Knees

[PatMarlin]

Geez... after 50 does everything just go down hill?

I'm sitting here in near tears trying to get my left knee in a position so the pain doesn't knock me out.

Weekend before last while cutting some pole trees down for firewood I was on my knees with the chain saw, on soft pine needles ground. Normally I religiously wear knee pads, but this time being in a hurry I was not. A few days later- a burning throbbing pain started in on my left knee, on the inner leg side, on the outside of it. I've been limping ever since.

It's better when I keep moving, but when I first sit down or go to bed it takes for ever to find a position where the pain will stop. It pretty much keeps on all night.

I've never put a real hardship on my knees. Never a full time job like construction, or carpet laying or roofing though I have done all of that kind of work, just not for a living. I have to start 2 woodstoves in the morning, one in the house and one in the shop and get on my knees to do that. Even on a pad, but now I think I've got to stop it.

Not used to living with pain. I guess that's what they mean when they say "it's hell getting old?" ...:roll:

[oneokie]

Getting old beats the alternative.

[wallenba]

I can relate to that Pat. It's been 11 days of pain for me so far too. A back spasm that won't go away. Vicadin and Flexoril help some. Try alternating hot and cold packs and keep the knee elevated if you can.:(

[GRUMPA]

I hate reading that, I just turned 51 and for the past year or so I can't walk more than a quarter mile before my hip joints get a searing pain and I have to stop and give them a rest. After that the walk takes a lot longer and I walk kinda like a duck.

[P.K.]

Geez... after 50 does everything just go down hill?

I'm sitting here in near tears trying to get my left knee in a position so the pain doesn't knock me out.

Weekend before last while cutting some pole trees down for firewood I was on my knees with the chain saw, on soft pine needles ground. Normally I religiously wear knee pads, but this time being in a hurry I was not. A few days later- a burning throbbing pain started in on my left knee, on the inner leg side, on the outside of it. I've been limping ever since.

It's better when I keep moving, but when I first sit down or go to bed it takes for ever to find a position where the pain will stop. It pretty much keeps on all night.

I've never put a real hardship on my knees. Never a full time job like construction, or carpet laying or roofing though I have done all of that kind of work, just not for a living. I have to start 2 woodstoves in the morning, one in the house and one in the shop and get on my knees to do that. Even on a pad, but now I think I've got to stop it.

Not used to living with pain. I guess that's what they mean when they say "it's hell getting old?" ...:roll:

Pat,
The length of time is an indicator of something else at work here and may warrent a trip to the canche mechanic. I know as we age those ACL and menicious(SP?) tendons are prone to injury. Same thing that causes tendonitus in the wrists, the sheath around the tendon wears etc.

[edler7]

It's the berries when you figure out what caused it, and think "Gee...last year that wouldn't have bothered me at all." Then you add another thing to your list of what NOT to do anymore.

Getting old ain't for sissies !

[EMC45]

I damaged my MCL left knee while in the Seabees doing construction/PT/marching etc . in 97 and now I have arthritis in both knees. Probably from favoring one while taxing out the other. They hurt a good bit from time to time. I am 35.

[Olevern]

You need to go see a doc about that knee pain, that's not normal, particularly at your young age.

[MtGun44]

Shattered my left femur at the knee at 19, never been fully right. I do not complain tho, I
have gotten reasonable use out of it, and can still hike pretty much all day with a pack at
60. It hurts about half of the time and at times it is hard to find a position to sleep in, but
it could be worse. It's not a great knee, but it is a knee.

The good news is now (until Obamacare eliminates it) you can get a new knee if you need it.
Docs have said I would eventually need it. I asked them how I would know when.

The answer is "You will know." You might be getting to the point where you need it one
of these days.

Start with two asperin, not only a pain killer, but cuts inflammation - which is often the underlying
cause of joint pain.

Good luck. I LITERALLY feel your pain in my left knee.

Bill

[gray wolf]

Men I am right in the middle of this PAIN thing, now they want me to go for an MRI for my back. I just had X rays and it showed Arthritis but they think it's more because the pain don't match the level of the Arthritis. Disc ??
So with that being said
I hope and pray that all the pain goes away from this board and all it's members. For me --
I just keep telling myself that some fine folks never had a chance to see 70 years old. Julie always say's ( you don't look old--just worn )
I ain't even going to mention Gout.
Once more I hope You/we/ me all get feeling better.
Someone needs to start a WOW I feel great thread. Maybe we can forget how ****TTy we feel.

[Freightman]

Get the knee fixed it will save you a lot of trouble in the future. I had one fixed 20 years ago had a ripped meniscus (cartridge) worked great and still does. Had one on the right knee I let go to long, wore the joint completely out had to have it (the knee) replaced about 10 years ago, but I am afraid that it is going to have to be replaced again soon. So do not wait to long.

[woody1]

Yes, Pat, Life's a Bit ch an' then ya die! Wait 'til you hit 70. Did you play football in HS? Real tough on growing knees and problems show up years later. I worked in the woods for years walking uphill and down. Got so downhill was a real killer on my knees. Getcherself stool or a little chair to sit on when starting the fire. I too heat with wood and currently have what must be a childs chair to park on in front of the stove. Puts us at the right level for starting and stoking without squatting or being on our knees. Had a 3 legged milking stool before until one of the legs (on the stool) went out.

My wife is well, mebe I best not say but last year at 58, she had a knee replacement and is happy as heck with her new knee. However, she's got spinal stenosis at 3 levels and now walks with a cane because of the pain and numbness in her good leg. Now we gotta get that fixed.

Yep, gettin' old can be a pain but still beats the alternative.

Regards, Woody

[redneckdan]

I hear ya Pat, been dealing with left knee pain going on 6 months now. Haven't got more than a few hours sleep a night since May. I get sick from opiates and ultram doesn't seem to work for me. Surgery helped a little but it didn't knock the pain down much. I'm 26.

[fishnbob]

Hey Pat, Go to a store that stocks knee wraps or braces and see it you can find one that has a circle of magnets that fit around the knee cap. The magnets are supposed to draw blood or increase the flow around the hurt area and it will help the body heal itself. I have two of them and have to break them out about twice a year. It has kept me from having a knee joint replacement that a Doctor recommended that I have about 6 yrs. ago. I am 67 and tore both knees up playing football around 100 yrs. ago.LOL!

[waksupi]

For aching joints, try rubbing WD40 into them. Seems to help for me.

[mold maker]

Pat, at 70 I look back at the pains and stiffness I had at 50, and wish I could be there again.
I don't mean to discourage you or others, but it's an up hill struggle from 50 on.
The Dr ask me "What do you expect, for a man of your age, and the torture you've put yourself through"?
He said I should, accept what is now my new normal.
They told me at 60 that surgery was a 30,30,30 chance for my back. 30% improvement, 30% stay the same, or 30% chance it would be worse.
I chose to do nothing, as long as one foot would pass the other. It looks as if the time for me to rethink that is getting closer.
I've lived a great life and don't plan to roll over now.
Just keep the faith, and don't give up, or in. As long as you know who is really in charge, he'll make a way through it.

[Geraldo]

If you can take Aleve, take it. My wife swears by the stuff.

If it keeps up you need to get it looked at. Everybody thinks of surgery, but last year when I tore my rotator cuff all I needed was physical therapy. My wife is doing the same now for a torn achilles tendon. Not everything has to be healed with steel.

[crabo]

Growing old is not for wimps!

[SSGOldfart]

well Pat best advise I can give is froozen peas,Ice for 30mintues and then heat for a few then it's back to the peas before bed time,they will form to your knee,try that for a couple hours before bedtime,I won't say much about my knees I ride a wheelchair now

[sundog]

Yeah, an Air Force doc wanted to cut on both of mine a few years before I retired from the Army (94). Some mornings they were swelled up like grapefruit, and hot. I said thanks but no thanks, sucked it up and drove on. I suffered through the last few years I was in, but never missed PT or failed a PT test, and always made it around in the field. These days, I take it easy on them and they just ache most of the time, especially when cold, but still tolerable. No more running. To many years of to much abuse to the body, and now the shoulders are giving me trouble. But ya know what? I wake up, I hurt, and I know I'm alive. Time to drive on, we're burnin' daylight!

[sundog]

For aching joints, try rubbing WD40 into them. Seems to help for me.

I assume you mean externally. The good stuff like the better Whiskeys, Ryes, etc, work best when rubbed on joints, too --- internally. Just ask. I know.

[firefly1957]

Pat two years ago I did something similar also to my left knee after two months I went to Doc he took xrays said it's arthritis and it will only get worse. A month later I took a bad fall off the porch twisted knee and after the pain left my knee was fine? I do not know what happened but suspect a calcium deposit was the true cause of the pain. Right now it is my left shoulder causing me problems for no apparent reason had a MRI Monday . I do not know what is going on but that MRI hurt like heck turned the sore area all red. The techs said sometimes shoulder MRI does that along with lower spine?? I did try a Vicodin for the pain No thanks The vivid nightmares left me more wore out than no sleep! Maybe it is the use of that substance that are making zombies so popular that is what was chasing me though out my restless sleep!

[Beau Cassidy]

PatMarlin a few things you describe really alarm me. First off is the pain is medially. Second it is burning. I do orthopedics for a living. Almost without a doubt, burning medial knee pain is going to be a medial meniscal tear. Probably the posterior horn. That would fit your mechanism of injury of prolonged flexion and probably a twisting motion with a flexed knee however slight it may be. I strongly suggest you get a good orthopedic provider look at it. My first course of treatment would be the required x-rays to look for arthritis (bilateral standing AP knee views, lateral, and merchant views). Those would be followed by an MRI. If you have a lack of knee extension then you probably have a bucket-handle variant of a meniscal tear.

If you live in an area that is strong on HMO's then they will probably want you to fail a course of physical therapy and/or steroid injection before authorizing an MRI (to me that fits the definition of socialized medicine which is another complete dissertation!). Make sure you mention to your doc the knee locks and/or is unstable. Those are two key words an insurance claim reviewer will look for before giving the authorization for an MRI.

I really hope everything works out for you. I can always see you first thing monday morning with a good 'ol Cast Boolits discount if you can make it to Hotlanta.

[shooterg]

What Beau said . I've had 3 knee ops starting at 19, last was at 43, 61 now and Aleve is my friend while chasing the newly walking 11 month old grandson ! Find the guy that works on the local athletic teams, amazing what they do now with arthroscopic.

[PatMarlin]

WD-40 ...:mrgreen:

I can extend my knee Beau. It doesn't burn as bad as it had been, but there's pain on one little section on the surface innerside, and sometimes it's totally gone, then it comes back. Seems like it's right after I sit down- takes some time but soon it goes away. Depends on the position. I can work on my feet all day in the shop, and catch a rest on a barstool programming. Still tossing all night, but I am getting sleep.

Well I see I'm not alone here. Thanks for sharing your pain, and I appreciate the suggestions. My problem is we don't have med insurance right now. I had to drop it 2 years ago when things got tight. Now I'm afraid to go in and get on record with a problem, only to have them nail me when I can afford to get back on insurance.

I got a couple of boys on their way over right now to help me drag and limb up the cull trees I cut down on the hillsides. I'm just gonna limb and buck em' up with the chainsaw and not lift anything. They can stack them on my CAT forks and I'll drive them down on a deck. Once there I cut and fill a bin each week and set the bin (pear bin) on the porch with the forks on my CAT. Easiest way to do firewood- no cutting and stacking, then bringing in wood from the wood shed. This way we just step outside and grab wood out of the bin.

We'll get her done.

[waksupi]

I'm serious on the WD 40.

[bobthenailer]

Knees! let me tell you my story , in july of 2010 my right was giving me problems with arthuritus , i couldent even kneel down and put weight on it , luckely i retired in augest 3 of 2010 in about 4 months it was ok . in june of 2011 pulled a ligment and got aruthritis in my left knee at the same time ,it was slowley getting better for a few months and then my left knee swelled up and was stiff to bend had it drained and was diagnosed with a torn amiscus ? had the sergury at the end of september and i can now just bend my knee all the way back when sitting . along with other problems that i hope will work out in time . so basicly ive been nursing bad knees since ive been retired and it does limit me doing things besides shooting, i could only cut grass with the rider mower and i could only drive my 1969 Z28 3 times this year because my left leg was needed to opetate the clutch pedal. and not use my boat at all

[bearcove]

At least I don't feel lonely anymore.

I been in the healing up stage for about a week now. Then back at it till I overdo it again.

[Char-Gar]

One you can accept the fact, that your body will not allow you to do the things you once did, old age isn't so bad. After a while, you loose the desire to do what you can't do and enjoy more what you can do.

I blew out my left knee in 1958 and after two surgeries and a total knee replacement, it still hurts like heck. The right knee how now gone south. I have been hobbling around on bad knees so long I have no clear memory of what it is like not to hobble.

So, is everything down hill after 50? Well physically yes, but at least I know what I like for breakfast and that cuts down on allot of decision making.

I have not had a waking pain free moment is 30 years, but life is good at any age! It is a head game and always has been.

[Gee_Wizz01]

Growing old is not for wimps!

That's the same thing my 91 year old Dad says!

G

[PatMarlin]

This is strange.

I've been up and down off my machine all day. Running a chainsaw up and down hillsides- my heavy one as the lighter one's not running right. Bucking up and limbing logs. and pitching them down hill so the kid can load them up, and I feel fine tonight.

I thought I was gonna be tore up, but just a mild flicker of pain in my knee. No way near as bad as yesterday and this morning. In fact this is the best I've felt for days... :confused:

Well it's still early yet. We'll see what happens tomorrow.

[P.K.]

Gee a rant to blow off steam.....I think we've all done that. ;-) Keep an eye on it and maybe a trip to see a Doc in "Hotlanta" in the future?

[a.squibload]

Yep, gotta keep moving (as much as possible).
I hurt worse after sitting around too long.
First part of the week we had a storm come through, right knee responded ( I guess),
now it's fine.

Had a shoulder problem at work some years ago, lifting heavy object.
Told Workers' Comp doc the exercises and steroids were not helping.
The programmed answer to that is "Well the exercises only help if you do them".
They don't want to lose a patient.
Went in to a real doctor who found arthritis with a MRI and an X-ray,
workers' comp docs don't like diagnostic tools like that, you might get healed up.

I got "frequency specific microcurrent" treatments from a holistic MD.
I was skeptical but that must be what fixed me up, after third treatment pain was gone.
No problems with shoulder for several years now.

Apple cider vinegar (not distilled, not "apple cider flavored") seems to help
with arthritis, as well as indigestion. Wifey is an aromatherapist, CMT, etc.

Whiskey only treats the symptoms, but side effects include a warm, pleasant feeling.:wink:

[Clinebo]

My neck has been bothering me for 6 months. Spent 2 days helping a friend built a roof over his patio area. I guess I looked up too much. I've been to 5 chiropractors and the clinic at the hospital. After X-Rays,pills and adjustments I hurt worse now than when I started out. My wallet is hundreds of dollars lighter,lost my job almost 2 yrs ago so no insurance anymore. Maybe I'll try the WD-40....or some Kroil!

[olafhardt]

I have a torn rotater cuff. Physical therapy did not do much for it, a little but not much. Then one day I fixed up a pot of boiled pig feet and my shoulder is much better. I don't think the effect was psycological because I was not even thinking about my shoulder. I have since been told by a doctor cousin that he thinks that some joint pills are ground cartilidge.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
I am over 60. Couple years ago I was walking up the back stairs to my little office and I noticed how badly my left knee was popping and the right half as much. I wondered about it. While I was seated at my desk I was evaluating it all and a thought came up. I am not trying to pick on anyone but at that morning I weighed 165 pounds... most in my life. Normal was 155-6. I thougt could 10#´s do this ? So I decided to find out.
With my body & knees as long as I maintain below 157 no popping and far less sore knees.
I do know this much. All the strain & weight does have alot to do on our bodies. I do not mean to be critical about anyone but all the extra some people are packing about is detremental to the bone structure / joints and accelerates the deterioration.
Mike in Peru

[winelover]

Good morning
I am over 60. Couple years ago I was walking up the back stairs to my little office and I noticed how badly my left knee was popping and the right half as much. I wondered about it. While I was seated at my desk I was evaluating it all and a thought came up. I am not trying to pick on anyone but at that morning I weighed 165 pounds... most in my life. Normal was 155-6. I thougt could 10#´s do this ? So I decided to find out.
With my body & knees as long as I maintain below 157 no popping and far less sore knees.
I do know this much. All the strain & weight does have alot to do on our bodies. I do not mean to be critical about anyone but all the extra some people are packing about is detremental to the bone structure / joints and accelerates the deterioration.
Mike in Peru


My Doctor told me that for every additional pound you weigh, it adds four pounds of pressure to your knee joints.

Also at sixty, I too suffer from advanced arthritis in my right knee and it's starting in my left. I don't consider myself over weight. I'm 6' 1" and weigh around 200 lbs. I am however bow leggeded and my mother had the same issues. I use to climb stairs to stay in shape, until a therapist told me that the pounding is the worst thing you can do. Now I ride a bicycle for excersise. Seems to help a bit. I have a perscription for Celebrex, but hardly ever take it because of the heart issues that it is linked to. I just grit it out. Winter cold, makes it the worse and the Summer heat makes it tolerable. It's just a matter of time before I'll need a total joint replacement or two.:groner:

Winelover:coffeecom

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I'll be 61 here shortly and I can't believe the things that bother me now. It's not always big things it's small things that make you wonder what is going on. It seems that my muscles in my hands are stronger than my tendons. I can have the strength to twist something off or lift but then it feels like the tendons are being pulled out and will hurt for a few days. Yesterday, I loaded up 326 (counted them) rounds of .357 on my LEE Turret Press and today that side of my back hurts. Now that is ridiculous. Some things I can do and some things get to me.
Maybe you can find a doctor that can help with the knee. Some times we can fix ourselves up without surgery or drugs.

[Pigslayer]

I can relate to that Pat. It's been 11 days of pain for me so far too. A back spasm that won't go away. Vicadin and Flexoril help some. Try alternating hot and cold packs and keep the knee elevated if you can.:(

Broke my neck in a car accident two years ago. Pain every day. Can't take vicodin or flexoril due to it not allowing me to sleep. I already have sleep apnea but have a machine for that. Aleve seems to keep the pain down to a dull roar.:groner:

[Char-Gar]

This is strange.

I've been up and down off my machine all day. Running a chainsaw up and down hillsides- my heavy one as the lighter one's not running right. Bucking up and limbing logs. and pitching them down hill so the kid can load them up, and I feel fine tonight.

I thought I was gonna be tore up, but just a mild flicker of pain in my knee. No way near as bad as yesterday and this morning. In fact this is the best I've felt for days... :confused:

Well it's still early yet. We'll see what happens tomorrow.


The only good thing about pain is you feel so good when it stops. Make you appreciate what you had taken for granted before. I am so glad you are feeling good. Take it easy for a while, at it will be easy to re injure the knee.

[waksupi]

Something I remember using for the knees back when I was still shoeing horses. Dolomite. It is a combination of calcium, magnesium, and zinc. Take as much as needed until the pain stops, was what I would do. I don't know how much an overdose would be. It sure helped when I was doing a dozen horses in a day. Most people think it is the back that gets a farrier. Usually it is the knees.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Very strange........ I just got off the phone with my brother. He is a farmer and has had a bad knee for quite a few years. He figured it was from sorting hogs for years. He finally went to a Dr. and they took a bunch of x-rays. They find out that he has a small foreign object in that knee. They will do surgery on it and it may well be fixed that way.

[PatMarlin]

Sorry to hear everyone's got pains to deal with. I guess it don't go away until we move on.

I'll be darned if my knee doesn't feel pretty good this morning. It would only hurt when I put pressure on it in bed, but if I'm on my back no problem. No more throbbing.

I've been thinking about my weight Winelover. I'm 232 @ 5'11''. This may be my main problem. Even though I'm on my feet all day machining now, I don't get the workout like I used to around here and have put on a pretty good spare tire.

[EMC45]

I too have been to the doc for the knees. That's how I found out about the arthritis. I am grateful I have a 2 decent knees to get around on. I just try not to squat or get up too quick if I am down on the floor. They pop like popcorn in the mornings and I have to let them "wake up" after I actually get out of bed. I think they do a lot better if I stay busy and get them moving through the day. If I sit all day at work they bother me.

[trooperdan]

Pat, I had a left knee replacement 11 Aug this year and I've just about figured out how to use the new one! I broke the old one on a military jump in '68 and it gradually got worse until my young wife got tired of me not being able to keep up with her and she insisted I get it rebushed. man, I wish I had a copy of my new x-ray's! I was shocked to see how much new I have in there! Only thing is, the new one "pops" during operation and I find that bothersome. When I complaigned to the doc he said, "Well, it doesn't hurt, does it?" And truely, it does not!

[trooperdan]

Sundog, I hope you have some VA disability on that service-connected knee! I am battling the VA now for going on two years about my knee that was broke on a military jump and was service-connected when I retired. Now that it has been replaced I'm trying to get the VA to up my percentage. I just found out that I am supposed to get a temporary 100 % for a year then a minimum 30% disability. BTW, the 100 % rate is about $3,000 tax free a month! Nice if I can get it!

[PatMarlin]

Here is some interesting news about knees...

Helping Knees Heal Themselves
http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?storyid=18643

I would like to see what ever happened with that.

[crabo]

Pat, I had a left knee replacement 11 Aug this year and I've just about figured out how to use the new one! When I complaigned to the doc he said, "Well, it doesn't hurt, does it?" And truely, it does not!

I've had both of mine replaced. One pops and the other one doesn't. My doc told me it was scar tissue, but to get rid of it, he would have to cut out the scar tissue and might have that turn into more scar tissue, so we would be back where we were.

[Freightman]

Pat, Only thing is, the new one "pops" during operation and I find that bothersome. !
Had my right knee replaced ten years ago, and it still pops, no way to sneek up on anything, but I can walk a lot farther than before.

[shdwlkr]

Pat
I am a few days older than you maybe years
I live with two deteriating knee caps, a broken ankle, broken back and arthritis in all my joints and I still walk on my own just not as far as I would like but I am working on that too.

Some days it hurts so much I don't even want to move but then I do and my back starts acting up so I get up and go sit in my recliner until things settle down and then I try and get something done.

I remember my grand parents and even parents talking about the golden years and then laughing I know now why they were laughing.
Keep as active as you can as the pain will only get worse the less you do, wonder how I know that one

[BD]

I'm 56 and it takes me a little while to get up and going most mornings. Generally the result of damage done when I was younger and invincible. On a bad morning I'll be able to remember exactly what dumb a*** thing I did that's now causing me pain. As has been mentioned, it's better than the alternative.
BD

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
I CAN FEEL YOUR PAIN, HAD R. KNEE OPERATED ON OVER 10 YRS. AGO, WORTH EVERY PENNY. :violin:
I have had over 10 yrs. more good use out of it. But I can still hurt a lot, so I can not sleep if I over do it, or twist it.:Fire::Fire:

[Boz330]

Celebrex. I was having trouble with the right knee a couple years ago and even went back to the ortho guy and nothing they did seemed to help. A friend who is a doctor wrote me a script for Celebrex and I had relief within a couple hours of taking the first one. After about 6 months of taking 1 a day I didn't need it anymore. I'm having trouble with it again but it isn't so bad that I can't function. An MRI showed that the cartilage on the inner bone is pretty much shot. I'm hoping that when it is time I can get away with a partial replacement.
After 50 it was a down hill slide for me, and exercising more just seemed to aggravate the problems more. Good luck.

Bob

[fecmech]

This past summer I was kneeling on the scaffold repointing my home and screwed up my left knee. Turns out I tore the meniscus (cartilage) and I'm 68. It got better over the summer but just last week I went in for arthroscopic surgery to clean out the cut area as I was told that would cause arthritis to form over time. The surgery was a snap, I'm a week out now and walking pretty much normal with no pain, knee just feels a little tight. In a couple weeks I should be 100%. Good luck whatever you choose to do.

[PatMarlin]

My knee gets better, but I keep hurting it again, by twisting a certain way or sleeping on it wrong. Other thing is I can flex my foot and toes upwards, and bend my knee and the pain will completely stop. I think maybe I tore muscle tendons and not cartilage from what I've read.

It all started from being out of shape, cutting down trees and clearing for firewood like I normally would do.

I need some kind of brace. I don't have med insurance and don't have a doc so I have not had it looked at. I'm gonna start looking for a sports doc. Used to know one down south years ago.

[GaryN]

Here's another link about a new therapy that shows promise. I watch this kind of stuff because I'm on the edge of having problems. I do floor coverings and at 56 I have a few aches and pains.
http://www.prolotherapy.com/