Has Mountain Molds gone belly up?

[Char-Gar]

How long does it take for build a shop for Pete's sake? I am beginning to think Mountain Molds is a gone goose. Anybody hear from Dan lately?

[Bass Ackward]

I corresponded with him about a month and a half ago and he was apparently OK then but was busy still try to beat winter on the house.

But my last email from 2 weeks ago recieved no response, which may or may NOT be a problem since I have a habbit of frustrating him. :grin:

[9.3X62AL]

I thought Dan's initial timeline estimate of moving a home and shop across Idaho and being back in production was pretty optimistic. Considering the logistics involved with his rural location and the labor involved in getting done all that was required to get a residence built and a shop under way before winter locked things up--tall order. I do hope he's able to get set up and live in the place and manner he aspires to. I like seeing people realize their dreams. Kinda cool, that.

[Greg5278]

You can't build a house with no cash flow. What the heck is he doing for work? It sounds like a stupid move to me, he put the screws to me on the last 2 molds.
I'dmhate to lose another moldmaker, but I really don't like his bad attitude any more. His forum is more sarcastica nd nasty every time I check it.
Greg

[Lloyd Smale]

I agree with Gregg the man is an arogant jerk

[Blacktail 8541]

He shure took the long hard route of doing things. Building a cords wood house by himself and by milling all his own timber without the proper tools was not the best way to go about things. He may have the pride of a built it myself house, but what good is that if he goes belly up in the process and can't keep it?

[Ranch Dog]

I had thought about using him for some of my mold work on my leveractions but from reading what he writes on his forum I changed my mind and have given Lee thousands of dollars of work through their special orders. He might deliver a good product but the guy appears to be a jerk and being more so over time.

[Antietamgw]

Remember when Veral left for Idaho? Had trouble getting help as well. But he did build the house, shop and a hydro plant to run it all.I thought he got it done pretty quick considering.

[500bfrman]

but I really don't like his bad attitude any more. His forum is more sarcastica nd nasty every time I check it.
Greg

Ditto, He won't get any of my money if/when he goes back in business. I'll pay more elsewhere if need be. Most of my stuff is odd anyway, so I pay ridiculous prices for molds but I don't care. His propaganda forum, oops I mean humor/politics forum sure let's me know where he stands. I've posted on there a couple times (different handle) I just don't get it really. I was wondering if anybody else thought this way. I think its the first time I've ever agreed with anything Lloyd said.:-D

[Lloyd Smale]

Hell pal weve allready came farther then the old lady and I as she hasnt agreed with me yet and its been over 6 years.

[Bass Ackward]

You people just don't understand Americana. Back east, we can be arrogant jerks. Out west, it's called independent personalities.

I prefer to leave the human element out of it and judge an operation by the products and the service. Same with knowledge that is presented here. I don't have to love you to get something I can use.

And his product has always been first rate or he made it right.

[500bfrman]

Oh, I understand Americana. Hopefully dan does too. As in don't be asking where we went. Yeah, I'm sure there will be enough biz to keep him up if he ever get's running again. Consider some of the attitudes and statements that have been made there though. If Ruger or smith/wesson said those same things on their websites everybody would call for a boycott. Lloyd that's too funny.:mrgreen:

[stocker]

I placed an order a couple or three years back for a 348 mould. Going through the e-mail correspondence we had I mentioned on 3 occasions that the rifle had virtually no throat. When I got the mould it was made for a rifle with about 1/4" of throat and is basically unusable. I don't know if Dan had the online design program in place at the time so I had specified the weight I wanted, a good sized platen and the diameter. At the time I got no sympathy from Dan but on a later occasion I inquired if it could be re-cut to a 35 mould as I couldn't use it as it was. Not interested in doing that but he did send me a free mould for the 348 which only has a slightly thick throat area but can be used provided boolits aren't too hard to force seat. It shoots quite well. I guess I can't complain much as he went out of his way to try and make it right. I always thought he was too shop busy to spend much time communicating. Perhaps he's not quite as bad as made out in some posts but I never did spend time on his web site to get any further insight.

[Bullshop]

I have always received a good product and good service from Dan. Our e-mails have always been plesent. I always enjoyed his testing when he was our sponcer for castboolits and many of us that payed attention learned something. I dont give a hoot for anybodys politics and dont judg by them so I have nothing bad to say about him. Hope we dont get judged by stupid things we do cuz if we do I would not be allowed here.
BIC/BS

[Glen]

I agree with you Bullshop -- I've always gotten good service from Dan. Sometime he can be a little cantankerous, but then again, so can I. I don't always agree with his interpretation of his experimental results, but he's actually doing the experiments, which is a lot more than I can say about a lot of "know-it-alls". Bottom line? I'll do business with him again, and do so gladly. Will I always agree with him? Nope, but that doesn't really matter. I'm paying my money to take advantage of his skills in making bullet moulds, and to date, he has made me exactly what I've asked for every time.

[fatnhappy]

Since when has CB been an appropriate venue for personal attacks?

[RugerFan]

When I was designing my first bullet mold on Dan's site, I had a fairly long e-mail exchange with him. Dan was always patient and polite with me and the mold(s) turned out great. As long as he does me right, I'll give him business.

[PatMarlin]

... which may or may NOT be a problem since I have a habbit of frustrating him. :grin:

Just him?... :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

[MGySgt]

Since when has CB been an appropriate venue for personal attacks?

What fatnhappy said!

I have a number of Dan's moulds and I had a problem with one warping, and 2 under size. He re-made all 3 without a hesitation and even changed the design (bad design originally, my fault, not his) - he stated as long as he had to remake them I could change the design.

I have had pleasant correspondance with Dan and will if the need arises do business with him again.

Drew

[KCSO]

All I can say is thast each mould I have gotten from him was EXACTLY what i ordered, good or bad it was what I wanted at the time and was delivered on time as requested. I guess I never got into his forum so I can't comment on that but all the moulds were excellent workmanship. Having built a house in the wilds I figured it was going to take longer so I have just been waiting impatiently. When he comes back I will place my orders and judge the product on it's merits.

[NVcurmudgeon]

Pat, guess the new picture is you in the middle. Who are the ladies, and was it election day?

[9.3X62AL]

I like Dan's products, and he has always dealt with me fairly and politely. His tools are are excellent, and I too will buy more of his products after he re-starts.

[charger 1]

I agree with Gregg the man is an arogant jerk


I dont know. I sent him the money order and drawing a few months back for a mold. He got in touch the second the money got there and told me he was not doing orders at the time. I said will you please keep the money cause it came from canada,so to save me the hassle of resending. He said that was fine, he'd make an acception....Over the next month he came back at be with lots of ideas to incorporate into the mold. Couple months after that LBT got going again and as we all know Veral had had bad luck, So I asked Dan if it was possible for me to pull the coin,and I think I even said I was getting it to Veral. He asked which postal method I'd like. And that was that....I dont know which way you wanta call that one as far as the business goes, but I couldnt find any arrogance there. My final note to him (and I meant it if you see this Dan) is that I found that all quite fine and he will see my business when he gets going. Between me and a friend theres 3 drawings of molds sitting here....
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -- - - - - -

that was my opinion (for what their worth here)

[charger 1]

I had thought about using him for some of my mold work on my leveractions but from reading what he writes on his forum I changed my mind and have given Lee thousands of dollars of work through their special orders. He might deliver a good product but the guy appears to be a jerk and being more so over time.


Ya, and with all due respect RD, cause I mean you do one heck of a good job at these buys and my continued appreciation goes out. I was hoping the lee group due to being custom might have some quality..After seeing the slop that came out of the 420 grain 460 lee GB I moulded a pile of firelappers with it, then it hit the ebay floor...Goin to tell you guys a little something about the precision metal trade..Invariably the smartest guy in the tool room will also be the grumpiest, or as you say arrogant. He just doesnt have time for what he perseves as nonsense...I guess in short they tend to be a bit ecsentric..You go into a guys shop that mounts some scopes and turns some screws, nice to talk to. Talk to a guy that builds the finest quality hand crafted rifles, not 100% of the time but a lot of the time he's not smiley jack type nice

[Lloyd Smale]

my gripe with him came from this. When he was first cutting molds i talked to him about .475 and .512 molds he didnt have many ideas on them at the time and asked me to send him samples of what i had. I casted bullets out of every .476 mold and ever 512 mold i had and sent them to him. A while after i sent them I emailed him to find out if he had gotten them ( he didnt even thank me for them) and asked him to cut me a .476 copy of the rcbs swc with the only alteration being a gas checked shank. I explained to him that im a dumb ### and the computer design program was a little over my head being computer illiterate. His reply was "design it yourself with the program. Ive got no time to do it for you" Now im sure i took more then twice the time it would have taken him to do that casting bullets for him. Then on another fourm he had the balls to call elmer keith a ********ter and claimed he knew much more then elmer about what makes a cast bullet work. Many people jumped him for that. More for the arogance in which he stated it. I too made my feelings noted and did so in a manner that wasnt near as nasty as most of them. He then singled me out and slammed me for badmouthing him after he had done so much for me!! I still havent figured out what it was he did! Theres to many other good bullet makers out there that will do custom work. Ballistic cast in my opinion makes a much better mold and if you talk to there mold maker will make you almost anything you want and do it at a price that is not that much more then there standard molds. The head mold maker there is very knowlegable and is more then happy to help you with suggestions on what will work and what wont and doesnt pretend to know more then everyone in the world about cast bullets.

[charger 1]

asked him to cut me a .476 copy of the rcbs swc with the only alteration being a gas checked shank.

Dont worry about it Lloyd. I asked a fella to send me dies with a 16.5 degree shoulder. He repeated back " 16.5" yep 16.5...To then send dies with absolutely no shoulder. Now after large arguments and in part the support of some folk here feels entitled to keep the dies and the 200 can$..Chin up ol boy

[charger 1]

Pat, guess the new picture is you in the middle. Who are the ladies, and was it election day?

Maybe the time of the month. But what I dont get is when guys get it does the dorm syndrome still apply?

[475/480]

I have many of Dan's moulds and he has always done me right and the 1 time the mould was wrong he corrected it.
I do not agree with some of his pollitical views ,but if I quit doing bussiness with everyone that don't believe as I do,I would have to quit buying a LOT of things. including gas etc........

Sean

[500bfrman]

...Goin to tell you guys a little something about the precision metal trade..Invariably the smartest guy in the tool room will also be the grumpiest, or as you say arrogant. He just doesnt have time for what he perseves as nonsense...I guess in short they tend to be a bit ecsentric..You go into a guys shop that mounts some scopes and turns some screws, nice to talk to. Talk to a guy that builds the finest quality hand crafted rifles, not 100% of the time but a lot of the time he's not smiley jack type nice


That may be true in this instance but it sure doesn't have to be. Example: Larry at State Arms builds custom 50 BMG rifles ranging in price from 2000-4000 dollars. Nicest guy you would ever deal with, his guns win championships too. I don't care where people buy their molds, I'm sure not telling you where to go, but I know if big gun companys said what he says you would have your panties in a wad. Think Smith and Wesson a few years ago.

[475/480]

Is his website down??????
I can't find it..

Sean

[GLynn41]

For what ever this is worth Dan is no grumpier than Veral -- both can be very nice and both can be the other way -- but when I want A mold I will go back to either one of them -

[Bass Ackward]

When you buy an LBT mold, you get the knowledge and experience behind it that Veral believes will be successful. So if you want to look at it, there is a certain amount of arrogance behind his product that he knows what you need. If you don't believe in that knowledge, you buy somewhere else.

When you buy an RCBS, Lyman, or any other brand you get that same knowledge or arrogance that what they sell is what "THEY" believe to be a good product. If it works, you probably agree. If it doesn't fit, you probably aren't a big fan of their work either.

Dan's business is different. Dan takes his arrogance entirely out of the picture. Dan's program allow "YOU", with your knowledge base to test your arrogance, to design and build a product to a set of perameters "YOU" decide on. His prices are cheap enough compared to other molds that allow poor fellas like me experimentation that otherwise wouldn't occur. Period.

I appreciate that opportunity.

If you can't operate the program, you are SOL. If you don't want to take the time to fit a bullet to "your" throat, you are SOL. That's just how it is.

[charger 1]

When you buy an LBT mold, you get the knowledge and experience behind it that Veral believes will be successful. So if you want to look at it, there is a certain amount of arrogance behind his product that he knows what you need. If you don't believe in that knowledge, you buy somewhere else.

When you buy an RCBS, Lyman, or any other brand you get that same knowledge or arrogance that what they sell is what "THEY" believe to be a good product. If it works, you probably agree. If it doesn't fit, you probably aren't a big fan of their work either.

Dan's business is different. Dan takes his arrogance entirely out of the picture. Dan's program allow "YOU", with your knowledge base to test your arrogance, to design and build a product to a set of perameters "YOU" decide on. His prices are cheap enough compared to other molds that allow poor fellas like me experimentation that otherwise wouldn't occur. Period.

I appreciate that opportunity.

If you can't operate the program, you are SOL. If you don't want to take the time to fit a bullet to "your" throat, you are SOL. That's just how it is.



Agreed. And Dan sure dont hold a gun to your head and force you to play by those rules

[45nut]

The website does seem down,its probable that he hasn't renewed his domain.

Backwhen I first started Cast Boolits Dan stepped up and freely contributed to the kitty to get it going and keep it ad free, In our conversations he was helpful and did indeed help design a couple molds of top quality for me.

Subsequently he did have an issue with the "lack" of scientific theory discussions and left us.
He had his own website up and provided me with plenty of good reading and never once did I think less of him after he decided to focus on his own site.

[Char-Gar]

I didn't know Dan had a forum or I would not have asked the original question. I went to his forum and did some reading. Here is my take on the situation.

1. The man has more on his plate than he can deal with. The pressure from folks to get back up and running has got him on edge.

2. His patience in dealing with the public is totaly gone.

3. The molds Dan has done for me have been first class.

4. In the beginning he would work with you on design, but he found out that he could not do that and turn a profit. He can turn your computor design into script and cut the mold and turn a profit. Soo...he no longer will help with design work and he says so on his forum.

5. I can't blame him for not wanting to lose money in his business, just because we want him too.

6. He probably didn't have a very winsome personality even in the best of times. But neither do I!!

7. I don't care about his personality, just his molds!

8. So, when he get up and running, I will continue to do business with him.

[JDL]

Dan has cut a couple of molds for me and I have absolutely no complaints as ther're my best molds! Whenever he resumes production, I'll not hesitate to use his services. I don't know his politics, but our correspondance has always been courteous and helpful and he does cut a fine mold. -JDL

[Tom Myers]

Is his website down??????
I can't find it..

Sean
Try this

http://mountainmolds.com/

[Buckshot]

http://mountainmolds.com/

Notice: This domain name expired on 12/14/06 and is pending renewal or deletion

...............Buckshot

[PatMarlin]

Pat, guess the new picture is you in the middle. Who are the ladies, and was it election day?


That's my mommie and my little sis Bill..

[PatMarlin]

Bill,

That was Rally for American at the State Capitol in Saramento 2003. I was asked to speak on account of a patriotic record I produced at the time.

They aproved the speach I had written but I changed the first line.. :mrgreen:

The new opening line was...

"This record of mine was made possible by the right to keep and bear arms in America"

You should of heard the croud cheer on that, and the frowns I got by some of the VIP's in the background... :mrgreen:

[Lloyd Smale]

pretty cool pat!!!
Bill,

That was Rally for American at the State Capitol in Saramento 2003. I was asked to speak on account of a patriotic record I produced at the time.

They aproved the speach I had written but I changed the first line.. :mrgreen:

The new opening line was...

"This record of mine was made possible by the right to keep and bear arms in America"

You should of heard the croud cheer on that, and the frowns I got by some of the VIP's in the background... :mrgreen:

[Ranch Dog]

Way cool... that frown on the VIPs pie-holes would have been one of those priceless AE moments! You know... Tank full of Venezuelan gasoline to get me to the rally $75, Foreign import to drive to rally... $40,000, Face on VIPs I pissed off with pro-gun statement... Priceless. Or at least something like that!

[Ranch Dog]

Charger1...

Thanks for your story with Dan... that seems to be reasonable but it also seems the exception as the only contact he has WANTED with customers is through the internet and through this method of communication he was rude and uncaring. I won't buy a burger from someone like that... I don't care how good it tastes.

He seems to have a good following with the fellows here and that carries weight with me because I definitely respect you guys. His "forum" was the worse advertising he could have simply because of his responses. I understand the need to keep your nose to the grid stone as a sole proprietorship but he set up the forum to communicate through. Look at Marshall Stanton at Beartooth Bullets. One of the nicest guys on this earth. Like Dan, he wants to spend his day working and not mess with his Shooters Forum so he set the rules and turned it over to moderators (Marshall made me a moderator so I can edit the forum for the Postal Match but there is about as much moderator in me as there are jacketed bullets on my reloading bench). Dan's time being the single responder on his forum seemed to piss himself off even more. I deleted my link to his forum about three months ago after reading his response to a couple questions asked on his forum. I knew then I would never do business with him so no sense in going back.

I've got some boolits sitting on my bench from one of his molds. They don't look or shoot any different out of my 45-70 or 450 Marlin than the boolits dropped from my Lee molds. Since the first weekend of November, my family has dropped 15 big game animals with boolit from Lee molds. That is all I ask for. I sent Lee another $600 worth off business yesterday, over $6000 worth of molds this year.

[db2]

What I have gotten from Dan was what I wanted. No problems there. Building a house that I do understand.

Four years ago my dad retired and and moved out in the sticks, and started building a house. It will be dried in, in a month or two. Why so long? Well, he decided he wanted to build a timber frame house by himself, all mortise joints. No nails, screws, or bolts. Just the joints alone took two years to make. I think there was nine bents @ 4000lbs each to put up, two stories tall. Not to mention over 4 months to make the stone fireplace. Yup, he's a better man than me.

When I had my house built a few years ago, I remember my wife chewing out the general contractor for doing this and that wrong, and thinking, thank goodness she's not mad at me :) I can not even imagine how he his dealing with my mother now.

db2

[PatMarlin]

Way cool... that frown on the VIPs pie-holes would have been one of those priceless AE moments! You know... Tank full of Venezuelan gasoline to get me to the rally $75, Foreign import to drive to rally... $40,000, Face on VIPs I pissed off with pro-gun statement... Priceless. Or at least something like that!


LOL!!.........:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

[PatMarlin]

Four years ago my dad retired and and moved out in the sticks, and started building a house. It will be dried in, in a month or two. Why so long? Well, he decided he wanted to build a timber frame house by himself, all mortise joints. No nails, screws, or bolts. Just the joints alone took two years to make. I think there was nine bents @ 4000lbs each to put up, two stories tall. Not to mention over 4 months to make the stone fireplace. Yup, he's a better man than me.


db2

That's what I'm gonna do db2 (is that as in decibles?) is timberframe construction, but now they have a cool fast way to do it, and even the most stringent traditionalist are now endorsing it's capabilities:

http://www.timberlinx.com

[Boz330]

I built my own house once, Won't do that again. Took almost every waking hour that I wasn't working my regular job for 2 years, and I bought the materials. And that General contractor's a$$ that was getting chewed was mine. There is a real test of a marriage if you want to try it, but I don't recomend it. One particular event that I remember well was after a long day of doing trim work, my wife walks in and says what have you been doing all day.
I also have a business of which I am the only employee, and I can understand being distracted by customers that want to BS. I just tell them that I have to get back to work. One difference is that I work on my customers equipment every year and most of them are accquaintenences if not friends. I have very few one time customers and they depend on me for my skills and I depend on them for my living. I don't have a monopoly but close. Even though I get stressed sometimes I try to be civil and when I do complain I try not to take it out on the customer. I just blame it on the FAA for making my life miserable. They all can relate to that. I hate paperwork!
I don't know Dan and haven't done any business with although I was looking to. To say that he has his hands full is an understatement. That is one time when he might have been better off doing what he does best and let house builders do what they do best. There is a tremendous pride in being self sufficient and building your own house, but it is still a PITA.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Bob

[sundog]

Box330, I did, too. Build my own house..., in my 'other life'. You're still married to the same lady, huh? I'm not, but the house wasn't the only thing. Like I said, that was like another life. And you are right - ever waking hour. And comments like, "what did you do today? Have you been goofing off? Doesn't look like ANYTHING got done. Are we still moving in.......... Yada, yada." Yup, it takes two years. I did everything except the ceptic and rock work on the fire place. Had some help on heavy stuff, but it was mostly a one man show. My Dad was a trooper for helping! I don't live it, but it's still there and looks good as ever.

I don't know Dan, never dealt with the man, but if he can make it all work and get a house built, too, my hat's off to him. Maybe he'll mellow out on the other side of all this. sundog

[nighthunter]

I have only purchased 3 molds from Dan so I guess I am not an authority on his business. I do know that I got exactly what I paid for in a timely manner on all 3 occasions. He even emailed me about a 45-70 mold I ordered and suggested a slight change that worked out beautifully in the end. So what if he has the guts to take a little time off to build something that he has apparently worked for and has the balls to go after. Dan doesn't owe us bullet molds. My Dad used to tell me that all good gunsmiths were slow. Well ............ Dan is a good moldmaker and I will be patient enough to wait for him to get settled into his new home and shop.
Nighthunter

[BD]

I think Charger summed up my feelings on the subject pretty well.
BD

[Underclocked]

http://mountainmolds.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=450

http://www.mountainmolds.com/pics/timber_11_2.jpg

Have been following his progress with the building for some time. The man has grit.

[rvpilot76]

I also have a business of which I am the only employee, and I can understand being distracted by customers that want to BS. I just tell them that I have to get back to work. One difference is that I work on my customers equipment every year and most of them are accquaintenences if not friends. I have very few one time customers and they depend on me for my skills and I depend on them for my living. I don't have a monopoly but close. Even though I get stressed sometimes I try to be civil and when I do complain I try not to take it out on the customer. I just blame it on the FAA for making my life miserable. They all can relate to that. I hate paperwork! Bob

Sorry for the hi-jack guys. Bob, do you mind me asking what you do? I am an A&P mechanic here in Idaho. I know what you mean with paperwork. I like my job, but my boss takes time out his busy day to micromanage and make life generally miserable for the rest of us mechanics. Do you fly?

Kevin

[LAH]

Don't know the man. I've had two of his moulds for the .401 in my shop. First one wouldn't release the bullet. Mould sent back. Second mould wouldn't release the bullet. Both were off center. My customer just ate the second one.....Creeker