I am thinking about having made......

[mag44uk]

Plastic sabots to fit the Lyman 12g slug.
In essence,the slug will be held inside its own plastic cup which will be in two indentical halves.
This would do away with using a traditional plastic wad.
The cup "halves" will drop away after exiting the barrel.
I would design it so the base of the slug is enclosed.
I like the idea of the slug being fully supported on its travel down the barrel.
I am looking at using this in smooth bore barrels.
I am thinking that these could be a simple injection moulding using a photo- degradeable plastic.
What do you guys think about this idea?
Tony

[longbow]

I am guessing you mean something like for the BRI sabot slug:

http://www.thegunsource.com/item/33922_Winchester_Ammunition_WIN_SPRX_BRI_20GA2_75_ 1OZ_SABT_5_250.aspx

but to suit the Lyman sabot slug?

I agree that supporting the slug fully will help as I have seen recovered Lyman sabot slugs with the skirt shorter than when it started out indicating set back. If it was fully supported then the skirt set back/collapse should be preventable. That should lead to less skirt distortion so more consistency and better accuracy.

Getting the sabot to discard consistently may be a bit tricky but other than that there is no reason I can see your idea shouldn't work. However, I suspect this would be an expensive endeavour to get set up and into production.

If you are serious about it you might check into getting a few sabots machined on a CNC lathe for testing. A material like nylon or Delrin should machine readily and turning out a few sabots for testing shouldn't be too costly.

Personally I lean towards the full bore Brenneke or Gualandi style slugs with no sabot required for smoothbore. Different strokes.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Longbow

[mag44uk]

Thats the type of thing.
I was thinking about the sabot going up to the waist but being quite long.
Long enough to take up the length of a conventional plastic wad to roll crimp into a 70mm case.
The other thought was to have "fins" like a Brenekke as part of the sabot to impart some spin.
I like the Lyman slug and they are .......cheap!
I think the acuracy would be enhanced if its travel down the barrel and subsequent release from the wad could be improved.
Slug is very expensive here,around a dollar a round.
There are enough comps,shooting on paper,to warrant looking into this.
The idea is to get a very accurate round to about 60 yards. Not interested in any terminal ballistics.
There are a few places here in the UK that take on low level moulding jobs that also have cnc machines.
I just need to find a way of making drawings!
Thanks,
Tony

[Blammer]

the trick will be finding the proper plastic for the sabot/wad

it MUST be VERY stiff, or at least keep from being deformed by the pressure and the barrel while IN the barrel.

[longbow]

I am still working on an attached wad slug that has given pretty good results so far but I have fallen behind in testing. Just not enough time.

In any case, so far it is easy to make, fits into a standard shotcup and seems reasonably accurate to 50 yards which is the farthest I have shot it. The big trick is maintaining consistent skirt/wad formation. I am using jigs and hot melt glue to make an attached skirt/wad onto a solid slug.

My experiences so far have been that hollow base slugs deform in the barrel unless heat treated and very thick skirts.

Your sabot idea may solve the deformation which would be a big improvement but it may also be a costly solution. You will have to try to find out.

Something else you might try is an attached wad to the Lyman sabot slug and cast them from antimonial lead then heat treat. I am thinking that holt melt glue cast into the hollow base and then extending 1/4" to maybe 3/8" would help support the skirt by spreading the load and the extended wad would help stabilize the slug.

Just a couple of thoughts for the home tinkerer.

If you decide to pursue the sabot, Blammer is right, you need a stiff. strong plastic. I suggest Delrin or similar plastic. Delrin machines well and is quite stiff and strong.

Longbow

[shotman]

you are over there. Have Jeff Tanner make you a round ball to match the bore ,and use fiber and hot glue as support. it will do all you want

[Beagler]

Plastic sabots to fit the Lyman 12g slug.
In essence,the slug will be held inside its own plastic cup which will be in two indentical halves.
This would do away with using a traditional plastic wad.
The cup "halves" will drop away after exiting the barrel.
I would design it so the base of the slug is enclosed.
I like the idea of the slug being fully supported on its travel down the barrel.
I am looking at using this in smooth bore barrels.
I am thinking that these could be a simple injection moulding using a photo- degradeable plastic.
What do you guys think about this idea?
Tony

I had the same Idea about a year ago. I wish somebody would make them. I talked to the guys at BPI. Figured they would have the ability to do it since they seem to make everthing else related to shot shells. There answer to me was just "Sorry we don't make them". Not long ago I hit them up again on there FB page stating alot of people would be interested in them. There response was the same and they tried pushing there blue sabots for the 50 cal. bullets. Maybe if enough of us bug them about it they will entertain the Idea. Think I will go to the FB page and hit'em again

[turbo1889]

Many have long wished for a BRI type two piece sabot for the Lyman 525gr. 12ga. Wad-Slug.

So far no-one to my knowledge has ever actually followed through on the thought and actually had one made in any noticeable quantity. There is a guy on a Russian language forum who made up a small batch turning them on a CNC lathe from solid rods of plastic and then slicing them in half and another guy who molded some from epoxy that I know of as far as small quantities to test the theory and it does work.

But no mass production injection molding that I am aware of. As far as what plastic to use, whatever they make the tough steel shot wads out of would be my first suggestion since that is "off the shelf" and an industrial knowledge base already exists for using that particular kind of plastic for injection molding shotgun wadding components and it is a lot tougher then the stuff they use for regular shot wads.

[725]

I just managed to squeeze a .715 RB into a WAA12F114 and force it into my H&R Ultra chamber with 30 grains of blue dot. One hole group. Haven't recovered the wad to examine it yet (it was dark out) This has prompted me to order a Jeff Tanner mould of .700 - .702. I want it tight to promote accuracy but not so tight as to be difficult to load. Hoping for the best.

[mag44uk]

Thanks for the replies and PM`s chaps.
I am sure this has got legs!
Tony

[Arisaka99]

Do you mean a sabot like is in the Barnes Copper Sabot slugs? The slug is shaped like an hourglass and with the sabot, it makes it look like a cylinder.

[W.R.Buchanan]

guys' you are talking about a very expensive mould with many cavities in order to produce enougn parts fast enough to make this worth while.

The market is 'limited" and maybe if someone like Midway was interested they would consider making the commitment to make the mould. Or if you could get Midway to commit to some kind of a big order then that could fund the project.

Moulds like this are usually valued in the $25K range so you have to sell alot of Sabots just to make back your tooling costs.

Regular milk bottle polyethylene is the right material. It's dirt cheap, Recycled material could be used. And is similar to what normal wads are made from.

You will definately need machined prototypes to test. They are going to cost you about $3-4 a piece. @ 100 ea. Typical minimum set up for any CNC lathe is $300-350 + material costs.

I see what you are trying to do, and it maybe a good idea. But you are just not in a very good position to do a project like this. I own a machine shop and "I" am not in a good position to do this.

The right person is someone who owns a plastic injection moulding shop, and likes shooting shotgun slugs,,,, alot!


Chris: You're a "Gun Nut". Learn to live with this affliction. We all are trying to cope too!

Randy