds cuz they are usually easy to get both holes producing perfect boolits. I don't like imperfect boolits.

I bought a 2 cav Lee 429-310GC and a 1 cav Lee.308-170 at my gun club meeting wed nite. $5 ea. !

last hight I cleaned them up and tried casting with them. the only good boolits I got were out of the front cav of the big .44 mould all the rest were culls. finally got one out of the 1cav mould. I know this is a mattter of just rebreaking in the moulds

I have similar experiences with many 2 cav moulds and as a result I would only be more frustrated trying to get a 4 or 6 hole mould to perform across all of its holes.

I realize that with High volumn pistol shooting a few wrinkles here and there mean nothing. But when I look at commercial cast boolits I find no culls. All of these boolits are cast in 1 or 2cavity moulds.

My whole thrust is to make the best ammo I can. and shooting boolits with wrinkles or voids is not gonna happen. I don't want someone looking at my ammo and seeing this type of thing, especially when you are showing them how nice your ammo is.

I have several rifle moulds I have never gotten two perfect boolits out of on the same pour, and I have a 1 Cav Lee .308-190GC I have never gotten a bad boolit out of.

So is it more effective to use a 2 cav mould that only yeilds one good boolit per pour or a 1 cav mould that makes a good one everytime?

If you look at the BPCS shooters they all use 1 cav moulds.

There are exceptions to every rule and I'm sure others have moulds that make perfect boolits everytime, and I have several moulds that you really can't do anything wrong with, but in the end I can make plenty of boolits for my shooting requirements with a 1 or 2 cavity mould.

If I someday need to make a zillion boolits I will buy a Magma casting machine, that uses 1 or 2 cavity moulds. My Magma moulds are some of the easiest to use moulds I have.

So that's why I use one and two cav moulds.

Randy

[1Shirt]

To me, it is a matter of preference, and the demand that you have for the quantity that you need. For handgun, think that the 6 cav. lees do just fine. For rifle, I prefer one or two cav molds depending on a number of things including accuracy, ease of casting, weight of mold, fatigue, etc. And in some cases, it may be that if you want a mold that is no longer made, you may have to go to e-bay to get one. And if it is no longer made, and you want it in HP, it needs to go to Buckshot for the job.
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[Rangefinder]

Pistol boolits I like in 6 cav for quantity because the minor differences of the cavities don't affect anything noticeable at handgun ranges. With rifle boolits I lean toward 1-2 cav simply for the consistency of each boolit dropped.

[btroj]

In brass a 4 cav is about as heavy as I want. 2 is more manageable.
I think fewer is easier with rifle bullets to get good quality from. For pistol I prefer the quantity froma 4 to 6 cav. I do have a 4 cav NOE 311165 RD that is a sweet mould.

I can't say I spend too much time thinking aout it, sometimes I just go with whatever strikes me as right at the time.

[NoZombies]

For me, It definitely depends on the purpose of the bullet.

Example 1; I have a single shot muzzle-loading rifle that I fire maybe 100 shots a year. I have a single cavity mold for that rifle, and if I had a 2 cavity, I wouldn't shoot the gun any more than I do now, and a 6 cavity would be pointless.

Example 2; I have a very nicely tuned S&W model 15 that I shoot several thousand rounds through a year. If I only had a one or two cavity mold for the bullets I shoot, I would find it irritatingly slow, and would probably shoot the gun less often as a result.

For volume shooting, I prefer volume casting, when I'm not doing volume shooting, I don't need to do volume casting.

[plainsman456]

I have 1 6 cavity,3 4 cavity and a bunch of 2 cavity,bot I also have 1 1 cavity mold because it depends on what the boolits are for.

[stubshaft]

Pistol boolits I like in 6 cav for quantity because the minor differences of the cavities don't affect anything noticeable at handgun ranges. With rifle boolits I lean toward 1-2 cav simply for the consistency of each boolit dropped.

Ditto

[Jim]

Arthritis has taken it's toll on me,
I have a hard time casting a long session with a heavy mould.

I hear ya', brother, I hear ya'!!

[9.3X62AL]

I use all configurations and cavity counts. I do like the production rate a 4-6 cavity mould enables, but I have a larger scrap rate with the volume critters. That is purely a skill anomaly, and laziness might explain the difference. I'm not real interested in setting production records while pouring 700* metal, either--from a safety standpoint. Refinement of pouring sequence with the larger blocks would likely resolve the differences.

[fredj338]

I think the 4cav is just about the right size for easy handling. In alum, a joy to use, in steel, anything bigger than 4cav is a pain. You can get just about the same production form a 4cav as a 6cav, the extra fill time & time to setup from the extra heat seems to cancell out the 2 extra cavs.

[kbstenberg]

For me it is the price. I figure if I limit my rifle bullets to 2 or 3 cavities after I purchase 4 my fifth mold is very inexpensive. And I have 5 different molds rather than 4.

[Jammer Six]

I want BILLIONS AN BILLIONS OF BOOLITS!

SHINY, SHINY, BILLIONS and BILLIONS...


...oh, I'm sorry.

Did I say that out loud?

[Hickory]

I want BILLIONS AN BILLIONS OF BOOLITS!

SHINY, SHINY, BILLIONS and BILLIONS...


...oh, I'm sorry.

Did I say that out loud?

So, tell us Jammer Six, how you really feel about moulds with lots of cavities.

[Jammer Six]

So, tell us Jammer Six, how you really feel about moulds with lots of cavities.
Well, let's see...

There appears, within the bounds of certainty, to be an observable precipitation of the curve when it approaches the outer boundaries of the observed behavior when adjusted for a set of variables that don't coincide, or, more accurately, fail to coincide with any remarkable incidence that can't be ruled out using various, shall we say, specious arguments that, taken together, (and considering that which is, at best, left unconsidered to date) don't have anything to do with it.

That said, Pa were a Chevy man, and I are one.

[Hickory]

:bigsmyl2:
Kinda what I was thinkin'.

[Guesser]

My favorite molds are my old Ideal single cavity molds. I have one 4 cavity Lyman that I've never used. My DC molds are good but the SC are perfection every time.

[tuckerdog]

for handguns I dont mind multiple cavity molds but for rifle I prefer single cav it eliminates variables [imo] i'm not so much about quantity as I am about quality

[Bent Ramrod]

I like to experiment with different designs. If I were limited to the designs available in multiple cavities, I wouldn't be able to play around nearly as much. Also, I don't shoot large volumes; 100 rounds a week is about my average.

[MikeS]

I think that 4 cavity brass moulds are about as good as it gets! The Lee 6 cavity aluminum moulds are good too. I find that the difference in effort to use a 2 cavity mould, or a 4 cavity (or a Lee 6 cavity) are about the same (at least the way I cast boolits), and with a 4 or 6 cavity mould, when I'm done, I'm looking at a big pile of boolits! When you consider that I don't have the stamina to really go much past 2 hours (and for me that's a long session) regardless of what size mould I'm using, I need to cast as many as I can within that time. I have a SAECO 8 cavity mould, and it's almost too heavy to use, and when I do, in like 30 minutes I have more than enough of those boolits to last a good long time!

[Aloxite]

Thanks for all of the responses. My own tendency is to go big. My high school auto shop teacher gave me a motto that have kept my whole life: If a little is good, a lot is better, and too much is just right.

Edit - That needs to be in my sig line. Looks nice there.

[white eagle]

lately I have been getting single cav molds
I do like casting and do not shoot large quantities of boolits
plus it gets me out of the house more....if you catch my drift
quality yes , price uhh....

[Love Life]

Pistol- Multiple cavities to feed multiple revolvers.
Rifle-Single cavity for quality and consistancy

[ColColt]

I've taken a "shining" to brass molds and got one when the group buy was going on with Miha and the H&G 68 mold. I got one in brass, four cavity and can say up front, I'm good for about 250-350 boolits at best. The long handles and weight of the mold make that quantity about it for the day. All in all, I think I could have done better had a 3-cavity been offered. So, for me it wasn't the price and I felt since I have my fair share of 45's I needed probably a 6-cavity but, it would take Hercules to heft that one for 2-3 hours.

[Frank46]

Interesting topic. I started out with lyman single cavity molds. then two cavity. I have some lee six cavity also. But when we had the group buys for the 9.3 boolit and the 316299 I ordered two cavity. I think its easier to check boolits from a two cavity mold than a six cavity mold. Plus the smaller ones heat up faster and for me its easier to maintain a good casting cadence. Frank

[shotstring]

I have some strength and arthritis issues much like some of the older members of this site. But I have to say that for me it is the picking up and putting back as well as opening and closing the molds that really bother me more than the weight of the mold. 4 and 6 cavity molds feel and work close enough to me that it doesn't make much difference which I choose.

That being said, the extra 2 slugs each round is certainly a plus. Using a double cavity mold is like waving a wand of cotton candy around by comparison, but it takes sooooo long to get a sizable pile that way. The simple truth of the matter is though, I love them all no matter how many cavities.

[smoked turkey]

I wear leather gloves when casting. They provide protection against the hot part (don't touch the hot part!) and mainly in ease of breaking the sprue from the boolit. I like to use my thumb on the sprue plate to break it and it is so much easier with one or two cavities. This is especially true if casting with harder alloy. I just don't like the thought of banging my mold sprue plate with a wooden hammer handle, even though I have done it a lot. The hand method works better for me.

[montana_charlie]

It's a matter of quantity versus quality.

If many bullets are required, multiple cavities will produce them.

If quality bullets are necessary, the single cavity mould is guaranteed to produce the same bullet every time, and it will do that perfectly if you have the mould figured out.

CM

[blackthorn]

Quote: "Well, let's see...

There appears, within the bounds of certainty, to be an observable precipitation of the curve when it approaches the outer boundaries of the observed behavior when adjusted for a set of variables that don't coincide, or, more accurately, fail to coincide with any remarkable incidence that can't be ruled out using various, shall we say, specious arguments that, taken together, (and considering that which is, at best, left unconsidered to date) don't have anything to do with it."

So Jammer Six-----What elected position do you hold ---or run for???

[jameslovesjammie]

Pistol boolits I like in 6 cav for quantity because the minor differences of the cavities don't affect anything noticeable at handgun ranges. With rifle boolits I lean toward 1-2 cav simply for the consistency of each boolit dropped.

This sums up my thoughts exactly! Lots of cavitites for handgun and single for rifle. I, like GLL, have paid more money for a single cavity hollowpointed than the multi cavity option.

[mold maker]

A correctly prepared and used 6 cav mold produces the same quality boolit as a single cav mold. Unless weight is a handicaping factor, using a multi cav mold is only common sense. You don't shoot single round pistols.
Cutting 6 sprues isn't a problem and the fill time per cav is less. dropping the boolits is the same if the mold is properly prepared. I vote for half to six times again as much production anyday. If ya do your part they all work the same.
I spent over 39 years making single cav molds that produced identical mirror frames, year after year. These molds weighed up to 600 #. Our boolit molds are childs play.

[montana_charlie]

A correctly prepared and used 6 cav mold produces the same quality boolit as a single cav mold. Unless weight is a handicaping factor, using a multi cav mold is only common sense.
Sounds like a man who knows what he is talking about, and knows what he likes.
Then, he provides justification for his argument.

You don't shoot single round pistols.
What amazes me when threads like this get going, is how regularly people answer from the point of view of a 'pistol shooter' who is unaware that rifles ... and even singleshot pistols ... using cast bullets DO exist.

This thead is full of 'pistol people' who readily admit that absolute perfection in a bullet is not an absolute requirement in short barreled firearms being rapidly fired. Therefore they prefer moulds that produce 'volume'. But, give it time to cook, and the oblivious handgunner will finally make his appearance ...

CM

[Dale53]

I have moulds from single cavity custom precision for 200 Yard Schuetzen rifles (1/2 minute rifle) to six cavity iron moulds.

If the mould is custom quality, a multi-cavity mould will do anything that a single cavity will. I have proven that by actual results shooting a black powder cartridge rifle at five hundred yards (the max range I have available to me).

I had both NEI and LBT make me custom four cavity aluminum moulds for my BPCR and that allowed me to shoot enough to prove what I say.

My handguns all shoot at high levels of accuracy, also. They get four to six cavity moulds, also.

My personal strength limitation is six cavity for aluminum, and four cavity for brass and steel. I have one six cavity H&G iron mould that casts extremely well. However, it is just too dern heavy for me. If I made a special set up to use it (like the old commercial casters who used these, it would be easier). Because it works so well and is a bullet I use often, I will keep it. However, I will NOT be buying any more six cavity iron or brass moulds simply due to weight.

Most people who talk about a single cavity being more of a precision product came about when it was true - the manufacturers couldn't hold the tolerances. Now that we have CNC machines (and world class operators) that will repeat with extreme tolerances, that is no longer true.

I ran a test with one of the early Mihec six cavity moulds (#68 H&G clone). After getting it up to speed, I set aside six bullets (one from each cavity). Using a precision micrometer, the diameter was within .0001" (one ten-thousandth) and the weight spread was .2 (two tenths of a grain). NO pistol in the world can tell the difference in those bullets.

You do have to be a good caster (but that applies to any mould, single or multi-cavity). I have heard it said that it takes the average person who has mechanical skills about two years to learn to cast excellent bullets. That is probably true.

Heading for the storm shelter - I hear a storm coming ...:mrgreen:

Dale53

[montana_charlie]

I have heard it said that it takes the average person who has mechanical skills about two years to learn to cast excellent bullets. That is probably true.
I don't know about the length of time required, Dale, but a person can never cast excellent bullets if he doesn't know what they look like.

A pistol shooter posted this picture, and I am sure they suit his purposes very well. But, if I had a couple of his, to photograph beside a couple of mine, it would be obvious that there isn't a square corner (on a base or a grease groove) in the entire picture.

As long as he continues to believe this is the best that a mould can do, it is the best he will ever try for.

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Creekerpics/Loading%20Room%20101/Bullets/Picture551.jpg

CM

[Dale53]

I started casting bullets over sixty years ago. I, early on, learned to let the targets tell me what worked.

If you have a precision rifle, then, indeed, you better have precision bullets if you want precision results.

Don't overlook the fact that you have to be able to shoot with precision to tell the difference.

Somtimes, I can do that:mrgreen:

Dale53

[captaint]

I have molds in all manner of cavity numbers. To me, it matters how many boolits of THAT type I plan to shoot. I recently bought on a group buy a 3 cav mold for the H&G 34. I bought it cause I don't have a round nose mold for my 1911.s. I have a bunch of SWC's and HP's that I shoot lots of. The round nose won't see that much use, so I settled for a 3 cav. That'll be just the deal. That's my story. For pistols, at least, the quality of boolits is certainly darn good, regardless of number of cavities. enjoy Mike

[Jammer Six]

Quote:So Jammer Six-----What elected position do you hold ---or run for???

Didn't I make that perfectly clear?

We can go over it again, I suppose...

[canyon-ghost]

Pistol- Multiple cavities to feed multiple revolvers.
Rifle-Single cavity for quality and consistancy


Love Life has one reason, here's another:

I cast with 2 cavity and 1 cavity molds because I use a small ladle casting pot.
If I used a bottom pour instead of dipper, I would need 4 and 6 cavity molds.

[barefooter175]

I have over 100 moulds and half are four or more cavities. With the exception of one five cavity .44-40 mould that I cast for a Henry repro, all the other gang moulds are for pistol bullets or roundballs. These are for guns that I shoot a lot. For example, I shoot 1600-2000 .45ACP bullets a month. I need production here. For guns like my .45-70, I use one cavity moulds; I don't need that many in a year.

My heaviest moulds are the brass four and five cavity moulds; they are heavy. Steel isn't too bad, and the six cavity aluminum moulds are not much heavier than a steel two cavity mould. This is also a factor when deciding how many cavities I want in a mould.

We all have our reasons for what we have. It kinda makes sense after awhile. You'll see.

James

[shotstring]

I know some of you cast bullets to see what kind of accuracy can be achieved. But I and many others cast because it is not only fun but more affordable and a challenge. But if I really wish to push the accuracy threshhold in a rifle, I use jacketed. In a pistol, I can achieve accuracy from a 6 cavity H & G mold that will serve me as well or better than jacketed in my competition guns. That has been verified by hundreds of pistol shooters. In fact, I used a pair of H & G 6 cavity #51s to supply a reload shop that customers say equalled jacketed cartridge accuracy. So much so, that we couldn't keep them on the shelves.

But that is what people paid the extra money for - molds that would deliver consistency in all 6 cavities (or even more). Current custom molds seem to do it as well, for the most part.
When I set up a casting station with 2 x 4's across a 5 gallon bucket of water to rest the 6 cavity molds on, the molds spent almost all their time on the wood and very little time straining my wrists or arms. It's all about technique - let the support do the work, not your arms.

If I want to wear myself out casting a large pile of bullets, I will use a 2 cavity mold, not a 6.

[nanuk]

..... But if I really wish to push the accuracy threshhold in a rifle, I use jacketed.


ah... but to me, the CHALLENGE is in pushing the accuracy threshold with CAST to Challenge MYSELF.

not only do I have to have my rifle in order and well tuned, and my weather cooperating, and my loading technique down pat, But I also need to have a good breakfast, NO coffee for the last 12 hours, the moon at 3rd quarter and my underwear freshly pressed with NO starch.

Only THEN can I make it to the truck to get to the range!

[Bret4207]

Thanks for all of the responses. My own tendency is to go big. My high school auto shop teacher gave me a motto that have kept my whole life: If a little is good, a lot is better, and too much is just right.

Edit - That needs to be in my sig line. Looks nice there.

Apparently your shop teacher never had hemorrhoids, children, bills or broken stuff!

[Bret4207]

A correctly prepared and used 6 cav mold produces the same quality boolit as a single cav mold. Unless weight is a handicaping factor, using a multi cav mold is only common sense. You don't shoot single round pistols. Cutting 6 sprues isn't a problem and the fill time per cav is less. dropping the boolits is the same if the mold is properly prepared. I vote for half to six times again as much production anyday. If ya do your part they all work the same.
I spent over 39 years making single cav molds that produced identical mirror frames, year after year. These molds weighed up to 600 #. Our boolit molds are childs play.

Ah, but some of us do. 1 or 2 rounds is all it takes to put down a varmint or livestock. I don't play games where I shoot up a gazillion rounds while running around pretending to be Bruce Willis or John Wayne. Generalities always have their flaws.

[Bret4207]

I find, for the most part, that those who get all rabid about quantity are noobies and young people. I have moulds up to 10 cav. My very best moulds are singles. I suppose it's all in your perspective.

[btroj]

Bret has it right, it is all aout your perspective.

I prefer 2 Cav for most rifle moulds. For anything going thru a lever action or handgun I prefer 4 to 6 cav to produce the number of bullets I will be using.

If I was going for ultimate accuracy I would use a 1 cav mould. I don't shoot like this offer so I own very few single cav moulds.

This is one of those questions with no right or wrong answer. I buy what I think seems right at the time or what I can get in the bullet design I want.

Great perspective- I shoot very few hollowpoints as they are time consuming to cast. My iL loves hollowpoint moulds and shoots many such rifle bullets. I am currently working, he is retired. He has far more free time so this makes sense for him but not me. Neither is right or wrong, we just have different needs and time constraints.

Buy what you want, it only has to please you. I don't tend to make purchases because they are what someone else says I need. I make those choices for myself.

[rintinglen]

I think the 4cav is just about the right size for easy handling. In alum, a joy to use, in steel, anything bigger than 4cav is a pain. You can get just about the same production form a 4cav as a 6cav, the extra fill time & time to setup from the extra heat seems to cancell out the 2 extra cavs.

Parallels my experience exactly. I like brass 2 cavity molds, steel 4 cavity molds, and 4 cavity aluminum. I think that 6 cavity aluminum molds might be okay, but the only ones I've ever worked with are Lee, and the reject rate with those for me is too high.

[williamwaco]

Age plays a role. I am 70.

For iron molds, the four cavity is useable but tires me out pretty quick.
I wouldn't think of using anything heavier than four cavities in iron.

In aluminum, the six cavities are practically weightless. If I could get it ( and afford it ) I would go to eight or ten cavities in aluminum.

Two cavities is just too slow for handguns unless you use two of them in alternation. Two cavities works well for rifle bullets because you don't need nearly as many of them.

Single cavity molds are an abonimation. Their only practical use is for hollow points. Even for rifle bullets it takes hours and hours of casting to make even a modrate sized pile of bullets.


.

[GLL]

I own a number of molds and most are 4-cavity. I do prefer casting with single cavity molds though (not because they always produce higher quality bullets but because it is therapeutic) ! I like the slower pace of ladle casting ! I especially enjoy making hollow points in 1-cavity molds and purchase new HP versions of older styles from BRP, NOE, and Accurate Molds. I mass-produce some designs in four and 6-cavity molds for friends but knocking out couple thousand at a time is not fun for me ! Mihec’s 4-cavity Cramer-style molds do make a pile of very nice HP bullets in short order though ! :)

Jerry

454612 "abomination" :)
http://www.fototime.com/4AEED3F97CF2DA8/standard.jpg

[atr]

my attitude is quality over quanity...
my 1 and 2 hole molds work great for me

[shotstring]

While discussing this thread, a question comes to mind. Has anyone here set something up so that when using, say, a 4 cavity mold - that each cavity is released into a different recepticle when the mold is broken open. That way it is like using 4 single cavity molds. Each cavity drops bullets into its very own pile. Seems that would be the best of both worlds.

[Jammer Six]

Apparently your shop teacher never had hemorrhoids, children, bills or broken stuff!
What in the world is good about child...

...er, hemorrhoids?

[DLCTEX]

I hope to soon be testing one of Ranch Dog's 6 cav. moulds for 45-70. I will know then about variations in multi cavity moulds for rifle boolits. I'll bet they are very consistent. My preheated 6 cav. pistol boolits are indiscernible from cavity to cavity. Before preheating there was considerable variation.

[williamwaco]

While discussing this thread, a question comes to mind. Has anyone here set something up so that when using, say, a 4 cavity mold - that each cavity is released into a different recepticle when the mold is broken open. That way it is like using 4 single cavity molds. Each cavity drops bullets into its very own pile. Seems that would be the best of both worlds.



Yes, I have done that with a .375 cal Lyman and with a .30 cal Lee.

I know I am going to get hammered for this opinion but there is not one whit of difference in accuracy.

I have tested groups from cavity 1
I have tested groups from cavity 2
I have tested groups deliberately alternating between cavity one and cavity two. I can see no difference at all.


That said, If I were competing for accuracy at 300+ yards, I too would be using the best single cavity mold I could find.


AND: Jerry is correct.

Casting slowly with a single cavity mold can be relaxing and therapeutic. Unfortunately, I cast 95% handgun bullets and If I can't produce 1000 in a setting, I run out of ammo too quick.








.

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

In high quality moulds, I have found very little difference in the roundness and weight variation between the cavities. I did NOT determine this by looking at them, but careful weighing and measuring, and ultimately by firing them in accurate rifles. I have punch-marked a cavity or more from one of my NOE 4/5 cavity moulds and found no appreciable difference in groups sizes from segregated (by cavity) boolets.

I shot Hunter Bench Rest for several years with a tight-necked FL 308W, and Varmint/Sporter Class with a SS 6PPC. I learned quite a bit about what is beneficial and what is a fairly boring way to pass time with case prep and bullet segregation.

Rowell makes 1/2 and 1lb ladles, so much for that issue.

Rich