babbit bullets, range report

[mainiac]

I feel i must report on a new alloy im shooting in my 45 colt bisley. Started shooting this alloy,and hundreds of bullets later,the bore shines like a new nickel! If you looked,you would think the gun hasnt been fired! No joke!!! The load is reddot powder @ 7.3 grains, lyman 452460 (acp bullet but who cares) felix lube in the bottom groove,and crimped in the top groove, fed 150 primer,win case. 1040 av velocity with very low e.s. of 14! The babbit is copper babbit i beleave, pain in the butt to figure out how much to use,because the babbit in itself will remain slushy no matter how much heat under it. I used pure lead (chimney flashing) and the babbit, and ended up using 8 lbs lead to 1.5 pounds babbit. Until this ratio,i couldnt get a good bullet. Also had to keep stirring the pot,because if i didnt the nozzle would freeze. Kind of a pain to work with, but i never knew a gun could shoot so good until now. .6-.8 12 shot groups @ 25 yards, and under 2 inches @ 50 , open sights with my eyes doing the driving!!!! Up until now, i knew that this load would shoot good with wheelweight bullets,but this alloy has taken the gun to a new level. Wondering what it is that is making the bore look so nice? Absolutly no leading,and no powder fouling. Still dont really beleave it. Only thing i know about the babbit,is that if you hit it with a hammer,it will ring like a bell, also it melts really fast(under 600 degrees) but it never really gets liquid, just slushy looking,and quite thick. Wish i had a hardness tester,to see how hard they are.

[MtGun44]

A couple of web sites indicate that babbit is about 90% tin, 7% antimony and 3% copper, rounded off. With your 8:1.5 mix your percentages calculate to be 84% lead, 14% tin, 1% antimony and 0.3% copper. I’d suggest that unless you have a huge amount of free babbit and a shortage of lead that you cut the mix to more like 6% tin, which is still considered ‘wasteful’ at current high tin prices, but is what Elmer Keith recommended in the old days when tin was cheap. Most modern alloys use just enough tin to make the bullets fill out well (about 2%) and get their hardness from much cheaper antimony, which your mix is very low in.

I’d bet if you went to 22.5 lbs of lead and your 1.5 lbs of babbit you’d be close to Elmer’s mix and it’d would likely to be cheaper. However – when you can get stuff way off of market prices, or even free, it may make sense. I’d be you could cast up bars of your babbit and sell it to the rest of us and make a good deal for us and for you. I’d buy some if the price was right, and I’d use it as a sweetener to make my wheelwts cast a bit nicer.

Sounds like fantastic results, tho!

Bill

[mainiac]

mtgun44, i couldnt make a bullet fill out until i got to this percentage. Am going to next mix with w.w. and see what i need with that. I got about 70 lbs. of the babbit,and melted it down to ingot form. It was in bars about 4 lbs a piece. I tryed to make a few bullets with pure babbit,and it was a total failure. Read what i read about the slush? This metal wouldnt even flow threw the sprue hole. Dont know what ive really got, but i have fun playing! Dont know what the shipping would be but i would send you some to play with. I have 20-25 lbs of babbit metal that i melt out of bearing liners at work, and this stuff acks like tin (a little bit per batch makes nice looking bullets) but this latest bunch of virgin stuff acks funny compared to the other. Ill quit right now before i get you confused,along with me!ha!

[Jon K]

Maniac,

Sounds like you need to flux & skim, when smelting. That should get rid of the top scum.

If you are using old babbit, you really need to flux more to get rid of the embeded impurities. You also need a hardness tester, because each batch you mix will probably be different. Different companies, different applications, different speed torque loads, require different mixes. So unless it all comes from the same company doing the babbit for the same equipment, it stands a good chance to vary. You will then have to vary your mix, to make it come out about the same each time you mix a batch.

Jon
:castmine:

[garandsrus]

Maniac,

I think the "slush" is because of the really high percentage of tin in the mix. If you flux with sawdust and light the mixture the tin will more than likely melt and go back into solution and the slush will be gone. Nothing to scrape off...

I have only had "slush" in my smelting pot when I was melting Monotype which is about 20% tin. I fluxed with sawdust and some wax and the melt looked great.

John

[Bass Ackward]

There are literally dozens of formulas for babbit. But the one constant for bullet use is that babbit should flow like nobody's business .... unless you got a mix that .... won't.

I have some down stairs that has a very high tin content but has a fair amount of aluminum in it which is just high enough to ruin it. When you heat that mix, it always remains thick and won't mold for $hit.

[Slowpoke]

There are literally dozens of formulas for babbit. But the one constant for bullet use is that babbit should flow like nobody's business .... unless you got a mix that .... won't.

I have some down stairs that has a very high tin content but has a fair amount of aluminum in it which is just high enough to ruin it. When you heat that mix, it always remains thick and won't mold for $hit.


Yep but I bet it will make a good boat anchor or two . A cut down coffee can or a lod sauce pan for a mould and a eye bolt . I have had two in my Jon boat for years that were made from babbit that didn't want to be boolits. :)

Good luck

[John Boy]

mainiac: I had the good fortune to have 53#'s of old Number 4 babbitt dropped on my garage floor. Been procrastinating about using the stuff but you've tipped me over the edge.

I'll put up a post about how they fly when I make up some batches ... 45 Colt for CAS and Lyman 457123's which will be shot at 600yds

[LAH]

Bass says: There are literally dozens of formulas for babbit.

AMEN

I ordered a couple hundred pounds of 95.5-4-.05 (lead-antimony-tin) and the boxes in which the alloy was shipped read #4 Babbit. Can't say if #4 Babbit is infact this mix or not. I never asked the foundry.............Creeker