Saeco Quality???

[cutter_spc]

I recently caught a mold on sale at Midway that I had been holding out for sometime now, a Saeco #356. I was able to get some of these from a member here sometime back to test in my 357 max barrel, turns out the ones he cast for me fit my barrel like they were made for each other. So needless to say when I caught it on sale I pounced on it. Well I have been working my tail off here lately and when I finally got a day off today you can guess was I was on a mission to do.

I cleaned the mold blocks, put on the handles, fired up the pot, preheated the mold. Once the pot got to temp, I started casting and noticed real quick that the bullets were sticking to the cavities a little more than I thought they should. After dropping about 50 bullets it was time to look over a few real close, my heart sank with what I saw.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e115e766f68d.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1374)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e11605beb68c.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1375)http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e11605beb68c.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1375)http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e11605beb68c.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1375)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e11605c09949.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1376)

I have never seen a mold drop bullets that look like this, and I knew instantly what the cause was without even looking at the mold, chatter. I work in the machining industry, and I see this stuff all the time. How it got passed there QC department is what I intend to find out.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_133174e11605c40840.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1377)

After the mold cooled down, I gave it a better inspection than I had before. Both cavities have it and on both haves (hey at least they are consistent!). These bullets have so many humps and bumps running they're length, they wont even roll!:shock::shock::shock::shock:

I intend to write up an email with pics and give them a shout Tuesday morning to find out what they intend to do about it. I'll post back with the results.

Personally I am sick of this **** in our shooting industry. I would guess that 70% of the shooting related items I have purchased in the past couple of years has NOT met my expectations and shouldn't have been sent out in the first place! Barrel with a bad chamber (custom maker 6 month wait to get it), dies that looked as if they were polished with a rock, loading press sent out with out all of its parts, flash whole deburrer handle not threaded, NEW custom mold came to me well used and with more burrs than Lee produces in a year, new revolver with the trigger so crooked it was actually sticking out one side of the trigger guard,.................... the list goes on and on. I can't be the only one getting this shotty **** can I?

[MikeS]

I can't comment on the poor QC, unfortunately it's everywhere these days, not only in the shooting sports! But, as you bought it from Midway, they have excellent customer support, and if Redding doesn't fix the problem, just have Midway exchange it. I have several Saeco moulds (all of them bought used, so I can't comment on new production) that have all been great, some of the best production moulds in my experience (which is limited).

[Circuit Rider]

Have 3 Saeco molds, always drop great boolits. As Mikes suggested, talk to Redding, they have always done me right. Whether product or tech question. CR

[Crash_Corrigan]

I have a Seaco mold that throws .411 diam boolits of 252 grains all day long. It is a 3 cavity mold and it is the best performing molid I have ever used.

I bought it new just a few months ago from Midway. I have at least 60 molds that I can find and a few others that have walked away some. Some just replaced, a few loaned to very good friends (I have some of theirs also) and others just on walkabout.

However this mold is a joy to use. I have had very good experiences with Redding and Saeco equipment. It ain't cheap but it usually is what is was touted to be and it works so I like it.

[kbstenberg]

Cutter It sounds like you have the same luck I do. What ever you get it came from the bottom of the QC spectrum.
Kevin

[cutter_spc]

I'm sorry for the rant guys. It's just that I try my best to buy tools with a reputation for quality and I'm not rich, so it's a significant investment for me. Here lately I think I would be better off buying Chinese stuff and saving lots of money to boot.

Unfortunately I know that Redding has a good customer service dept., care to guess where my incomplete press came from:mad:

[bhn22]

One interesting point. You bought a quality mould, so you officially have ******** rights over the defects. It's not like you bought the cheapest *** you could find, and are complaining about the quality. I'm certain SAECO will replace the mould for you.

[cutter_spc]

Well I called Redding this morning, I couldn't find a number for Saeco. I got to speak with a guy named AJ. I told him about my new Seaco mold making "stop sign" bullets, he told me to send the mold to them with a letter stating the problem and if it was found to be defective they would replace it.

Now i tried to be nice through out the conversation, the object is for me to get my mold replaced with a GOOD one. but it really burns me to have to spend shipping money On something they may not fix. I think in the letter I send in with the mold I will turn up the pressure a little.

[Buckshot]

"but it really burns me to have to spend shipping money On something they may not fix. I think in the letter I send in with the mold I will turn up the pressure a little. "

.............Well just don't be rude or crude with'em. Won't gain anything. I do hear ya about paying shipping from where ya bought it, then having to pay shipping back to the place that made it, and it shouldn't have LEFT there in the 1st place!

I've never had a problem with a Saeco mould and I have 11 of'em. I also have several RCBS moulds and their quality is comparable. Years back I bought their 7mm-168 mould. The mould blocks must not have closed completely when they were being cherried as they produced a football shaped boolit. Pretty obviously NOT round. I sent it back and got a brand new one EXACTLY like the one I'd sent.

This time I called and let them know what had happened. I said I would include my credit card number and if they also agreed that the 2nd mould I was paying to send back was indeed also incorrect, I'd appreciate it if they'd credit my shipping charges to me, as I felt that would only be fair. I also included a couple cast boolit with the mould blocks. I got a new mould back which included a couple nice round well cast boolits, AND a copy of the credit slip where they'd reimbursed my shipping charges. I thought that was nice.

Some time later on I called needing a new rod for thier primer pocket swage tool. The lady said she'd send one right out gratis and asked for my address. What's right is right, and that wasn't right. I'd ruined the rod due to too much pressure and it wasn't their fault, which I let her know. She said it was okay and didn't want me to pay for it. I said I didn't operate that way and if she didn't want my money I'd simply have to order another set from where I'd bought it. She laughed and said okay, she'd take my money.

..............Buckshot

[cutter_spc]

Buckshot, when I said turn up the heat, I meant in a tactful way. I know the object is for me to secure a good mold. The way I plan on doing this is by mentioning in the letter how "people who I have shown the mold to can't believe it left the factory and when I posted pics of the mold on cast boolits every one assured me that Redding would replace it". Kinda lets them know they're not just dealing with one induvidual, and other people are aware of they're mistake.:grin:

[jimofaz]

Whatever you do, don't chamfer the female pin alignment holes! I did this to a #315 old several years ago, trying to correct a .005" out-of-round cast bullet with the pins set tight. No rattle or click while holding the blocks together up to my ear and trying to rotate the block halves in different directions & no light showing thru the parting line. I sent it back & Saeco refused to honor their replacement warranty claiming the mold had been 'modified', and then proceeding to explain that the chamfered pin holes was cause of the out-of-round bullets. Even though I have many other Saeco molds that previously came thru fine in the quality department, I have refused to purchase any Redding/Saeco products since that day. I did not care for the attitude of their cust. service person. Jim

[MikeS]

From what I see here, it seems that their wonderful warranty can be hit or miss. I think that when buying a new mould it pays to get it from a place like Midway, as at least they will stand behind it if the factory doesn't! Of course this doesn't help if you buy the moulds used as I do! I currently own 5 Saeco moulds, and I've been lucky. Some moulds I will only buy new, specifically Lee moulds, as I've never had a problem with a new one, but did get a worn out one on eBay (I was able to save it tho). But then there's a BIG difference in price from a new Lee and a new Saeco! I just bought a couple of Saeco moulds that I haven't gotten in yet, I'm hoping I have good luck with them as I have with the other Saeco moulds I have.

[cutter_spc]

Well I got a package from Redding the other day, they replaced the mold. But after looking it over it has the same defects, only not as bad. I haven't had the time to try casting with it, but I really have my doubts about it casting usable boolits. They must have run a whole bunch of bad molds of this design, I wonder if they know this kind of stuff can harm your reputation! Debating as to send it back again ($8 more of my $$$) or just have Midway exchange it for an RCBS!

I'll try to cast with it soon, and get some new pics up.

[cajun shooter]

I'm sorry to hear about your trouble with a Saeco mould. They are along with RCBS the best quality mould for the money that you may buy. The price of Saeco moulds are very close to the price for a custom built Accurate Mould. At $120 to your door for a 3 cavity brass mould that is lathe cut is a great buy. I purchased my first Accurate mould over 14 months ago and posted a message about how nice they are. I see all kinds of others who have also purchased from Tom. The brass was my first but not my last as I have purchased others since. He offers different materials but I suggest you try the brass. Good Luck

[Swede44mag]

Thanks for the post I WAS considering ordering a Saeco mold but not anymore.
When I am ready I think I will order an Accurate Mould.

I would contact Midway and get my money back since Saeco either doesn't care or doesn't know how to make a good mold anymore.

[leadman]

I bought that same Saeco mold from Midway a couple years ago and could not be happier with it.
Then again I bought an RCBS 41 mag mold about 5 years ago and the halves were offset. Midway sent me another just like it. I then called RCBS and they checked their stock. They were all the same.
I then ordered a Saeco that casts great.

I think the people that are doing the machine work and inspections are not boolit casters and so not know what to look for. Or are too busy testing on their cell to care.

[cutter_spc]

Hey Leadman, I'll trade ya! :mrgreen:

[stubshaft]

I am disappointed to hear that SAECO QC has apparently been compromised. I have six SAECO molds I bought over 20 years ago (when they still had 3 digit mold numbers) and have never had a problem with any of them. They are the only factory mold maker that I could say that about. I guess i'll stick to my creed "if it wasn't made in the 1900's then I won't buy it".

[Buckshot]

I am disappointed to hear that SAECO QC has apparently been compromised. I have six SAECO molds I bought over 20 years ago (when they still had 3 digit mold numbers) and have never had a problem with any of them. They are the only factory mold maker that I could say that about. I guess i'll stick to my creed "if it wasn't made in the 1900's then I won't buy it".

.............Kinda like my few NEI moulds. All made by Walt. Older moulds bought second hand but cast perfect. I wouldn't buy a new NEI on a bet. As I mentioned in my previous post, I have 11 Saeco's with nary an issue. If Saeco has something I need in the future I'd still buy it. I'm about 'Lymaned Out', and I don't see myself buying any new Lyman's again.

................Buckshot

[gasboffer]

I hate to hear all this. I just ordered a Seaco #130($145.93 with handles)
Pray for me.

[redneckdan]

Any more I try to do business with the little guys. Some favorites here are NOE and MIHec for molds. 7x Leather for leather goods, I hear good things about Whyte but haven't dealt with them yet, I plan to remedy that in the future. Lathesmith can't be beat for size dies, better than what magma turns out for the star and lee is not even in the same league for push thrus.

For other stuff, I like Empire Canvas Works for winter outdoor clothing. I don't even bother with the likes of Patagonia or Mountain Hardware, they're all made in china.

[GLL]

Talk to Tom at Accurate Molds ! He will draw up exactly what you want, cut an absolutely beautiful custom brass mold for you, and deliver it to your door in about the same time Midway can ship a standard mold !

http://www.accuratemolds.com/

http://www.fototime.com/8F95495D13D5995/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/802153ED687B012/standard.jpg

Jerry

[OuchHot!]

I generally just lurk on this forum and mostly prefer not to say anything negative. Based on the mold I just received from midway; a 3 cavity #322, I can say I will stick with noe, mihec, accurate and so on. The SAECO's cavities are very rough and the sprue plate has to be lapped....it grooved the top of the molds when they assembled it. On the one hand, we have the great benefit of small shop customs that are beyond anything I could get 20-30y ago but the old standby companies seem to be losing it.