Problem with 45 cal gas checks.

[grubbylabs]

So I just got all my stuff for casting and loading for my 45-70. This is the second time I am using a gas check. I had no problems running them through the sizer and getting them to seat on my 44 cal stuff.


However,

My 45 cal stuff is not so user friendly. My boolit is .460 and my sizing die is a Lee .460 sizing die that I got from Ranch Dog. My gas checks go on real easy and after going through the sizing die they come off just as easily, what is the problem.

[Hardcast416taylor]

My question to you is, what brand of checks are you using? I have always used Hornady because they "snap" onto the bullet base and don`t tend to come off. Something sounds to be either too large (checks) or on the undersized area (bullet shank).Robert

[arkypete]

Go to Good Will, Salvation Army and buy a small skillet, stainless pan. Do what ever is required to clean and degrease.
Pour gas checks in the pan/skillet put pan on burned at high. When Gas Checks turn color, black, burning the laquer off. Set pan aside to cool.
You have annealed you gas checks. They should grip your bullet like crazy.

Jim

[grubbylabs]

I am using a Hornady gas check. Not sure if you are familiar with the Lee sizing die but you push the boolit from the bottom up nose first so the punch should be seating the check.

[Sonnypie]

I use a Lee push through sizer for my 30 cal and Hornady Checks (or did).
They seemed to stay put for me.
I tumble loob my boolits, so there is that bit of sticky stuff on the bases, maybe that helps hold mine on???

I'm trying out a new check maker and the .006" copper checks are coming off non-loobed boolits. (Small test lot)
The .011" brass checks seem to be staying. But it is too soon for me to tell. Other than the Hornady that went on loobed boolits mentioned above.
I'm still wondering if the loob helps glue them on.

And I'm going to try Jim's idea about annealing them as well.

[ReloaderFred]

Bullet lube is slippery, and won't glue checks on. What holds them on is the crimping when they're run through the sizing die. That, and the proper size check for the shank of the bullet, unless using one of Pat's Plain Base checks. In that case, the check is swaged into the base of the bullet.

I use both kinds, depending on the bullet I'm using.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[edsmith]

I agree with cloudy cake-oops- I mean sonnypie :bigsmyl2: I think alox helps the checks stay on, rub your finger over a boolit after the alox sets up, nothing slick about it, kind of sticky.

[paborn]

Had the same problem with Hornady gas checks with my 45-70 and 458 Win Mag bullets with .460 sizing die. Hornady makes one check for BOTH pistol and rifle bullets. A .460 sizing die just wasn't crimping them on. Switched to Gator 45R checks that ARE made for rifle bullets and got a firm crimp.

Paborn

[HollowPoint]

If you have any other brand or type of gas checks available, I'd check the fit of those also. If they all seem to "Come Off Just As Easily" then I'd most likely open up the Gas-Check-Shank portion at the tail end of the bullet mold.

I've done two of my molds this way. It's not rocket science or anything difficult. All I did was wrap some fine sand paper around a wooden dowel of the appropriate size, stick it down into the top of my mold just far enough to touch the shank portion only and spin.

I did just a few spins then checked with my calipers. It's not a precise way of checking your progress but, it's a good indication of when to stop.

Of course if some of the other brands of Gas Checks do fit well for you, then it's most likely just that particular batch or brand of gas check that's the source of your problem.

HollowPoint

[white eagle]

grubby
sometimes the mold needs a bit of seasoning to bring
all dimensions into spec
are you using the same alloy that you stated you would use
when you ordered the mold
chances are good that it will turn around
keep at it

[405]

If you have any other brand or type of gas checks available, I'd check the fit of those also. If they all seem to "Come Off Just As Easily" then I'd most likely open up the Gas-Check-Shank portion at the tail end of the bullet mold.

I've done two of my molds this way. It's not rocket science or anything difficult. All I did was wrap some fine sand paper around a wooden dowel of the appropriate size, stick it down into the top of my mold just far enough to touch the shank portion only and spin.

I did just a few spins then checked with my calipers. It's not a precise way of checking your progress but, it's a good indication of when to stop.

Of course if some of the other brands of Gas Checks do fit well for you, then it's most likely just that particular batch or brand of gas check that's the source of your problem.

HollowPoint

That description is the best way I've found to get a good shank to GC fit. I've also found that there is more variation mold to mold and alloy to alloy than there is among GCs.... so predicting a good fit is usually iffy.

When placing, snapping on or what ever method is used, the fit should be SNUG and SQUARE TO THE BASE when placing/seating the GC onto the shank. Then as the bullet is pushed thru the Lee bullet sizer die it will be "crimped" firmly on. There is a "very fine line" between too loose, too tight and just right. Sometimes if the objective size is too large then the GC will not be crimped down far enough for a good purchase crimp onto the shank. Another type of GC might work but that over-size combo may require both opening the shank slightly on the mold AND opening the GC slightly to be seated fully and squarely onto the shank before sizing/crimping. I have one mold for a particular gun that is over-sized... as is the shank diameter. I made a GC opener punch dedicated specifically for that one application. The punch is flat on the end and is turned down just enough to enter the GC, then there is a short radiused shoulder that opens the GC a tad. One tap with a hammer and the punch bottoms out in the GC and opens it up just the right amount. Just another step that is a pain, but the only way I found to handle that "oversize" situation using standard sized GCs.

For those times when opening the GC is called for.... a couple of things can help. One is to lightly chamfer the base of the bullet (NOE makes a very handy base chamferring tool) and the other is to use a GC opening punch. Steel balls and other ideas I heard about didn't work very well. Pics of a simple punch I made for a specific application. They could be made for any GC.

[josper]

Had the same problem with Hornady gas checks with my 45-70 and 458 Win Mag bullets with .460 sizing die. Hornady makes one check for BOTH pistol and rifle bullets. A .460 sizing die just wasn't crimping them on. Switched to Gator 45R checks that ARE made for rifle bullets and got a firm crimp.

Paborn

+1 one this idea.I tried Gators and it cured my problems.

[Pigslayer]

So I just got all my stuff for casting and loading for my 45-70. This is the second time I am using a gas check. I had no problems running them through the sizer and getting them to seat on my 44 cal stuff.


However,

My 45 cal stuff is not so user friendly. My boolit is .460 and my sizing die is a Lee .460 sizing die that I got from Ranch Dog. My gas checks go on real easy and after going through the sizing die they come off just as easily, what is the problem.

Maybe going to a thicker gas check would help. Had that problem with my 7MM. Sagebrush made some out of .014 AL & they work perfectly.