GEW 88 scope/sight

[frnkeore]

My eyes aren't the best any more so, I'm wondering if there is anyone out there that have creative ideas of how to mount a (non pistol) scope on these guns or a aperture rear sight.

Also, on mine, I'm having a lot of trouble trying to get it to groups down to the POA at 200 yards with cast 200 gr GC bullets at 2000+ fps. They are lighter and slower than the original 227 gr 8x57 loads. Mine is a '05 coversion and has the sight for the spitzer bullets so, it should shoot even lower but, they are still shooting about 10" high at 200 at the lowest sight setting.

Frank

[webfoot10]

Frank: Try about 16 to17 grs. of SR 4759, should bring your groups down to POA.
Play around with the loads till you get what you want. My 88 likes 17.5 grs 4759
under the Lee 180 gr. boolit sized .324 dia. Use a little gun cotton for filler, 1 in
groups @ 100 yds with this load. Hope this helps. webfoot10

[dbldblu]

You might try reading glasses that are just strong enough to bring the front sight into focus. You might also try the hawkeye aperture that sticks on your glasses, which will help bring the rear sight and the target closer to focus. Works for me.

[gew98]

If you had the time and maybe the money you could purchase a gew88 commercial sporter that had a scope with a bad bore. Problem is most of those guild guns are around and lacking scopes. I dare say you may be able to locate one of the old lyman scope bases that mounted tot he siderail of the 98 mauser and make it work if you are looking to be cost efficient.
As it was/is the germans never fielded gew88's with optics in military trim. But pre and post war gew88 actions with scopes were very popular and relatively cheap then. Go to Gunboards.com and look up user " Varook" , he likes these and has come across more than a few if it may help you any. He may very well be able to put you onto a gew88 scoped rifle/action you can utilize for your wants. But it likely won't be a cheap(er) alternative.

[Frank46]

One of the options I have heard about is using the front sight blade from a 1901 argentine mauser and the other is to get a tall blade from brownell's for the swedish mauser. Frank

[madsenshooter]

About the only hope for a scope mount other than a scout type would be something that went on the side, like an Echo, Pachmayer, Griffin and Howe or Mykrom, along with a butterknife bolt handle low enough to fit below the scope. I've the same trouble with my Madsen, which has a split bridge and the bolt handle forward of it. I'd have to remove wood from the left side to mount any of what I have listed, and that's not going to happen.

[frnkeore]

Thank you all for your input.

What I'm actually looking for is a sight that I can adjust to POA with at least 4 different loads. I'm shooting 150 and 185 resized 8mm jacketed bullets and 175 and 208 gr Ideal 32 cal GC bullets.

Frank's suggestion of a Argentine front sight should get me back on the paper for my lowest shooting loads and I can get elevation changes after that but, I would welcome anything that could be done besides drifting the front sight for windage.

Thanks again everyone,

Frank

[Multigunner]

Thank you all for your input.

What I'm actually looking for is a sight that I can adjust to POA with at least 4 different loads. I'm shooting 150 and 185 resized 8mm jacketed bullets and 175 and 208 gr Ideal 32 cal GC bullets.

Frank's suggestion of a Argentine front sight should get me back on the paper for my lowest shooting loads and I can get elevation changes after that but, I would welcome anything that could be done besides drifting the front sight for windage.

Thanks again everyone,

Frank

I've seen antique front sights that were screw adjustable for windage. There might be a repro of one of those available. You might check sights made for repro BP breechloaders and see if there is one that can be adapted.

The old term for these was a Windgauge sight, rather than windage, windage still meant the difference between an undersized round ball and bore back then.
You gauged the wind I guess.

PS
Just checked repros are available but they are mighty high dollar items. I might pay that for an original but I doubt you'd want to put 350 bucks or more into a front sight.

[madsenshooter]

I have a Mykrom side mount that is for a mauser with a step to the reciever. In addition to the scope mount, which you'd need a vintage scope you can take apart in order to get it through the ring, there's a windage and elevation adjustable receiver sight that replaces the scope mount. It's not click adjustable though. An old bolt mounted peep sight like the Rice would appear to be ticket for you. Back to the Mykrom, you'd probably still need the butterknife bolt handle, one of the gunparts companies might have one.

[frnkeore]

Madsen,
Thank you very much for those pictures. I've never seen a mount like that! I don't think it would work on a '05 stripper clip type like mine w/o steping it for that area. Does it swing over out of the way? If so, it looks like it might clear the bolt handle that way.

I'd love to find a butterknife handle for mine. I love the looks of them.

Frank

[Multigunner]

If I could see a detailed close up image of the exisying rear sight I have seen images of a number of issue military sights that had been modified to allow windage adjustments.

Once I studued the existing sight I can probably look up the type modification needed and you might be able to obtain spare sight parts that can be modified for the purpose while leaving your original parts untouched to be returned later should you wish.

I think some Lee Metford or Lee Enfield sights were modified in this way for civilian match rifle use.

[gew98]

Madsen,
Thank you very much for those pictures. I've never seen a mount like that! I don't think it would work on a '05 stripper clip type like mine w/o steping it for that area. Does it swing over out of the way? If so, it looks like it might clear the bolt handle that way.

I'd love to find a butterknife handle for mine. I love the looks of them.

Frank

I dare say the likelihood of finding a kar88/gew91 butterknife bolt would be tough. I have known collectors - still looking for some to round out there 88/91 carbines.

http://forums.gunboards.com/forumdisplay.php?14-Mannlicher-Steyr-amp-Blackpowder-Cartridge-Rifles

http://forums.gunboards.com/forumdisplay.php?66-Workbench-Forum

http://garagegunsmithing.com/

http://www.gew88.com/

Check these links out if you think it may help in your endeavor.

[madsenshooter]

Frank, I doesn't swing like a Pachmayer, there's a double V arrangement that's hard to explain, but it insures a good return to zero. All one has to do to remove the scope is loosen that little knob on the back and the scopemount or receiver sight comes up out of the side mount. The screw of the knob pushes the scope mount/receiver sight into the double V and locks it. I imagine with the receiver sight, you'd still need a higher front blade. The pictures don't do a whole lot of good, you really have to see it up close to understand the workings. In the bottom pic you can see it is cut for a receiver ring that's larger than the rest of the receiver. Her's some illustrations that might help you see a bit better: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2470282.pdf

[frnkeore]

Multigunner,
The problem of replacing the existing sight is, that it's soldered to the barrel tube. If it were screw mounted, I could put one of my 1902 Krag sights on it. The rifle is in very good shape for a '88 so, I don't want to mess with it to much.

Madsen,
Thanks again, that explained the connection.

GEW 98,
Thanks for those sites, I've done a lot of research on the 88's and I appreciate all sources of info on them. They are very interesting rifles, I have two of them. A Loewe '91/05 and a Spandau mn '93 with no modifications.

Frank

[Multigunner]

Multigunner,
The problem of replacing the existing sight is, that it's soldered to the barrel tube. If it were screw mounted, I could put one of my 1902 Krag sights on it. The rifle is in very good shape for a '88 so, I don't want to mess with it to much.

Madsen,
Thanks again, that explained the connection.

GEW 98,
Thanks for those sites, I've done a lot of research on the 88's and I appreciate all sources of info on them. They are very interesting rifles, I have two of them. A Loewe '91/05 and a Spandau mn '93 with no modifications.

Frank

Sorry we couldn't find a solution, but I'll keep my eye out for any possibility.
If wore came to worst, you might consider a temporary add on rear sight that sat higher than to existing sight and coupled with a higher front blade you could have a raised line of sight. For limited use in finding the best loads the rear sight could be secured by a heat resistent glue.
Not something you would want to leave on for any length of time of course.

The Sporters built on these actions do have a certain old world appeal.

BTW
A member of another board has been making replacement bolt heads for the GEW 88, if anyones interested PM me for contact information.

[madsenshooter]

Sorry Frank, didn't realize you were messing with a collector piece or I wouldn't have suggested the Mykrom. Guess I'm used to seeing the ones bubba has already had his hands on on the auction sites.

[gew98]

You may very well be able to pattern a set of sights attaching them as the Anti-aircraft sights attach. The germans made both of these pattern sights useable on the gew88 and gew98. Should'nt be terribly hard to fabricate soemthing similar with notches only centered up and or rear with a windage/zero adjust capability.