FAL Cast load

[HARRYMPOPE]

I have just run 250 cast loads though my "new to me" FAL Imbal parts gun with 6X Russian "tiger" scope.I have used a load that shoots well in my Saiga 308.This is 30g of Surplus 4895 and a Lyman 311466 Bullet from my 4 cavity.When i first tried the bullet is wouldn't enter the throat very well and sort of bumped the rifling while the Saga's big chamber eats it all up..Accuracy was inconsistent from best of 2" to "stringy" 4" groups.Loads functioned great with the gas nut set to "3".I then decided to run my 311466 nose first into my taper die to put a 1 deg taper from the first band to about the 3rd.The bullets now engraved and the aluminum GC was now flush with the bottom of the case neck.I loaded 15 to test this AM and so far it looks promising.While my Saiga 308 shoots lead a bit better this is getting acceptable.

Left group is the first 5. The #1 shot from the cold barrel went low and the next 4 up and tight(total group 2.25").Target to the right is 10 shots after a slight scope adjustment and is 2.2" and round.

George

[nicholst55]

That's as good as most FALs will do with j-word bullets! Good shooting, George!

[JeffinNZ]

I agree. Well done. The FAL or SLR, as it was known in the NZ Army, is a great old war horse but no target rifle.

[HARRYMPOPE]

i am sure the next time out i will be at 4" groups again,but it feels good for now.The taper die made the big difference.

George

[JeffinNZ]

On an aside, a veteran of SE Asia with the NZ Army once told me how the VC hated the AU and NZ troops as they carried the FAL/SLR and their rounds had a nasty habit of punching through 'cover' that would stop M16 rounds.

[nicholst55]

7.62X51mm NATO; turning cover into concealment since 1957!

[HARRYMPOPE]

That's as good as most FALs will do with j-word bullets! Good shooting, George!

the rifle shoots best at 1.2"-1.6"(5 shot groups) with Sierra 168's.it still throws a few out with jacketed to make many 2" groups.I'm happy so far with my FAL.i do like the idea of a 30 cal semi auto.

George

[HARRYMPOPE]

Shot the 311466/4895 load one more time this AM.I shot two ten shot groups at 100 yards out of a full 20 round magazine.Functioning was 100% and groups acceptable.I'd like the have the high one back one the left group,but such is life.

right group is 2.75" and left one 3.25" with 9 of them into 2" even.

George

[HARRYMPOPE]

After today's shooting i deiced to field strip the rifle.I barely go the gas plug removed it was wedged so tight.it was plated with lead and shavings were all over.it was my own personal lead mine so to speak.i am uncertain how long until i would have reliability issues,but me feeling is the FAl is not the best cast semi auto rifle choice.I am not willing to scape it out every 300 shots.My Saiga 308 has many more though the tube without any problems.

George

[missionary5155]

Good morning
My 2 Fal´s like the RCBS 180 gr gc fn with enough powder to get to 2200. Not a tack driver but cycles reliably and I can hit bowling pins at 100 yards consistently. If I had my loading book here I could give you a little bettter info.
Mike in Peru

[offshore44]

Good show! Normal accuracy with my FAL and DAG surplus is around 2 - 3", so your cast is right in that ball park. As a previous poster said, that is pretty normal and reasonable accuracy for an FAL. The first shot and the last shot out of the mag tend to open up the group size, and verticle stringing is also normal. A precision bolt gun they aren't.

I was wondering about how much lead you would collect in the gas system.

[10x]

I have a FAL - the Canadian government has declared it to be prohibited and has decided that it is far too dangerous to shoot - at all. So it sits on a gun rack and waits for rational and reasonable gun laws.

On the bright side my Norinco 305 (M14 clone) shoots 180 grain cast bullets very nicely with H335 and I have an inexpensive source of milsurp powder that is equivalent to H335.

[HARRYMPOPE]

I was wondering about how much lead you would collect in the gas system.

Not much in the tube itself,but the outside of the plug where it touches the gas tube where the buildup occurs.This is what binds it up tight.I cleaned it out and shot 30 rounds yesterday and that alone was enough to make it very hard to remove.In all honesty it may just get to that point and stop.it had no more than when i fired teh first 300 rounds with cast.

George

[greywuuf]

not sure what barrel you have on an imbel, the newer kits will have a US made new barrel and the older imports can have about anything, if it is in fact a US made barrel I would expect the drilled gas port to still be a little rough and possibly shaving lead, there is no real reason to get lead SHAVINGS in the gas port of a smooth bored gas gun...I think you need to play with it a bit more, I would help by shooting cast in mine but I stall have a couple cans of Various milsup left to unload first, plus I only have large bore pistol molds ... so casting for mine is not high priority.

if the lead shavings continue you might consider slinging a number of J bullets Down range .. or even some "Fire lapping" rounds.

[randyrat]

I have a FAL - the Canadian government has declared it to be prohibited and has decided that it is far too dangerous to shoot - at all. So it sits on a gun rack and waits for rational and reasonable gun laws.

On the bright side my Norinco 305 (M14 clone) shoots 180 grain cast bullets very nicely with H335 and I have an inexpensive source of milsurp powder that is equivalent to H335.
There is a way to make your FAL into a stripper clip gun only (not permanent) using a allen head screw to hold a modified 5-10 rd mag into the lower.
The only permanent thing is the hole into the lower mag well. Of course, that would suck eggs and you could only load with stripper clips. They did that with California legal FALs. OH yeah, they also remove the pistol grip and added a little stub. It kinda looks like a neutered poodle with no legs. You also gotta blind pin and solder any muzzle device. I believe that made them Cal legal.
The hole (covered with solder) with the allen head screw could be drilled out someday if you want to bring it back. Just an idea.

[greywuuf]

RandyRat,
The poster is a Canadian and not Californian, I believe by their laws a Fal is a Fal is a FAl. Specified explicitly , not by an arbitrary set of attributes as was our law. his may even allready have the stripper clip dust cover as the one I have on mine is I believe an original Canadian piece as well, and the Magazine not removable without a tool thing is handled in a much more restorable method by drilling and tapping a set screw into the Mag release lever... that way no holes in the receiver. I did one build that way pre sunset, and although it was kinda bulky in the soft case and you could not mount "traditional" optics it was quite usable as the strippers were kinda handy, still have several thousand rounds loaded on clips.

[Ben]

Shot the 311466/4895 load one more time this AM.I shot two ten shot groups at 100 yards out of a full 20 round magazine.Functioning was 100% and groups acceptable.I'd like the have the high one back one the left group,but such is life.

right group is 2.75" and left one 3.25" with 9 of them into 2" even.

George
___________________________

George that is some fine shooting out of a military semi auto .30 cal.
I never met a Loverine that I didn't like.

Ben

[HARRYMPOPE]

not sure what barrel you have on an imbel, the newer kits will have a US made new barrel and the older imports can have about anything, if it is in fact a US made barrel I would expect the drilled gas port to still be a little rough and possibly shaving lead, there is no real reason to get lead SHAVINGS in the gas port of a smooth bored gas gun...I think you need to play with it a bit more, I would help by shooting cast in mine but I stall have a couple cans of Various milsup left to unload first, plus I only have large bore pistol molds ... so casting for mine is not high priority.

if the lead shavings continue you might consider slinging a number of J bullets Down range .. or even some "Fire lapping" rounds.

i have shot a few Hornady 165 SP's though the gun.The barrel is a milsurp Argentinian barrel i was told and is very smooth and does not lead at the 1900 fps loads i am shooting.The sides of the plug is plated with lead and almost impossible to remove after very few shots.I am still going to play with it and see if different gas setting will make a difference.

George

[HARRYMPOPE]

___________________________

George that is some fine shooting out of a military semi auto .30 cal.
I never met a Loverine that I didn't like.

Ben

I too like Loverins,but until i tapered this one it wouldn't shoot very well in this rifle.I tried so non functional loads @1500 with the SAECO 315, RCBS 165 SIl and 31466 and they vertically strung very bad.

George

[Ben]

Tell us how you taper the Loverins ? ?

[HARRYMPOPE]

I taper bullets in a lubraziser with a taper die from Eagan.it is a 1 deg taper and i run bullets in nose first to reduce the first band or two to fit the throats.I have dies for my press that i can also use,but these are convenient.I have them in a couple tapers for 30.I have 20 or so being made by a machinist for a few of us CBA guys. i may sell the spares.I had to have that many made to get a price break and make it worth his time and the reamer cost.

George

[HARRYMPOPE]

I shot FAL the rifle in a two day match.Before the match 200 rounds were fired and i shot 160 more at the match.Rifle was not cleaned and the point of impact stayed good.It was a score match but i had one 10 shot group into 3.5" at 200 yards(too bad it was in the 9 ring!)I used a non functioning load with the SAECO #315(22 bhn) at 1700 fps to keep brass from hitting other shooters.The bad is the gas system was leaded badly and a bear to remove it to clean.While it shoot very well it its too much of a pain to clean out.My Saiga 308 shoots better with cast and the loose gas system hasn't had any problems to date.

see pictures of the lumps of lead on the plug and piton.I had to beat the piston out from the action side.

george

[truckmsl]

Hey George - let that sit in a small container of 50-50 hydrogen peroxide and white vinegar for a few minutes and it will be clean as new.

[HARRYMPOPE]

Hey George - let that sit in a small container of 50-50 hydrogen peroxide and white vinegar for a few minutes and it will be clean as new.

never heard of than one

[truckmsl]

After reading up on this mixture I see where the end result is an aqueous solution of lead acetate, which is considered highly toxic, so maybe not such a good idea after all.