Winchester 1892 Help

[Anaxes]

Hi,

This is a rifle I found at a small firearms dealer in Somerset (SW England). The owner was unfortunately in seriously bad health, and he was selling his entire collection via the shop. Modern Winchesters are fairly common here, but these are quite unusual.

It seems to have been produced in 1894, and at some point it has been converted to .44 Magnum. I am told this was fairly common when the cartridge first started to gain popularity? Apparently full-powered magnum loads wouldn't be a good idea, which seems logical given the age.

The issue with it is that despite the bore being in very good shape, it slugs at .431". We don't get a good range of pistol calibre bullets in England due to the pistol ban back in the early 90's. I'm not very good at casting just yet, so in the meantime, my only options in .431" are either 200gn Oregon Trail Laser LFP, or 240gn Oregon Trail Laser LSW. They come in 500rnds per box, and they are expensive.

Hoping to shoot light .44 Spl through it - I assume it would cycle Spl cases resonably? It'll have inert cartridges run through it before anything live is tried. I find AA No.5 does very well for .44 Spl, but we have access to most major American powders, so I could use another type, if that would be preferable?

Here are the visible stamps on the barrel. The manufacturing details are quite worn towards the front of the text. The images are thumbnails, so please click them to enlarge.

http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/th_046-2.jpg (http://s316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/?action=view&current=046-2.jpg)
http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/th_047-2.jpg (http://s316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/?action=view&current=047-2.jpg)

Here is a more complete photo of the rifle. That is a Parker Hale tang-sight it has fitted. PH did retail other manufacturers products, they also produced many fine sights themselves, although I've not seen one for a lever-action previous to this. Not sure where that sticker is from, but it wasn't the dealers I found it at. The writing on the sticker is illegible.

http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/th_042.jpg (http://s316.photobucket.com/albums/mm329/KoriumLG/?action=view&current=042.jpg)

The rifle will also need to be stripped down and cleaned. I have done Winchester Model 62 pump-actions in the past, so it shouldn't be completely bewildering. Would the videos on dissembling Rossi copies be close enough to use?

Thanks very much.

[runfiverun]

like said the same but the spring it's in the buttstock.
the writing on the left side of the bbl shows a 240 gr bullet and maybe a powder charge.
[23 grs of h-110 [hodgdons] ??? possibly... but a fairly stout charge]
the 44-40 was designed around a 200 gr boolit
anyways the lyman 429667 [a 240 gr rnfp]should be about the perfect mold for that rifle.

[smlekid]

I think it is 23gr NC (nitro cellulose powder) the gun has been to one of the english proof houses
would a Win 94 barrel screw into a '92 maybe it has a later barrel in it?

[Anaxes]

Who made the barrel ? I cannot read the maker in your photo.

Winchester. It was made at New Haven, Connecticut.


I think it is 23gr NC (nitro cellulose powder) the gun has been to one of the english proof houses
would a Win 94 barrel screw into a '92 maybe it has a later barrel in it?

The markings of "BNP" represent British Nitro Proof. The markings on the bottom right of the barrel may also be British, or at least some of them. Marking on the furthest right looks similar to one on my Winchester P14, which I was told is related to proofing.

I suppose it could be an earlier British proof stamp from when it was imported. Given the age of the rifle, it wouldn't surprise me if it has been re-proofed. Perhaps it was converted in this country and received the later markings then?

People owned Winchesters here by the late 1800s I'd say, so it may have been exported shortly after manufacture.

At some point, I will try taking more photos in detail. The camera isn't holding its "zoom"; if that makes sense, so when I take the photo, it reverts to non-magnification.

Thanks again.

[northmn]

If I remember correctly Winchester loaded some 44-40's pretty hot for the 92 to be at about 1700 fps with the 200 grain bullet. They quit because some did not use them in just 92's but even in pistols. The 44 mag brass would be fine for a handloader as long as one keeps loads reasonable. The 44-40 was a 200 grain bullet at about 1300. That r3eally is not all that bad a load.

DP

[405]

Anaxes,
Before loading up a bunch of 44-40s using 44 Mag brass, load a couple up with your bullet and try chambering in your rifle. I tried it and they wouldn't chamber in my 92. My bullet is .430" diameter. The 44 Mag wall is fairly thick (the modern 44 Spl may also be too thick??). 44-40 brass is very thin walled.

[wellfedirishman]

Anaxes, can you purchase Lee molds in the UK? If you purchase a Lee 2-cavity or 6-cavity 44 magnum mold (I favor the 240 grain tumble-lube model), it is very easy and inexpensive to cast your own bullets. By using beagle tape (aluminum high temperature ducting tape) you can get the mold to cast .432 diameter bullets easily which would work nicely in your rifle.

Also, since you can purchase US powder, I highly recommend Trailboss for cowboy (light target) loads. I shoot the bullet mentioned above with about 6 grains of Trailboss, for a velocity of 800 fps from a revolver or 1000 fps from an 1892 rifle. It is a very safe and low-pressure load, and plenty strong for hunting deer or knocking over steel targets.

I would recommend against loading full power 44 mag rounds for that old action, it would be a shame to damage it. Also, be gentle if you decide to take the 1892 action apart. I have stripped and rebuilt both my 1892s (Rossis) and it takes a bit of learning to do it right.

Here are some instructions that I found to be very helpful:
http://marauder.homestead.com/files/RossiDis.html

If the action on yours is stiff, a company called Gunslinger makes an excellent spring kit that really smooths out the action. It costs about $25 US. I installed them in both my 1892s and it makes a world of difference to the smoothness. You can get the kit from Brownells.

If 44 Mag brass is too long/tight to fit well in your gun, try 44 Special brass cases with the bullet loaded long to approximately 44 Mag overall length. That might help it cycle better, although you will have to experiment to find what OAL works best.

Good luck from a fellow British Isler, although I come from the less civilized part :)

[looseprojectile]

That gun here would fetch $1500.00 or more just as it is. Regardless of the refinish.
I have had lots of experience with 92 Winchesters as they were my first love back in the late fifties when they were real cheap, like ten or fifteen dollars.
That one seems to be in wonderful condition and I don't think that it would come apart with any factory level loads. Even the early 92s were very strong.
Any load in excess of 1400 or 1500 fps is overkill anyhow. Think of your shoulder.

My choice of bullets would be, and my favorite, the Ranch Dog .432 265 grain
RNFP. That bullet is perfect for the Winchester and Marlin rifles as they were custom made for Marlin leverguns. An old two cavity mould should be attainable.

If it were mine I would just take the butstock off and wash it out with solvent of some kind and blow it out with compressed air and relube it.
You will really love it.

Life is good

[John Boy]

Would the videos on dissembling Rossi copies be close enough to use? Yes, but have not seen a video. Here's a couple how to and also slicking it up if you care to read them ... http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=7504.0

[missionary5155]

Greetings
Have come across 3 1892 Winchester 44-40´s here in Arequipa. All need a boolit of .432+ to shoot well. A smaller sized boolit seems to leave the case and get the wobbles. I have tried .427 all the way up to .434 and the fatter boolits all shot far better if they will chamber. 8 grains Unique is my standard "for everything" load with a saeco #443 220 grainer.
Mike in Peru

[Anaxes]

I think I'll have a go at casting for it now rather than purchasing factory bullets. Didn't fancy it a while ago as I was having real problems casting Lee 12g slugs, and never managed to remedy the issues.

Thanks again for the responses.

[Wayne Smith]

Casting big slugs is different than casting 200-240gr boolits. Did you ladle cast or use a bottom pour pot? Big slugs need a ladle for reliable success.