High velocity technique?

[lar45]

Hi all, I mostly shoot handguns. I shoot a few hundred rounds and clean before I put them away.
I'm starting on the Fat-30(192 gns with gas check) in a 30-06. I have water quenched wheel weights sized to .313".
How many rounds do you guys normally shoot inbetween cleaning at the range? 5 rounds run a dry patch, then shoot again? Or 3 rounds, scrub with hoppes no.9, dry patch and shoot again?
Does the barrel start to take a seasoning and then start shooting everything better? It seemed like everything started shooting better after an hour at the range.

I cleaned the barrel with Ed's Red, then some shooter choice copper solvent and Ed's after that.

I started with a new bag of win brass, and CCI primers. My col is 3.075" and the nose is just engraveing. I put a heavy crimp to hold the bullet in place. I'm shooting Win 760. I read on Dan's forum that it is resistant to the high pressure secondary spike.

Thoughts?

[Bass Ackward]

How many rounds do you guys normally shoot inbetween cleaning at the range?

Does the barrel start to take a seasoning and then start shooting everything better?

It seemed like everything started shooting better after an hour at the range.

I cleaned the barrel with Ed's Red, then some shooter choice copper solvent and Ed's after that.

I read on Dan's forum that it is resistant to the high pressure secondary spike.

Thoughts?

Lar,

There are many ways of doing things and I have some guns that need the exact opposite as another one. What you do for cleaning shoud follow a method that you are comfortable with and simply work your loads up that way. If your rifle prefers a good blackbore, leave it. If it does better dry patching, do it. Since I hunt with my rifles, and we have a problem with sweating in the cold, I develop my loads to shoot from a clean barrel in case of moisture. That's just me.

Every powder burns differently not only in every cartridge, but at different pressure levels as well. That's why you can't find a burn rate chart that doesn't have some powder outta place. Some powders will spike in differect cartridges that didn't in others. The secondary spike is only an issue if your initial pressure is high enough. I shoot fairly soft lead at high velocity for hunting so I seldom go over 40,000 psi unless it is an underbore cartridge. The 30-06 is not underbore until the 200 grains for which it was origionally designed.

[Buckshot]

.............Lar45, you really only have to clean your rifles for 2 reasons. One is if accuracy sours and the other is if you're not going to be using it again for awile. Accuracy is what you're after and if your rifle is shooting well why mess with it? I think Sundog mentioned he's shot his 03-A3 all season for some bunch of shots without cleaning.

Probably the 2 rifles I shoot the most are my 03A1 and the small ring Mauser 7.62x39. I cannot for the life of me recall the last time they were cleaned. Ditto most all my other ones too, but these 2 get the heaviest use and probably have several hundred rounds through them. Before putting them up I check the locking lug areas and run an oiled patch through the barrel. That's it.

If I had some load testing to do then I might clean one when I get home just to see if there was any leading. Other then that they get the above treatment and get put up.

Also I guess you could call better shooting after a few rounds have gone downrange, seasoning. Possibly the same thing is the barrel reaching a steady state, consistantly fouled, whatever. It's most easily seen in 22RF's when switching between brands of ammo. You could say the barrel is 'used to' one brand of ammo and when you switch your groups and their placement on the paper will most likely be different. Fire enough of the new stuff and it settles down. That is assuming your rifle is going to shoot it at all.

.................Buckshot

..............Buckshot

[swheeler]

Lar: if it is shootin' good leave it alone, if you must "clean" pull a bore snake thru it after every session or every 5000 rounds, whichever comes first!
Scooter

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
I don't clean my pistols every wk. as I go shooting 2-3 times a wk. in the summer. So they get cleaned every 300-500 rounds probibly. I clean them if they are going to just sit for a wk. or 2.
My rifles when shooting lead (Pb) will get cleaned every 1-200 rounds.

[lar45]

Is this casual cleaning for sedate loads in the 22-2400fps range? Or the same if I am trying to get past 2700fps?

Thanks. I think I'll load up a whole pile of what worked the best so far and see what happens after lots o rounds.

What do you guys consider good accuracy from a scoped bolt action shooting lead? 2-3" at 100yds?

With my condom loads, I like everything to be sub MOA.

[Buckshot]

What do you guys consider good accuracy from a scoped bolt action shooting lead? 2-3" at 100yds? With my condom loads, I like everything to be sub MOA.

...........Open to debate. Depends on the heritage of your cast loads :D. A good visual inspection, properly sized for the rifle, thrown charges into 'same lot' cases and any old primer should see you with 3" or less at 100 yards. This assumes you are in the realm of normal type cast boolit speeds.

More accuracy requires more refinement. Ditto velocity, when you get up over 2,000 - 2,100 fps. Most cast boolit benchrest matches aren't shot with slugs going 2400 fps, and there is a reason for it.

..............Buckshot

[Bass Ackward]

Is this casual cleaning for sedate loads in the 22-2400fps range? Or the same if I am trying to get past 2700fps?

Thanks. I think I'll load up a whole pile of what worked the best so far and see what happens after lots o rounds.

What do you guys consider good accuracy from a scoped bolt action shooting lead? 2-3" at 100yds?

With my condom loads, I like everything to be sub MOA.

Lar,

Same, same. The higher the velocity, the more things need to be the same. That goes for molding technique, loading, and shooting. If fouling is a problem with your particular situation, you will need to clean. If you are running "just enough" lube for that velocity, then a black bore is going to improve things. Just no clear cut answer.

Scoped bolt rifles will shoot the same with lead as they do with copper. Just harder to find the right conditions. If you shoot MOA with jacketed, you can shoot MOA with lead. More so in the summer time. My 06 load is 1/2" over 85 degrees and that is at 2600 fps. Below that temp and things open up quick. But success at 2000 - 2300 is much more temperature stable, although I do do better still in warm weather.

[StarMetal]

I have found that a few of my rifles foul (and that isn't leading, actually the bore looks quite good when they do) with casts. I can tell when the accuracy starts to deteriorate. One is my 260 Rem. About 20 shots or so and I have to clean it to maintain the accuracy. Like noted earlier I can't really see anything in the bore to cause it. I've tried different lubes and different about of lubes. I've just settled on that rifle fouls.

Joe

[buck1]

I find most of mine settle down with a "dirty" bore. about 10 shots or so. Then I can get in to it.
I only clean my CB guns when they become leaded, or I just cant take it anymore. I was raised cleaning after every trip, and it hard to put it up with out cleaning it first.