45-70 collar button???

[Guesser]

Anyone have recommendations for a BP gallery load using the 457130 collar button?
This is to be used to introduce youngsters to big bore cartridge shooting.

[tacklebury]

Depending on barrel length, I'd thing about 10 gr. Unique and pan lubed button boolits would do nicely. I use 10 gr. Unique with RB in the .45-70 which are 165 gr. and collar button is 150 gr. It's a 100 yard blast to get ground hogs with it. ;) If you're shooting a shorter barreled gun, you can go as low as 6 gr. Unique from what I've heard, but from my 32" barreled BC, 10 is about minimum. 8)

[Guesser]

I'm very familiar with using smokeless powder to do what we want, but I want to introduce them to the smoke and sound of Black Powder, that's why I asked about anyone using BP for this boolit and purpose. It was originally loaded over BP for gallery shooting but I can't locate any data.

[Chicken Thief]

I would say sonething like 25gr of fine BP topped of with your filler of choise.

[94Doug]

Ideal 39 lists 130 plain base with 5 grains unique for 900fps...I believe that is the CB. I think there is a PDF on CastPics of Ideal 38, if you want to double check that. I have the 45-70 page from the 39 scanned, if you want it.


Doug

[Guesser]

I have the old Ideal books back to ?, including #39 but what I'm looking for is Black Powder Gallery loads.
Thanks

[Lead pot]

How old is he Guesser?

[Baron von Trollwhack]

I was able to locate a reference in Phil Sharpe's Handloading Guide to a fellow attempting to work up indoor gallery loads For a .45-100 Sharps. While there was no direct reference to powders I had the distinct impression that Sharpe was suggesting smokeless powder.

In one of my old Lyman books the bullet you referenced is pictured with a note that it weiged as much as a .45x diameter RB. Going back the Sharpe's book in the handgun section, he lists 3 grains of bullseye for the 145 grain RB in the .45 Colt.

There is a reasonable starting point for you.

Remember that gallery loads were shot indoors mostly with primitive ventilation and to me, BP would have been nearly so impractical as to be worthless for any amount of shooting. Outside , I would recommend BP blanks for a starting introduction , then very light bulleted smokeless, then to 1F/filler with a light bullet to bring in the smoke and boom with a gentle recoil progression.

The line throwing blanks I was very familar with had fast smokeless powder with about a 1/2" wad down on the powder and a severe roll crimp at the case mouth.

BvT

[Don McDowell]

Ideal sold special cases for use with blackpowder and that collar button bullet.
I think I'ld move up to 70 someodd grs of a 1 ro 1.5 f powder and a 300 gr bullet with a heavy wad. Recoil should be managable by anyone big enough to shoot the rifle, and give some fairly decent accuracy besides.

[Lead pot]

If you want a very mild recoil from a .45-70 get some plastic sabots they come in all sorts of sizes now where you can load a .40 caliber round ball or cast pistol bullets. fill the case with 1F and seat the sabot on top of the powder.
It's the bullet weight that generates the recoil.
I got some .45 sabots for my .50-2.5 and loaded them with a round ball the recoil is very mild and they shoot straight to boot.

[94Doug]

sorry I didn't read the "BP" part.

d

[bigted]

Anyone have recommendations for a BP gallery load using the 457130 collar button?
This is to be used to introduce youngsters to big bore cartridge shooting.

sorry no collor button info but have some patched round ball data that should curl your toes for what you want.

i took my case and flaired the mouth...un-sized.
took a 440 round ball and wrapped it with a muzzle loader patch of .015 inch
slipped the patched ball down tight over 20 grains of goex 2 f powder.
sparked it with a cci 200 large rifle primer.

this load would group into the same hole at 25 yards for small game loads. no recoil and sparks n smoke like i wanted. had to wipe the bore after 3 or 4 rounds to keep the accuracy but with the patch lubed with bore-butter it kept the fouling fairly soft and easy to clean with a wet soapy patch followed with a dry then back to the fun shoot.

sounds like what your looking for but alas not a color button load.

[bigted]

guesser...never read your decision nor your outcome...what did you finally do for your collor buttons...im curious... just like a mangy ol cat!