Respect and common courtesy

[frkelly74]

I really like the spirit of community that exists on Castboolits. By and large most goings on here are civil and there is an atmosphere of mutual respect among its participants. And the wealth of knowledge and experience is impressive and can save the newbie a ton of screwing around if they will listen. There are however a few who do not show the respect that is due to others all the time. I use the swappin and sellin section to share out brass that I have no need of and to gather up supplies and equipment without having to go retail and I really enjoy the give and take of trading and love it when both parties feel that they have gotten a good deal. Lately I have had some trades that the other party has said they would like to do and then for some unexplained reason have disappeared. Really it is not a big monetary deal and I have not lost anything material but it is not the way I would like to be treated. I do not think anyone wants to be treated that way. Things do happen and a man can change his mind and that is okay, just say so when it happens. To become unresponsive and disappear is not a good way to behave in a civil society, it shows disrespect and as my grandmother used to say " Poor upbringing". We are better than that. Frank Kelly

[Ben]

This forum is far larger than it was 5 - 8 yrs. ago. As we grow, we seem to bring into the forum a few with the characteristics that you've described. I'm not certain what the answer is , if there is an answer.

You're right however, the great majority of members here do show that they have plenty of good " upbringing ".

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

It's kind of funny you bring this up today.
last night I was thinking how much this place is like a Gunshow.
and how lucky we are to just pop in for an hour or so each day.
I don't mean just the tradin' of items...but the tradin' of conversation too.
like a gunshow, you have a core group, at a gunshow that'd be the dealers
and a few customers that show up everytime. But with any large group,
there are those that pop in once if they need something, then disappear.
at the once a year, one gunshow where I am a vendor, my buddy calls them "beebacks"
that is where they say, "I really like this item, I'll be back later to buy it"
then they disappear, never to be seen from again.
It's just how things are, that'll never change.
Jon

[selmerfan]

With the respectful and diligent moderation that occurs here (primarily by non "moderators" but just standard members) will hopefully prevent this site from going downhill. The level of respect between members is VERY high, and when someone is out of order on the forum, they are usually quite promptly informed of it. And when things really get out of hand or start flirting with fraudulent, the official moderators do an excellent job of handling it without going into a draconian mode about it or just being power/control freaks. I've pretty much quit participating in any other shooting forum because I enjoy this one so much.

[badgeredd]

I've been really fortunate in not having dealt with any "dead beats" here but they do show up on occasion. I understand the reasoning behind the rules we have for using the "Swappin and Selling" forum. Possible changes have been discussed on several occasions. As someone that has been here for a while, I can see merit in not allowing swapping and selling post until one has been here for a while, but I also can see not making the probationary period too long.

I'm sure that many will not agree with me, but I feel the probationary period should be longer and require more posts. I have noticed several members who have been members for MUCH longer than I have but have very few posts. Obviously they are active but have little to say until they really need some information that they can't find on their own. Or aren't as danged gabby as I am :bigsmyl2: but I kinda wonder if we shouldn't extend the probationary period to a longer time frame. Hopefully that would help slow down the "hit and run" members. Posts should have some bearing on the probationary period too. Personally, I feel that posts made in the swapping forum should not count toward our post total...but that is MY opinion. The reasoning behind my suggestion is that the swapping forum is a part of the forum here for convenience of the members (I believe) and not for a sales venue.

Any one that wants to flame me for my opinion can jump right in...I respect your right to disagree.

Edd

[frkelly74]

"beebacks", I like that one Jon.

[geargnasher]

Edd, I tend to agree, since there are a handfull of frequent sellers that only post in the SS forum. Thing is, it IS a free country, they DO abide the rules (if not what you and I think would be the "spirit" of them), and I simply don't buy from them. I only buy from frequent contributors and longtime members, because they have a vested interest in not screwing up any relationships here with a bad deal, that goes far beyond the member who only uses this forum as a venue for occasional sales. I've done a great deal of business here with individuals and VS alike, and so far have been 100% satisfied with my purchases and trades.

Gear

[mold maker]

At the gun shows I am a frequent "beeback". I am challenged and have to walk with a cane most of the time. carrying a heavy package through the show is not possible, thus, "I Beeback", and unless I forget, I'll be back. I do quiet often go ahead and make the purchase and ask vendor to hold it for me.
Once a show vendor held a small purchase for me for a year. (til the next show) I forgot, and he was nice enough to remember.
You'll not find that kind of honesty everyday, but I find more of it, in the shooting community, than anywhere else.

[theperfessor]

I think there is a lot of difference between paying for something and having a vendor hang on to it until you can pick it up versus expecting a dealer to hang on to something and turn down a sale on the word of someone they don't know and that may not return. My wife and I own a mini-storage business and get a lot if people that call and want us to "hold a space" until some future time. 99% never call back and we lost money trying to be nice folks. Now we tell people that they can rent and pay now or call back when they are ready to rent and pay then, but we're not losing any money to bee-backs. Cash talks, bee-backs walk, to paraphrase an old saying.

[Char-Gar]

A couple of thoughts on the subject at hand;

1. I only got bit once in a trade/sale/purchase. The guy had serious health and financial issues. He came back two years later and made it right with interest.

2. I really don't think its a character fault to change one's mind before the deal is done and the money or goods change hands. After something changes hands is another matter.

3. I hope this place is not like a gun show. There are way to many cheats, liars and crooks at gun shows selling and buying. Most are not, but way to many are. I would hope we could do better than a gun show.

[deltaenterprizes]

My gripe is with posting a PM sent vs a direct PM saying "I'll take it" ! I have missed items I have been looking for because of the order that the PM/ post was sent.

I had a good one and the gentleman was very good about MY screw up. I sent a PM "I'll take it" and was responded to with an address to send funds and after a couple weeks I inquired about the items being sent or payment being received. Gentleman informed me he had not received any payment. I checked and he was right, boy did I feel stupid! I sent the payment and promptly received the items. Good guy to deal with.

Members have also sent items before payment was sent, trusting souls or I have an honest face!

Not everybody on here is as gabby as I am or has the time to spend reading and posting. I am retired early due to illness and if it is too hot or too cold I spent the day in front of my computer. I have done a lot of casting and loading and machining so I have some input, others, 2 of them are friends of mine, prefer to read posts only, they have to work and have family to spend time with. Let the people that want to post do so and them that want to read only do so also.

Trying hard to get my second boolit!

[MtGun44]

I got caught in probably the same one as Chargar's #1. Turned out the guy was for real,
had real problems and made everything right. I would never even say the name, he is
a good guy and would not want to even speak about it. All the folks I have dealt with
here have been straight with me.

So far just a few knuckleheads, but most respond to being asked politely to reconsider the
way they are acting. I would truly hate for this place to get messed up or close down,
so I try to be polite and not shy in asking others to be, also.

I think that Cast Boolits is one of the most gentlemanly places on the web.

Bill

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I hope this place is not like a gun show.
There are way to many cheats, liars and crooks at gun shows selling and buying. Most are not, but way to many are.
I would hope we could do better than a gun show.

Wow, that is really sad. you must have had some bad experiences.

I can safely say, that has not been my experience.
The one show I work at, is as good as this place. Lots of information sharing and tale telling.

I should point out, I do not mind the BeeBacks.
I hold nothing for anyone, not even friends...to easy to get burned.
I have angered more than one friend with that rule of mine.
I would gladly store an item for a customer who has paid for it, til he leaves the show.

Last year, I had a 8.375" S&W model 57 (41 Mag) priced at $325...it had issues but was a fine shooter,
I was telling everyone $300.
Boy did I have the BeeBacks on saturday.
One was a close friend, he needed to ask permission from the wife,
another one was a long time vendor and a friend (who I see once a year, at the show).
Both said they'd Be Back.
I said I ain't holdin' it for no one, the first $300 takes it.
Late Saturday (after close) at the vendor steak fry,
a brother of a new vendor asked , "what's wrong with that cheap mod 57 ?"
I told him the issues, and he bought it for $300.
Boy did I have lots of explainin' to do to my two friends,
they both thought I was holdin' it for them.
I said again and again, I don't hold nothin' for no one !
Jon

[adrians]

common courtesy is always a biggie with me ,i have no time or breath for the "ten foot tall and bulletproof foulmouth type".
and yes i said bullet( thats just street slang for boolit).
everyone have a great evening .:evil:[smilie=s::evil:

[Alvarez Kelly]

I don't post much except in the Swappin' & Sellin section, 'cause I don't have much to add to most conversations. I am a new caster and spend a lot of time reading... I do occasionally post info if I happen to know something that will help or clarify a subject, but as you can plainly see by my post count, I am anything but gabby.

I guess what I am saying... to have a minimum post count as a requirement to place an ad will result in a lot of "me too" posts with little value. There are a lot of us lurkers, trying to learn... We want to buy stuff... so we'll place a WTB ad. We also want to sell stuff we don't need anymore to fund our new castin' hobby. Please don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Just my 2 cents from a NG.

[Char-Gar]

John.. Every Gun Show I have attended in the last 20 years have folks trying to pass something off for what it is not. Common guns being hawked as rare guns. Reblued guns being passed off as mint factory guns, and on and on and on.

A Gun Show is not a place to buy a gun if you don't know what you are doing. Folks who walk in off the street without prior knowledge get fleeced all to often.

[white eagle]

thats more buyer beware
I agree good spot to come
lots of good intell

[Alvarez Kelly]

John.. Every Gun Show I have attended in the last 20 years have folks trying to pass something off for what it is not. Common guns being hawked as rare guns. Reblued guns being passed off as mint factory guns, and on and on and on.

A Gun Show is not a place to buy a gun if you don't know what you are doing. Folks who walk in off the street without prior knowledge get fleeced all to often.

That's what I have seen at the traveling gunshow that comes through my town too. There are many good vendors, but there are ALWAYS guns being misrepresented.

I hate to paint them all with the same brush, but I have come to view gun sellers like I do used car salesmen. Maybe we better leave it at that.

[Char-Gar]

Alverez.. There are good an honorable folks in sales of all kind. There are dishonorable folks in sales of all kinds. But at the end of the day, they all eat by selling you something. Eating is a strong motivator for making a sale.

I am never sold anything. If I intend to buy something, my thinking is done before I enter the "point of sale". The sales person just facilitates the prior decision to buy something.

I have been this way all of my life. Therefor I have never been bitten by a salesperson. I have bitten myself once or twice, but that is my fault.

[bravokilo]

Last year, I had a 8.375" S&W model 57 (41 Mag) priced at $325...it had issues but was a fine shooter,
I was telling everyone $300.

Jon


WHERE was that show? What issues did it have?

BK

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Hutchinson MN. the last weekend of September.

Long story, this is alot to type out so you better be reading this bravokilo.

The 57 had been used heavily, well worn bluing, the grips were all dinged and scratched.
The bore was good, the chambers were good.
Also some pitting on one side of the cylinder and one side of the muzzle.
Like it had sat on a metal shelf in a moist basement for a few years.
when I shot it double action style, pulling the trigger real slow,
the cylinder wouldn't always advance far enough to dent the primer hard enough to fire,
plus the dent, which which was faint, wasn't in the center of the primer.

I took it too a gunsmith "Palmer" in St. Boni, MN
(I include his name so everyone reading will know who he is...I won't be going to him anymore).
I told him the problem and also told him to do an action job too,
the trigger pull was way to heavy for a S&W.
Palmer is normally real good at tuning S&W revolvers.
I got the pistol back and he said the adjustment screw on the main spring was way too tight
and that caused all the problems and then charged me for a full action job.

I got it out to the range, the action was better,
but not as good as others action jobs he's done for me,
During slow trigger pulling in double action style shooting,
the gun did that exact same thing it did before.

I brought it back to him and told him the story.
If front of several others, he told me that I shouldn't pull the trigger that slow or
I'd wind up dead, everyone laughed...Yeah that angered me.
He said when he tested it, it shot fine, but he did say, "I didn't try pulling the trigger slow".
again, laugher broke out in the shop....getting madder !
I left the gun, He said he'd look at it again.

Days later, I went to pick it up,
He said an internal part was worn,
I can't remember exactly what he said...some kind of "arm".
He charged me again, about the same as the action job.
I didn't say anything, but I should have.
He should have just charged me for the part only and not Labor.
He should have noticed that worn part during the action tuning on the
first go around...unless he didn't even tune it (which I suspect now,
I think he just adjusted the main spring and charged me for a tuning).

ANYWAY, I brought the gun out to the range.
It was surely improved but still had some of the problem.
During slow trigger pull, the gun would fire most of the time now (like 5 out of 6)
whereas it would fire like 1 out of 6 before the "Arm" replacement.
I wasn't going to take it back to him, so I just sold it cheap,
Lost my a$$ on that deal, told all the potential buyers this story,

To close, I suspect that whatever part the "arm" interacts with is worn excessively as well...I don't know what part that is ? maybe the cylinder ?
the gun seemed to function fine in every other aspect.

bravokilo, Let me know if you go to the Hutchinson gunshow,
I'll buy you a Homebrew. I am usually in the center of the last row, next to north wall.
Jon

[bravokilo]

BINGO!!! We have met, however briefly. I ALMOST bought it. I was with a friend (used to be part owner of a gun shop and a S&W guy from way back) and had him check it over. He told me "It's fine as is, but will need a little tuning if I shot it a lot." What ultimately decided the issue was I have never owned a .41 Mag. Now, usually that is a "good" thing, I get to play with something new. However, I started adding up the cost of brass, dies, a few molds, etc. and the pocket wasn't quite deep enough at the time at the time to "complete' the purchase. I will look you up the next I get to the Hutch show.

BK

[ggb3]

Hi All,
Hope all is well with you and yours. Like a few have stated, I do not post very often, even less than often actually. However, I am here most every day reading. If I have nothing to contribute outside of what has already been written, I typically will not post. I am not a +1 kind of reply person either. I do not have a problem with it, just do not choose to do that. Also, sometimes I have asked a question and then forgot about it and then looked several months later....

Politics do get to me and if I see something that I have not seen posted, I will have to try and spread the word. I love this country, however, I feel deep anxiety of where we are and where we are headed. We are in trouble and few (outside of concentrated like minded folk) seem to even give it a first thought, let alone a second.

I do feel that I know many of you and respect / like a great majority. I also feel that I should contribute as in a way, I do feel that it is not being even handed, somewhat like I am a stalker.... However, I am a good, honest, decent person. If I say I am going to do something, I will be doing it. If something extreme were to happen and I can not, I will make it right somehow. I do get busy and forget things as well.

I have not utilized the swapping and selling forum, however, I would like to know I was welcome regardless of my post count. I also understand getting to know someone helps to define ones character and then, hopefully, trust.

I do enjoy the site and many of y'alls significant experience. It has saved me time, money, and very possibly, some bodily injury.

George

[Alvarez Kelly]

Alverez.. There are good an honorable folks in sales of all kind. There are dishonorable folks in sales of all kinds. But at the end of the day, they all eat by selling you something. Eating is a strong motivator for making a sale.

I am never sold anything. If I intend to buy something, my thinking is done before I enter the "point of sale". The sales person just facilitates the prior decision to buy something.

I have been this way all of my life. Therefor I have never been bitten by a salesperson. I have bitten myself once or twice, but that is my fault.

Actually, I agree with you. The trouble with gun show is you don't know the "good an honorable" seller from the "not so good" an honorable ones... I have seen some grossly misrepresented guns. I didn't buy them, but it begs the question... did an unsuspecting buyer get ripped off? Let the buyer beware is all well and good for most of us on this forum. Unfortunately for me, I always think of the unsophisticated buyer.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

BINGO!!! We have met, however briefly. I ALMOST bought it. I was with a friend (used to be part owner of a gun shop and a S&W guy from way back) and had him check it over. He told me "It's fine as is, but will need a little tuning if I shot it a lot."

Good to seen you again...although, I'm afraid I don't remember you. I hope to see you again in Sept.
Jon