Anyone have Charter Arm Off Duty?

[georgeld]

Been dwelling on getting one of these aluminum .38's Charter arms makes.

Needing a pocket/carry gun that's lighter than most and more affordable.
Haven't found anything I've wanted in two yrs yet.

This sounds interesting, plus it's American made.

Looking for someone else that has one to learn their experience's with it.
I know a one inch tube is a belly gun.
Figure with plinking loads of cast it should be a real banger of a toy.
Yet, with HP's in a defense load they'd be better than wet socks.

Thanks much,

[TCLouis]

Like the Smiths of the same size, take the wood grips off, screw then together and THROW them as far as you can sling them.
Now that you have gotten rid of that fatal design problem, buy a set of Pachmayr Compac grips and you have a simple light carry gun.

[georgeld]

Believe they come with rubber grips, haven't seen the gun yet, any of Charters for that matter.

But, the pictures from their ad's show black rubber on all of them.

Thanks for the advice and input,

[Bret4207]

Have the 44 Bulldog and wish I had 3 more! No complaints. Keep in mind it's a design you carry a lot and shoot a little, at least with full house loads.

[MT Gianni]

I have a 3" bulldog 44 and am surprised at how many places it fits with out being noticed. I would not go smaller than a 2" tube myself. Gianni.

[C1PNR]

Another vote for the 3" Bulldog .44 Special. I actually load mine down a little for better control.

It's my current carry gun. I do swap off now and then with the 2" Detective Special.

[dk17hmr]

Not meaning to get off topic on you guys but ya'll are talkin about a revolver to keep in your pocket and talkin about rubber grips. Might just be me but wood grips seem like a better choice, less likely to get caught on your pocket or clothing if needed.

Less sticky I guess I am tryin to say.

Am I wrong?

[Bret4207]

No Doug, you're not wrong. Rubbery grips grab cloth and pull it out and about. But I carry my Bulldog shoved down between my pants and shirt at the small of my back and rubber holds it there real nice. I prefer the wood grips since they're so much smaller and they are on 99% of the time. Most guys get a holster of some sort and the wood vs rubber issue is lessened then.

For pocket carry you'd need pants like men wore 50 years ago. Huge pockets and a waist that ended just under your rib cage. Nowadays pocket guns are 25's, 32's, and a few 380's.

[BD]

I carry a S&W M37 with Hogue rubbers in the front pocket of my jeans pretty often. In an Uncle Mikes pocket holster you can see that I've got something in my pocket, but it's not obvious that it's a gun. When I'm not carring it there I carry my wallet there so the folks around me are used to my having something in my front pocket. As for grips, I think it depends on how the gun fits your hand. The sights on most of the snubbys are pretty minimal. With the little stock wood grips I shoot way hig unless I really bear down and concentrate on the sights. With the hogue grips the little gun shoots where I point as fast as I pull the trigger.
BD

[versifier]

I have owned a .38 Charter, shot it. As Brett pointed out, it's a "carry a lot and shoot little" kind of gun. I would not go out and buy one. What I do carry a lot and shoot a lot is an ancient S&W pre-m36, much better made and much, much more accurate. There is no comparison between the two when it comes to actually using them. I trust my life and those of my family every single day to my S&W, and if I had a choice, would never choose to rely on the Charter for the same purpose.

Full house loads are not fun to shoot out of it, nor are they out of any revolver this size, but most of my practice is with WC's and light charges of BEYE. I shoot just enough carry loads at the end of a practice session to assure myself that I can keep a cylinder full on the paper at 25yds, shot DA (and yes, the S&W is that accurate, the Charter on the other hand, is NOT - nowhere near it). Gun Tests has had some interesting things to say about the new Charters, another good reason to opt for the S&W.

Keep in mind that the larger BullDog model is more ruggedly built and better made, not the same gun at all, so to bring them into the discussion about .38's is pretty much pointless, as far as I am concerned. Then, consider that for what you could buy a new Charter for, you could have your pick of many good used S&W's, with enough cash left over to buy a decent holster and plenty of components.

No, it's true that the wooden grips are not comfortable for extended shooting sessions, but hey, this is a carry weapon, not a target pistol. Unlike rubber, the wood grips don't catch and snag on clothing and wearing the wood it draws easily from an inside-the-pants holster (I carry it in a PagerPal, a product I highly reccommend). I'll keep the wood grips on mine.

The .38Special, with the proper HP bullets or boolits, will do anything that a 9mm can in terms of a self defense handgun, far exceeding the .380ACP, which I consider to be the minimum self defense round. It is not a magnum, and won't strike with the punch of a .45, but it can, has, and does do the job when you need it. In the winter here, you can conceal just about anything under a heavy coat, but I can be discretely armed in summer wearing only a pair of shorts and my hat with the little .38, and none of my other handguns will allow that.

It is no accident that sales of this size revolver have remained steady for everyone that makes or imports them. More of them are actually carried regularly than many other "special purpose" carry guns. That tack driving .45 won't do you a bit of good at home because it was too heavy or too bulky for the weather and you don't have it when you really need it.

[MT Gianni]

I had an interesting conversation with my BIL over Christmas. He works undercover for a state agency in a western statethat has a lot of gunowners. He carries either a pocket 380 or a J frame Smith. He is an auto guy from Marine training and prefers Fobus to leather so he is nontraditional in my book. He gets checked regularly in bars and other social occasions and has yet to have his gun found yet it is accessable. Most non law enforcement people do not know how or where to search and don't recognize a "gun print" for what it is. Gianni.

[Jon K]

George,

Like Versifier said "I wouldn't go out and buy one" and Bret says "carry a lot & shoot little". I have owned Charter Arms 38 & 44, S&W Mod 36 & 37. I think the S&W 36 is the best of the bunch Mod 37 comes next. Now let me tell you about the Charter Arms, the 38 will barely keep it on the target board @ 17-25 yds, and the 44 Bulldog would keyhole @17 yds and can't even hit the target board @25 yds. I guess it's ok if you just want to see a lot of muzzle flash.

Now I'll probably take a bashing for this cause it's not American made, but for a small carry gun, I like the Walther PPKS 380. It feeds anything reilably, and will hold a 6-8 inch group offhand @100 yds. It's DA, and the grip is not too small. I have had other med sized autos, and this one has been the best. Any larger and my choice is a 1911 no contest!

Have Fun Shooting,
Jon
:castmine:

[Bret4207]

Jon- I've heard that the Bulldogs are a hit or miss proposition. Some, like mine, shoot great. Others have real issues.

No flames on foreign guns from me. My Astra Constable is a good shooter as is my Star PD.

[robertbank]

Doesn't matter anymore where a gun is made, good ones are good ones and stinkers are still stinkers no matter what flag flies in the hallway.

Take Care

Bob

[versifier]

I am not at all down on the little Walthers, although some of the first ones that were produced here were not what they should have been. My dad has been carrying one for almost 20 years. The only downside is when you have the mag without the finger rest in place. With it, your hand tends to ride higher during firing and the little bugger takes a chunk out of the web of your hand. I understand that the beavertail was extended on them a bit, but my dad, brothers, and I all have matching parallel scars just below the second thumb knuckle. It is a surprisingly accurate little pistol, though, even though I much prefer something with a lot more energy.

[redbear705]

Most carry guns will never be used any farther out then 25yds and most self defense shot occur alot closer than that! Most encounters are up close and personal...(not like the movies....badguys shooting 9's at 150 yards).

So if you need a small pocket gun that you will carry all the time and not leave it at home cause its just too big or inconvienient to carry then go for it and get the short barrel!

Lets face it.....there are target guns and self defense guns....you pick which one ya need!

JR

[scrapcan]

My wife has a charter undercover with exposed ejector rod. The gun is old and has been around the world, literally. her mother bought it and it was passed on to my wife about 25 years ago. It was kept as a truck gun for most of it's life with my wife while hauling horses or what not (always good to have a way to humanely dispatch a seriously injured animal or an animal that need sto be seriously injured).

I made sure it was clean oiled and functioned and did not shoot it for the first 4 years that I was allowed into it's life. I then decided it needed to be shot, by both of us. I will tell you that I am very pleased with it. It will keep all shots on a paper plate as fast as I can DA at 25 yards and under. It is a bit bitey with service 38 SPL loads, but it will get the job done. It is also easy to carry and very simple in mechanical function. Not many parts in that frame. I have shot about 2000 rounds in the last 5-6 years, lots of target level loads and not as many service loads. it is still tight. Sights are marginal, but it is a personal protection sidearm not a target gun.

The model that we have is all steeel and blued. Had very small wood grips, no wears a set of compact pachmyr grips. does not bite as much with a different design, I would like a set of wood grips designed like the rubber grips only a little thinner.

So in my long winded fashion, I am pleased with the older Charter, but cannot comment on a new model or the bulldog (even though I would like one to try).

I would like a steel (too hard to control scandium or titanium, and guns are made to be shot) 5 shot compact 45 acp that uses moon clips. That would be fun, anyone know if there has been or is one made?

[Scrounger]

One of my carry guns is a Ruger SP-101, three inch barrel .357. Quite a handful with full power .357s. It would be perfect if it were in .44 Special or .45 ACP.

[9.3X62AL]

I do like those SP-101's. Sis in MT has one for car carry, good little sidearm.

Another Walther-esque carry gun is the Makarov. I really like mine, it's an East German variant. The PP series work well for me, although the 380's tend to take a divot outta my thumb/forefinger web unless Pachmayr grips stabilize things.

[nelson133]

+1 on the SP101, I carry the short barrel DAO model, and had it ported. Enough weight to make shooting full house .357 loads and still concealable.
Charter arms quality has varied by who hs owned the brand at any given time. The current owners are the people who make the Hi-Point guns, If they back the current Charter Arms stuff the way the support the Hi-Points, they may be a decent choice. Though personally I would look for a used major brand revolver first.

[georgeld]

Great bunch of replies, thanks to everyone. Not what I was hoping for about the particular gun I asked about though.

Ok, here's a run down so far. I haven't been back to this post because I've been doing other things and completely forgot about it to be honest.

The gun came in, as I special ordered it, took it. Was not too impressed with it's looks and still not really. Dull light gray alum, black rubber tiny grips. It does have a 2" barrel though. The fit leave's quite a gap between the barrel and cyl. Way too much in my notion. I'd bet it's a full 1/32".

I've had it about two weeks now, carried full time, all the time. That's the intentions, right?? I've only shot it once, with a cast 147gr SWC 4gr Red Dot, my standard 38 plinker. That was at about ten feet at cardboard into the ground of my shop. I was amazed at how little recoil and blast it had. I've fired these same shells in several other small 38's like this and they've all reacted much heavier than this 12.5oz gun did. There's not much sign of blowby on the bridge like I expected. It was daylight, so couldn't tell what the fireball looked like. Haven't thought to go out and try it at full dark. Will keep that in mind. But, living in town I don't like to do much shooting and then only in the shop where it's defensible against concrete walls, dirt floor, or hunk of lead or steel.

Since all this snow and cold here in SE Colo. I haven't been to the range, went the other day and the wind was blowing so hard I turned around and came back home. So it's only been fired one time so far since I got it.

But, so far I'm impressed with the way it shot and handles. the finish could be a hell of a lot better without much effort. It fits and rides in my jeans pocket just fine. I do intend to have a pocket holster sewn up soon just to smooth out what little imprint there is. I've been around a lot of people and no one has noticed it yet, and a few were very surprised when I took it out and showed it to them. Most know I always carry a pocket full of junk anyway. My keys must weight two pounds, more than this gun loaded does for sure. Just wish I could lay it on the scales at the postoffice, but, don't think that would go over very well if it was seen.

I've been doing a lot of dry fires, and defensive moves in the house with it and it seems to handle and point real well. But, the proof will be at the range doing the same with live fire.

Oh yeah, the cost taxes and all came to $329 and change. Listed at $375 I figured it would be more than it was, but, less than list.

Bret: that back carry you do, is that in a holster? IF not, how do you keep it in place? Don't think I could live with something riding my back like that. I've got a glue on clip but, it won't fit this gun. Had planned to use that the same as I did with the P40 I had.
That was a good carry gun for me, but, with big hands the grip was too small. By the time I over rode the massive staging trigger it was too close to the palm of my hand to make it fire. At least this thing is a lot better. I do wish someone would make a wheel gun like this in 40 S&W though, I'd sure get one.

Appreciate all the replies and will get back to this more to report how the gun is doing etc once I get a chance to shoot it.

[Bret4207]

I just shove the Bulldog down between my waistband and shirt, tighten the belt a little and go. Works with wood or rubber grips. I have some older work pants from back when I wore a 44" waist and now that I'm a 36-38" the pockets are huge. I can put a Bulldog, Star PD or a mess of other guns in them without anyone noticing.

[robertbank]

Reminds me of the Hollywood phrase, "Is that a gun in your pocket or are you just happy to see me".:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Take Care

Bob

[georgeld]

I'm going to have a pocket holster sewn up soon.

How heavy should the flat side leather be??

The inside can be softer, right?

Should I have a rubberized surface on the pocket contact side?

Or just rough side out??

Thanks,