Kimber Bent Barrel

[Kskybroom]

Freinds Kimber locked open. So he sent in to the factory
Thay said the barrel is bent do to reloads,,,,,
Thay want $380.00 for a new barrel:holysheep
5.0gr 231 200gr swc ?????
Anybody herd of a barrel bending ????

[BD]

I bulged a Kimber barrel once about 7 or 8 years ago. They sent me a new one for $129. $380? Something more to this story?
BD

[Lee W]

It sounds like a pile of something to me. I have ringed a barrel, but never bent one.

All I can think of is the barrel metal was not of good quality, or not heat treated correctly.


I have installed three of these.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=7611/product/1911_AUTO_EASY_FIT_BARREL_KIT

[KCSO]

Probably not bent but BULGED. Had this happen 3 times to customers shooting with WOLF ammo. One round goes pop and the bullet doesn't clear the barrel but the case ejects and another round is fired with a bullet still in the bore.

Now as to $380 for a barrel??? This depends on where the bulge is and where the slide sits. If the slide is back behind the bulge you need to replace the barrel, turn out the old bushing and probably replace that and the spring too. A GOOD barrel will cost from 150 to 200 dollars and labor for fitting the new parts at the shop average of $70 an hour??? Could well be, but this is a home fix for any 1/2 ways talented fellow and if you just go on parts cost he could do it at home a LOT cheaper.

[Multigunner]

A friend had a Colt auto with a collet bushing that snapped a leg jamming the slide tight so it couldn't be taken off, The factory had to cut the slide apart to get it free. They replaced everything free of charge because it was an obvious factory defect.

With any handloading the loader has to take responsibility for busted parts, even if he's sure theres nothing wrong with his loads. If a factory round damages a pistol then the ammunition manufacturer takes the responsibility, or slugs it out with the gunmaker to see who pays.

I never reload for auto pistols, mainly because I'd rather not trust reformed cases for life or death situations. If I did load for an auto loader pistol it would be to work up loads then load up new unused brass for serious work and not fire any more handloads than necessary to work up a load for a chosen bullet type.

For awhile good 9mm was dirt cheap, so reloading wasn't cost effective anyway. I used Remington 185 gr semi wadcutters and milspec ball in my Remington Rand.
Revolvers on the otherhand aren't so ammo sensitive, so far as function goes anyway. I've reloaded bushel baskets of .38 Special for a half dozen revolvers over the years.

Anyway, unless a factory recall of the barrel from the same lot came along, your friend is probably stuck with paying for a new one.
I'd get the best aftermarket barrel rather than trust a replacement, just in case it was the fault of the OEM barrel. Others from the same lot might carry a defect in metallurgy or heat treatment.

I did find photos of a number of barrel failures of auto pistols of similar design awhile back a bulge on the underside can cause the barrel/bore to bend upwards. Depends on the place where it might bulge and how much the slide restricts movement during the moment of greatest stress.

A bullet forced back into the case during the loading cycle can cause excessive pressure.

[spqrzilla]

Well, Multigunner, I can understand a reluctance to use handloads for actual self-defense uses. For a variety of reasons including reliability.

However, reloading an autopistol for target shooting and practice is what we do here.

Without seeing the barrel in question, I don't know how to interpret "bent". But a 1911 pattern pistol that needs a barrel replacement is pretty likely to so need because of a reloading mishap. There are a couple of such failure modes possible.

There is also a failure mode from a manufacturer defect in making the barrel but those are pretty obvious - especially on a two piece barrel which I didn't think Kimber used.

[btroj]

If is didn't reload for auto pistols, or any gun for that matter, I wouldn't shoot very much. I certainly wouldn't be shooting cast.
Reloading is what we do. There are risks involved, no doubt about that. Done properly, and safely, and no problems occur. For that matter, can you guarantee that factory ammo will never have a squib or another problem that cause a damaged gun?

[casterofboolits]

Smells fishy to me. In 40 years I have seen bulged, split, ringed, and two piece barrlel seperation, but never a bent 1911 barrel.

[MtGun44]

Seriously doubt it was bent, bulged is actually what it is, I would bet.

Bulged is common due to handloading, no powder round sticks a boolit, next round
impacts the first boolit, instant bulge. If the bulge is fairly far forward, it will jam like
a mother when the bushing comes back as the slide cycles.

If there was some unfixable damage to the slide, I can see $380 being resonable.
Barrel, bushing, slide and fitting.

When you hear the funny "pop" - STOP. I have saved at least two guys barrels during
IPSC competition when the shooter missed the 'pop' and the RO (me) did not and stopped
them before they could fire another and ruin the bbl.

Bill

[Lloyd Smale]

price must have gone up. A buddy of mine bulged the barrel in his kimber shooting ppc two years ago and kimber charged him 200 bucks to fit up a new one.

[Multigunner]

Well, Multigunner, I can understand a reluctance to use handloads for actual self-defense uses. For a variety of reasons including reliability.

However, reloading an autopistol for target shooting and practice is what we do here.

Without seeing the barrel in question, I don't know how to interpret "bent". But a 1911 pattern pistol that needs a barrel replacement is pretty likely to so need because of a reloading mishap. There are a couple of such failure modes possible.

There is also a failure mode from a manufacturer defect in making the barrel but those are pretty obvious - especially on a two piece barrel which I didn't think Kimber used.

Yeah I get your point. I reloaded a lot for Revolvers, and since finding that the most common cause of blow outs of autopistol barrels was due to the bullet becoming pushed back into the case during chambering I had begun to reconsider handloading for my autoloaders. At least for my Browning 1922 in .380. The 1922 has far better casehead support than most mordern high performance autoloaders. I checked and only the extractor groove is left uncovered by the feed ramp cut.

Anyway I began looking up info on the older auto pistol cartridges, since you almost never hear about blow outs during the early days of the old standby pistols.
I found that the milspec .45 ACP case had a canne;ure behind the bullet base specifically to prevent a bullet from being forced back into the case. Some old commercial 9X19 ammo in my collection has the same sort of cannelure. Most 9mm cases these days doesn't have this feature.

It wouldn't be that difficult to add the cannelure to cases that don't have it. I have my own ideas on how to do this, but haven't tried it yet.

Preventing this very simple but apparently not so uncommon source of excessive pressure could head off a lot of otherwise unexplainable accidents involving handloads.

I had seen references to an alteration made in the design of the original 1911 barrel after tests revealed a flaw that might caise burst barrels. The source did not explain what the defect had been.
Its become all too common for modern day manufacturers of all sorts to repeat mistakes made in the past.

[spqrzilla]

Well, the .380 ACP loads at a fairly mild pressure range, and for that reason at least gives you some leeway for a pushed-in bullet. I actually enjoy reloading for the .380 ACP more than the 9x19 which always gives me fits for some reason.

I think I've seen case cannelure tools. Don't feel a need for it myself. My .45 ACP loads have more than enough case tension.

The high pressure events I see in auto pistols are some 9x19 but mostly .40 S&W.

[MT Gianni]

price must have gone up. A buddy of mine bulged the barrel in his kimber shooting ppc two years ago and kimber charged him 200 bucks to fit up a new one.

Not that much. I sent mine in this spring for a bulge and $322 later had a new bbl, bushing, and a trip through the custom tune shop with return shipping. The trigger has definitely been tuned on mine. He has some other parts damaged as well or it is a maximum what else could be wrong estimate.

[Baldy]

Seriously doubt it was bent, bulged is actually what it is, I would bet.

Bulged is common due to handloading, no powder round sticks a boolit, next round
impacts the first boolit, instant bulge. If the bulge is fairly far forward, it will jam like
a mother when the bushing comes back as the slide cycles.

If there was some unfixable damage to the slide, I can see $380 being resonable.
Barrel, bushing, slide and fitting.

When you hear the funny "pop" - STOP. I have saved at least two guys barrels during
IPSC competition when the shooter missed the 'pop' and the RO (me) did not and stopped
them before they could fire another and ruin the bbl.

Bill


This happen to me in competition. I liked to never got my Kimber apart with that buldged barrel. I ordered a barrel, bushing, and link from Fusion and I was up and running in less than a week.:2 drunk buddies:

[Shooter6br]

Bulged a barrel in a AMT Gov model. Squib load. Did it again in 45 ACP Mech tech carbine. "What i don't learn by doing once i learn by doing twice" I visually check each round, have no distractions( wife talking to me or son. and pay attention And dont ignor the warning signs of a squib load

[Char-Gar]

Sounds like another careless handloader screwed up another firearm. Don't know what "bent" means but I do know what careless means.

I am not trying to be a pissant. I just don't want folks reading this thread to think damaging a firearms with handloads is a necessary thing and part and parcel of the activity. It is fairly common, that is why the use of handloaded ammo voids the manufacturers guarantee in most cases.

In 50 years of handloading and well over a half million rounds, I have never damaged a firearm. It doesn't have to happen. With the big push to use progressive reloading machines, such damage to firearms have spiked. It is the times we live in where folks think faster just must be better. NOT!

[btroj]

Amen Chargar.
I do not blame the progressive as much as the idea that they belong in the hands of a beginning reloader. A progressive is a press for a guy with lots of experience. Lots and lots. A guy needs to fully understand what is happening at every reloading stage to safely use one, how can a beginner possibly do that?
We deal with a potentially dangerous item. Proper care and understanding needs to be involved at all time. We push so much for firearm safety, maybe we should push for more bench safety also?

[Char-Gar]

btroj... I tried a progressive about 1990. I started to get some high primers and had to go back and ease the primers back down by hand. That at made me nervous. I then touched off a 38 Special round and it bucked and roared like a magnum. Obvious an over charge of powder. There was no damage done to the good old Colt sixgun.

A progressive press requires watching the process like a hawk. You can't get distracted or let your mind wander even for a moment, without courting problems.

I decided progressive were not for me and sold mine down river. I agree with you, that they have no place in the hands of beginning reloaders. They also don't have any place in the hands of many experienced handloaders....like me!

I get quite concerned when newbies come to this board, asking about equipment and folks right away begin telling them about how happy they are with their fancy smancy high dollar progressives. I do not wonder why there are so many damaged and destroyed guns these days. I am surprised there are not more serious injuries.

[dla]

btroj... I tried a progressive about 1990. I started to get some high primers and had to go back and ease the primers back down by hand. That at made me nervous. I then touched off a 38 Special round and it bucked and roared like a magnum. Obvious an over charge of powder. There was no damage done to the good old Colt sixgun.

A progressive press requires watching the process like a hawk. You can't get distracted or let your mind wander even for a moment, without courting problems.

I decided progressive were not for me and sold mine down river. I agree with you, that they have no place in the hands of beginning reloaders. They also don't have any place in the hands of many experienced handloaders....like me!

I get quite concerned when newbies come to this board, asking about equipment and folks right away begin telling them about how happy they are with their fancy smancy high dollar progressives. I do not wonder why there are so many damaged and destroyed guns these days. I am surprised there are not more serious injuries.

Hard for me to keep quiet at this point. Too much Male Bovine Excrement.

There are manually indexed progressives (Dillon 550-series) and auto-indexed progressives (Dillon SDB). The auto-indexed progressive is THE safest machine. Doubles and squibs are much more likely with loading block charging or manually-indexed progressives.

The only thing you learn with a single-stage press is that progressives are really nice. :)

[L1A1Rocker]

Could have been a bad reload, or it could have been a defect in the barrel. At any rate, for that kind of money I'd have a Bar-Sto or Brilley barrel put in by a good gun smith.

[btroj]

Dla, that is one mans opinion. I do not think a progressive is a good press to learn to reload on. I also do not use a loading block. A case is charged with powder then bullet is seated. Always.
I have a 550 b and would not dream of it for a newbie.
New guys need to learn to be vigilant of everything. This is why I also think a new guy should learn under the eye of a knowledgeable person. It is how I learned. I ink it is the best way.

Call it BS if you chose but I will NEVER consider a progressive a good beginner press.

[Char-Gar]

dla.. Folks can have different experiences and hold different opinions without being "less than". There is no need to dismiss another experience and opinion in such a disrespectful way. Such posts do not tend to make this place more civil. Such posts do not produce light, just heat.

Just a note...It was a Dillon Square Deal that I had and gave me the problems.

[spqrzilla]

I too try to strongly discourage beginning reloaders from starting out with a progressive until they've got some experience. Too much to keep track of when starting out.

Bill, as you will see in the thread, most people here believe that "bent" is a misinterpretation of "bulged" or some other failure.

[bhn22]

I would expect a progressive press to overwhelm a beginning reloader. You need to watch every station at once, and be able to understand what is happening at each station with every step. Just learning how to adjust each die is a lesson in itself. I used a single stage press for many years before moving up to my Dillon, and even then I didn't fully understand how everything co-relates. The primer mechanism & the powder measure took a lot of getting used to. I do realize that I'm probably the dumbest person here, but most guys still need to walk before they can run.

[Potsy]

I've got a couple of buddies with Dillons and have seen them have 2 Sqibs and one hangfire (don't know what that was about) out of a LOT of rounds loaded. They were bright enough to figure out something was not right before sending the next round downrange.
I've loaded a few with them on it. It DOES require more focus than a single stage.
Maybe if I was shooting a few thousand rounds a year, I'd think about one. But for my few hundred rounds a year, I'll keep my Rock Chucker.

[thegreatdane]

No pictures?

[35remington]

If a bullet doesn't have enough oomph to leave the barrel, it similarly doesn't have enough suds to work an autoloading pistol action. Pressures are not high enough to get it done if the bullet does not exit. Heck, the primer alone will drive the bullet an inch or so down the barrel, and that's a long way from operating the action.

What then happens is the shooter clears the malf by ejecting the case, chambers another round and sends another bullet down the barrel, bulging it where the stuck bullet is struck by the fired bullet.

Yes, a squib is to blame, partially, but most of it lies at the feet of the shooter for not checking the barrel after the gun fails to cycle.

[Frank46]

tell your buddy to get a Kart pre fitted bbl and bushing. Costs a lot less than a kimber bbl and way better. Frank