Safety Question Overall Length 44 Special

[Thebeancounter]

I think I may have misunderstood the Lee reloading book and need advice.

I am reloading for 44 Special. I am using the starting charge of 4.6 Gr of Titegroup (wow that is some dirty stuff, but that is another issue) and I am using a Lee 200 Gr round nose bullet. The pistol is a S&W 629 and can handle magnum loads. I want accuracy, after all, I am shooting paper.

I looked at the overall length of 1.615 inches and loaded them up. Then one of the guys at the range told me to stuff the bullet into the case until it looks like a commercially loaded round. I admit it does look a little goofy.

Jazzing around with the bullet seating has to make a difference in pressure, so I started researching the topic - lots of discussion about rifle stuff but not too much about hand guns.

I would like to know if it is safe to seat the bullet deeper as maybe the magic 1.615 number is a maximum length? I read lots of cautions about seating the bullet too deep, but nowhere did I see a safe range - only the 1.615 number.

And another thing, what if you are loading bullets of different weights? Lighter or heavier bullets have to impact the overall length or affect pressure.

There is discussion about what goes on between when the round is discharged and when the bullet makes contact with the lands and grooves. Rifle guys want as little distance as possible between the bullet and the rifling when the round is chambered. In my case there is a relatively huge gap the bullet has to jump before it makes contact with the lands and grooves. So is it better to use magnum brass to reduce the distance the bullet "jumps"? Perhaps I am over analyzing all of this.

Thanks in advance for your comments,
- Bill

[MtGun44]

There is no "magic number" in LOA. Only the number used by the guy that did the pressure
testing. If the boolit design has a crimp groove, then they probably used it and you will
probably use it, too, so no issue. With no crimp groove, and esp in a semiauto where the
throats vary a lot, you will set YOUR LOA by dismounting the bbl and using it as a gauge.

If you are seating significantly deeper than the guy that did the loading data that you are
using, you need to consider that and reduce the load appropriately for your smaller
combustion chamber. A smaller combustion chamber will produce higher pressures.

If you reduce the combustion chamber volume by 10%, I'd start at the starting load minus
10-15% and work up from there.

Cyl length and mag length are actual hard limits on LOA, and the throat dimensions in a
semiauto is another 'hard limit', but other than these mechanical fit issues, the LOA is whatever
you want it to be.

Bill

[Thebeancounter]

Thanks. I'll load up another batch and make the adjustments.

[mooman76]

Good advice by Mtgun44. There is also the option you mentioned of using 44mag brass. I often load 44 special loads in 44mag brass. No need to worry about excess pressure because you are giving the bullet more air space. I wouldn't worry too much about what joe blow at the range says for advice either unless he is a credible source. Is he just some guy or do you know him and is he an experienced loader?

[Mal Paso]

There is discussion about what goes on between when the round is discharged and when the bullet makes contact with the lands and grooves. Rifle guys want as little distance as possible between the bullet and the rifling when the round is chambered. In my case there is a relatively huge gap the bullet has to jump before it makes contact with the lands and grooves. So is it better to use magnum brass to reduce the distance the bullet "jumps"? Perhaps I am over analyzing all of this.

Thanks in advance for your comments,
- Bill

My 629 originally had .429 cylinder throats and Specials were less accurate than Magnums. Since the throats were reamed Specials are just as accurate. YMMV

[Snapping Twig]

Like was said, OAL is determined by bullet weight and dimension, there is no universal OAL.

That said, if you know which bullet you are using and refer to Mfg. specs, there is a suggested OAL.

Reloading data takes into account powder charge, available space and case dimension.

Crimping grooves allow for correct seating depth for a given bullet.

In 44Spl, typically you use a cast bullet, these have a crimping groove and owing to the low pressure (typically) of the cartridge, you are not riding the ragged edge of pressure, so variations in the position of the bullet are not quite so critical. Use the groove.

For copper jacketed bullets, these too have a crimping groove and if not, there is an OAL listed in your reloading book for that weight bullet.

Good luck and post a pic or two to let us see your work - we like pictures. :)

[Silver Jack Hammer]

For what it's worth I measured 10 gr. of Unique with a 429421 crimped in the crimping groove and it clocked at 1197 fps. Switching to RCBS 44-250-K the longer driving band wouldn't allow the cartridges to chamber. I had to seat the entire driving band into the case and crimp over the driving band. Concerned about over pressures I started low and worked my way up to 1192 fps. This velocity was achieved with 9.0 gr. of Unique. So roughly .10" reduction of overall length required 1 grain less of Unique to achieve the same velocity. Tests done in a 3-screw 7 1/2" SBH with the same brass, same powder and Alox lube in both, but different bullets, same alloy of straight Linotype. Take this for what it is worth. Try to get a copy of Dave Scovill's Loading for the Peacemaker, Colt's Model P. I think you'll find it interesting.