Another KaBoom.

[littlejack]

Sorry fellas, no pictures.
I was called by my nephew two days ago from Bend.
My brother (his dad) and him were shooting nephews S&W 44 magnum Hunter Classic, and it blowed up. They were shooting reloads that nephews Step-dad had loaded. He had loaded them with 15 grains of AA7 under a 240 grain cast swc. Nephew immediately called his Step-dad and told him he had just blowed up his Hunter Classic with HIS ------- reloads. They both felt bad, as the Classic was given to nephew BY his Step-dad about 15 years ago.
Anyway, the usual happened. The top strap was totally gone, as was the top three chambers. They were truly blessed, as neither nephew or my brother were injured. Nephew's thumb got slapped by ?, as his off hand was in the usual position except that his thumb was laying against the left side of the top strap and cylinder.
Go figure.
Only a brused thumb was had by him.
It was deduced that there must have been a double charge in the case when the trigger was pulled.
Step-dad loaded with a Dillon progressive, but I do not know the model.
Just a few rounds prior to the KaBoom, there was a round fired that had no powder in it. Brother and nephew had to pound the boolit out from the muzzle.
Speculation is that maybe the powder that didn't go into the dud cartridge, double charged in the KaBoom cartridge.
God is Good. Lets be careful.
Jack

[Blov]

Ouch, glad everyone is ok. That is the reloaders nightmare, the double charge. It is really too bad about the Hunter classic, but it can be replaced.

[DrB]

Thanks for the post.

[songdog53]

Sorry about the gun but thank goodness your nephew wasn't injured.

[tek4260]

Glad everyone is okay. If I were shooting someone else's reloads and had a squib, you can be your ... that I would not shoot another single one, especially out of that box.

Now that I think about it, I have never shot anyone's reloads other than my dad's.

[44man]

Pounding out loads on a progressive is always a formula for disaster.
Dillon makes the best but it is not foolproof.
I have turret presses and do two operations like sizing and expanding at one time by turning the turret. Then brass has the pockets cleaned and primed by hand. I put them in a block. Powder is thrown from a Redding measure and is weighed if powder is a stick powder or does not flow to exact weights.
Every single case is inspected for powder levels before boolits are seated.
I do not trust measures on top of a press and anything automatic.
Speed kills, plain and simple!
Even 296 can bridge in a measure. You better pay attention and to rely on a progressive is asking for a blown gun.
Doesn't the Dillon have a powder check?

[MGySgt]

I have a Dillion RL 550B, bought it new in 82.

I seat myself so I can look into each casing after it comes from the powder die. I have yet to find a case empty or with a double charge.

I have double charged on it but only when I have short stroked the ram - like a boolit not starting straight in the next station - bring the ram up about 3/4s the wayu and realize the boolit is a litle crooked or something doesn't feel right. A common thing we do on a single station press (RCIV). I take the case from the powder station and dump the powder back into the powder measure and put it back in the powder station.

With a progressive loader you have to be just as diligent and observant (if not a little more because you have 4 or 5 operations going on at the same time) as to what you are doing as you are with a single station and ther eis a few things (like short stroking) that you simply can not do on a progressive.

I use to try for speed on my 550 - but over the last 20 years I have slowed down beasue I started hearing of cases without powder or double chargred cases.

This works for me and I trust MY reloads.

[454PB]

Sorry to hear this, the loss of a fine handgun, but at least nobody was hurt.

I don't use AA #7, but will 30 grains fit in the case?

[Groo]

Groo here
I suspect a hangfire- caused by too little powder...
The bullet is stuck in the BC gap by the primer as the powder smolders..
then the powder lights as the pressure builds but the bullet is not moving normal.
The cylinder lets go because the bullet becomes a plug...
I do not down load any magnum powder Ever.. I do not use a progressive press
any more and if I want less kick I use a smaller case or trailboss

[felix]

Maybe not, but 20 will and that is 5 grains too much. 15 grains is on the ragged edge anyway, especially for a Smith. ... felix

[littlejack]

Thanks for all the best fellas.
I load my 45 acp rounds on the Dillon SDB. I bought this press in the mid 80's. It is a great press, but as stated above, the progressive presses are not perfect.
I load with my SDB, very causiously and am very direct in what I am doing. In other words, when I am raising or lowering the handle to size,prime, bell,charge powder,seat and/or rotate, I do it and watch and make sure that all is functioning well during the cycle. This will also make ones press and parts last a lot longer, rather than slamming the rotory shell holder to an abrupt stop every time and bouncing a charged case around and throwing out the powder. I load for QUALITY, rather than quantity. I can look and see the powder charge in the case if needed. I have been going to mount a mirror so that powder inspection will be easier.
This KABOOM will cause me to speed up the installation.
I DO believe that if a double charge was entered into one of his cases, it would have been very visable if the loader had been paying attention.
Jack

[ColColt]

Awful accident and my heart goes out to both parties. Progressive reloaders are fine I suppose for some but for this ol' dinosaur, I'm sticking with my RCBS Jr and DU-O-Measure powder dispenser. No accidents in over 38 years of reloading. Slow...but sure. It's a hobby and I'm never into mass production. I look over every case before putting a boolit in them. You just can't be too careful.

[justingrosche]

Pounding out loads on a progressive is always a formula for disaster.
Dillon makes the best but it is not foolproof.
I have turret presses and do two operations like sizing and expanding at one time by turning the turret. Then brass has the pockets cleaned and primed by hand. I put them in a block. Powder is thrown from a Redding measure and is weighed if powder is a stick powder or does not flow to exact weights.
Every single case is inspected for powder levels before boolits are seated.
I do not trust measures on top of a press and anything automatic.
Speed kills, plain and simple!
Even 296 can bridge in a measure. You better pay attention and to rely on a progressive is asking for a blown gun.
Doesn't the Dillon have a powder check?
I batch load also. Size and expand on a turret, hand prime, charge powder and inspect every case in the block for powder charge.Slow, but hard to make a critical error.

[Multigunner]

I always seat the bullet immediately after charging the case.
I also turn every case upside down to let any hiden debris fall out before charging the case.

I've found expended primers that immigrated into a case and even a live bee inside a case left unattended for only seconds.

I've used the Lyman 310 nutcracker, the Lee Loader, and now use a Lee Hand press.
I don't shoot enough rounds at any one time to warrant any complicated loading out fits.
The simpler hands on tools don't leave as many opportunities to screw up.
As Murphy's Law states "what ever can go wrong will go wrong".

[Heavy lead]

Well that stinks, but am certainly glad he's ok. I do load all my handguns on LNL's I always, always visually check with a bright light over the station when I seat the boolit, or bullet. Also I always use a powder for a given purpose that will if double charged bring the powder level at least to the top edge of the cartridge.
Good luck and be careful.

[Ben]

Last week, I helped a father and his son get started reloading the 38 Spec.

They are using Trail Boss to prevent the very thing that we are reading about here.

We spent a considerable amount of time talking about the dangers of double charges with powders like B'eye.

The father agreed that his son would not load a single cartridge unless he was present to insure 4 eyes were watching each procedure instead of the usual 2.

Ben

[PacMan]

Last year there was a guy on here that was trying to set his nephew up reloading the 243 win. and by his post was going to let him at it all to his self after teaching him the basic.I forget the powder he had bought but seemed like is was unique or along those lines. I sugested that he use a powder that would fill the case and still give accuracy and velocity. ReLoader something dont remember now as i had looked it up at the time.
I explained the reason why and was attempting to make it impossible for a kid to overload the case.
Best i could tell it fell on deft ears. OH well you can only do so much. Then you hope for the best.

[Dale53]

I have loaded a couple hundred thousand rounds on Progressive loaders with out issue. You just have to "pay attention", that's all. I have used Lee's Pro 1000, CH inline progressive (Mk IV), and three Dillons (a 450 and two 550 b's).

Many others have done so, also. There have been problems, but they are operator problems, almost invariably.

Dale53

[MtGun44]

A shame to lose the gun, but the people being safe is great news.

One double charge on my manually powder dropped Dillon 450 about 26-7 yrs ago. No
big harm. Never a repeat - BE CAREFUL and LOOK AT the powder every single case
that moves through one of the Dillon 550Bs that I use today.

Bill

[Artful]

Glad no one is hurt - sorry about the gun but they'll make more - send bits back to S&W see if they'll give a discount.
Best to use a powder that will overflow on double charge
- Dillon's are just a tool dependant upon your use of the gray matter god gave ya. Don't blame the tool.

[MGySgt]

Just cause -

FWIW -

I checked quick load - 30 grains of AA 7 is 136% charge in a 44 mag case - It wasn't a double charge.

[44man]

I always seat the bullet immediately after charging the case.
I also turn every case upside down to let any hiden debris fall out before charging the case.

I've found expended primers that immigrated into a case and even a live bee inside a case left unattended for only seconds.

I've used the Lyman 310 nutcracker, the Lee Loader, and now use a Lee Hand press.
I don't shoot enough rounds at any one time to warrant any complicated loading out fits.
The simpler hands on tools don't leave as many opportunities to screw up.
As Murphy's Law states "what ever can go wrong will go wrong".
You missed a fun shot! BZZZZZZZZZ all the way to the target! :smile:

[garym1a2]

Due to liability concerns I will not load for others. only my brother. Hot loads are charge with 2400 for me

[white eagle]

I am beginning to think my single stage is looking real good
may take longer but that kinda thing would be tough to do
never give handloads to anyone either unless they are proven by me and fired from my guns

[44man]

I am beginning to think my single stage is looking real good
may take longer but that kinda thing would be tough to do
never give handloads to anyone either unless they are proven by me and fired from my guns
Slow and easy with attention always on what you are doing. 20 rounds that hit are better the 1000 that spray.
A second of not paying attention can destroy a gun or injure a guy. In 56 years I have never wanted a progressive.
A few like to load one case all the way through and that can be wrong if you are distracted for a second. A friend did that and his son asked him something. He forgot the powder in one and the boolit stuck in the bore. He fired another behind it and ruined his gun.
I fear for my friends so please, PLEASE look in every case.
To trust a machine to dump the powder is asking for trouble.

[littlejack]

One thing is for sure.
Anything mechanical WILL eventually fail. It's just a matter of time.
Jack

[Hammerhead]

Glad everyone is OK.
I have to see every charge before I seat a bullet.
I chose a turret press years ago when I started handloading just to slow things down and concentrate on one cartridge at a time. I've thought of 'upgrading' to a progressive from time to time, but there's always a kaboom story involving a progressive press that convinces me not to.