30lb R134a Tank Lead Pot

[BigRix]

I searched and couldn't find any info on the use of these for smelting pots. I haven't tried mine out yet as I just finished making it. I basically cut it with a die grinder just above the weld so I would have a guide line. Smoothed out the edge with a grinder and 3M abrasive pad so as to not leave any burrs.

I welcome your thoughts on this scrounged up pot. Is it too thin? Is the lead going to stick to the inside?

I'm sure it can handle the heat because my co-worker uses one to melt aluminum in his home made forge.

http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Casting/photo3.jpg

http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/Casting/photo2.jpg

[bumpo628]

Looks good. I'm sure the thickness will not be an issue.
Fire it up!

[mroliver77]

Looks good. I have used one for a few years now. No worry about led sticking either.
Jay

[BigRix]

Shot a new video of my first go with the new pot. As you can see at the end of the vid I made a few mistakes. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8N8GkjEMoc

[badbob454]

Would 1/2 an old propane tank work as a smelting pot, and it should be steel not aluminum?

i use a 1/2 of a propane tank works great i would use steel myself

[craveman85]

good idea but i still prefer cast iron. seems to hold heat better up here in ny.

[BigRix]

good idea but i still prefer cast iron. seems to hold heat better up here in ny.

I'm pretty sure in the middle of summer here in Tucson, I may not even need the turkey fryer to smelt lead. :)

[Defcon-One]

BigRix:

I watched your video. Not too bad. I gotta tell you I was yelling warnings about the plastic bucket. I saw that coming and was pleased to see that you fessed up later. I'm sure your honesty will save a few hundred other guys from doing the same thing.

Only advice beyond that is that you need to refine your fluxing process a bit.

Drop in the crayon, candle or sawdust and once it gets carbonized, stir fairly vigorously with the slotted spoon. Stir deep and all around. You are trying to mix it all up and work the metal on top back down into the mix. Just be careful not to splatter or spill it.

If you do it right, all you will skim off later is some blackish grey powder and a lot of grit. If your dross has a lot of shiny metal in it, you did not flux enough to reduce it back into the mix. So try again. If you are skimming off anything metallic, your not doing it right.

I usually flux once BEFORE removing the clips, then again after. You'll get more lead off of the clips if you do this.

I'd say your pot is a winner. Enjoy!

[10 ga]

Good pot! I cut mine just at the top of the straight side. Took the hammer and flared the top I cut off and use it as a top to save heat when I start the smelt or add wood chunks or sticks as I smelt with wood fire but cast with propane. Mine started that "hospital" green too but now is all black and burned on the outside. 10 ga

[BigRix]

I've always wondered about fluxing but figured I would just give it a go and see what happens. I'll be honest, I haven't come across much in the way of "How To's" on fluxing. Thanks for the tips. I think the part of the tank I cut off is still in the scrap bin, it will make a wonderful lid.

[Doby45]

First, I was LMAO at the doggies constantly making an appearance and thier presence known. Second, I would use the TOP of that freon bottle as my clips pot/dross pot. I did the same thing with a propane tank and the top of mine is used just as I described.

That skin that is on top as you are ladeling your ingots needs to be stirred back into the alloy and you need one really good flux while all the clips are still in there.

The little tan pup is the funniest..

You are doing a great job and appear to be enjoying yourself, carry on!!

http://i44.tinypic.com/8vfm.jpg


Shot a new video of my first go with the new pot. As you can see at the end of the vid I made a few mistakes. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8N8GkjEMoc

[Longwood]

Don't feel too bad about the plastic bucket. I had a stainless pan sitting on my table that I tossed a few of my clips in. It is a good thing it was a few, the table was one of those plastic folding tables. It now has a divot in it.
To speed up the setting up of the lead in the molds, gently tap on the mold with a small hammer or something while it is cooling. It will surprise you at how it will speed things up a bit.
If you have some sort of vibrator (no, not that kind) it will help also. A drill motor with some sort of eccentric (no, not that kind) in it will work by simply laying it on the table.

Oh yeah, put that tin that is in with the clips back in the pot and flux the melt with wax and sawdust next time. I would do the melt over again so it is in the ingots.

[Longwood]

One other thing, I would also go to the dollar store or Walmart and get a longer handled ladle. Make a bend in the handle so it is easier to work with. Be careful while making the bend and don't use the cup to lever against if it is a really cheap one that has the cup spot welded to the handle. Avoid the plastic handled ones.
I use a Wok ladle I found at a garage sale some of the time. It is steel so I was able to pound a small pouring lip/spout on each side of the cup using a piece of round stock and a fairly narrow gap in the jaws of my vise. If you have a acetylene torch, that would make the job even easier.

[evan price]

Right around 3:00 or so when the clips are out, you can see the top of the lead is purple, gold and blue... that means you have too much heat, your lead is too hot. You'll notice after you flux and skim the lead surface clouds over and goes grey really quickly? That's because the temp is too high and the lead is oxidizing as soon as it hits the air. A properly fluxed pot at the right temp will hold the mirror shine for a very long time as long as the temp is low enough. Use high temp to get the melt going then keep reducing it until the lead stays liquid, no more heat than that.

A thermometer would help but just watching the top of the liquid lead will tell you just as much. All that material you skimmed off after fluxing is probably good metal that just needed to be fluxed again at a lower temperature. You'll notice that by 6:00 the lead has gone golden again; too high temp! Once the entire mass is liquid it will hold heat a long time. You can go to low heat while you are fluxing, watch the lead and if it starts getting grainy add some more heat slowly.

Might also want to consider putting a piece of cheap 1/4" luan plywood down on that nice patio to catch the lead drops that almost always seem to drip while working... mrs. BigRix (if there is one) will appreciate that and be more tolerant of the hobby if things are not messed up!

Might want to find something a bit more sturdy than that white table to hold the ingot mold- ever have one get spilled? You get some fancy footwork... be a sad thing if that big puppy of yours bumped the table and got hurt. A couple cinder blocks will work just fine. I also have used a row of cinder blocks with a small fan blowing across them to cool the ingot molds. That speeds up cooling time so you can drop your ingots out faster.

Just my $.02 and advice!

[BigRix]

Right around 3:00 or so when the clips are out, you can see the top of the lead is purple, gold and blue... that means you have too much heat, your lead is too hot. You'll notice after you flux and skim the lead surface clouds over and goes grey really quickly? That's because the temp is too high and the lead is oxidizing as soon as it hits the air. A properly fluxed pot at the right temp will hold the mirror shine for a very long time as long as the temp is low enough. Use high temp to get the melt going then keep reducing it until the lead stays liquid, no more heat than that.

A thermometer would help but just watching the top of the liquid lead will tell you just as much. All that material you skimmed off after fluxing is probably good metal that just needed to be fluxed again at a lower temperature. You'll notice that by 6:00 the lead has gone golden again; too high temp! Once the entire mass is liquid it will hold heat a long time. You can go to low heat while you are fluxing, watch the lead and if it starts getting grainy add some more heat slowly.

Might also want to consider putting a piece of cheap 1/4" luan plywood down on that nice patio to catch the lead drops that almost always seem to drip while working... mrs. BigRix (if there is one) will appreciate that and be more tolerant of the hobby if things are not messed up!

Might want to find something a bit more sturdy than that white table to hold the ingot mold- ever have one get spilled? You get some fancy footwork... be a sad thing if that big puppy of yours bumped the table and got hurt. A couple cinder blocks will work just fine. I also have used a row of cinder blocks with a small fan blowing across them to cool the ingot molds. That speeds up cooling time so you can drop your ingots out faster.

Just my $.02 and advice!

Thanks so much for the helpful advice. This new hobby of mine keeps me constantly learning. I wondered why I was getting that colored layer on top of my pot. I will keep an eye on the temps from now on. And yes Mrs. BigRix will appreciate me not making a mess as well.

[Markbo]

My post is like that. But it has a small spout welded into one side on the top and the removed portion of the pot was turned into a skirt and tac welded back along the bottom. I think it just helps hold heat in better.

[BigRix]

I took the advice given in this thread and smelted another pot full of wheel weights. I took the rest of the tank and made a lid that also doubles as a dross pot when flipped over.

http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss208/BigRix/a104759d.jpg

I kept the temp down and didn't get all the pretty colors this time.

I did however have a few issues.

I still had a lot of lead stuck to the clips when I skimmed them off. I fluxed when they were in the pot but no matter how much I stirred they were still speckled with shiny spots. I saved them this time so if I get that part figured out I can re smelt them another time.

I moved my operation into the garage to keep the dogs out of harms way and fired up the pot near the open garage door and then promptly stunk up the whole house with the vapors coming off the pot. Luckily it was a nice night and we just turned off the A/C and opened all the windows. Mrs. BigRix was none to happy. I guess I'm relegated to the back yard for sure now.

Will melting my ingots in an electric pot cause this kind of smell? I hope not because I had plans to cast at my work bench in the garage.

[canyon-ghost]

After the wheelweights are poured into ingots, the smell goes to about 5% of the original. There's hardly a smell at all.

Ron

[SciFiJim]

As you can see at the end of the vid I made a few mistakes.


I had to chuckle when I saw you making the move to dump the clips into the plastic bucket.

On working the oxides back into the mix. Something I learned here is when you have them collected against the side of the pot, press them against the side while pushing them back into the melt. Think of it as smearing the oxides on the side below the melt level. It seems to help get them back into the mix. Sawdust works better for me for fluxing.

[Tammany42]

I seem to remember that somebody was selling cut up propane tanks for smelting. I can't seem to find the thread. Anyone know who it was?

[LabGuy]

I’m pretty sure D Crockett will make a pot from a tank for you.

[daviddoo]

I just got a freon bottle from my AC man and will be making a similar pot in a couple of days. I think it willl work great.

[MikeS]

One comment I would make concerns your dogs. They look like nice dogs, and I would hate to see anything happen to them. It's probably best to leave them inside when you smelt, just in case something happens, they're not wearing any safety equipment, and might not be able to get out of the way fast enough, so you should probably leave them inside, even if they complain about being left inside, in the long run it's better for them! Or if you can't put them inside, then at least keep them on a leash short enough to keep them far away from where you're melting your lead. Other than that, and not using plastic pails for clips, looks like you're doing ok!

[afish4570]

Would 1/2 an old propane tank work as a smelting pot, and it should be steel not aluminum?

Just melted 73# of lead in mine today on an old propane plumbers pot. Works great and is thick enough so that I don't believe the pot will fail. Follow the safety precautions for cutting a propane bottle on other threads. The thin cutoff blade took about 10min to cut and used only about 1/3 of the blade (10pk. costs $10 in Harbour Fr. store locally plus taking a 20% coupon.afish4570;)