Looking for info on 32-30 Remington...

[jdgabbard]

Ok, I've searched the web... Only to come up empty handed, and left wanting.

I'm considering doing a conversion of a single shot. And I've been considering the types of things I want from the rifle. I want a small cartridge, .30 caliber, and medium velocity (1400-2200fps) with a lower heavy weight boolit (150-180g)... And from what I hear, the 32-30 fits the bill. It's supposed to be a necked down .357 magnum.

Does anyone have any info on this catridge? Something they could scan and post/email would be great. But anything at all is welcome. Looking specifically for diagrams, specs, and if available load data. Even better would be anyone that sells dies and a reamer.

If this is is what I think it is, I'd be looking at chambering it in a rebarreled top break shotgun action. Looking at rebarreling a .410 H&R.

[jdgabbard]

Or any info on the .30/.357 or the 30/.357 MAX would be welcome. I think all of them are going to be in the ball park

[excess650]

Your spec of bullet weight and veloctiy point straight to the 30-30. As unglamorous as that may sound, it has a good length neck, modest powder capcity, and works at moderate pressure. This should work OK in some break-open .410 shotgun actions.

[Three44s]

Another +1 for the .30-30!!

I have a Contender frame and am trying a friend's Bull 14" in that caliber and I must confess, I have never been much on them ............ till now!

But would it be easier to find a different break open already in that caliber and leave your .410 as it is?

Three 44s

[jdgabbard]

Ok, thats a good idea. But, I already have a 2x '94 Winchesters, and a contender in 30-30... So kinda defeats that purpose.

As I stated above, looking at going with a small size cartridge. And from what I can tell, the 30-357mag or something similar would have a shorter OAL then the length of empty 30-30 brass. Yes, volume goes down, and pressure goes up. But something like that would handle it. And i'm not worried about hacking up the .410. I bought the thing for $40, and have absolutely no use for a .410. I have plenty of shotguns, I bought it as it was cheap, in great shape, strong, and for the purpose of something just like this.

The concept is something like a rook, but with a little more umph, and a helluva lot more fun to plink with than a full size rifle round.

[excess650]

The velocity and bullet weight you spec'd along with the small capacity cartridge means high pressure. I doubt that your shotgun action is up to it. If you had a Miller or Hall action, Browning highwall or lowall, Ruger #1 or #3, maybe a CPA Stevens or something else made of modern steel and known to be strong, a 32 Miller or some such would be OK.

[jdgabbard]

Excess, will all respect, you need to look at the rifle before just outright doubting the concept. The same action is used (mine is only several years old mind you) to chamber 45-70, 500 S&W, .308, ect... And while they are not super pressure cartridges, any action that can handle them can more than handle the pressure of the 30-357max, mag, or 32-30.

Now I have handgun data for the .357max that shows a 210g Cast boolit in excess of 1450fps. It's for rugers only, but if the max can safely generate 1400 in a pistol with that weight of a boolit, then it will be able to generate 1800 in a rifle with a 150g boolit. And remember, they do chamber this action in 45-70...

Now will I load it that hot? Probably not, I'll look for a load that is accurate with a boolit weight of my liking...within reasonable velocity that is. I'm old enough, and bright enough not to want to hot rod a small cartridge. But trust me, the action can handle it.

So now back to the question. Has anyone played with one of these wildcats? Any experience?

[frnkeore]

I shoot a cartridge called the 32/35, It's .308 groove with a 2.15 CC case capacity and should be similar to the case capacity of a 30 Max. It's a tapered case that goes from .400 case head to case mouth in 1.88". If you'd like my data PM me.

Frank

[Wayne Smith]

If your action is an H&R make sure it isn't one of the cast iron shotgun actions. They are not particularly strong and H&R won't put a rifle barrel on one.

[Old Goat Keeper]

If your action is an H&R make sure it isn't one of the cast iron shotgun actions. They are not particularly strong and H&R won't put a rifle barrel on one.

If that .410 IS an H&R then it IS one the SB-1 action and NOT the SB-2 which is chambered in those rifle calibers mentioned. besides all of those rifle calibers and including the .357 maggie run at way higher pressures than a .410 does.

T-o-m

[jdgabbard]

Goat, I've never heard of that. I've looked at other H&Rs and havent been able to tell there was a difference between this one and the other. Got a source for the info, as that would definately be a reason to not rechamber this gun.

[bobthenailer]

THe 32/20 is not a necked down 357 ! the 256 win mag is. it is a seperate case designe which is also necked down to 25/20 . I have a 32/20 ss pistol with a 10 3/4 inch barrel that has a .308 bore dia so that you can use the vast aray of 30 caliber bullets , I use the RCBS 165 gr sil bullet @1250 fps which is still not a max load I think you can reach at least 1400 fps with that bullet if needed and in a rifle the velocity would be at least 300 fps higher .

[excess650]

32-30 Remington was a BP round introduced in 1884 and discontinued in 1912. Ballistics were pretty anemic by today's standards.

[rond]

I've loaded the 7.62x39 with a cast 150 gr. FP with good results.

[Rocky Raab]

There's this thing called a 30 Herrett...

[rockrat]

Funny you should ask about a 30-357 max. I have a MOA pistol and a barrel for my TCR chambered in that cartridge, but it has a long 30-30 length neck. Body is just a bit longer than the 300 blackout. Designed it for cast boolits and shooting at the Coors Schutzenfest, but never made it back.

Haven't shot it in years. Use 357 mag dies on the body and a cut down 30-30 die for the neck/shoulder. Have thought about just having the reamer re-ground to 300 blackout specs on the body, that way, could use the dies to reload it and maybe only lose about a grain powderspace. The MOA shot very well in IHMSA.

Did run the reamer in farther in a 30 cal barrel , for use in a small bolt face XP-100 and use full length 223 brass. Shoots well. Going to suprise the fellows in our varmint sihlouette match this weekend, with it!!:)

Another thought, which I am thinking of doing, is stubbing one of the NEF barrels and make a 30 cal barrel, then running a 300 blackout reamer in the extra .210" for the added length of the Max case, then just using 300 blackout dies to load. You would have a shorter length neck and a couple more grains of powder capacity, than the Blackout round

Designed the 30/357 max case about 25 years ago. Would add a pic, but for some reason, can't log on to my photobucket account.

[Dave Bulla]

You mention wanting bullet weights in the 150-180 range. As far as I know, that's not gonna happen with the 32-20. Heaviest bullet I've seen for it is 115gr. I've got a Marlin cowboy carbine limited in 32-20 so I've done a bit of looking but have not yet reloaded anything for it. Pretty hard to find either ammo or brass except on line. Paco Kelly has some pretty good loading info for it on his page with I think three separate categories for pressures. I'm thinking the top speeds he lists are around 2200.

[9.3X62AL]

As BobTheNailer pointed out, the 32-20 WCF is not a necked-down 357 Magnum. it pre-dates the 357 by at least fifty years (~1882), and began life as a black-powder chambering in rifles and revolvers. Most of the cases in this caliber are not especially strong, and might not take kindly to high-pressure loadings that heavier-for-caliber bullets at increased velocities would entail.

Black-powder loads ran 115 grain-class bullets to 1300-1400 FPS in rifle-length barrels. High-velocity loadings suited for Win 1892 and Marlin 1894 leverguns can safely run 100 grain J-words to the 1900 FPS level, and my Lyman #311316 (118 grain flatpoints) can get to 1800+ without straining things. These are 40K PSI actions, so I don't get overly intrepid with them.

I don't write this to discourage experimentation, just as a caveat to the parent caliber and its casings' limitations. Starline makes cases in this caliber that seem to be a lot more substantial than the usual run of R-P or W-W brass, but I keep the systemic limits of an 1882 caliber in mind when I play around with it.

Far be it from me to erect STOP signs, I love the neck-and-shoulder 30 caliber pistol rounds like the 30 Luger and 7.62 x 25 Tokarev. These are quite efficient, flat-shooting, and accurate field rounds. Loud as h--l when run at top levels, too. WAY FUN!

Two REALLY ESOTERIC, WAY-OUT-THERE, FRONT-END calibers suggest themselves for the performance envelope you mention.......30-30 WCF, and 32 Winchester Special.

[excess650]

Some of you guys still don't realize that he was asking about the 32-30 REMINGTON., and not the 32-20 WCF.

The 32-30 Remingon is .05" longer than the the 357 MAXIMUM case.

[bobthenailer]

Im glad someones on the ball ! I thought he typed it in wrong ! and i cant remember hearing about a 32/30 / I guess ill have to dig out cartages of the world and do some homework.

[9.3X62AL]

I can read pretty capably, Excess. I have no insight into anyone else's knowledge level, and was responding in order to help prevent a possible safety issue or nomenclatural error. Forget I said anything.

[Rocky Raab]

Hard to tell sometimes, when half the posters claim that grammar, spelling, punctuation and typing skills don't count because people "know what is meant" anyway.

[badgeredd]

Some of you guys still don't realize that he was asking about the 32-30 REMINGTON., and not the 32-20 WCF.

The 32-30 Remingon is .05" longer than the the 357 MAXIMUM case.

Thanks you for bringing attention to the original post. EXCEPT a 357 Mag case necked to 30 caliber is not a 32-30.

I have been playing with a 38 Special necked down to 30 caliber(named 30 Badger by some friends). I designed it with a .310 neck length because my intent was to shoot only cast boolits with it at moderate velocities. Essentially it turned out to be a modern version of the 32-20 with a nearly identical case capacity to the bottom of the neck. In my opinion, I have achieved exactly what was intended with the cartridge which was something CHEAP to load and get brass for. In designing it friends made suggestions that worked out fabulously. I use the 30 Mauser/7.62x25 dies to load it and form the cases. No special dies need be bought.

I've toyed with the idea of applying the same design to a 357 Mag case and likely will proceed with it when I get a few extra bucks around. I would guess that a cartridges based on the 357 Mag case should easily be able to achieve 2000-2100 fps with a 120 grain boolit. Just a food for thought.

Edd

P.S. I am sure the same design could be applied to the 357 Max case BUT in my mind there are several existing commercial cartridges available with roughly the same case capacity. Therefore I personally see no need for the cartridge EXCEPT it does have a rim to make it easier to use in many single shots.

[blackpowdermax]

jdgabbard......in my opinion the 32-30 Remington is a very nice choice for your single shot. A bit more powerful than the 32-20, it lost favor because it was too long for the lever repeaters of the time.

The original used a .312" diameter, 125 grain bullet. I form mine from the 357 Max case, but must anneal before forming or the neck will crack. My dies came with the rifle and are RCBS.

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL938/2122351/4239634/397580892.jpg

An old Wm. Wurfflein in the 32-30 Remington.

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL938/2122351/4716768/172468315.jpg

Or you could always reload it with one of these. :grin::grin:

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL938/2122351/4716768/390846260.jpg

Good luck with your project......

max

[leadman]

The 300 whisper is capable of the velocities with the boolit weight you want. This is based on the 221 Fireball case. Check Mike Bellm's website for the same cartridge based on the 357 Max, might be what you are after.
check GreybeardOutdoors website for info on the Handi rifles. The older H&Rs, even the ones chambered in 357,44, 30-30, 45-70, 22 hornet, and the shotguns are all cast iron recievers. The newer version are SB1 cast iron for the shotguns, SB2 steel for the rifles. You can also check the H&R website.

410 shotshells run about 13,500 psi max, while the 357 magnum can run closer to 26,000 psi. This is from Hodgdon powder website.

[helice]

JD
I heartily encourage conversation with Badgeredd. He's a storehouse of information and one of the finest men on the forum. He has posted some of his information above but I highly recommend a personal message and if possible a phone conversation. You won't regret it. All my past dealing with him have been 'sterling'.
Karl

[209jones]

My 32-30Rem is built on a 222Super rimmed case. It was built on a #1 action. It has a 28" RKS on it, it has been shot with black powder cartridge loads and AA9 and SR4759 breechseated loads. I have a Lyman mould which casts 180gr .311 bullets and an LBT 165gr.
You may want to check the ASSRA forum, there were a few people using it before the 32rks and Miller short came out. The fella that shot Black cartridges in this one is departed now, I have the load, but, have never tried it. Ron Smith at RKS will likely have better info as he built it and knew and shot with the owner of it for a long time.
403-631-2405

[frnkeore]

209jones,
What was the groove size on that barrel and the ending twist rate?

Frank