Ever seen brass like this?

[rbertalotto]

http://images58.fotki.com/v154/photos/3/36012/5770246/oconnorbrass001-vi.jpg

http://images57.fotki.com/v505/photos/3/36012/5770246/oconnorbrass006-vi.jpg

O'Connor Two Piece Brass........Stainless Steel base with threaded, screw on brass body.....Can contain huge pressures..........

[3006guns]

Interesting. Which piece has a flash hole? How thick are the "case" walls?

[Bwana]

I always thought it interesting if not practicable. The "masses" are well served by the standard fare.

[Phat Man Mike]

"Steelheads" is the name given to a radical new style of cartridge case offered by O'Connor Rifle Products Co., Ltd. (Rt. 1, Box 572, Dept. GA, Edisto Island, SC 29438). These cases, which are of "basic" design and meant to be formed by the user into any appropriate standard or wildcat rifle cartridge configuration, are of two-piece design, with a brass body which is threaded to screw into a stainless steel head. If a brass body is ruined, it can be unscrewed and deep-sixed, and a new one screwed into the almost indestructible steel head. I suppose it would be possible to use the same Steelheads for several calibers, merely by interchanging the brass body portions. Extra brass bodies are available.
Steelheads are currently available in standard (.30-06) rimless and belted magnum styles, and are long enough to be shaped into any modern round.

The idea is that the head of a conventional brass rifle case is its most vulnerable portion, the part most often ruined by high-pressure loads through expanded primer pockets and/or swollen heads. Replacement of this area of brass with tempered steel, therefore, should allow the handloader to work at maximum pressures almost indefinitely (as far as case-life is concerned, anyway) with a larger safety margin. Or, if he chooses, he can exceed conventional handbook-recommended maximum loads safely for super velocities. I suspect this latter motivation generates the majority of Steelhead sales. Some of the loads reported in literature accompanying the Steelhead samples sound a bit frightening to this conservative old handloader, including some hairy duplex loadings, with some pressures exceeding 80,000 pounds per square inch absolute (psia)! This data is not to be taken as the manufacturer's recommendations, being merely a report of test results.

Do velocities increase to match the pressures? Well, they certainly increase, but perhaps not as much as might be expected. A Steelhead .30-06 case is shown to drive a 150-grain spitzer softpoint up to the 3,100-3,200 feet-per-second (fps) range from a 24-inch test barrel, which shifts the '06 into .300 H&H Magnum territory. Some years ago, however, I achieved similar velocity levels with long-loaded rounds of conventional brass from a 26-inch barreled Ruger #1 (almost certainly the strongest sporting action commercially available today). Those loads were distinctly too hot for regular use, as indicated by head expansion, but they were by no means bombs. Theoretically, these Steelhead cases might permit one to use such loads routinely, in a very strong, modern rifle.

It seems to me, though, that there are other considerations. A rifle and its ammunition is a rather carefully balanced system, all the elements of which have evolved together. A radical change in one element affects all other elements. For example, some good bolt-action rifles may suffer locking-lug setback (increasing headspace) at pressures around 80,000 psia, and other portions of the rifle will accumulate severe stresses, although no immediate deformation may be measurable. Barrels will erode much more rapidly at such pressures, temperatures and velocities, shortening their useful life. In some instances, hunting bullets designed for conventional velocities will fail badly at excessive speeds, and accuracy may suffer. In all instances, recoil effect will be magnified, perhaps exponentially. In other words, merely increasing pressures and velocities safely is not the whole story; there will be adverse side effects as well as advantages, at least without a major redesign of the entire system.

Each handloader must decide for himself whether the benefits of Steelheads outweigh the disadvantages. The product appears to be very well-made, although the belts on the magnum samples furnished me are too wide, with the result that they will not chamber in several rifles with normal headspace. The accompanying literature is quite thorough and realistic. Instructions for forming brass are excellent.

Steelhead cases have considerably smaller internal volume than conventional brass in the same caliber, about 8 percent less on average. This means, of course, that even conventional loadings must be completely redeveloped in them. Full and proper testing of this product for evaluation will be a time-consuming and expensive project.

In boxes of five, basic standard Steelheads cost $14.95, belted magnums two bucks more. Unformed replacement brass comes five for $4.95 for standard, $5.95 for magnum. No FFL is required, and postage and handling adds $1.50 per order. For a SASE and $.40, you can get literature, including .30-06 test data and manufacturer's loading recommendations.

Roy Weatherby and others have been preaching for a generation that the most promising route to progress in rifle performance is via higher velocities. That idea brought about first the "express" cartridges, and then the "magnum," almost a century ago. Although I might argue the point (breakthroughs in bullet construction and a couple of other items having almost equal potential), the high-velocity hypothesis is difficult to contest without getting into some specialized and subjective realms.

Perhaps the Steelhead concept is on the cutting edge of a technology which will lead to higher standard velocities and greater rifle effectiveness. It is even possible that they are that technology. The passage of another generation may see all rifle cases made this way, with "old-fashioned," all-brass casings regarded as quaint relics of a bygone era. It's always interesting to speculate on the impact of such imaginative new products, but only time ... and the economic rough-and-tumble of the marketplace ... will tell. is this the same stuff?[smilie=p:

[376Steyr]

Does it come with special, high-pressure primers too? I would think you couldn't gain too much in the pressure department before you'd start to see primers crater and pierce.

[markinalpine]

I always thought it interesting if not practicable. The "masses" are well served by the standard fare.

Ditto! Interesting, but not my cup o' T. [smilie=f:

Mark :coffee:

[zuke]

I remember someone offering these a couple decade's ago.
I forget who it was but it was the exact same idea.

[Hardcast416taylor]

I seem to vaguely remember reading about this kind of cartridge cases being made back in the late `60`s. Another oddity case had small tubes that threaded into the inside case head and extended nearly to the shoulder area of the case to send the primer flame up and ignite slow burning powder from the top down. Bad thing was the need to unscrew these tubes to deprime the case and then screw them back in after repriming. Artillery cases had this type of primer tubes if I recall.Robert

[williamwaco]

Looks like a solution in search of a problem to me. If you want more velocity buy a larger cartridge. Don't do it by putting a hand grenade in your chamber.

One day, some one may test some of the modern actions and pronounce them safe at 80,000 psi. Until them, I would stay far away from anyone who even had these things on the shooting bench.

By the way, that pressure level is probably going to reduce barrel life to about 500 rounds.

When I was a kid, my parents used to tell me "Just because you can do it, doesn't mean you should." I thought they were crazy. I guess now I am the crazy one.

[XWrench3]

Sounds to me like a great way to ruin a perfectly good rifle. Ok, so the back half of the "brass" will hold up. What is saying the rest of the gun will?! I know there is a certain amount of safety margin built into our firearms. But think about the results of a failure! And if you push your gun to hard, or long, it will fail. It is no different that an internal combustion engine. You can mildly overrev almost all of them a couple of times. But overrev one to much, or to often, and it will come apart. I do not want my face two inches from a breach when it comes unglued @ 80,000 psi! I will stick to published loads, thank you very much.

[watkibe]

Seems like I read somewhere that in the 1800's this type of case was made, and was somewhat popular.

[Reloader06]

"Another oddity case had small tubes that threaded into the inside case head and extended nearly to the shoulder area of the case to send the primer flame up and ignite slow burning powder from the top down."

Sounds to me that you're talking about Rocky Gibbs' line of cartridges. Just a guess.

Matt

[mpmarty]

Thanks but no thanks. 40,000 psi is plenty for most of what I need to perforate.

[fisheadgib]

I'm more impressed with gaining more velocity without gaining more pressure.

[stubshaft]

"Another oddity case had small tubes that threaded into the inside case head and extended nearly to the shoulder area of the case to send the primer flame up and ignite slow burning powder from the top down."

Sounds to me that you're talking about Rocky Gibbs' line of cartridges. Just a guess.

Matt

IIRC - Elmer Keith was one of the instigators, and he prodded Gibbs into trying to produce them.

[HangFireW8]

"Another oddity case had small tubes that threaded into the inside case head and extended nearly to the shoulder area of the case to send the primer flame up and ignite slow burning powder from the top down."

Sounds to me that you're talking about Rocky Gibbs' line of cartridges. Just a guess.

Matt

That sounds like the OKH series with extended flash tube. The "K" is for Elmer Keith. He tried to sell the gov't on it during WWII, then tried to market it commercially afterwards. It was used in combination with a duplex load that ignited from the bullet end on down.

Gains were small over conventional cartridges. With new powders coming along every couple years, each one giving lower pressure and higher velocities than the last, Ordnance wasn't that interested, though they did check it out.

-HF

[Chicken Thief]

All that threading cant be good for case capacity.
So to start with higher pressure just to compensate for less internal volume, hmmmmmm!

[10x]

I seem to vaguely remember reading about this kind of cartridge cases being made back in the late `60`s. Another oddity case had small tubes that threaded into the inside case head and extended nearly to the shoulder area of the case to send the primer flame up and ignite slow burning powder from the top down. Bad thing was the need to unscrew these tubes to deprime the case and then screw them back in after repriming. Artillery cases had this type of primer tubes if I recall.Robert

Elmer Kieth experimented with tubes to burn the powder from the bullet to the back of the case. If I remember correctly it wasn't worth the time, expense, and effort.

[Clark]

rbertalotto,
always good to see you.

I have seen that steel case head and brass body developed in two places, independently, ~15 years ago.

I saw it on Casull's web site [early gun site on the WWW] and I saw them in Lynnwood Guns. Randy Kechum of LG, is a very inventive fellow.

The pressures are no greater than can be contained with Lapua 308 small primer brass, if you can live with a small primer.

[noylj]

Those who shoot major 9x19 and .40S&W may be well served by these.
The cost alone would be out of my interest.

[Tatume]

Are they still available? I couldn't find them with an online search.

[Hardcast416taylor]

I was talking with an old friend of mine, 1 of the few old friends of mine left, yesterday about this type of cartridge case. He also remembered when it was being touted as the next new best thing to come along. However, he also had read a report somewhere that the threads connecting the 2 case parts suffered the most due their fine tpi design and the fact that gas did leak through them abit making them gritty and tough to clean. I don`t think I have to point out to anyone here how hard dirty threads are to connect. Many thanks to you other sharp minded posters that remembered it being Elmer Keith touting the primer flame tubes.Robert

[imashooter2]

Those who shoot major 9x19 and .40S&W may be well served by these.
The cost alone would be out of my interest.

Buy them by the thousand to scatter into the grass at matches? You better have a sponsor...

[Artful]

It's back


Shell Shock Technologies NAS3 next generation 9mm shell casings.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2ozLtD9_Kw

Shell Shock Technologies claims the cases have been tested to 65,000 PSI.
https://www.facebook.com/shellshocktech/

Wonder what the primers looked like at 65K PSI...

[M-Tecs]

Interesting.......................

[Traffer]

From the looks of em you hardly need a barrel. Looks like they could make them to fit shotguns with rifle cartridges inside.

[NoZombies]

Those could be interesting in a sub-gun...

[beagle]

Ran into a similar concept in Honduras several years ago on 7.62 X 51mm blanks. Case had a steel base and a plastic body./beagle

[fivefang]

Hardcast, I belive you are referring to "tube-priming" which was to ignite the powder at the front instead at the base, I read about it in the Rifleman back in the '60's ,yes interesting to say the least, Fivefang