Ruger .45 Colt....ream it or lap it??

[oldfart1956]

Fellers I'm just ponderin' here. Loading for the new (to me) Ruger New Model Blackhawk and of course the cyl. throats are.....snug. Average is .451 which is fine for jacketed bullets but I'm casting my own from a Lee 452-252 and they're dropping at .453 average. I figger I'll get the Lee sizing die to bring em' down to .452 but they're still gonna be a little fat. I've read the option of getting the reamer from Brownells ($80) or getting a cylinder lap from McMasters-Carr and lapping the cyl. throats. (item # 4548A19) Being the frugal sort the cost of the lap is intriging at $8. Has anyone used the lap? I know about Cylindersmith and his excellent work. I also believe I saw he wasn't taking on anymore work at present. And I don't have a problem doing the work myself. I've checked a dozen gunsmiths around the Greencastle/Chambersburg Penna. area and none of them has ever even heard of opening up the cyl. throats for cast bullets. I haven't been able to locate anyone locally that has the reamer and there doesn't appear to be a "loaner program" here at Cast Bullets that I've been able to find. I am aware one of the Ruger forums has a loaner but I'm not a member at present. So, has anyone used the lap? Is there a tutorial available? If it matters the barrel measures .4515 and at present I am loading the oversized boolits and they shoot quite well with no leading using moderate charges of Trailboss. Perhaps I should leave well enough alone...eh? My concern is pressure spikes when I elevate the powder charge for hunting loads. Hmmm...I suppose the other option would be to size the boolits down to .451 and eliminate the opening up of the throats. Well fellers, enlighten me. Many thanks in advance. Audie...the Oldfart.

[Iron Mike Golf]

1. I wouldn't worry about pressure spikes shooting cast at hunting velocities in your gun. .001 over throat diameter is fine and recommended by many.

2. I looked at those hones on McMaster-Carr. They have no pilots. You have a risk of honing them off-axis (throat centerline no longer latches bore centerline). That will result in bullets entering the forcing cone skewed. Not good.

3. I'd load up some hunting loads and give it a whirl as-is. You have a good chance of not needing to do anything, other than tweaking your alloy.

[Cadillo]

I just bought the tool from Brownells. My Bisley with LC and ACP cylinders had some throats as small as .448. Reaming was easy, fast, and resulted in much better performance with cast bullets(all that I shoot), and MUCH less leading of barrel.

[Casting Timmy]

If it was me I'd keep my money and keep shooting it as is, I would keep sizing at .452 too. If accuracy is good and it's not leading I wouldn't mess with it as there would be nothing to gain.

[gzig5]

Lapping all the cylinders evenly to the same dimension is unlikely unless you've done it before. Buy the reamer, do the job correctly and if you want to recoup your investment, sell the reamer for probably 75%+ of what you paid for it.

[stubshaft]

Send it to Cylindersmith let him do it and save on buying your own reamer and trying to sell it later.

[oldfart1956]

Thanks for the replies fellers. Arrggh...hadn't noticed the lap not having a pilot. Sure wouldn't want to oval out the front of the cylinders! The back of the cylinders already looks like beavers chewed out 3 of the chambers. (from the factory) Well, I'm not in any rush so I'll just load up some more and bump up the loads a bit and see how it shoots. So far, as mentioned, no leading and no spitting of lead from the cyl./barrel gap so mebbe it'll turn out to be a non-issue. Again...thanks to all. Audie...the Oldfart.

[leftiye]

Turn a cone on your lathe that matches your leade - with a pilot. Coat it with abrasive compound and polish your leade with it. Get fancy, thread the pilot to screw to a cleaning rod. Polish your forcing cone with a piece of 600 grit wet or dry.

[gandydancer]

Send it to Cylindersmith let him do it and save on buying your own reamer and trying to sell it later.
where can I find cylindersmith?? NEVER MIND. I found him.

[MtGun44]

Search for an old post one reaming my BH cyls. I used the MSC reamer and got great
results. I later bought a lap to use in a drill press with the cyl in a v-block in a floating
machinist's vise on the table to self center, like I did with the reamer.

To clarify - I have not yet used the lap, but I believe that with simple fixturing (V block and
machinists vise) you can get the cyl square to the table. If the table is square to the
quill, you should be able to lap very nicely with the vice self centering under the lap,
the same way the reamer did.

Bill

[contender1]

I have over a dozen Ruger 45 Colts. It was well worth it to me to buy the reamer, pilots, etc. And as mentioned above, you can always sell the stuff after you use it. I'm a longtime member on rugerforum.com and you can visit as a guest, search the archives, and find a LOT of excellent info about this subject.
And, as for lapping, I do believe that 2 dogs, (a member here and there as well,) has written an EXCELLENT article on firelapping a barrel. Well worth the time to look it up, and read it. I printed a copy for myself.

[Char-Gar]

Send the cylinder to Cylindersmith and be done with it!

[pdawg_shooter]

Why would anyone willingly pay $500.00+ for a firearm knowing they were going to have to rebuild it to make it right?

[MtGun44]

"Rebuild it" ? My gun had tight throats on both cylinders, and they both shot pretty well with
factory jacketed ammo as it was. I spent $12 for a reamer to make it friendlier to cast, but
it shot cast reasonably well, too. It now shoots a bit more consistently.

The gun was fine for most folks as it was. I am just a pretty accurate handgun shooter, a
fiddler and a fussy person, and had fun making it a little bit better.

Bill

[geargnasher]

Why would anyone willingly pay $500.00+ for a firearm knowing they were going to have to rebuild it to make it right?

Because it costs three times that much to buy one that is truly ready-to-go out of the box with cast boolits! With a wire spring kit from Brownell's, $20 MSC chucking reamer, some masking tape, a section of cleaning rod, #8/32 tap, lead forcing cone lap made from a large .45 slug, a split dowel and some emery paper a person can make the average Ruger a fine shooter.

Gear

[btroj]

Sometimes we just have to make a gun fit pur very specific needs. Joe Gunowner shoots mostly factory jacketed and he doesn't worry aout leading. Leading? What is that?
We want a fun that meets pretty specific needs. We want throats that allow a good seal in the barrel, no leading, and good accuracy. Joe Gunowner doesn't have a clue about any of those. It goes bang when he pulls the trigger, that is all he cares.
Joe Gunowner and his friends buy way more guns than we do, that's the market the guns are made for. What are we to do? Exactly what Gear said, fix it so it meets our needs.
I think most hard core cast bullet shooters are also people who like to tinker. We are not afraid to make orifice tons to our guns to make them into what we want.

Someday we need to have someone post a series of photos showing how to use a chucking reamer to open the cylinder throats. Won't be me, I haven't a clue. I know my limitations.

[oldfart1956]

Surprised to see this post bumped! Anyways, to answer a few questions. I bought the gun for $300. used...it's a 1997 model. The newer Rugers seem to be coming thru with correct throats for cast boolits. (.452) I like tinkering with guns. I haven't actually seen any .45LC factory rounds yet that don't have lead boolits in them...I'm sure they're around...I just haven't seen any. I have 4 five-gallon buckets of wheel weights and I've been casting (muzzleloaders .36 to .75cal.) since....1973. I couldn't afford to shoot factory .45LC's if I wanted to, so this gun is gonna shoot boolits! The gun is actually shooting well, as previously posted. The main limitation is my failing eyesight but I think I can do just a smidgin' better if the throats were properly sized. Now, somebody talk to me about this $20 "chucking reamer." A tutorial would be wonderful. Audie...the frugal Oldfart!

[tek4260]

No offense to those who have used the chucking reamers and other assorted ways of opening the throats, but there is a reason the Brownells kit is $80, because it is worth it. It really is idiot proof and requires no special tools, lathe, floating v blocks, ect.

Too easy to ruin a $100+ cylinder trying to save a dollar. Cylindersmith is the absolute best value out there.

[MtGun44]

btroj said: "Someday we need to have someone post a series of photos showing how to use
a chucking reamer to open the cylinder throats. "

Someday happened a long time ago -- ;-)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=12464

The Search function seems to be underutilized.

And my memory was wrong. I paid $26 for the reamer, not $12. I think the lap was $12.

Bill

[canyon-ghost]

Well, Oldfart, Cylindersmith is going to charge you $30 and he does work fast! I'm serious here, my 41 mag was done by him. He's in the Northeast, I'm in Texas. It took a week and I had the cylinder back. I shot it two or three times and cleaned it up real good with brushes. Now, it shoots really good.

The reason everyone recommends him is-- He's good! http://www.cylindersmith.com/http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx228/3rdshooter/contenders/Blackhawk003.jpg

[btroj]

btroj said: "Someday we need to have someone post a series of photos showing how to use
a chucking reamer to open the cylinder throats. "

Someday happened a long time ago -- ;-)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=12464

The Search function seems to be underutilized.

And my memory was wrong. I paid $26 for the reamer, not $12. I think the lap was $12.

Bill

Thanks. I never even thought to use the search function. Doh!

I did my 45 Colt BH entirely by lapping with emery, a split rod, and a drill. Used a jacketed bullet to test for size. Sure made it a better shooter and stopped the lading. .449 throats and a .452 barrel just dont work well for cast!

[2Late45]

Why would anyone willingly pay $500.00+ for a firearm knowing they were going to have to rebuild it to make it right?

Funny how folks have been buying Gold Cups for decades and doing the very same thing...