What can I expect from cast boolits in a slightly pitted bore?

[got_lead?]

Hello all:

I have a Smelly #4 Mk1 with a very slightly pitted bore. The rifling is sharp, but the bore doesn't have a nice shine to it, and a few strokes with a bore brush confirms the surface is not perfectly smooth.

I have yet to shoot the rifle, what can I expect? Will cast boolits streak all the way down, or do they shoot better than jacketed when the bore isn't perfect.

Is fire lapping an option?

I'm in new terratory here.

[madsenshooter]

Fire lapping is an one option. Another is judicial use of a stainless steel bore brush, which is sometimes hard to find. Last ones I bought came from Natchez shooters supply. I had purchased a Krag with a slightly pitted throat. I took it out, shot it with cast, and noticed each round was a little harder to chamber. The pitted throat had snagged lead from shot one and the remaining rounds were adding to it. Once I got the lead out, it didn't take very many strokes with a stainless brush to smooth the throat enough that it doesn't snag lead anymore. Sometimes lube will fill in minor pits and bad looking bores do amazing well with cast.

[Bent Ramrod]

Slightly less-than-perfect bores tend to be a law unto themselves, but unless there are a significant number of large or deep pits present, your rifle ought to shoot cast boolits fairly well. I have a Remington .30 caliber with a dark bore from chamber to muzzle and it shoots at least as well as a couple of other .30 calibers with pristine bores.

I would hold off fire lapping until you determine if there is actually a problem. One surefire accuracy killer is a trumpet-shaped muzzle caused by the same careless cleaning procedures that left the bore dark in the first place. You might check for that condition when you slug the bore for your boolit diameter.

[Bret4207]

I have a 93 Mauser 7x57 with more than mild pitting, in fact this barrel looks like 12 miles of bad road. But, by cleaning it thoroughly (getting 90 years of copper fouling out) it shot cast pretty fair. Then I got the brilliant idea of running some Lee Mule Snot down the bore on a patch and letting it dry. Ran a dry patch through after that, with some difficulty, and proceeded to shoot some pretty respectable groups. It'll never match my 48 Yugo or FR8, but I have minute of deer kill zone out to 100 yards or more.

[JeffinNZ]

You will have to clean her up and try. I had a Mod 92 Winchester in .32-20 that had a bore that looked like a dry river bed. With the right load it shot just dandy.

[leadman]

I have an old H&R Shikari that was a 44mag that I think was shot with black powder. A rechamber to 445 SuperMag removed some of the pits ahead of the chamber but not all.
I does pretty good with the RCBS 225gr SWC with gas check. Still shoots jacketed as well as any other old H&R I have had.

[Buckshot]

...............Yup, you'll just have to try and see. Be sure to slug it (and the throat too). Loverin designs for "Fat 30's" are few and far between, but if your lands are still sharp and not worn you should be okay with a bore rider, so long as the nose truely DOES ride, or visibly engrave the nose. I'd start with light charges of the common faster powders like Unique and 2400. Work up from those powders to the medium burners (fast rifle powders) like 4227, 4759 to 4198, again starting low and working up. If you're just wanting to shoot it accurately maybe the Unique and/or 2400 range will do what you want. None of the slugs will bounce off the target paper 8-)

I have a 1895 Chilean infantry rifle that is in outstanding condition, except for it's barrel. It must have been the platoon 'duty' rifle as the barrel is worn to a frazzle. It's lands are very noticeably rounded and it's dark with fine pitting. Not much shine to be seen. However it has a good crown, but it's throat ends somewhere up around the rear sight[smilie=1: However it will shoot the (NLA) Lyman 150gr Loverin 287405 as nice as you'd please up to about 1600 fps. The lands are so worn that shooting a bore rider would be a waste of time and components.

The rifle does not lead at all. However upon cleaning the first few patches after brushing push out a thick dark goop. Looking at it in bright sunlight you can tell there is microfine lead dust in what must be solvent thinned lube. The barrel will eat up a bronze brush, and a few strokes leaves what looks like thinned copper paint on the rod:shock: All I do is give it a couple strokes with the brush, push through a few patches with solvent, a couple dry patches and then an oiled patch and put it up. So long as your barrel doesn't have any mega pits it should shoot just fine ................. to some point.

................Buckshot

[got_lead?]

The rifling is sharp, just a bit of light pitting from years of corrosive ammo, there is a lightly pitted ring around the FP as well. Just the usual dues from serving her Majesty's Army in time of need.

I have a 170 grain bore rider that's honed up a bit, and casts large. The nose just barely fits down the muzzle, and it casts out about .314. I am gonna give this one a try. I amxious to shoot the rifle, but have to wait a couple of weks ona die set for it.

[303Guy]

You might try simply polishing the bore with something like Autosol Metal Polish. By that I mean fire-polishing. Just enough to remove the razor sharp edges of the tiny pits that might snag lead. I would do that before shooting cast through the gun just to save on having to clean out lead. The stainless steel bore brush sounds like it will achieve the same thing. A pitted or 'rust textured' bore won't necessarily lead and as stated, the pits will hold lube.

However, a pitted or rough bore needs more care as salts can collect in the tiny pits and promote rusting.

[craig61a]

I have had excellent results using a product such as clover lapping 320 grit compound. I run a solvent soaked patch down the bore, wipe a some compound, make about 15 - 20 careful passes, then patch with solvent to clean out the compound. I have found that this is sufficent enough to smooth over the edges of the pitting that might grab pieces of bullet metal and give some consistancy and accuracy.

Further smoothing will be accomplished when you start shooting it...

[HollowPoint]

I recently got my Enfield No.4 up and running again and the bore description of the OP fits my rifle to a tee.

It seems to shoot just fine. With factory peep sights it get decent accuracy but, I've considered fire lapping.

I recently read a post on casting "Hot Glue" bullets. I thought I'd try casting some "Hot Glue" bullets with their surfaces impregnated with a fine-grit compound of some sort.

I thought I could simply spray my bullet mold cavities with Pam-Cooking-Spray, then dust some lapping compound on them and inject the hot glue.

It seemed to me that this might be an ideal application. I wouldn't even have to drive the twenty miles to the shooting range. I could lap it at home. And these Hot Glue bullets are re-usable.

HollowPoint

[got_lead?]

I like the hot glue lap, I wonder if you could cast it in the bore and use it likd a conventional lap?

[303Guy]

I've rescued a rusted 22lr barrel using kitchen pot scourer abrasive. That gun shoots just fine now and does not lead.

Glue boolits are flexible. Maybe not a bad thing but they won't have the rigidity to lap the tighter areas of the bore more than other areas. For simply smoothing the rust pits that may be just fine. Lapping compound impregnated molten glue might be just the ticket.

I've thought of an abrasive wad behind the boolit, one that is seated tightly in the case neck.

[Char-Gar]

You don't know what you have, until you shoot it and fine out. After the barrel is cleaned and with a bullet of the proper fit, it will probably do much better than you think.

[45 2.1]

Make a good lead throat impact slug and see what you've got. Taking a normal size 30 caliber lead boolit cast soft and patch it up to slightly under throat diameter. (We have an excellent paper patch with smokeless powders here). Shoot a bunch of them and the whole bore will uniform and improve. You just might get very good accuracy doing so.

[Hang Fire]

Can only speak from many years ago for a Model 86 in 45-90 with an atrocious pitted bore. I used 500 grain GC hard cast seated way out in 45-70 cases and 3031 powder. Was pleasantly dumbfounded when the accuracy proved out to be excellent from the get go.

[superior]

I would think that if one were to shoot cb's in a pitted bore, there would'nt be much of a problem, so long as the bore wasn't scrubbed excessively and allowed to develop a uniform bore condition. After all, I would think that the pits would be smoothed eventually from a buildup of lead deposits.
At least that's the way I think it should work ( I have no experience to back it up with though).

[303Guy]

I would think that the pits would be smoothed eventually from a buildup of lead deposits.I think that lead on lead will not work. Those pits should have rounded edges and carry some lube. Lube over lead fill might work.

[largom]

Lube some cast boolits with 320 or finer lapping compound and shoot them. You will be surprised at how easy it is to fire-lap a barrel. Could require anywhere from 6 to 30 shots to clean the bore up. This is also how I "break-in" a new barrel, ALL new barrels!

Larry

[303Guy]

This is also how I "break-in" a new barrel, ALL new barrels!For some time now have had the idea this was a good idea. But I hesitated with my mint bore even though I know it needs polishing or smoothing from about the middle of the bore forward. It has a partially 'cordite conditioned' bore with a slight taper but does lead if not careful, closer to the muzzle. Interesting!

I'm beginning to think a 'slightly' pitted bore is going to be a positive rather than a negative.

[largom]

I had fire-lapping material setting on a shelf for several years but just could not bring myself to shoot GRIT down one of my bores. I acquired a rifle that had a bore that looked like a corn cob inside with tooling marks, not rust pits. At the best this gun shot 3-4 in. groups. I decided I would rebarrel it anyway so why not try the fire-lap. After a dozen or so fire-lap boolits the rifle shot a 5/8 in. group at 100 yds. Since that time I have fire-lapped dozens of barrels, of my own and customers, and have always seen an improvement. I have never had any negative results from fire-lapping but I suppose one could carry a good thing too far.

Larry

[vintagesportsman]

I have an oberndorf in .308 that is ptted bad. My gunsmith wants me to lap the barrel with some JB on an old bronze brush. He says the pits will never leave but the gun will shoot just fine.

[geargnasher]

I don't have a good way to take pictures of the bore, but this .30-30 has a lot of large pits in the bore, some are like nicks in the sides of the lands, but it shoots straight and doesn't lead at all with properly fitting boolits. The rifling is sharp and the barrel is fairly smooth between the pits, and the crown is decent, and the target shows the first three cast boolits I tried on target at 50 yards after cleaning and de-coppering.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=24079&d=1280378396

I tend to agree with 45 2.1, slugging the chamber and throat and paper-patching accordingly might yield excellent results, the paper jacket will keep the gasses sealed behind the boolit even as it passes over the bad spots.

But it might shoot to your satisfaction just the way it is, without firelapping or anything. Try it and see.

Gear