shooting range

[white eagle]

anyone know what the owners legal rites are when it comes to shooting on your own property :Fire:
I have land with my own range
bought the land 20+ years ago
since then they put a trailer park across from my land
well there was a note tied to the chain across my drive saying I need to stop
that just because its the country that I can not shoot and to stop
because I am interrupting their piece and quite
sheet I even shoot on Sunday for Christs sake :castmine:

[geargnasher]

I don't even know where you live, WE, so it's impossible to say. What you need to do is go down to your local Sheriff's office, make an appointment to talk to them, and calmly discuss the situation when you meet. Listen to what he/she has to say, even if it flames you at first. You have to make "points" with them, because he/she will remember you, and if the impression you leave is favorable, it will certainly make things work in your favor if disturbance calls from the trailer park roll in in the future. You need to be the first on to talk to LE, before those who are against your shooting make their voices heard.

Much of law is up to local interpretation, but usually safety issues and complaints of disturbance of peace are the governing factors regarding your "rights" to shoot on your land. That and your attitude.

Gear

[Von Gruff]

The size of your property and the sfaety of the backstops would also come into the equation I would expect. And a "in use" flag with notice may be good PR .

Von gruff.

[white eagle]

this is Adams county Wisconsin

[shooter93]

Check with the local constabulary and the township. We had a similar problem here (Pa.) when some lots were sold near a place where we shoot on private land. The police actually came out and examined the range then told the people complaining....No rounds can leave the property and there is no noise ordinance in this township so they are violating no laws, get used to it.

[fecmech]

I can't speak for where you are but here in New York state you cannot discharge a firearm within 500 ft of a residence without the permission of the owner and also if there are no town or county ordinances that ban discharge. I have 2 neighbors who live across the road from me who would be in that 500' zone when I shoot from my 50 yd bench( I obviously am shooting away from their homes). Fortunately we are on good terms and they don't mind my shooting. I try to keep track if they have company or are outdoors at the "Barby" and also don't shoot early in the AM etc.

[white eagle]

all of these things I will happily agree to
but not only did the person not come back to talk to me
they left a threatening note on my gate

[Houndog]

Like others have said, go talk to the cops! I have no idea about your local laws, but where I live there's no law against shooting on your own property as long as your bullets do not leave your property. I'd try to find out who was complaining and have a little talk with them. If I couldn't come to an equitable solution, I'd suggest THEY move! Since you said your complaintant lived in a trailer park, more than likely they are renters. It always amazes me when city folks move to the country and immediately try telling all their neighbors how they should live when they are the outsiders.

[white eagle]

I would talk to them but they snuck in and snuck out

[Jim]

The person that left the note assumed you would find it. What if the wind blew it away? I'd say they made a very feeble attempt at contacting you to discuss their issues.

I have a very similar situation here. It came to me, third hand, that a couple of the residents in a trailer park a half mile or so behind me didn't like "all that shooting". They have yet to come talk to me or call the Sheriff's Office.

I ain't the least bit worried about it.

[wills]

all of these things I will happily agree to
but not only did the person not come back to talk to me
they left a threatening note on my gate

If it was a threat, report it to law enforcement.

[Bullshop]

I had a similar experiance while living in the Bitterroot Valley in Montana. I had bought my land several years before anyone else had moved into the subdivision of an old farm.
I even put in my range several years before anyone else bought into the subdivision
When finally the Bitterroot started to become over run and I was surrounded with new homes each on a 5 acre parcel I began to have problems.
I was payed a visit by the state troopers one day looking into a complaint about the shooting. The trooper checked my range and deemed it a safe place to shoot. He said since it was in place and in use before anyone else moved there it was grand fathered in. He then told me the only thing that could cause me trouble would be for disturbing the peace. He said as long as I didn't shoot before 8:00 AM or after 8: PM
that I would not be disturbing the peace.
I did end up leaving there to come here to Alaska because those new folks were intent on causing me trouble. There was nothing they could do about the range or my shooting but when one of them put his doberman dogs out after my wife and then tried to kill my dog I new if we stayed we were bound for big trouble.
The mobs moving in ruined what I liked about that place anyway so I decided it would be best to let them have it and move on to a place where it wouldnt happen again.
I think I made it. Any new troublesome folks generally get out in the spring after trying a winter here.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Depending on your county ordinances/laws, You may need to get a C.U.P. (Conditional Use Permit) Go to the Township hall meeting and ask. This is what my Sportmans Club did. We have a troublesome neighbor. At the Meeting, we were actually told we didn't need it, but in a "confidential" conversation with one commissioner about our troublesome neighbor, The commissioner said get the C.U.P, is no big deal and then the troublesome neighbor can do nothing, as long as we don't break any Laws, which we Don't.
Jon

[shooterg]

Might be a neighborly thing to not shoot before noon on Sunday. Here in rural VA, shooting on your land in a safe manner won't get you in any trouble, but it is increasingly hard for new organized ranges/clubs to get permits to operate.I'm on 80 acres, but still had folks in a new subdivision question - told 'em to come on over if they wanted to shoot with me !

[Bad Water Bill]

Years ago we had a lot of ranges outside of Chicago. The easiest way they found to close the ranges down was to dig up a couple projectiles from the berm in the middle of the night. The next time they heard shots fired they ran to the County cops and said these just hit my house, barn,tractor etc. Range closed. At one range the person shooting only owned a 22LR. All of the boolits turned in were 45 cal. Didn't matter range closed. Even worked in a 200 foot deep quarry.

[quilbilly]

About a year ago a similar question came up at a community meeting with the sheriff in my county. He said that if there is a good backstop and the projectiles stayed on the property he couldn't help the complainers.

[waksupi]

Check your state laws. Here, a range is very well protected, especially if registered.

Ignore them, and keep shooting.

[WILCO]

anyone know what the owners legal rites are when it comes to shooting on your own property...

Step 1) CONTACT AN ATTORNEY!
Step 2) Do as Attorney advises.
Step 3) Move on with your life.

[white eagle]

I wish I could post the letter for everyone to see
but they are even telling me what kind of gun to shoot
apparently they find the 45 colt distasteful and suggest I move to a smaller caliber
that makes less noise ..?like my 220 swift maybe,that has a quiet crack to it as it breaks 4000 fps.....
I do not plan on stopping and may shoot more

[Jim]

Got a digital camera? Photograph the letter and post it.

[CWME]

I was shut down essentially by a couple who moved in from Mass where I grew up. They wanted the country but nothing the country brought with it... Town of Gorham has a noise ordinance. If someone thinks the noise, no matter what it is, is disturbing they can call the Police. My backstop was inspected by a local Game Warden and found to be perfectly fine. I could legally shoot until they called. The cops would come and tell me I had to stop for the day. Normally that meant I had about 45 min to an hour.

This went on for about a year. I gave up shooting there after I left for college. Came home one weekend and had a rookie cop show up with his gun drawn. Had enough of that. Joined a local range.

[Longwood]

Step 1) CONTACT AN ATTORNEY!
Step 2) Do as Attorney advises.
Step 3) Move on with your life.

Nah!
Do it the Redneck way.
Open a woodlot just across the fence from them and use the biggest loadest chainsaw you can buy. A diesel caterpillar to skid the logs around would be good too.

Dammit I'm mad, is Dammit I'm mad, spelled backwards.

[white eagle]

here we go
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v730/kempobb/neighborrant.jpg

[Jim]

Try this for a letter to the editor in your local paper.

"Dear "Unhappy neighbor",
Not only do I not understand why you wouldn't come speak to me face to face about my shooting on my own property being an irritation to you, I do not understand why you wouldn't sign the letter you left chained to my gate. Are you afraid of me? Or is it because you don't have the maturity to handle conflict?

In your letter, you advised me that if I didn't stop or switch to a firearm that makes less noise, you would get a petition against me. Has it not occurred to you that I would most certainly find out who you are when you do that?

Had you come to my house, introduced yourself and asked if we could discuss an issue that bothered you, I would have invited you in my home and heard what you had to say. I'm not saying I would have accommodated your wishes, but you would have had a better chance than you do now.

If you feel that getting a petition against me is the best course of action, by all means, proceed. Meanwhile, I will continue to exercise my rights and discharge my firearms on my property in a safe and legal manner. You spend your time, efforts and money on your actions against me and I'll spend my time, efforts and money on my hobby.

We'll see who comes out of this with the greater expense and a court ruling in favor of."

And then SIGN YOUR NAME TO IT!

[white eagle]

perfect :mrgreen:
thanks Jim :castmine:

[Jim]

On second thought, when you write your letter to the editor, you might begin with "I found the following note attached to the chain on my gate:" Doing so would reveal to the whole town the content and context of the original note. That would then set the stage for your reply.

[WILCO]

Try this for a letter to the editor in your local paper.

Too much drama. Life is short.

[geargnasher]

Looks like handwriting learned in the 1950's, so expect a retirement-age person. At first I thought it was a woman's writing, and it may well be even though it says "my wife". The writer is very conventional, insecure, close-minded, introverted, secretive, and violently tenacious. Not professional or educated, though. At the moment I can't remember what the slashing "i" dot means or the disproportionately long lower loops, but they are significant. Expect to have to deal with all that if you meet.

Gear

[white eagle]

bout the way I had them pegged to Gear
man who hides behind momma's skirt ....well :2gunsfiring_v1:

[shooterg]

Probably someone w/o a computer/printer, newly moved in retired city folk. I like the idea of sending copy of original in to Editor of a local paper with a reply. Besides, even 100 "Unhappy Neighbor" signatures ain't gonna matter. Even places with noise ordinances have a decibel level that must be exceeded at the property line to warrant action . And your gate needs one of those "YOU ARE NOW IN RANGE " signs !!

[Finster101]

Seems a lot of people have witty answers to the problem. It is not fun having neighbors who are out to get you, especially lots of them. Starting off arrogant and bull headed about it will solve nothing and escalate things quickly. I would do my best to try and talk it out. It would be hell having the place you love turned into a place you hate. That being said, if the high road did not work out, well I would do whatever was legal on my property that I wanted.

[gray wolf]

Find out what the laws are in respect to firing a weapon,
Your either within the law or your breaking the law.
As for the note, don't mount to a hill a beans. It's what the law say's,
that's the only thing that can be enforced
If your shooting on your property you should know what the local ordinance is and what the law is. Here in Maine it's 300 feet from a occupied dwelling or building with farm equipment.
Unless with permission.
So if I am shooting 305 feet from a house they can suck wind if I want to shoot.
However that IS NOT my attitude, I do try to respect others thinking and there feelings. As for some stupid petition they would have to change the law if there is one,
They can't just single one person out.
I think if there was a law these A holes would have looked into it before now.
The note would have said " your breaking the law shooting nasty guns"
"and we will call the local constable on you "
Again--find out what the law is or get a fifty cal. and have at it.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I would do nothing...except continue shooting and do as you did before.

No signature means no note !

If you are confronted by these neighbors or the authorities, I would play dumb and say, "what note ? "

If it were Me, I would still go to the township meeting and try and get a C.U.P as I previously mentioned, although I assume you don't need one.
Jon

[bootsnthejeep]

It's funny to see so many responses from here in Maine, with the liberal lean to most of the southern half of the state, coupled with all the Mass immigrants trying to escape the tyranny of their own state by creating a small version of it here, we get a LOT of this around here.

Falmouth Rod and Gun is currently closed down due to a couple bitchy neighbors and alleged safety concerns. They may come out the other side, but last I knew, the place was closed down until further notice. It really stinks.

That strikes me as a woman's writing. And not just the writing but the way its phrased and worded. Possibly one of those neutered house husbands broken of his manhood by a domineering feminazi, but that would be neatly printed on recycled hemp stock from his nifty Macintosh. We have lots of those in Portland.

However, I agree with the poster that said being level headed and speaking to the law FIRST is going to gain you serious points. In my opinion, putting letters in the paper and what not are only going to make you appear to be making more of this than it is.

Let's not forget, this is one person. People who leave passive-aggressive notes on people houses are the sort to THINK that they represent the group, and CLAIM to represent the group, when in fact its more likely that everyone else in said group is just as fed up their **** as you are.

He/She is most likely a kook. Go talk to John Law, and bring the note, and just say "Look, I don't want to piss in anyone's pool, if I'm doing something wrong I'd like to know about it, but I think I'm doing everything as safely as I can."

They can circulate all the petitions in the world. If you're not breaking the law, they can pound em.

What they CAN do (and here is where I came back to the Migrant M******* topic) is either try to get the noise/firearms ordinances CHANGED (which would take some doing, but the squeaky wheel gets the grease), or if they have money or have any legal training (Not to judge, but if they live in a trailer park, probably can rule that one out), just begin filing petty litigation against you and bury you in paper work and attorney's bills until you give up and go their way. Seen it before, I'll see it again. It's depressing, but many people only see the law as a way to get their own way, and will wield it like one of those noisy guns they don't like at all.

Tread lightly, my friend. Keep doing what you're doing. I'm sure you don't shoot early in the morning, or late at night. As for Sunday? Guess what, I have the weekends off, that's when I'm going to shoot. Tough. Sunday's just another day of the week. Have at it.

But I would DEFINITELY make my face seen with the local law and get on record as trying to do the right thing FIRST, before someone else starts accusing you of wrongdoing just to settle a petty grudge.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I wish we could relocate all gun hating liberals to one state, then watch them bitch, demonstrate, campaign and otherwise slowly bore each other to death. Of course all their political hacks would have to go with them. I just have no idea which state to pick on. There are good people that live in every state. Most of the shooting ranges have been closed here in Southern Ca. by the same type of liberal creeps. As I have stated before on this site, I travel 100 miles round trip to shoot. I should point out that it is also a sorry excuse for a shooting range. I suppose I should be glad that we still have that place, sorry as it is.

[clintsfolly]

Talk with your local law and if your ok have a two day cast boolit shoot for 100 of your closest friends!!!! Camping, meeting, greeting, bonfires, shooting, just good old fun weekend! Will try to come and bring the 458AccRel,454casull, 44 mag and my 50cal smokeless muzzleloader. Just a thought. Clint

[Bill*]

When you figger out who it is...don't forget to tell em that they want peace and "QUIET" not peace and "QUITE". They did it twice so it's probably no typo. In fact, the first time, they scratched out "QUIT" ;)

[firefly1957]

white eagle you had a similar thread earlier have you talked to law enforcement? do not expect correct answers from police ask question and write down the laws they cite and then check for accuracy. You have internet you may find answers there on your states websight. Also I bet the person that wrote the letter has contacted law enforcement and were unhappy with the response. Another guess is previous people are right you are looking for older unhappy possibly unstable person.
How many neighbors do you have at trailer park it may pay to go door to door and ask each if the shooting bothers them, when , and why it bothers them. You may have to offer to let a couple of them to shoot with you though.

[white eagle]

thanks for the idea :Bright idea: firefly
I went to the township ordinances and found none pertaining to shooting ...
whatsoever :happy dance:
I did take Gears advice and called the county sheriff and they said I should see the township that the county did not have any ordinances on shooting on ones private property :bigsmyl2:
I love having a lot of ammo

[edsmith]

I read somewhere that someone made a muffler out of a 50 gal. drum that cut down the noise a lot. might think about that.:drinks:

[Von Gruff]

You can silence your shooting dramatically by setting tyres in a row and shooting through them. The capacity in the tyres acts as an axpansion chamber and makes quite a difference to the sound heard from the sides.

Von Gruff.

[MT Gianni]

Tire baffles work well. A friend had his hanging from chains and a tripod. IIRC there were 5 or 6 tires in line. 30-06 sounded like a 22 RF.

[Mumblypeg]

I MIGHT stop shooting at my house when they make people put mufflers back on their motorcycles... then maybe not. I've been shooting here a long time also. Few complain because other people around the neighborhood shoot too. For those that don't like it... they can just go to hell. They do stuff that I don't like and I put up with it. Besides... I'M a COB!!!

[gew98]

Put a game camera that would take a picture of the sod whenthey come back with another note. And if they are actually on your property and not the road when they again leave their drivel...Identify them leave a note in their mailbox with the printed out pic stating you have little tolerance for tresspass , vandalism,littering and or threats. Next incursion will entreat you to a meeting in court, thank you.

[DragoonDrake]

I am with gew98. Don't send a letter to the editor of the local newspaper. You have made a call to the local LE and that was the right thing to do. File a note with them about the letter, but state you wish to not make a case or press charges, you only want on record was has happened in case something else happens in the future (and state that you do not expect any other disturbances). Then put a trail camera out and catch whoever it is that is putting the note on your chain. Deliver a copy of their note, a picture of them trespassing and a copy of the ordanance/law about trespassing on another's property, also include a signed letter/note from a LE that there is no ordanance stating that you can not fire on your own property. Finally as a touch of sincerity, invite them to shoot at your rifle range and see what all the noise is about.

My $.02

[white eagle]

seems so very ironic
they very people that ruined my hunting ,my piece and quite and privacy are the very one's complaining

[canyon-ghost]

I think that somehow makes sense, where most gun-haters are chimpanzees trying to stand up for rights that don't exist.


I went to the township ordinances and found none pertaining to shooting ...
whatsoever
I did take Gears advice and called the county sheriff and they said I should see the township that the county did not have any ordinances on shooting on ones private property

I shot a possum one morning at 1am, the next door beagle had it cornered and wouldn't be quiet. Using a 32 magnum, I didn't know exactly how loud it was. Someone in this small town called the Sheriff. He drove around the block and looked, then on the second round he found the white possum on the grass. I'd fished it out of the dog pen with a rake and laid it out next to the road. He took one look, got in his car and went home.

I know all that because I was still standing in the driveway at 1:30 am sipping coffee (varmint hunting is tedious :lol: ) We've even had mountain lion reports, one walked into town and killed a couple of show animals. In this town, you'd better be ready for the country around you. It isn't all that civilized. By the way, who makes it civilized? Somebody has to keep all the critters from crawling all over your property. I don't think it's going to be the trailer park people. And I live in a mobile home myself.

Ron

[lbaize3]

C-G
It is interesting that you should mention the mountain lion. Just northwest of me a cougar attacked a horse and the woman who owned the animal went to its defense with a rake. She and her lawn rake managed to drive off the cougar. Don't know if she was brave, stupid or just unwilling to make noise with a gun late at night........:Fire:

[white eagle]

an update on my situation
although the mountain lion is way more interesting
there are no county ordinances or township ordinances regarding \
shooting or noise so the guy can whine all he wants [smilie=w:
I did try the tire thing and although I am uncertain if it did indeed reduce the blast noise
I did manage to get the concussion blast directed towards me can't say I like it any an bit
startling as well

[Jim]

You checked on the laws and there's no restrictions. Throw the tires in the dump and go back to shooting.

[Bad Water Bill]

You might want to attend ALL township villageb and county meetings to make sure the trailor park doesn't try to get a law passed behind your back.

[Jim]

That's not a bad idea, Bill!

[canyon-ghost]

My guess is the lady with the rake was scared and defensive. Mountain lions and bears are overpopulating in New Mexico and following the canyons through Texas, they make 80 miles in a single day.

The liberals haven't won here, we just don't have enough animal control to solve all the problems. The range I shoot at is only 5 miles away though.

Happy Shooting there White Eagle,
Ron

[firefly1957]

You might contact the actual land owner and let him know that one of his tenants left what you consider a threatening note. Give him the documents that show your shooting is legal Then ask him nicely to notify all tenants that your shooting is legal. Of coarse also let him know he may be responsible for your legal fees if he fails to do so and you have further problems.

Keep shooting Jim

[crabo]

Is your property well posted?

[Jim]

Is your property well posted?

I thought about that, too. Here in Va., it's a $50 fine for trespassing on unposted property. $500 for trespassing on posted. That oughta' get somebody's attention.

[cajun shooter]

Most all towns have laws that pertain to this problem. If your gate is on your property then you have proof that the person has trespassed and if the letter is indeed a threat then that also is against the law. With out knowing of your local laws, the only person who has violated any is the note writer. It should be taken serious as you don't know the person and their minds health. It is against the law to shoot in so many feet of a state highway, within so many feet of a subdivision, within any boundary lines to certain game areas. These are just some that are common. I would go to the local Sheriff and have a talk with them. You also have the right to look up all laws and see if you have violated any. If possible I would make sure I had a good back stop if needed. You need local help and nothing we say will amount to a hill of beans where you live. Do take the time to look up all laws in your area. Not just state but any local ordinances and have them with you on that visit. I had a Sheriff tell me that no law was on the books that would allow him to take action against a neighbor. I handed the printed out law to him and he wrote the man a ticket. He was burning his trash and garbage on the side of the road and not paying for pick up as the rest of us. The smoke and smell was very bad at times. He has stopped using government property for his fires.

[MtGun44]

If you want to minimize the noise heading towards the neighbors, you can put up a wooden
wall with old carpet on the side facing you, with the wall between you and them. It will
knock out a lot of the sound in the specific direction and may get them to be more hearing
like a .22 than .45. Draw a line between your muzzle and them, and put a wall perpendicular
to that line at as close a distance to your shooting position as is convenient for you. Needs
to be about 8 ft tall and wide to do much good. Longer and higher are better, closer is
better. Dbl layer old carpet would be even better. If you are lucky on layout , it can double
as an afternoon sun shade on your shooting position.

I have no reason to stop shooting on my property if it is legal, but also do not want to
unnecessaryily irritate the neighborsnif there is a simple way to minimize the sound a
bit.

I love the "high caliber guns" comment - clearly have zero knowledge about firearms
terminology. So you've been shooting your Heinie 1911s and Merkel shotguns? Maybe
the odd Rigby or Wessley-Richards double rifle? These are all pretty high caliber.

Bill

[firefly1957]

You all are thinking this note writer is a sane and responsible person if this was so they would have talked over problem not left note not knowing if it would be found or not.
While Michigan has a 450 feet safety zone around a occupied building or out building that is for hunting only not target shooting. Wisconsin may have different rules all together.

[azcruiser]

Since you gate or fence line is on your property
I would post it no Trespassing or no trespassing without permission also state post No notices/flyer's /sales signs .Then get one of those game cameras their pretty cheap now less than $70 . Set it with a clear view of you gate then sit back and wait a picture worth 1000 words.Guessing this type of person likes to have the last word so you know they will be back .Kind of like varmint hunting rewards come to those who wait
quietly .

[firefly1957]

Maybe a shooting range sign on the gate would be an idea? vandalism of sign is more likely to be prosecuted then trespass.

[songdog53]

The folks wanted to live in the country so they have to live with comes with living in the country. It is your land and can do whatever you like as long as doesn't break any laws. Tell them to get a straw and suck it up cause it is your land you own and pay taxs on so get used to it or move. I try my best to get along with my neighbors and have shot when i please and never had a problem. Course they shoot whenever they please and doesn't bother me. They want peace and quiet let them buy them some land and move in middle of 100 acres or so and have their peace and quiet. What about living in country and folks shooting on their land do these people not understand?

[gray wolf]

You checked on the laws and there's no restrictions. Throw the tires in the dump and go back to shooting.

AGREED But also stay on top of it so nothing sneaks up on you, just cover your 6

Those that want to be left alone
And those that wont leave them alone

Very sorry for all this trouble your having.