casting for use in sabots

[subsonic]

I thought it would be easy, but so far I have been thwarted.

I happened to have Harvester H15045BR sabots and a LBT 300gr WFNGG cast from WDWW and sized to .4525" with no checks or lube. Over 100gr of BH209, only 2 out of 4 hit a 20" rectangular piece of cardboard at 25yds. I didn't bother shooting more.

Any ideas where to go from here? Do I need to put checks on them to help the SABOT grab the boolit? Do I have a sabot petal length problem? Or?

I will experiement, but thought I would ask anybody else who has tried so I might save some time repeating other failures.

[jonas302]

I have used 240 grain 44 cal pistol bullets in the green sabot and they work great now more interested in the lee reals at the moment

how is your gun shooting sabots otherwise? Sounds like a lot of powder in there too

[Crawdaddy]

I thought it would be easy, but so far I have been thwarted.

I happened to have Harvester H15045BR sabots and a LBT 300gr WFNGG cast from WDWW and sized to .4525" with no checks or lube. Over 100gr of BH209, only 2 out of 4 hit a 20" rectangular piece of cardboard at 25yds. I didn't bother shooting more.

Any ideas where to go from here? Do I need to put checks on them to help the SABOT grab the boolit? Do I have a sabot petal length problem? Or?

I will experiement, but thought I would ask anybody else who has tried so I might save some time repeating other failures.


Try lowering your powder charge. I am using 80 grs of BH209 and a 463 gr cast bullets and a harvester crushed rib sabot. When I got up to 90 grs they started going all over. I am getting 1557 fps with a heavy bullet.

Gas checks will not help as they will not be touching the inside of the bore.

What is the twist rate of the rifle you are using?

[Crawdaddy]

One other thing. Weigh your bullets, just to make sure there are no large differences in weight.

Also are you sure the sabot you are using is not for a .458 bullet instead of a .452? You want a nice tight fit.

[subsonic]

It shoots about 2" @100yds with hornady 250sst sabots and the same charge.

Gun is an Encore Endeavor 1:28 twist.

The wfns and sabots fit about like the SSTs. Pretty snug.

The comment about the gas check relates to how the boolit fits in the sabot. If the sabot can't grip the boolit, it won't spin-stabilize it. It seems like the sabot does it's gripping at the heel of the boolit. I'm gonna try a few with checks just for the halibut.

If I can't get them to shoot with 100gr, i'm not interested in shooting them.

I shoot the same boolits out of my ruger bisley and the group 3" @50, so I don't expect worse from a rifle.

[yovinny]

I usually shoot 100gr of 777 in a T/C Omega.
I've had good luck using the Lee 430-310 sans GC in the Hornady green sabots.
Cast from 98/2, sized lee push-through and weighed to +/- .5gr
I've tried the same load in the Harvester sabots with very dissapointing results.

[P.K.]

I have used 240 grain 44 cal pistol bullets in the green sabot and they work great now more interested in the lee reals at the moment

how is your gun shooting sabots otherwise? Sounds like a lot of powder in there too
Those things spoiled all else from going in my front stuffer. I shot about 20 of them over the course of a 2 hour range visit and never had to swab the bore. When you have a Boolit that scrapes the fouling on loading it sure makes shooting the black alot more fun. ;-)

[Packy]

I shoot the lyman 457122 with the knight orange ez load sabots, in my knights.Size them to 452 in a lee sizer. 2 pyrodex pellets and they shoot great.I have tried the lee 430-310 and 452-300, they shot ok but not as good as the lyman. I'm am going back to the 54 cal and patched round balls this year.

[wgr]

what are you casting them out of/ i cast some of the same bullets out of soft lead couldnt get them to shot out of a 1:28 twist. went to casting out of ww and they shot 11/2 at 100yards.

[Packy]

I cast some out of stick on w.w. and some out of soft lead.(lead pipe and old roof flashing.) They both shot the same. Shot 2 deer withe them last year. The 1st one was about 50 yards, the bullet came out the off shoulder and did quite a bit of damage. This was with soft lead. The other deer was about 70 yards, shot her a bit back,the bullet went thru the liver and pretty much destroyed it. Made a good size hole coming out. This bullet was made with stick on w.w.

[Crawdaddy]

I think you are probably spot on with it not grabbing the bullet but not for the same reason. I suspect you are trying to drive the sabot/bullet combination too hard for the particular rifle and it just isnt latching on to your rifling.

I just cross referenced the sabot you are using and I use the same thing with a .458 bullet. (yep, I know what the website says) I get 1'' groups at 100 yards but with a lighter load and heavier bullet.

I wonder if you would get better results with their sabot that is for smokeless pwders? I suspect the differentiation is due to higher velocities. Here is their part number if interested.

H25045SRR

[OnHoPr]

I tried the same scenario with the Lee .44 310gr gc without gas checks and couldn't even hit the paper. Without the gc the sabots were blowing out or being destroyed on ignition. I haven't acquired any gas checks yet, but I just bought a Lee .44 240gr round nose and cast a few to try. They cast out at 258gr, 33/67 WW/Pb and sit in the sabot well. The mold was cheaper than the gas checks. Last week I though about milling off the gc portion of the Lee 310 for more proper fit in the sabot. I was thinking of the 240gr (258gr) being soft for longer range. For the big meplat 310gr, WW water quenched hard for real brushy applications.

[quilbilly]

I am not sure how this relates to your 100 gr of 209 but I have been using 78 gr of Goex FFF with the green sabot and a 260 gr .429 boolit for nearly 20 years of elk hunting. That load out of a T/C White Mtn Carbine 50 cal. puts them down in a hurry and has been known to lift the whole elk off the ground when a big should bone is hit ( saw that just before the smoke hid everything- memorable). The longest shot was about 70 yards though.

[rayzer]

I tried My NOE.460425 hollow pointed Boolits in my T/C Encore, with 80, 90, 100 grains of Blackhorn 209. These boolits weigh 390 grains. are sized to .452, and I am using Hornady Black sabots. The 80 gr. loads grouped at 1-3/4" at 50 yrds. The 90 gr. loads were 7/8" at 50 yrds. The 100 gr. loads grouped at 1-5/8" at 50 yrds. Next time out I will check the 90 gr. loads for velocity. The blackhorn powder lived up to its reputation, I shot 25 rds. without cleaning between shots, no problem seating the boolits. and accuracy did not suffer.

[Tatume]

My modern muzzleloader was blowing up deer with jacketed pistol or 45-70 bullets, so I went to a hard-cast LBT M-profile bullet. At about 2500 fps they are instantly deadly, and I no longer am accused of hunting with hand grenades. The mold is marked 330 gr and 0.4575 diameter when using wheelweight metal, but I've never actually weighed or measured them. I use the MMP orange HPH sabot, and Veral cut a slight bevel on the base specifically to fit this sabot.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh7/Moscheutos/MLM-Bullets.jpg