9mm Question - LEE 356-125-2R

[Powersgt]

Okay,

Here is my dilemma; reloading 9mm Luger for wife and son to shoot in local IDPA match. It took me a while to find a starting recipe and everything is working fine except when the Magazine is empty the slide doesn't lock open. Happens on my M&P and my SIG 226R.

Here is the load:

Case: .750-.754
Prim: FED100
PWD: Titegroup 4.0g
Bullet: LEE 356-125-2R
Material: WW with 50/50 added
Actual weight: 129-130g
Crimp: med to heavy
OAL: 1.160

Chrony reports about 1090fps with slight deviation

I tried seating bullet deeper; approx .030 and huge pressure jump (to the point that the primer flowed all over.)

Change crimp and no change - primers are now flat but are not distorting out of the pocket or deforming in shape.

I have a few other powders that could use Unique and AA5.

Any suggestions? Anybody out there have a recipe for this bullet? :confused:

Jeff

[epj]

I have tried 9mm lead with Tightgroup and it did not work out all that well. I have used Clays, Universal, (2 different powders) AA5, and 231 with much better results.

[63 Shiloh]

The slide not locking open on an empty mag may be solved by installing a lighter recoil spring.

I have had to do this on my CZ 75, went down to 12lb spring.

Using the same boolit as you for IPSC in my 9mm.

Lube is BAC, sized to .357" with water dropped WW.

OAL is 1.130", light taper crimp.

Powder is AP70N/ Universal at 3.3gn. Primer is FED SP 100.

So, try reducing your OAL a little, give Universal a go, it is an excellent powder for both my 9mm and .38 Super. I have had no problems with pressure using this OAL and powder.

Good luck mate,

Mike

[evan price]

I used to load 4.0 of Titegroup with 125-2R and 124-2R and had cycling problems in my Keltec sub 2000 carbine- short stroking and fail to feed the next round. Also it felt light in my pistols.

I now load 4.4 titegroup with that bullet and have no problems in my KT, Sigs and XD. This is a max load for jacket bullets but it seems to work fine in everything I shoot it in.

The only difference I can see between the 125 and the 124 is the 124 has a defined step at the front edge of the driving band where it transitions to the ogive. I had some commercial cast boolits that looked like 124-2R's and some that look like 125-2R's (No step @ ogive)

I load the 125's to the same OAL as the 124's. I think I am using 1.125" oal.

I now cast the TL-356-124-2R myself.

Perhaps you may also have a weak mag spring?

[Powersgt]

Thanks for the help,

I don't think that I am going to change the springs in either of my 9mm yet, we commenly use both of these for CCW so I would rather leave them alone for now. Besides, you would think that a velocity of over 1000fps would work fine for this load. Also, both guns fail to lock open so I would doubt it would be a magazine or such.

I have a load made with Berrys plated bullets, same recipe except 4.3 grains of TG and a seated depth of 1.125" If you think about it, that load is pretty much the same so I will keep on. Also, I will probably pick up some Universal or W231 next time I am near a city that sells reloading supplies and try something new.

Thanks for the help,

Jeff

[Fishman]

I loaded and shot a couple thousand of these with 3.6 grains of bullseye as the charge and tumble lubed them.

[Centaur 1]

I loaded and shot a couple thousand of these with 3.6 grains of bullseye as the charge and tumble lubed them.

I use the same load with an oal of 1.115", works great in several guns.

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

POWER PISTOL i don't reload 9mm yet but a coworker swears by power pistol and it is listed as the top or one of the top powders in most 9mm loads int he lee book

he is running his in glocks for idpa type shooting

lee modern reloading 2 lists power pistol as the #2 powder for 125 gr jacketed

it lists starting charge of 6 gr power pistol 1133 fps and max load of 6.6 gr at 1235 with a jacketed 125 gr bullet

with a 124 gr jacketed with titegroup a starting charge of 4.1 at 1066fps 3 a max of 4.4 at 1136 fps

so power pistols starting velocity is listed 3fps slower than titegroups max that should get the extra power to cycle the action to lock.


not all guns are obviosly going to react the same but thats a decent difference , and at 16 dollars a pound worth a try , he also noted very good metering of power pistol in a auto disk measure

[Cherokee]

Try power pistol, 231, HS6. they all work for me with that bullet.

[JRHYS]

I had a problem with the slide not staying back on my last shot so I called Brownells and talked to one of their gunsmiths. Explained my problem to him and I suggested using a lighter recoil spring and he said that he would not want to do that in fear of unneccessary wear and possible damage to the gun. I was totally unsure of what to do then. While shooting at a local range, the range officer took the clip out of my sig p6 and stretched the magazine spring and that worked for me. Jerry

[runfiverun]

titegroup as you have seen goes along fine then....
try a slower powder or a more stable one.
unique is pretty good with cast.

[Bullwolf]

If you have tried other loads, and they do cycle the slide enough to engage the slide lock, I might suggest a powder change.

But only if you have inspected the gun, and you are convinced that the magazine follower on an empty mag is capable of engaging the pistols slide lock first.

If that is the case, I would suggest giving Unique a shot, since you have it on hand, and it is pretty forgiving for pressure too. A relatively light load will still cycle the slide typically.

I tend to start off really light, and work up until I can cycle the slide while using a weak grip. (limp wrist the gun) if the gun will cycle for me that way, and for my wife, I tend to feel pretty positive about it when using a solid grip.

*Disclaimer*
I know I should not give load data out over the internet, and I recommend that you personally double check any data in a couple of other loading manuals, as well as checking on the powder manufacturer's site. - Alliant's Online Reloader's Guide.
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/default.aspx
You can also contact them online, or give them a call. Sometimes they can be quite helpful on the phone once you manage to get hold of someone.

That being said, in my personal experience, and echoing the conservative starting data from my old Speer #11 and #12 reloading manuals 4.0 grains of Unique should be a safe starting point for that LEE 356-125-2R in 9mm with a 1.115 to 1.116 OAL.

My RCBS Cast Bullet Manual #1 shows a range of 5.1 to 5.5 grains of Unique for a 125 grain 9mm RN Lead .356 cast bullet.

But please do check it for yourself using a few other reloading manuals. Never just take my word for it.

After working my way up from a safe starting load, I settled on 5.2 grains of Unique for me, using my components. In this case Winchester Brass, and a CCI 500 small pistol primer, and my own Boolits cast from 2 parts WW and 1 part Lino for 125 grain 9mm RN, using a 1.115 OAL. My pressure levels are quite low, (no flattened primers, and it will typically average a bit over 1100 fps on the chronograph) it will also cycle the slide reliably in all of my 9mm Pistols.

If I have a real pressure problem child, I tend to use Bluedot, but it can be a bit blasty, as it is a pretty slow burning powder. I find Unique to be a better fit for me in 9mm.


- Bullwolf

[Ausglock]

The slide not locking open on an empty mag may be solved by installing a lighter recoil spring.

I have had to do this on my CZ 75, went down to 12lb spring.

Using the same boolit as you for IPSC in my 9mm.

Lube is BAC, sized to .357" with water dropped WW.

OAL is 1.130", light taper crimp.

Powder is AP70N/ Universal at 3.3gn. Primer is FED SP 100.

So, try reducing your OAL a little, give Universal a go, it is an excellent powder for both my 9mm and .38 Super. I have had no problems with pressure using this OAL and powder.

Good luck mate,

Mike

G'day Mike. I am waiting for the 356-125-2R to arrive. I plan on loading it in 38 Stupid for my Kimber. Do you have a load for this pill with AP-70?

I'm loading a Topscore 125Con with 4.2 WST for the kimber, but want to use a home cast.

Thanks.
AHN=Glock40sw

[Cherokee]

Ausglock - WST works with cast as well with that bullet, but HS6 and Power Pistol are better, if you can get them there. If you are talking 38 Super (Stupid ?), HS6, AA7, Bluedot work for me with that bullet.

[Ausglock]

G'day Cherokee. Yep 38 Super. I have Power Pistol and heaps ( 20lbs) of W540.
Power Pistol is great for 357 Sig loads to make Major Power Factor with a 135 RN.

I'm currently burning W540 in my S&W 586 357 Mag with a Lee 358-150-1R.

I tried 5.1gr AP-70 today with a 125 Topscore Conical and it is one bloody accurate load in My Kimber Stainless Target II 38 Super.

I will be trying this powder with the 125-2R, when the mold arrives.