Blue Dot

[pdawg_shooter]

Has anyone heard any more about using Blue Dot in a 357 with 125gr bullets? I have done it for years and now they say not to. Why? 14.0gr of blue dot has been my go to load since the mid 70s.

[Larry Gibson]

I still use Blue Dot with 125 gr J bullets in my .357 mag also. My load is a tudge more than yours and is a max .357 load psi wise for the .357 Magnum only in stout revolvers and single shots. My load with the Hornady 125 FPXTP runs 1690 fps out of my 6" Ruger and 1940 fps out of my 7.9" Contender. PSI's (measured with the Oehler M43 in the Contender barrel) are definately top end of SAAMI's specs. Extremely accurate and a litteral death ray.

In my psi testing with Blue Dot I did not find any abnormalities of "pressure spiking" as were reported to Alliant which caused the warnings. In conversing with Alliants techs right after the warning came out they said "pressure spiking" was reported to them (wouldn't say by who) and issued the warning as a precaution. My testing pressure testing has been with the .357 and the .44 magnums. I've posted a report here on the .44 magnum results. I've found Blue Dot to be an excellent powder in both cartridges and will continue to use it unless someone can provide definitive proof of "pressure spiking".

Larry Gibson

[x101airborne]

High Five, Larry. I have used blue dot in everything from plus P 38's to full load (or all I want) 454 casull. As far as a hunting load, blue dot is hard to beat. I am sure there are better or faster out there, but why mess with a good thing?

[felix]

I have used BlueDot to the hilt in the old days and have found it to be the cat's meow in every revolter on the shelf. The cheaper military powders have taken its place in those applications and for no other reason than cost. ... felix

[oldgeezershooter]

Have used it in .357 and .44 for years no problens.

[theperfessor]

My best 9mm loads use Blue Dot. Some of my best magnum revolver loads use Blue Dot.

As I recall, the warning mentioned something about pressure spikes at temperature extremes. I remember telling myself that I wouldn't have to worry about that since I wouldn't be shooting at those temperatures anyway.

[oldgeezershooter]

I shoot 8gr. of Blue Dot with a 180gr. cast semi-wadcutter in my XD40, very accurate load.

[songdog53]

Have used Blue Dot in 44's for many years and had no problems. Have used in 40's also and have not seen any pressure signs in either. Haven't used any in 357 but wouldn't have any problem using it.

[freedom475]

I thought that when the safety info came out for BlueDot pressure issues, it was determined to be bad data printed in the manuals(more like bad proof reading)..This is why it was specific to certain bullet boolit weights in the 41 and 357.

[leadman]

Some of the old data seems to be incompatable with the new version of BD. Then you have the guy that advocates using BD way beyond anything I would use.
BD works great in the 9X18 Mak, 357 mag., 41M, 44M, 9X19, 22 K-Hornet, 223, and other rifle cases for me.

[harley45]

I have used the new version in 10mm extensively, however in my Wilson I get higher velocities than what some do that post over on another forum and are using the old version. I trust the powder but I do work up all my own loads.

[BLTsandwedge]

I think the warning relates to the combination of .357 and 125g JHP or J(whatever) and the Smith 19. I cracked a forcing cone on a Smith 19 by using 125g JHPs and a near-max load of W296. I do know from experience that the warning is appropriate for- but perhaps limited to- Smith 19s and 125g Js.

[pdawg_shooter]

Should be alright in my Pythons then.

[9.3X62AL]

Sometime around the late 1980s-to-early 1990s, SAAMI lowered the 357 Magnum pressure standard significantly--from the 42K PSI ballpark to the 36K PSI level. This was done to reduce wear and extend service life of S&W K-frame 357 Magnums, and opened the door for J-frame 357s to be created. Now, S&W came out with the L-frame 586/686 series in the early 1980s to address the issues created by full-tilt "old SAAMI" loads......but SAAMI lowered the bar anyway.

The 41 and 44 Magnums got the same pressure-lowering at the same time, owing to supposed issues with full-snort 44 Magnum loads at 42K PSI in the older N-frame examples. My own experience with the Model 29 genre--esp. the 4" barrelled examples--is that Elmer Keith had a good point when he said that "1200 FPS is all you need" from his caliber. In the 4" M-29, that is about the top load level I can shoot comfortably in sustained firing. And 36K PSI loads run about 1175-1225 FPS from 4" barrels with 240 grain bullets/boolits.

Not liking artificial limits on my shooting......I have Ruger revolvers in 357 and 44 Magnum to exploit the calibers to their fullest potential.

[oneokie]

IIRC, and I have slept since then, only certain lots of BD were suspect in the overpressure problems. At that time I had several different lots of BD and I called Alliant and was told that the lot numbers I had/have were not part of the problem lots.

[9.3X62AL]

FWIW, I recall an article by the late Bob Milek in one of the gunrags c. 1975, detailing his work with Blue Dot in the 357 Magnum. BD was newly-issued at that time. One remark I distinctly remember was commentary that BD had "pressure excursions" for him when fired at -35* F.

Living in southern California at the time, it's funny how that factoid has stuck with me--but there it is there. We need to keep in mind that Blue Dot as formulated was intended for heavy-shotload 12 gauge shells, the "Magnum" waterfowl stuff. Lead shot for waterfowl went the way of 8-track tape decks soon thereafter, but Blue Dot remains--though in magnum revolvers its usage runs 2X or more the pressure envelope it was originally intended for. Unexpected results can be an unintended consequence of such experimentation. Just sayin'.

[BAGTIC]

I have used BD since the beginning in all sorts of handgun calibers including .32 Magnum, 9mm, .357 , and 44 Magnum among others. BD gives me all the power I have ever needed.

[Walt]

I have experienced the "Pressure Spike" that is talked about here. I was loading for a new 6" M27 in the early 90s. The two suspect cases were removed with a hammer and a dowel. I don't recall the exact load (I may still have it on file) but the problem occured when I reached max powder levels with a 125 JHP. I have not used Blue Dot for the .357 since. The Blue Dot warning from Alliant (Hercules?) came shortly AFTER this incident.

[mdi]

Yep, we've all used Blue Dot in nearly all calibers (I have a Puma that loves 265 gr. Ranchdog RNFP over 16 or so gr. of Bluedot). But, a while back Alliant put out a warning about Blue Dot in 125 gr 357 loads and 41 Magnum loads. All I could find is:

July 25, 2008

Dear Functional Wholesaler:

Please distribute this letter to all of your customers immediately with instructions for them to do the following:
• Post this letter in a highly visible area of their establishment
• Distribute to their customers as soon as possible

Alliant Powder Blue Dot® Product Safety Notice

Alliant Powder® periodically reviews and tests their published reloading data to verify that recommended recipes have not changed over time.
During the latest review Alliant Powder discovered that Alliant Powder’s Blue Dot® should not be used in the following applications:
• Blue Dot® should NOT be used in the 357 Magnum load using the 125 grain projectile (Blue Dot® recipes with heavier bullet weights as specified in Alliant Powders Reloading Guide are acceptable for use).
• Blue Dot® should NOT be used in the 41 Magnum cartridge (all bullet weights).

Use of Blue Dot® in the above cases may cause a high pressure situation that could cause property damage and serious personal injury.

We apologize for any inconvenience that this may cause and appreciate your understanding and cooperation in this matter.
Thank you for your cooperation and if you have any questions or concerns please contact me at Dick.Quesenberry@ATK.com or call me at 540-639-8503.

Dick Quesenberry
Alliant Powder
Product Line Manager"
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