Lee Pro 1000 as a utility press?

[wallenba]

I load my pistol cartridges on a Lee Classic Cast 4 die turret press and I'm very happy with it. I also prefer to prime off the press, as well as use an 'M' die and seat and crimp separately.
My problem now is arthritis in my left shoulder. It is very painful to raise my left arm more than chin high. I have been using a press mounted RCBS APS unit. With that, I use my right arm to feed the primer unit, then lower the handle. Lots of extra movments.
I was thinking that investing in a Lee Pro 1000 just for decapping, and re-priming after case cleaning, would save some time, effort and pain. With the drop tube and collator it sounds easy, this could free up a die station and allow a case activated powder measure too. But is there another option out there?

[geargnasher]

There are always options, but I think your idea is just fine, as long as you're only talking pistol calibers, .30 Carbine, or .223. I have six Pro-1000 presses and one often just gets used for priming operations. The Collator (extra part that doesn't come with the press as I'm sure you realize) is a godsend, and it really works, as does the case feeder once you get it adjusted correctly. Sometimes, like when I load .45 Colt for my H&R Carbine with PP 340-grain boolits, I use my .45 Colt Pro1000 to run the cases through, and just back off the seat/crimp die and change out the spud in the PTE die for a 45/70 PTE expander, so when I crank them through I get primed, belled cases that collect in a bin beside the press and then get put in a loading block for charging and boolits. Boolits get seated on a single-stage press.

It's a snap to just run all your cases through to size and deprime, then if you want to clean them, go back and run them all through again to prime. The cases don't care how many times they go through the merry-go-round, and since all you'd have to do is work the press handle and shake the tube/collator around a few times and keep the primer tray full, it would save a lot of wear and tear on YOU any way you look at it. The cases auto-eject from the press and collect in any container you provide that will fit under the chute, like a 6x8x2 Tupperware container.

Personally, depending on what you're loading for, I'd say it's time to make the jump to full-automation and try using the Pro1000 as it was intended, although you'll have to figure out how to put a boolit in each time from the left side of the press without hurting your shoulder.

I went with progressives for one basic reason, and it wasn't speed. I'm a full-time heavy-line mechanic and years of doing that plus building my own house, cars, and equipment, and having all of my hobbies be hand-motion intensive, I have carpal tunnel syndrome and the beginnings of Rheumatoid Arthritis in some finger joints (hereditary condition). Anything I can do to reduce repetitive hand, finger, and arm motion helps me a lot, especially with the hobbies.

If you decide to go this route and need any assistance getting the press set up and properly adjusted, pm me and I'll see what I can do to help.

Gear

[wallenba]

Thanks Gear. I read some bad reviews on the Load Master and wondered if the Pro had the same priming problems. Most reviewers like the Pro. I can feed bullets with my left arm OK. I just position myself with my elbow on the bench while seated, and swing it in an arc from the bin to the die. I load the usual straight wall stuff, 38's 45ACP 44 special & 45 Colt. I usually only do 50-100 at a time so the bigger buck presses are not justified, and my methods require more than 3 die holes.
My plan is to,
1. Deprime with a Lee universal decapper.
2. Clean the brass.
3.Full length size & prime, and 'M' die expand.
4.Switch out the Pro in my Rock-Dock for the 4 station Classic.
5.Charge with a case activated powder dispenser.
6.Add an RCBS Lock Out die.
7.Seat.
8.Crimp.

Operations 1 & 3 will be done on the Pro.

I wonder too if the cases will eject properly into the bins without the top heaviness of the boolits?

It just occurred to me that If I seated and crimped in the same die, I could charge, cop, seat/crimp in an extra Pro turret ring. That would also allow me to add the Lee bullet feeder!

[Westwindmike]

I used to use a Pro 1000 for sizing and decapping. I never could get the stupid primer system to operate reliably enough to trust it for priming the cases. I ended up selling it to a guy who thought he could make it run.

Best of luck with yours.

[geargnasher]

The empties will eject no matter what, that isn't the problem. The problem is actually WITH the boolits, they often flip out of the exit trough and onto the floor due to being top-heavy. This mostly happens with the taller stuff, .357 Mag and .45 Colt, almost never with the .40, and only once in a while with the .45 ACP. I've built various guards to keep this from happening, but you won't have the problem at all with empty cases.

I haven't tried the bullet feeder die, I have enough trouble keeping the case feeder tubes indexed and the priming tray shaken and filled! The bullet feeder looks like it would get gummed-up with lube pretty quick and start hanging things up, and since I never load J-words anymore it would be a waste of money if my suspicions are correct about it. That's why I never mentioned it, although if you could make it work it would really help your situation.

Remember also that the Pro1000 isn't very versatile, you pretty much have to expand/charge at station 2 and add boolit/seat/crimp at station 3, although you could easily just fill up the primer tray and take care of that at the same time. If you just used the first head to hold a universal decapper die and cycled the brass through, you could use it for all of your calibers, and after prepping the cases, you could size (with or without the decapper rod), prime, expand/charge, and seat/crimp with the second head and be done with it. If you tape a small LED flashlight to the back side of the press or use a goosneck lamp over the left side, you can see the powder charge in each case before you place a boolit on top of it and eliminate the need for your powder checker die. I find a visual inspection better than relying on a mechanism to flag empty cases. You can see well enough with pistol stuff to tell right off if you got a charge that's off enough to be a problem.

There are a couple of caveats with the Pro1000 as a full-progressive that you might want to know in advance. First, you have to get in the habit of going full-stroke up and down each time. If you short-stroke it, even a little, you will either flub the priming (ram down) or powder charging (ram up) or the powder on the next stroke if you didn't push the handle all the way forward (priming stroke) because the pullback chain on the Autodisk is only activated at the full-down stroke of the ram. It amazes me how easy it is to get distracted and automatically stop shy of seating the primer when I feel the resistance. Years and years of operating single-stage presses got me in the habit of instantly stopping the ram if I felt anything unusual, and that habit comes in both handy and unhandy with any automatic press. As for priming, the system operates quite well provided you do two things: Keep the chute clean of powder kernels (they filter down from the Autodisk directly above the open top of the primer trough) by putting scotch tape or masking tape along the open top of the chute, and NEVER let the chute go low on primers. The chute requires at least a dozen primers in it to gravity feed or things will jam up badly. Simple solution is to keep an eye on the primer tray, and when the last one goes out into the chute, go about four or five more until you can see the last one at the top of the chute, then you can pull out the primer tray without stacking primers in where the spout goes and having to dig three or four of them out to get the tray plugged back into the chute after refilling. Drill a 1/16" hole in the tray cover as close to the exit as possible and use a paperclip or toothpick as a "valve", otherwise you'll dump primers everywhere when you invert the tray to plug it into the chute. I don't know how Lee overlooked this small detail, but you better fix it for them or you'll be cussing! Keep one eye on the primer tray, the primers can get hung up and require frequent tapping to keep them moving into the chute. The pin on the chute that is supposed to ride against the right rear pillar and get "joggled" by the grooves in said pillar as the chute goes up and down with the carrier usually isn't enough to prevent jam-ups in the primer tray. I know all this sounds awful but it really isn't. Just go into it knowing what to fix ahead of time and what to watch as you use the machine.

As for seating and crimping in the same step, I do it for most stuff except .44 magnum, which both needs the roll tight against the groove (tough to do when seating/crimping in the same operation because the boolit is "running away" from the crimp as the crimp is being formed) and needs to be precise for best long-range accuracy. With .45 ACP it's a non-issue, and I tend to crimp my .45 Colt stuff by just barely tucking the mouth under the leading edge of the crimp groove since the revolver recoil isn't enough to overcome case tension the way I load most of mine, and the main concern is in tube mags where the boolits need to stay put. Plus, this doesn't work the brass very much compared to a full-on roll crimp, which is what's needed to keep the boolits still in both revolver and tube magazine situations.

Gear

[wallenba]

Gear, I have, somewhere, an RCBS case activated linkage and powder die. I think I'm going to try and adapt my little dandy to it for the second head. That way I won't be committed to the chain activated station. Probably will try the first die station if the case feeder will allow it. Worst case, it will just be a decapper/priming tool. If it does work there, it would be too difficult to seat at station two, so a cop or lock out die, would'nt hurt. I have had squibs before. I was lucky each time, as they were all 38 wadcutters that got stuck in the throats. I was charging on my turret with a lever operated dispenser. I guess I broke my rythmn.
My loads are all target loads. The only crimp I worry about is my 625JM Smith. Taper crimps can be iffy, with vaying case wall thickness being in play. I shoot 200 SWC in that. I may start a slight roll crimp just over the top band. It means seating deeper, but I do feel a wimpy round going off now and then. I attribute that to bullet creep out.

Mike, I like a challenge now and then. I really like to tinker. Like Slim Pickens said, " A'hm a gonna git those bomb bay doors open, iffit hare lips everbody in Bear Creek"

[geargnasher]

If you do that, make sure you have an expander die (like a PTE die with the top plug in it) somewhere in your decap head.

To do all those calibers you'll need two extra shellplates, one for the .45 ACP and one for .38/357. The third will cover .45 Colt, .44 Magnum, and .44 Special. The press should come with both small and large primer chutes and seating punches so you can convert back and forth. You may also need to buy the "other" case slider for .38 and the bent Z-bar for feeding the .45 ACP cases. I have some extra parts and maybe a few shellholders if you get into it that far.

Gear

[rbertalotto]

I have six Lee 1000 presses set up for various pistol cartridges.

It does help if you are a Ferrari mechanic or a Swiss watch repairman to get these things to run correctly. But once set up correctly, and mounted to a VERY rigid bench and kept well lubricated with SILICONE spray, they can turn out excellent ammo very fast.

The primer tray and feed is the weak link for sure.

The tray needs to be kept full so there is adequate weight to push the primers down the little slide. If the primers jam up at the entrance to the slide, the primers will stop feeding. They need this total weight to move them along. Goes without saying the tray and slide need to be "Operating Room" clean at all times.

I tried the "Automatic Bullet Seater" option on one of the units. FAGETABOUTIT!
This thing will drive you to drink. And I realized I much rather place bullets manually anyways. It's still extremely fast and placing the bullets manually slows things down just to the point where you are not making mistakes.

Hope this helps!

http://images12.fotki.com/v254/photos/3/36012/76857/DSC_1511-vi.jpg

[wallenba]

I tried the "Automatic Bullet Seater" option on one of the units. FAGETABOUTIT!
This thing will drive you to drink. And I realized I much rather place bullets manually anyways. It's still extremely fast and placing the bullets manually slows things down just to the point where you are not making mistakes.

Hope this helps!

http://images12.fotki.com/v254/photos/3/36012/76857/DSC_1511-vi.jpg

Yep, I read the reviews on the bullet seater on Midway's site. Nobody liked it. I'll save my money there. I have a wish list there. Some of the RCBS stuff now have rebates available, and I just got some promo-code numbers. Everything on my list is in stock, so it might be time to order. I'm adding some spare ratchets too, they look fragile. Any other notorious parts to include?

[wallenba]

[QUOTE=geargnasher;1399926]If you do that, make sure you have an expander die (like a PTE die with the top plug in it) somewhere in your decap head.

The Lyman "M" expander would go in the first turret head after the FL sizer where the priming is done. I have used, in the past, the Lee PTE after the "M" die. I turned the O.D. of the PTE down to fit inside the case without disturbing the multi-expand of the "M". That gave me the best of both. But...not enough room on the Pro without using two turret rings...oh well. I really like the "M's".

[geargnasher]

I wouldn't say "notorious", but you should probably get a spare primer gate arm, can't remember what its official name is, but it's a little black piece of plastic that senses a case passing by and only dispenses a primer if there is a case in that slot of the shellholder heading to the priming station. I've never broken one but f it breaks you're dead in the water. I have so many of these presses that if something breaks I can always rob a part to get by for a while.

The press comes with an extra ratchet or two and a package of spare "small parts", but if you polish the index shaft with 1000-grit emery paper and keep it lubed with silicone oil or gun oil the ratchet it came with may outlast you.

Don' forget the case collator isn't included in the kit, you'll be sorry if you don't order one!

Gear

[geargnasher]

[QUOTE=geargnasher;1399926]If you do that, make sure you have an expander die (like a PTE die with the top plug in it) somewhere in your decap head.

The Lyman "M" expander would go in the first turret head after the FL sizer where the priming is done. I have used, in the past, the Lee PTE after the "M" die. I turned the O.D. of the PTE down to fit inside the case without disturbing the multi-expand of the "M". That gave me the best of both. But...not enough room on the Pro without using two turret rings...oh well. I really like the "M's".

Sounds like a plan. I love those "M" dies.

Gear

[wallenba]

[QUOTE=geargnasher;1400280]I wouldn't say "notorious", but you should probably get a spare primer gate arm, can't remember what its official name is, but it's a little black piece of plastic that senses a case passing by and only dispenses a primer if there is a case in that slot of the shellholder heading to the priming station.

Is that the 'thingy' that looks like a model airplane pedastal? I saw that in the parts & accessories section. I'll add that. Yep, the collator is DEFINATELY on the list.

I just realized that the Little Dandy won't work with the RCBS case activated powder drop linkage. The geometry is wrong. The Uniflow and the linkage is designed for about 140 degree articulation. The Lil' D is about requires 180 degrees. If the uniflow does not clear the case drop tubes, I see on Roy's pics the Lee's do.

[UNIQUEDOT]

I used to use a pro 1000, but sold it in favor of the loadmaster. The priming system works well on the pro as long as you keep the trough full. The loadmaster will prime down to two or three primers in the trough. On the pro you have to manually seat the primers by pushing the handle forward as on other presses, but the loadmaster primes on the upstroke. You have to adjust the primer seating depth on the loadmaster, but after adjusted it's good to go with no further adjustments. For those that just couldn't seem to keep from crushing primer sliders on the loadmaster (i only crushed one in several thousand rounds) Lee has changed the priming system last month http://www.titanreloading.com/new-load-master-large-primer-feed-system so you may want to look at this option as well.

[wallenba]

I used to use a pro 1000, but sold it in favor of the loadmaster. Lee has changed the priming system last month http://www.titanreloading.com/new-load-master-large-primer-feed-system so you may want to look at this option as well.


I placed my order a little while ago before I read your comment. I spent a week or so trying to decide between the two presses. Part of my decision was based on the fact I'd have to relocate on my bench, several permanantly mounted presses. The Pro will mount right on my Rock-Dock as is. The Load Master case feeder and discharge bin would not fit in the space between another press. The other factors were price and the negative comments in the reviews. Normally I don't pay too much attention to those as I find most of those guys just can't, or are unwilling to work out the bugs. I still might like to get one if I find a used one at a good price.

[Mike Kerr]

It will work utilizing the press under several configurations. So will the Load Master. Good luck, I am sure you will figure it out.

regards,

:-):-):-)

[garym1a2]

If you size and prime off the press with the po1000 can you expand and powder on station one, seat on station two and tamper crimp on station three, I am thinking of upgrading from a classic turrent to a pro1000 or a loadmaster in 9mm. Since range pickup brass is a pain to deprime a seperate deprime station is needed for me.


Remember also that the Pro1000 isn't very versatile, you pretty much have to expand/charge at station 2 and add boolit/seat/crimp at station 3, although you could easily just fill up the primer tray and take care of that at the same time. If you just used the first head to hold a universal decapper die and cycled the brass through, you could use it for all of your calibers, and after prepping the cases, you could size (with or without the decapper rod), prime, expand/charge, and seat/crimp with the second head and be done with it. If you tape a small LED flashlight to the back side of the press or use a goosneck lamp over the left side, you can see the powder charge in each case before you place a boolit on top of it and eliminate the need for your powder checker die. I find a visual inspection better than relying on a mechanism to flag empty cases. You can see well enough with pistol stuff to tell right off if you got a charge that's off enough to be a problem.

Gear

[wallenba]

Well, it's here, and mounted to my Rock-Dock. It needed a lot of tweaking. The first time I sized a case the whole carrier assembly was pulled off the ram. The cinch bolt was not tightened, and had oil on it too. Fixed that. It was feeding primers to an empty shell plate. The case sensor would not return to lock out the primer ram. Fixed that by grinding some off the bottom that rides over the shell plate. The zero-out screw would not turn the shell plate. The notch in the carrier was too small for anything but just the tip of the screwdriver. Fixed that. The case feed tube would only drop a case if the bottom was rotated to a point under the edge of the turret ring and stopped upward movement. Fixed that by grinding some off the front of the black tube retainer so it would clear. The discharge ramp was polished with 600 grit and waxed, (works...better). I polished the case feed shuttle ramp, top and bottom, and lubed the underside. I then took it back apart and lubed what was needed. It runs like a top now.

One die plate has only a universal decapper in it. Spent cases are dumped in the collator and deprimed, then cleaned.
Another die plate has a full length sizer at number two station with the decapping pin removed, I reprime there. Station three has a Lyman 'M' die.
The third die plate has an RCBS Uniflow powder charger with case activated likage, followed by an RCBS lock-out die to keep me safe, and finally, a seat and crimp die.
Eventually I plan on having a shell plate carrier assembly for most of my hand gun cartridges.
Also, I use Hornady die lock rings, so they stay adjusted and the seat crimp dies are the only thing needed to change on the third die ring.

Another benefit of the Rock-Dock is I can just pull it out, tip it back, and all the unused primers slide right back into the tray and can go back in storage.

[smokingguns]

I have a pro 1000 and can't wait to get my bullet feeder to go on it. I like it with out the bullet feeder I can still crank out some ammo
I load, 9mm,40sw,44mag,45acp,45lc,454 and 204 on it
I've used Lee stuff a long time and always been pleased

[smilie=w:[smilie=w:[smilie=w:

[wallenba]

I have a pro 1000 and can't wait to get my bullet feeder to go on it. I like it with out the bullet feeder I can still crank out some ammo
I load, 9mm,40sw,44mag,45acp,45lc,454 and 204 on it
I've used Lee stuff a long time and always been pleased

[smilie=w:[smilie=w:[smilie=w:

I heard some discouraging info about the bullet feeder on youtube and elsewhere. But I may give it a try as I'm finding it a little clumsy getting my big hand and fingers around that post at that station. I'd like to make it work. I got the Pro running good, so, it's worth a try for me.

[geargnasher]

Dang, Wallenba, I never had those troubles with any fo mine, and the newest one I puchased last year. Glad you got it going anyway.

Are you sure the wire spring that retains the priming punch and also loads the case sensor arm isn't put on backwards? It's possible to do that (trust me, I know) and maybe that's the way it came.

The case feeder can be a pain until you figure out how to adjust it just right, the key is to get the height adjusted and locked in just right, about 1/16" or less clearance above a dropped case is about right for me.

Gear

[wallenba]

Dang, Wallenba, I never had those troubles with any fo mine, and the newest one I puchased last year. Glad you got it going anyway.

Are you sure the wire spring that retains the priming punch and also loads the case sensor arm isn't put on backwards? It's possible to do that (trust me, I know) and maybe that's the way it came.

The case feeder can be a pain until you figure out how to adjust it just right, the key is to get the height adjusted and locked in just right, about 1/16" or less clearance above a dropped case is about right for me.

Gear

The spring clip is good. The corner of the case sensor that hangs over the shell plate was dragging on the shell plate. When a case went by and pushed it aside to drop the primer ram so a primer would feed, it stayed there. Then the next primer would drop down even if there was no case coming. I just used my Dremmel tool to remove enough plastic so there was no interference. It really was just a minor thing, but it took a while for me to reason out what was happening.
The case feeder problem was a matter of just a few hair widths. On the upstroke the black plastic part the tubes fit in, would catch the very edge of the turret ring. If I moved it rearward out of the way, the case rims would hit the very edge of the shuttle and not drop. Removing some plastic on the tube holder in front allowed me to move it forward enough to drop cases and still clear the turret ring. All the stuff was minor, even a little amusing in a way. Kinda like a puppy that's hard to train, but later is your best buddy.