Lyman Mold " Tune Up "

[Ben]

I purchased a nice Lyman, 357446 , 2 cav. mold from a board member. The mold arrived today.

I decided to give the mold my usual " Tune Up ". I'd like to point out that this is a very nice mold and my work today to this mold is not an indicator on anything that I consider to be a problem by the seller. As a matter of fact, this mold is several steps above what I purchase at gun shows, and from other individuals.

When I decided to begin work on this mold today, I also decided to get my Dig. Camera out and shoot a few photos as I worked, hoping that it might be of some help to some of you.

Most of the work that is needed on a used Lyman mold has to do with the techniques that are used by Lyman to produce their molds ( such as stamping out their sprue plates, and the use of those **** split ring washers under their sprue plates. A little bit of time spent on a used Lyman ( or for that matter, a lot of other brands of molds also ) can make the casting life of the mold a lot more pleasant for the mold owner.

( As a side note, it is also interesting that the factory box is mislabeled. It reads 357466 and should read 357446.)


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These blocks fit together so well, it is VERY difficult to see the parting line.

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[Echo]

Good effort, Ben.

[Ben]

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[theperfessor]

Very good write up and pix. My compliments!

[Ben]

Thanks for those kind remarks.

I hope my efforts will make someone else's experience with
a new ( or used ) Lyman mold more enjoyable.

Ben

[kbstenberg]

Ben When you deepened an widened the sprueholes, what did you use? I tried it ounce with my largest drill bit but that was too small.
I had to make a large wooden dowel end to the same angle as the sides of the tapered sprue hole. Chuck that in a drill press. Apply grinding comp to the tip of the dowel. An lower the spinning dowel to the sprue plate. It took quite a while.
Is there some kind of grinding bit with the correct angle that I could use instead?
Kevin

[Ben]

A 60 degree countersink has been recommended.

Ben

[Ben]

Up - Date

I went outside and cast about 250 this afternoon with the Lyman 357446 mold.
This mold is a joy to use ! All my " Tune - Up " efforts are paying real good dividends now.

Bullets are nice and round at .360 ".

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[462]

Ben,
As always, excellent write up and pictures.

In case anyone is wondering about the wave washer, 6 mm is a perfect fit and should be available from a local auto parts store.

[Catshooter]

Nice write up Ben, as always.

I don't know what Ben used on the sprue plate holes to deepen and clean them up, but I use a 60 degree countersink. Go here to see:

http://www.victornet.com/subdepartments/Countersinks/1740.html

These are good folks to deal with by the way.


Cat

[Ben]

462 and Cat,

Thanks for those nice comments.....................


Cat,

I think I need one of those.

Do they do a nice , slick, clean job of re cutting the sprue holes ?

Ben

[kbstenberg]

Cat do you use the 60 degree that cuts 3/4"

[HORNET]

Looks very familiar, Ben. A couple of minor additions that I do sometimes:
Check the faces of the blocks and clean up the vents
Push the locating pins back and clean up the mold faces if necessary, deburr the pin holes with a case chamfer tool (both blocks)
Cut a light chamfer around the other edges of the blocks to make them more damage resistant
Dig out some spacer blocks and a carbide scribe and cut a new vent between the cavities to the outside of the blocks so the first boolit cast doesn't block half of the venting to the second cavity (helps a lot sometimes, never seems to hurt anything)
I usually use a small flat washer and a wave washer to spread the force out a little better
A well tuned mold can be MUCH easier to use than stock ones

[Ben]

Hornet :

A well tuned mold can be MUCH easier to use than stock ones.

I'm in total agreement.

Ben

[white eagle]

Glad you like it

[Ben]

Great Mold, many thanks White Eagle ! !

Ben

[smoked turkey]

Ben I want to be first in line when you decide to sell a mould!! Nice work and an inspiration to those of us that just want to get to casing when we get a new mould.

[Ben]

smoked turkey


All the work that you see took place within a 40 minute time frame. The mold runs " smooth as silk now ".

Time well invested.

Ben

[Catshooter]

Yes, the 60 degree counter sinks are the ones that fit the sprue lead- in cut (leed, not lead). Anything over 3/8 will work. Turn them very slowly. High speed will make them chatter, which means they will sorta bounce up and down in the cut. Very ugly finish. Turned slowly they cut nicely and leave a smooth finish that lead doesn't want to stick to. A little shot of just about any oil will help them work.


Cat

[Ben]

In reference to the tops of the mold blocks and " breaking the edge "
to allow air to vent.

I once had a fellow give me a set of near new, double cav. Lyman mold blocks
38 / 357 Mag. Keith style .

He said that he had cleaned the mold blocks until he was "blue in the face".
He had tried different alloys, different heat settings for the alloy,
he had used a dipper, he had used a bottom pour.
He could not get a decent bullet base fill out from either cavity.

Out of frustration, He handed the mold blocks to me and said..." I don't ever
want to see that mold again ! ! Take it, it is yours - - FREE ! "

I did the same thing outlined in the photos above....the result of the work...Perfect bullets and perfect base fill out each and every pour.

Little things in life really do make a difference.

Ben

[6.5 mike]

Looks very much like what I do to my lee moulds when I first get them. Great pics & write up as always Ben.

[Ben]

Thanks Mike :

Let me make one other comment............

I may have implied in the article that this could and would only be done with Lyman molds. If I've done that , let me set the record straight by saying, I've done this to used SAECO's, RCBS , and quite often have to do the described work on Lee molds.

I will say that the Lyman molds and Lee molds usually need more work than the others.

Ben

[selmerfan]

I went through all of my molds tonight. I have the following:
.30 caliber
NEI 178 gr. RNFP
RD-311-165 RF 6 cav
Lyman 314299 2 cav.

6.5mm
NEI 130 gr. RNGC

.35 cal.
RD 359-190-RF 6 cav
Saeco #354
GB Lyman 358627 copy 6 cav made by Lee
Lee 358-158-RNFP 2 cav

Not one of them was perfect. They all had imperfections where the blocks met and didn't slip together perfectly. I've done all of Ben's tweaks and look forward to dropping boolits with them. The RD 311-165 was the worst offender with a full burr running on the top of one mold block on the cavity side. And the Lyman sprue plate was very rough. This is my first Lyman mold and the roughness is not anything the previous owner did to it, it's just not finished real well. The best finished of my lot were the NEI molds. Not much there that needed to be done.

[Ben]

selmerfan

I'm fortunate that I now own several NOE molds.I also own a Mountain Mold, and an NEI made by Walt. These molds ( along with a few of my SAECO's ) are at the top of the list when it comes to making a mold the RIGHT WAY ! ! There is usually nothing to be done in the " tune up " dept. when molds like this arrive. They are a joy to use.

Based on what I'm reading, there are many other custom makers that make a similar product. It is nice to buy something that works just as soon as you've picked it up to use it, without you having to spend time on it " fine tuning " .

Of course, that also carries a price tag.

Ben

[Catshooter]

The devil lives in the details. Very true too.


Cat

[Catshooter]

Oh my goodness, a double post.


Cat

[LongPoint]

Very nice writeup and photo's. If there is damage to the top of the blocks on a Lyman mold, how would a person go about removing the sprue plate locator pin? I would guess it is a pretty snug fit, and can't be tapped out from the bottom. Could a person maybe latch onto it in a drillpress and pull it free?

LongPoint

[Ben]

I've grabbed onto them with a set of vice grips and twisted them out. Some come out fairly easy, some won't come out at all.......for those stubborn ones, I've had to drill them out ( on a drill press ) and put a brand new one back in its place.

When you get ready to remove one, I like to let penetrating oil soak around them for a couple of days. Heat will sometimes help free one so that it can be removed.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

Ben, your postings on this form a great tutorial. The powers that be ought to make it a sticky. Many here would suffer poor process and product for lack of such good advice.

Regards, BvT

[Ben]

BvT :

I take that comment as a true compliment. Many thanks ! !
I've also sent this one to Wiljen for CastPics.

Hopefully, it will make someone's casting a little smoother and
less troublesome. I hope so.

Ben

[ColColt]

I would be ecstatic if Lyman would make a mold that would drop a boolit large enough to not require beagling or a trip to Erik to open it up. Case in point is the 358429 that dropped boolits .356-.357" and I needed to size to .359"-requiring at least a dropped .359" boolit. I sent it back, explained the problem and it was gone three weeks only to receive a new one with virtually the same problem. The top driving band was .356" and the base band varied between .357-.358". I gave up on Lyman.

[bruce381]

BEN nice write up if you get a load for them thats shoots well please post it as I have only gottn patterns with that boolit never any groups.

bruce

[GaryN]

Another thing I noticed is that on molds that come with wave washers, sometimes the wave washer is a little rough and will gouge the top of the mold on brass molds. I took one and worked it over with wet and dry paper down to 1600 grit. It runs very smooth now.

[Ben]

GaryN


You've almost got to be a detective......That's great, that is what a " Tune Up " is all about.

Thanks,
Ben

[Baron von Trollwhack]

AKA Bellevue washer.

BvT

[BACKTOSHOOTING]

Did this tune up to my RCBS & Lyman molds yesterday and cast with them today and was very Happy with the results,
Thanks for posting this thread, was quite helpful, Steve

[tward]

Nice write up Ben! Someone on the forums mentioned they use a chamfering tool to sharpen the sprue plate holes, it works great the tools are usually hardened and sprue plates are fairly soft!
Tim

[Ben]

Glad that all of you got something out of the article ! !

Good Casting,

Ben

[famdoc2892]

When you talk about "breaking the edge" of the blocks, are you referring to the outer edges, or the inner edges where the cavities meet?

[Ben]

When you talk about "breaking the edge" of the blocks, are you referring to the outer edges, or the inner edges where the cavities meet?

If your mold is not offering good bullet base fill out and you are satisfied that your alloy and mold blocks are hot enough & your mold is 100 % free of oils and you continue to have " rounded bullet bases ".....this technique will remedy the problem. Often , air has a problem escaping from the area of the juncture of the sprue plate and the tops of the mold blocks. This air that can't escape can interfere with proper bullet base fill out.
Sometimes this can be remedied by simply loosening the sprue plate hold down screw and putting less tension on the sprue plate. This act of putting less pressure on the sprue plate will often times improve the escape of air and improve the bullet base fill out. If you try this and it doesn't help, it is time for a very slight amount of metal removal.

You take a FLAT FINE CUT SWISS FILE and remove a VERY SLIGHT amount of metal, - - - - Let me repeat A VERY SLIGHT AMOUNT OF METAL , in the areas where the red arrows are pointing. This metal removal is done on both of the mold halves.

If you fail to follow the directions and remove too much metal, you'll end up with fins on the bases of your bullets.
( Not a real big problem as your sizer die will break off the fins, but it is something that can easily be avoided , if you work slow and test your molds for proper base fill out )

Don't over-do this metal removal with your fine cut Swiss file.

When the work is done properly, this BREAKING OF THE EDGE, allows air to escape and greatly improves base fill out on your mold .

Ben

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When I 1st purchased this mold and began to use it this particular Lyman mold wanted to offer about a 70% rate of proper bullet base fill out. Once the work that you see above was done, that changed to 99.5 % near perfect base fill out as you can see in the photo below.

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[miner49r]

Great write up and thanks for sharing.
I noticed in post #8 that you neglected to comment about insetting the sprue washer.
Was it inset to compensate for the double spring washers?

[Ben]

miner49r

That particular sprue plate is a " custom " plate, not a Lyman original . The " inset " that you speak of was done that way by the individual that machined the plate.

Ben