Reloading the .410 bore shotgun

[rtracy2001]

Through a fortunate happenstance at the local auction house this morning, I brought home my first .410 bore shotgun. Nothing special, just a little H&R Topper youth model. Anyway this afternoon I took it out to the range with the oldest (12) and her BFF (Best friend forever) to try out the .410. We had a blast; all three of us, the oldest broke several clays and even her BFF that had never shot a firearm in her life winged a couple. I was surprised myself as I hit significantly better with the .410 than I did with my 12 ga. Long story short, I see shooting a lot more .410 in the future, but the ammo price is insane! 12ga target loads go for about $5 and change for 25, but the .410 is $10 or more for target loads (field loads were a bit cheaper.)

Anyway with the prices that high, I anticipate loading my own as soon as I find some equipment for less than full retail. Problem is rumors abound that the .410 is very difficult to load for. Lee won’t make a load-all II for that very reason. I already reload for the 12, and the father-in-law’s 20. Is the .410 that different? Any tips for someone undertaking the task?

[Bret4207]

I don't know if it that difficult, not having put my 410 MEC into service yet, but components can be a bear to obtain. It ain't cheap.

[klcarroll]

I used to load a lot of .410 back when I had a Saiga in that caliber. Bret is quite correct in pointing out that some components are difficult to find.

Around here, wads were the item that required some pre-planning: …Stores that stocked thirteen different types of wad in 12 gauge MIGHT have one or two bags of .410 wads on the shelf. (…buried under the 28 gauge target stuff.)

This didn’t bother me that much because most of my reloads featured three or four 000Buck pellets, and I loaded those over a fiber wad column. (Ballistic Products Inc. is your friend!)

,,,,,,,But there is much more “Good News” than “Bad News”! …….If you load any of the handgun “heavy hitters”, you probably already have the powder you need on the shelf. (2400, H110, IMR4227, 296, etc.) ….And because you are only throwing half as much shot as you would in a 12 gauge target load, you get a lot more “Bang From The Bag”! The .410 is a VERY economical round to reload!

Also, …..Because NOBODY reloads .410, it is always a good idea to be aware of what you’re stepping on when you’re at the range! ……The odds are really good that some earlier shooter has left a “contribution” to your reloading efforts!

…..And BTW: Give serious consideration to picking up a roll crimper for .410! ……I found that it was FAR easier to get a good, clean, SOLID roll crimp than it was to get good results with that tiny, fiddly little star crimp. A roll crimp also allows you some flexibility in load column length: …..An important consideration when a small change in powder or shot can significantly change heights! (,,,And totally screw up a star crimp!)

The .410 just screams to be roll crimped! …..Make it happy! (Ballistic Products has the .410 .032” overshot cards.)

Kent

[HeavyMetal]

I agree the 410 can be a lot cheaper to reload than the 12!

You'll also find more 2 3/4 shells than you will 3 inch but grab any that you find you can get some decent loads out of the 3 inch shell by the way!

Just to show you how strange reloaders can be I'll tell you that I have a 410 Mec Jr bolted to my loading station but don't own a 410!

The Mec started life as a 12 gauge loader and I got it at a yard sale with a box of wads and a half a bag of 5 shot for 20 bucks!

Still have that half bag of 5 shot.

Already had several 12 gauge loader so I called Mec and bought the conversion to make this JR a 410 just to see if I could do it. It wasn't that hard and I think the kit cost me 39 bucks at the time.

Works fine and I have loaded a couple box's of 410's for friends and family. As noted components can be tough to find but I have two sources, Ballistic Products, which carries everything, and a local shotgun supply house here in L.A. that caters to every guy that owns one of those neat little Winchester 410 pump trap guns, I think the model 42??

So don't be afraid to load that 410 round just plan your supplies well in advance of you needs, one more tip these things dote on 9 shot!

[elk hunter]

410's are fun, but can be exasperating to load for. If you can, stick to one brand and length of hull as minor variations make big differences in load height/crimp and pressure in the tiny 410 case. I try to always use hard, target grade shot since the payload is so small you don't want to lose any more of your pattern than you have to to deformation.

[onesonek]

The hard part for me was finding hulls,,,beyond that it can be fickle to load for. Main thing I found with the Mec, is to operate the charge bar slowly, otherwise the shot has a tendency to bridge in the drop tube. The other was actually getting the the shot charge to fit, such as 3" 11/16 load with prescribed hull, shot cup and powder combination. Seems like just about all didn't leave enough room for a good star crimp. The previously suggest roll crimp might solve that to a point, I haven't the part to have tried it. What I did was simple shorten the petals on the shot cup till the shot charge fit nicely for a good crimp. Works and patterns fine, that is all that matters to me. Once you get all the minor idiosyncracy's figured out, loading it isn't a whole lot different than anything else. Shot bridging in that small drop tube is the most fickle I found.

[rtracy2001]

Good info all, thanks. i can see where the bridging would be a problem. I suppose if it gets to be too much trouble i can make up a shot cup and drop it by hand.

Looks like most components are available online, so I just need to plan ahead and add them to my next order (once I find a press). They just take standard 209 primers, right? That is what they look like.

There is a Texan machine on Evil-Bay right now, I just don't know about powder bushing availability. In the short term I may have to talk to a machinist priend of mine about making me some 7/8 dies that I can use with my Rockchucker (probably a pipe deram).

[onesonek]

Yes, standard 209 primers

[tonyjones]

In addition to Ballistic Products, Inc., Precision Reloading, Inc. is a good source for the shotgunner. Both carry a fairly extensive line up of products including .410 wads and cases (new & once fired).

I suggest that you consider a Ponsness Warren 375C reloading machine. The others work, but not as well. Also, try some No. 10 chilled shot on skeet range (out to 20-22 yds.) targets; it will turn them into smoke balls.

Yes, the .410 utilizes a 209 primer. Be very careful about substituting components in the .410. It's one thing to substitute primers in a 7,000 psi 12 Ga. recipe. Most .410 load data is in the 10,000 to 12,500 plus psi range and one can encounter excessive pressures FAST!

Stick to No's 8, 8.5, 9 & 10 shot. The .410 bore is too small to handle larger shot efficiently. Mine will handle No. 7 in a few tailored hand loads but my bore is .422". I've measured some as small as .405".

IIRC my 3" field loads cost under $4/box and target loads are less than that. Factory loads can run $10 to $15/box.

Good luck and have fun shooting your .410. Mine is a blast!!!

Regards,

Tony

[Boerrancher]

I have one of the Mec Jr loaders. Right now it is set up for the 28 ga. but I also have the 410 conversion for it. I have yet to convert it to a 410, but the instructions seem easy enough. I don't shoot much 410, so the boxes I bought years ago are left mostly unfired. I love my little 410 pump, but I am not really a shotgun person, yet when I am small game and bird hunting, it seems that my custom built side by side 28 ga. loaded with #5 shot is what I grab as I am heading out the door. I have loaded some 410 shells on a friends mec, so other than components, don't sweat loading for the 410. Also remember, it is true that the 410 begs to be roll crimped.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[smoked turkey]

I recently got a 410 bolt action Mossberg with a tubular magazine. It is a tight bored gun and a joy to shoot. I have a MEC JR. in 28 gauge. I bit the bullet (or the casing in this case) and purchased the 410 conversion set for it. It is a lengthly change over to go from one gauge to another, but I figured it would be worth it. I found it to be a very well thought out tool. It provided good ammo from almost the first handle pull. Don't do the normal man thing...follow the directions and you will make it fine. I have also loaded a small amount using BPI over powder cards, cushion wads, and a fold crimp. I too want to get a roll crimp for the 410 but they are kind of pricey so I haven't done that yet. I tried making some 3" hulls into 2 3/4" but without success on the crimp due to the hulls being skived (sp?) for 3". The hulls when crimped would not stay folded. I think the best bet is decide on a length and stick to it, The 2 3/4 hulls will do what I need them to do. Good shooting with it.

[Newtire]

I load lots for the .410"

As far as cases go, I stay away from Federal. For some reason, they won't size down and stick in the chamber of my .410's.

I love the 3" but cases are hard to come by.

I have a Mec 600 jr and kits for .410, 20, 12, & 10 gauge. I pieced them together off ebay or ordered directly from MEC.

The hulls crimp correctly when I have about 1/4" left to crimp after loading the shot. I hand dip the shot using Lee powder scoops for the shot scoops. Get a little electronic scale and weigh out the charges from each scoop until you find a scoop that does the job.

On crimping, make sure you use ample crimp starting to avoid the holes in the center. If you get a hole in the center, put a little candle wax on it. pump the handle slowly about three trips rather than one and you get a good crimp that way. It becomes a sense of feel more than anything. A little bit of pressure is all it takes but only by degrees,not all at once.

Used to have trouble with the crimps coming open until I sarted putting the finished folded crimp shells up into a roll crimper from Precision Reloading and pushing down just a skosh while turning it at 600 rpm in the drill press. I hold the case by hand while doing this. I have trimmed up cases and made 1-3/4" shells this way with no trouble having the crimps open up. they are kind of cute. I used to do this way back when I was a kid and empties were hard to come by and I just had a Lee loader.

You can sure get alot of loads from a 25 lb sack of shot when loading for a .410 also.

I bought a ton of empty HS AA type shells off a guy on Gunbroker in 2-1/2" and have accumulated enough 3" cases to keep a few boxes loaded.

I use .444 Marlin cases with a light roll crimp to hold the overshot card in and they work in my M-42 and Savage 24 22/.410 but don't fit an old Stevens single shot I have.

The .410 sure is alot of fun to shoot and real easy on the shoulders. You can use plastic loading boxes for .30-06 size to hold 50 rounds.

Have fun & don't let anyone tell you they are hard to load!

[rtracy2001]

Thanks for the info!

For now I will shoot factory and save the hulls building up a good stock of empties. I am keeping an eye on EvilBay and saving the pennies, I'll probably have enough to buy new before EvilBay has a good deal.

Are the loadbook USA books worth it for the .410? My 4th ED Lyman book has very little info on the .410. (It does say that the AA hulls and the Win field loads are the same internally, which helps as the Win field loads are the cheapest factory ammo I can find.)

[wills]

Most of the manufacturers publish data.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/RecipeList.aspx?gauge=410&gtypeid=3

[shotman]

dont go for a progressive press it dont work. If you are shooting clays the 444 brass is way to go H110 or little gun guy on feebay has wad cutters for $9.50 mail him and have a 46 cal cut. use the lids from cottage cheese / butter/ yogert etc they work for over shot wads.
stay with 7 1/2 and smaller and you will have fun loading
if you dont overpower the loads you dont need a press or need to resize the 444s
I have shot 444s for 20 + times and load all by hand. just use press to de/re prime

[steg]

Newtire; I got to try that trick with the roll crimper, sounds like a winner, I'm going to try it on some of my wally world 12 Ga hulls that have a tendency not to stay crimped, at least not enough to work through my Saiga.................................steg

[Newtire]

Newtire; I got to try that trick with the roll crimper, sounds like a winner, I'm going to try it on some of my wally world 12 Ga hulls that have a tendency not to stay crimped, at least not enough to work through my Saiga.................................steg

It was another one of those "tricks" I blundered onto while roll crimping for my old 10 gauge.

[donald duck]

Not too long ago there was an article in Handloader Magazine on reloading the .410. Check with them and maybe you can down load or purchase the article. I still have the issue I'm sure. Will be happy to send the article to you. dworley7@msn.com

[leadman]

I used to have a Lee hand kit for the 410. Sold it years ago and just recently bought a Mossberg pump.
Now I'm looking for the kit I sold.

[JIMinPHX]

I made a Lee Loader style hand loader for the .410 a while back. I got good shells off of it with no problem after I added an intermediate crimp die to the system. I was going to make them to sell, but after I found out that Lee discontinued making all the shotshell caliber Lee Loaders & then I looked into it a little more, I got cold feet & I decided not to. The liability concerns got the better of me.

Another board member has my drawings from that adventure & he is trying to come up with a version that will fit in a standard single stage metalic cartridge reloading press. Keep an eye on the vendor sponsor section of the board for that little gem to pop up some day.

You can take a look at what I did here - http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=20002&page=4

I've found that the Winchester .410 hulls are head & shoulders above the rest when it comes to reloading. The older AA hulls take a different wad than the new HS hulls take, but either one is a good solid hull that can be loaded many times. Other brands didn't do as well for me.

[rtracy2001]

Well to my surprise Evil-bay came through with a MEC 600 JR in good condition for a lot less than new. It arrived today, and little cleaning is all she needs. It also came with a 2nd ED Lyman shotshell book (that has a lot more .410 loads than my newer book).

Guess I have to put a midway order in soon to get some wads, unless I find some local (yeah, right!).

I also fixed the broken toe on the little 410. Looks pretty good for a cheap gun. (no not worth the trouble to post a pic)