Hornady Lock'n'Load AP SUCKS

[deltaenterprizes]

Finally got my press set up and on the first 9mm case I ran through it the drive hub that the shell plate bolts on to cracked in half!
It looks like the part that takes all the stress is investment cast, this sucks.

[bbqncigars]

I would bet money that it's MIM(metal injection molded), not investment cast. Call Hornady C.S. and they'll make it right. I've been very happy with my AP so far (almost 6K assorted rounds loaded).

[deltaenterprizes]

I think you are right, I made one myself and the press is back in working order and better than new.

[ReloaderFred]

I've got about 20,000+ rounds loaded on mine and it's still going strong. Looks like you got done what you needed, but as noted, Hornady stands behind their products.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[rsrocket1]

Finally got my press set up and on the first 9mm case I ran through it the drive hub that the shell plate bolts on to cracked in half!
It looks like the part that takes all the stress is investment cast, this sucks.

so you have failure in a single part which is probably a manufacturing defect (should be covered under warranty) and the whole thing sucks?

oh well, at least you made a superior replacement part.

I've only loaded a few thousand on my LnL AP and the only thing I don't like about it is the easily kinked spring that holds the cases in the shell plate. However, it is also makes taking out and putting in cases very convenient for powder weight checking or making sure primers are seated properly. Being that you could buy 3 for $7 makes it well worth its "wimpy-ness" and even though my first spring has about 3 kinks in it, it still functions without problems.

[pmer]

I have a LNL AP too and had no troubles with it. I don't tighten the allen bolt that holds shell plate down very tight. But I think it must be a defective part too.

[rsrocket1]

The allen bolt should be tightened enough that you don't need to hold the plate to tighten it anymore. If the plate slips out of the ball bearing holes, that's tight enough. Any tighter and the plate does not move freely and you start wearing out the pawls. Another LnL owner stuck a lock washer in his and said it made things much better. That might be another user improvement.

[ReloaderFred]

rsrocket1,

If you'll call Hornady Customer Service, they will send you a few of the springs for free.

You can also use your Dremel Tool to remove the sharp edge in the track the spring travels in under the ejection/new case positions. When the spring transitions from the groove to the shellplate, it can sometimes get caught on that sharp edge. I ground an elongated groove at that point and it solve the kinked spring problem. Polishing the transition point also helped quite a bit.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[Hardcast416taylor]

My Hornady started out as a Pro-7. then upgraded to a Pro-Jector. I have tried the case ejector feature and removed it after it wouldn`t work properly - no matter how much I fiddled with it. I have also tried their first attempt at auto powder drop. I promptly wore out the center bushing that the actuation rod passed thru, so I file 13ed that thing. I removed the auto-prime feature on the press after the upgrade was done. So now I have a press that is dedicated to loading and manual powder dropping. I prime off the press and haven`t had an upside down primer seated in many years. I figure if you are in such a rush that you need this LNL silliness, go ahead. I still have the strength God gave me to screw my dies into my press and remove them the same way.Robert

[oldhickory]

so you have failure in a single part which is probably a manufacturing defect (should be covered under warranty) and the whole thing sucks?

oh well, at least you made a superior replacement part.

I've only loaded a few thousand on my LnL AP and the only thing I don't like about it is the easily kinked spring that holds the cases in the shell plate. However, it is also makes taking out and putting in cases very convenient for powder weight checking or making sure primers are seated properly. Being that you could buy 3 for $7 makes it well worth its "wimpy-ness" and even though my first spring has about 3 kinks in it, it still functions without problems.

Hornady sent me 10 of em...Free for the asking. I really like mine.

[klcarroll]

so you have failure in a single part which is probably a manufacturing defect (should be covered under warranty) and the whole thing sucks?................


Well, .......I can kinda understand where Deltaenterprises is coming from: ....If the design team responsible for that product decided that a machined part wasn't needed there, (...as it clearly WAS) ....then how many other parts are similarly under-engineered????

I worked in product design for quite a while, and I smell yet another classic case of a Sale/Marketing VS Engineering debate!

ENGINEERING: "If we build it to hit your required pricepoint, it's not going to hold up!"

SALES: "......But if you Engineers build it the way you want to, we won't be able to compete in the marketplace!!"

ENGINEERING: "But it's not going to last!!"

SALES: "......Don't worry about it!! ....We'll let Customer Support deal with it on the warrantee end!"


Sigh..................


Kent

[Cowboy T]

@klcarroll: That is so true.

[rsrocket1]

Yeah, I hear you klcarroll.

Even Richard Lee poked fun at the over-engineered and over-built presses on the market when he wrote his reloading book, but then his company came out with the Classic Cast SS press and Classic Turret press (his son's decision) and that is the preferred option for most reloaders even though the BL Challenger and $30 "C" frame press is probably "good enough" for most.

Being an engineer myself, I know of several fellow engineers who would climb onto a launch pad with a wrench saying "I just want to make one more change; I guarantee it'll really make things better!"

[nes4ever69]

mr. simpson, you really have no desire to eat the food in front of you.

What food im blind.

hmmm the product causes blindness, what do we do about that?

i dont know, well let marketing figure that out.

[truckmsl]

My understanding is the drive hub is designed to fail first in the event something locks up the press and a ham-handed operator tries to muscle through it. Sort of a shear pin effect. For what it's worth, I've put over 10,000 rounds through my LNL and have never broken the hub. I do keep one as a spare part, due to it's sacrificial nature.

[bumpo628]

The engineering term for this part is "overload protection".
That's what engineers tell marketing to call parts that break easily.

[jjjefferson]

I also had the drive hub key on the LNL AP shear off on me. I was decapping and full length sizing about 60 WBY 300 Magnum shells when the indexing went awry. I fiddled with the pawls (one of which had also chipped) and getting really frustrated I couldn't get it to index fully. I unscrewed the plate and was surprised to see the "key" had sheared off the hub!!!! Also the threaded shaft is cracked behind the key. I've only tightened the plate by hand...without tools.


The HUB looks like its cast aluminum...That is a part I would have expected to be made of steel since it is the the KEY part of turning the plate. (pun intended)
I sent an email to Hornady and will be following up on with a call to customer support on Monday. I am still "learning" the press and hope this is an anonomly. From what I've ready 90+% of the people are very happy with the press...which is why I bought it.

I hope I can get he parts shipped to me vs shipping the press back. Anyone have any experience on how long it takes Hornady to turn-around a press if I do need to ship it?

Thanks all.

JJ

[ReloaderFred]

Just call Hornady and they'll take care of you. They're nice people and they back their products. They also have a funny answering machine message!

Hope this helps.

Fred

[jjjefferson]

I called Hornady customer support this morning....that phone system message was hilarious! I just stayed on the line..cause I was laughing so hard I couldn't remember the options. :D

So a very nice woman came on the line...I think her name was Jackie.... I explained to her what happened and she said they would ship me a new Drive Hub and two Index Pawls ASAP.

I hung up the phone and in about a minute I recieved and email confirming my order for the hub and pawls under Warranty. Wow....that was WAYYYY fast.

The tech-support then replied a little while later to my email saying they would be sending me and new spindle for my WBY 300 Resizer die! The amazing thing is that when i first set up the press about 2 months ago...I did fail to tighten the spindle down completely and the first shell I put in ...pulled the spindle down by the neck-sizer and jammed up the press. I was able to back everything out and get it all straightened out...but the spindle did have a small bend to it. It still worked so I just solidered on thinking nothing more about it. Apparently....what I did must have NOT been unique...its almost like they read my memories!

I am very impressed with Hornady support and very happy I bought from them.

I will try not break anything else....but I know I probably will.

JJ

[selmerfan]

The spindle set-up on Hornady dies are pretty much worthless as far as I'm concerned. Even with heavy wrenching (farmer tight) the darn thing slips consistently. I got fed up with Hornady's dies a couple of years ago. Their CS is fantastic and every other product seems to be great, but I won't bother with another set of their dies.

[Doby45]

I LOVE their boolit seating dies and thats about it. ;)

[selmerfan]

The bullet seating dies are good, but I got spoiled early with Forster seaters, so everything else seems a little bit inferior.

[jjjefferson]

The spindle set-up on Hornady dies are pretty much worthless as far as I'm concerned. Even with heavy wrenching (farmer tight) the darn thing slips consistently. I got fed up with Hornady's dies a couple of years ago. Their CS is fantastic and every other product seems to be great, but I won't bother with another set of their dies.


I only had an issue with the spindle that one (first) time. Since then what I have done is put a .30 Cal brass cleaning brush on my portable drill. I leave the shell casings in the plastic holder (that came with the ammo) and run the brush in and out of the neck for a second or two. After that ...I toss em in the tumbler. When clean I stand 'em up and spray some One-Shot Case lube on em making sure I get some down the neck...let it dry.

I also lube the resizer with a light film of case lube paste. Since then I haven't had a spindle slip again.

Cheers,

JJ

[jeff423]

Had one, sent it back, bought a Dillon, end of problem.

Hornady customer service is great but (at least when I had the LNL AP):


There aren't very many of them and the wait on the phone could be long.
They don't work on Saturday's.
They can't fix a design problem.


Jeff

[Shiloh]

Don't mean to stir the poop, but if it becomes a PITA, one might consider a Dillon.

That being said, and as you already have the unit, I would firmly but respectfully and politely see if Hornady would make it right. I have never dealt with Hornady on a customer service basis. Never had a lick of trouble with their bullets or their collet bullet puller.

Shiloh

[blikseme300]

I think you are right, I made one myself and the press is back in working order and better than new.

What material did you use? My AP broke the same part after about 500 .40S&W rounds. Brass was clean and lubed with One Shot. I am surprised that it broke this easily as there was no signs of resistance during the loading.

Bliksem

[williamwaco]

Just call Hornady and they'll take care of you. They're nice people and they back their products. They also have a funny answering machine message!

Hope this helps.

Fred

Mine broke too.
It is severely under engineered for that press.

But they did send me an other no questions asked.

I requested two. They made me pay for the second one.

[40Super]

This is a batch of casting problems,it happens to many of the presses with serial numbers between35,000 and 35,600.Above and below that its not a problem.Anyone with a press in that number range should look at their press closely for the crack that is sometimes there before it is even used.Many people had the drive hub break on the first round,which is sad.I bought mine in the middle of this issue but got one with a 36,XXX serial number ,so it is good,I've loaded a couple thousand rounds now with no problems.

[200swc]

It's dissappointing hearing this about the LNL AP, I've been looking at one for myself.

I've been using a Lee Turret and was looking to upgrade to the LNL. Although the Lee is good, I've heard the LNL has a better output rate by a couple hundred rounds an hour.

That means more time at the range instead of spending time at the bench.

[Lloyd Smale]

Theres a few things that bug me about the 3 lnls i have but ive loaded 10s of thousands of rounds on them and havent broke the hub yet.

[blikseme300]

Well, called in to Hornady customer service today. As posted previously, the automated attendant on the phone is indeed hilarious.

Spoke with a well-mannered and friendly lady and she helped me out. I ordered a few additional replacement hubs and some primer pick-up tubes. She did let me know in a nice way that returning the warranty card is the right thing to do. In fact, a replacement card is included in the shipment to me![smilie=l:

I have no beef about the design or manufacture of the LnL AP. I did have a few jams, mostly because the primer pin was not set deep enough and most likely did force the ram a little. I am not a light weight and have been known to break things when trying to persuade them to move. (I have broken a number of other tools that were supposedly unbreakable. Everybody has a skill....)

Still like the LnL AP and it's red color.....

Bliksem

[RayinNH]

If that where a Lee press that part would have been referred to by now, as that cheap pot metal stuff...Ray

[Lloyd Smale]

and it would have been true! ;)
If that where a Lee press that part would have been referred to by now, as that cheap pot metal stuff...Ray

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

The part is a cast part and within a specific run of presses, these problems have been showing up with the same exact problem. It's a known problem and Hornady has been quick to ship a replacement part to everyone who's experienced the problem.

I had a Dillon 550 years ago with a maching problem and Dillon was not nearly so quick to replace the defect part. So saying "replace it with a Dillon" is no solution at all.

One thing you don't read about Hornady presses from owners is after ten years, they have to send it back for a "rebuild." Why? Doesn't need one after ten years of use.

[jmorris]

I had a Dillon 550 years ago with a maching problem and Dillon was not nearly so quick to replace the defect part. So saying "replace it with a Dillon" is no solution at all.


One thing you don't read about Hornady presses from owners is after ten years, they have to send it back for a "rebuild." Why? Doesn't need one after ten years of use.

And the funny thing is that a 10 year old 550 is still worth more than a new LNL.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Actually, that three month old 550 was sent back to the factory for a replacement by the guy I sold it to after Dillon did NOT get it fixed for me. And I notice you didn't comment on the rebuilds or which press has had the greatest number of blown guns due to design.

And just because you pay more, doesn't mean you get more. I think we proved this with the Lee Classic Turret. I have loaded on a 550 since I got rid of my bad one, but I still found the LnL I owned to be a better press, especially for the money.

Time is passing, lots of folks opting for the Hornady over the 550 and finding it to be a worthy press. They are more honest and more forthcoming than Dillon owners about the press's faults, but the presses have no more problems than I read over on the Dillon forums when I go over there about issues with Dillon equipment I own.

jmorris,

You wanna pay more money and get less, that's your business though. Always gotta be folks who think if they paid more, they got more. PT Barnum loved those kind....

[canyon-ghost]

Guys, the original poster hasn't said a word for 11 months. This thread took on a life of it's own. Yeah, that was bad but, Hornady does have good stuff.

[Whistler]

My LNL AP has serial number #00146 and has loaded several 100,000s of rounds! Drive hub is fine! I've had to replace the indexing pawls (which I broke with negligent excessive force) and the primer slide (same thing there). Hornady replaced both, no questions asked. I actually received a whole new indexing assembly for the first fault, that was really impressive!

The only thing I'm not impressed with was the brand new shell plate I bought for the .45 ACP (shellplate #45). It was clearly a case of badly done MIM technique as the air voids and cracks could be seen on the rear of it. I tried to get it replaced, but they wouldn't as they said it hadn't broken yet and was just a cosmetic error. So far it works good, but I don't trust it one bit.

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/9903/20110907001004.jpg

[jmorris]

And I notice you didn't comment on the rebuilds or which press has had the greatest number of blown guns due to design.

None of the Dillons, Hornady LNL's or anyother press I own or have owned ever blew up any of my guns. That being said the 1050 is the most idiot proof.





jmorris,


You wanna pay more money and get less, that's your business though.


Just saying, I'll trade a new LNL for a Dillon any day and I have both.

[milprileb]

I think Dillon and Hornady make fine presses and either maker has a bad one at times. I find most folks don't send the problem child back quick enough.. they try to fix it and limp it along.

Currently my buddy is having major problems with Dillon and his 650, one thing after another. I have zero issues with my 650, 550 or 450. My 450 has been sent back twice for rebuilt (I just do it every ten years for the heck of it). I don't want to step on any toes but I think my buddy has operator error in the mix more than machine failures in manufacture.

Anyhow: QC failures or operator error: send the sucker back and get it sorted out and start again.

YMMV

[Sonnypie]

Threads like this make me want to go kiss my presses, old, medium, and new. [smilie=s: :popcorn:

[Colorado4wheel]

jmorris,

You wanna pay more money and get less, that's your business though. Always gotta be folks who think if they paid more, they got more. PT Barnum loved those kind....

You pay slightly more. You get a way better press. Speaking of the 650. 550 just works better. My LnL was a priming nightmare that Hornady simply could not fix. The Casefeeder is a disaster as well with 9mm.

[shovel80]

My Hornady LNL AP Has been a Great press for many thousands of rounds so far..I've had a little trouble to begin with, mainly operating learning to use it!..Hornady has always been 100% Helpful, and replaced a part that I even misplaced!

Terry

[1in9twist]

Manufacturing can be a real challenge.


Keeping taps on your vendors\suppliers to make sure they are not cutting corners\substituting inferior to increase revenue can be tricky. Especially in the volume the LNL is produced.

The difference is how the company reacts and takes care of the customer. Which they do a good job of. Once this batch runs its course, you probably will never see that issue again.

[Lloyd Smale]

as to blowing up guns idiot loaders do that not presses. If your not a careful loader you dont belong behind any progressive press. As a matter of fact you shouldnt be reloading period. As to guys prefering them over a dillon i will say this. I own both and have loaded extensively on red and blue equiptment. the dillon stuff is more expensive but for me has been more reliable. by reliable i mean setting up and loading a 1000 rounds without a hickup. Hornadys are decent progressive presses but ive rarely made it though a day of loading on one without having to do some kind of tweak to it. Be it timing ajustment, primer missfeed, or the suck !!! case feeder system

Ive loaded a bunch on square deals, lnls, 650s, and 550s and a little on 1050s. No doubt in my mind a 650 is a better engineered press. But then it cost alot more. A lnl is priced in line with a square deal. As to reliability though NONE of them is as realible as a 550. Just common sense. There manual advance and thats a major system that just cant go wrong unless you break your finger. Problem for me with a 550 is speed. I just loaded 2k of 38 specials over the last two days on my 550. Never had one single burb of any kind but its about like being in a dream and trying to run in mud after loading on a true progressive with a case feeder. But id bet if a guy factor in all the down time for troubles it wouldnt be all taht much differnt. It sure feels it though.

As to saying that so many people brag on there lnl so they have to be good ill say this. How many people do you know that will never admit they made a mistake. How many will tell you whatever they buy be it a press or a truck or a motorcyle is the best in its class. It has to be because there just to intellegent to buy anything but the best. Then you have guys that maybe load 5k a year on there presses and think they actually have a handle on how reliable they are. Multiply that by at least 10 and then come back to me in 5 years and ill agree that you have somewhat of an idea how good that press really is. I just wish i could catch one of you guys that claim to have bougten dillons and dumped them to buy lnls. I surely would have been standing in line to swap my lnls for 650s!! As to the money personaly i think the added cost of a 650 over a lnl is justified in what you get. Id gladly send my three lnls back to hornady and give them 200 bucks a crack to upgrade them to the point they were as reliable as a 650. Heck id throw these casefeeders in the pond and buy new ones for 300 bucks each just to cure the case feeder headaches. QUOTE=DaveInFloweryBranchGA;1590471]Actually, that 10 year old 550 was sent back to the factory for a replacement by the guy I sold it to after Dillon did NOT get it fixed for me. And I notice you didn't comment on the rebuilds or which press has had the greatest number of blown guns due to design.

And just because you pay more, doesn't mean you get more. I think we proved this with the Lee Classic Turret. I have loaded on a 550 since I got rid of my bad one, but I still found the LnL I owned to be a better press, especially for the money.

Time is passing, lots of folks opting for the Hornady over the 550 and finding it to be a worthy press. They are more honest and more forthcoming than Dillon owners about the press's faults, but the presses have no more problems than I read over on the Dillon forums when I go over there about issues with Dillon equipment I own.

jmorris,

You wanna pay more money and get less, that's your business though. Always gotta be folks who think if they paid more, they got more. PT Barnum loved those kind....[/QUOTE]

[blikseme300]

as to blowing up guns idiot loaders do that not presses. If your not a careful loader you dont belong behind any progressive press. As a matter of fact you shouldnt be reloading period. As to guys prefering them over a dillon i will say this. I own both and have loaded extensively on red and blue equiptment. the dillon stuff is more expensive but for me has been more reliable. by reliable i mean setting up and loading a 1000 rounds without a hickup. Hornadys are decent progressive presses but ive rarely made it though a day of loading on one without having to do some kind of tweak to it. Be it timing ajustment, primer missfeed, or the suck !!! case feeder system

Ive loaded a bunch on square deals, lnls, 650s, and 550s and a little on 1050s. No doubt in my mind a 650 is a better engineered press. But then it cost alot more. A lnl is priced in line with a square deal. As to reliability though NONE of them is as realible as a 550. Just common sense. There manual advance and thats a major system that just cant go wrong unless you break your finger. Problem for me with a 550 is speed. I just loaded 2k of 38 specials over the last two days on my 550. Never had one single burb of any kind but its about like being in a dream and trying to run in mud after loading on a true progressive with a case feeder. But id bet if a guy factor in all the down time for troubles it wouldnt be all taht much differnt. It sure feels it though.

As to saying that so many people brag on there lnl so they have to be good ill say this. How many people do you know that will never admit they made a mistake. How many will tell you whatever they buy be it a press or a truck or a motorcyle is the best in its class. It has to be because there just to intellegent to buy anything but the best. Then you have guys that maybe load 5k a year on there presses and think they actually have a handle on how reliable they are. Multiply that by at least 10 and then come back to me in 5 years and ill agree that you have somewhat of an idea how good that press really is. I just wish i could catch one of you guys that claim to have bougten dillons and dumped them to buy lnls. I surely would have been standing in line to swap my lnls for 650s!! As to the money personaly i think the added cost of a 650 over a lnl is justified in what you get. Id gladly send my three lnls back to hornady and give them 200 bucks a crack to upgrade them to the point they were as reliable as a 650. Heck id throw these casefeeders in the pond and buy new ones for 300 bucks each just to cure the case feeder headaches. QUOTE=DaveInFloweryBranchGA;1590471]Actually, that 10 year old 550 was sent back to the factory for a replacement by the guy I sold it to after Dillon did NOT get it fixed for me. And I notice you didn't comment on the rebuilds or which press has had the greatest number of blown guns due to design.

And just because you pay more, doesn't mean you get more. I think we proved this with the Lee Classic Turret. I have loaded on a 550 since I got rid of my bad one, but I still found the LnL I owned to be a better press, especially for the money.

Time is passing, lots of folks opting for the Hornady over the 550 and finding it to be a worthy press. They are more honest and more forthcoming than Dillon owners about the press's faults, but the presses have no more problems than I read over on the Dillon forums when I go over there about issues with Dillon equipment I own.

jmorris,

You wanna pay more money and get less, that's your business though. Always gotta be folks who think if they paid more, they got more. PT Barnum loved those kind....[/QUOTE]

Lloyd, are you feeling better after this rant?

Bliksem

[blikseme300]

The part is a cast part and within a specific run of presses, these problems have been showing up with the same exact problem. It's a known problem and Hornady has been quick to ship a replacement part to everyone who's experienced the problem.

I had a Dillon 550 years ago with a maching problem and Dillon was not nearly so quick to replace the defect part. So saying "replace it with a Dillon" is no solution at all.

One thing you don't read about Hornady presses from owners is after ten years, they have to send it back for a "rebuild." Why? Doesn't need one after ten years of use.

Hornady service is top notch, as expected from a US company. I am not convinced that there is only a single company that delivers quality.

The holes on my targets don't know or care what press was used. Ease of use and volume of a press does not impress me. Show me the target.

Bliksem

BTW - price of equipment does nothing for accuracy.

[Lloyd Smale]

I dont understand your point. Does the hornady press load more accurate ammo then the dillon does and if both do it equally well wouldnt you prefer the one that works the best and is easiest to use???? If cheap equiptment is as good for accuracy as expensive equiptment why dont you see bench rest shooters or competitive pistol shooters loading on lee presses. Most bench rest shooters use nothing but top shelf and id bet if you took a pole at a major competitve pistol shoot of all the top 5 placers in every class that 90 percent of them are loading on dillon presses and the other 10 percent are given ammo by a sponsor.

then ill go this route with you. I load a ton of 223 and 308 for my ars and my bolt guns. I do it progressively because i dont have time to sit there with a single stage press and make up a 1000 rounds that is shot up in a couple days. Ive loaded this ammo in the past on single stage presses because its all i had. Ive also loaded it for years on 550 and now do it on a lnl. I keep records of the accuracy of my guns and when i load with a new lot number of powder i reshoot them off the bench. I dont recall ever seeing a differnce in accuracy caused by which press this ammo is loaded on. Id bet you a dime to a dollar you could load the same load on your "accurate" equipment and i could load it on my lnl and it would take a caliper to measure the differnce in .00010 of an inch those groups would vary and when im measuring groups its with a ruler and a 1/16 of an inch plus or minus is close enough for my records.. Surely the difference in accuracy between presses is nothing worth mentioning in the field and they only time it would even be a minor consern would be if you were shooting competitive benchrest. So for the most part in my book anyway accuracy isnt even a consern when buying a press. Any press will load ammo accurate enough for me. What is my consern? Ease of use and volume;)

[40Super]

It all comes down to: how a person likes to load, what brand he thinks serves his use best, wether his dad/friends likes a certain brand, amount of disposible funds , how mechanicaly minded he is/understands ect...
Many things in life I have found the price does reflect quality,materials,warrantee ect... but many times only up to a point. This fact doesn't always stand true though,some things you are simply paying for a name,nothing much more.
This topic of which brand is better has no right or wrong answer. It is purely what one person likes/prefers and how he veiws what "works" for them at the price they are willing to pay.
These "discussions" always remind me of my truck situation. I used to own brand "X". I bought 3 of that brand, new trucks over the years and always was annoyed at interior rattles.
My last one I had a folded up paper wad shoved under several places in the dash,even though it was in for warrantee 5 times(for other items,I always included those rattles also),it still had paper wads in the dash when I sold it four years later.
I switched to brand "Y" for my latest truck and continued to have people baffled why I switched. EVERY GUY that I said it was because of the constant rattles(it was other reasons as well) they ALL insisted "MINE DOESN't HAVE ANY WHATSOEVER". I kept a $100 bill in my wallet so when someone said that ,I would tell them "I bet $100 to your $50 that if we go 2 miles out and back, I will be able point out at least 1 rattle" NOT ONE SINGLE PERSON OUT OF AROUND 12 GUYS WOULD TAKE THE BET!! WHY?

[thehouseproduct]

I like my LNL. My 550 is good too. I wish I could take the priming from the Dillon and drop it onto my LNL. I prefer the shell plate design, powder measure, bushings, and primer disposal of my Hornady. I think if they mounted the priming system firmly on the press instead of the shell plate, it would be great.

[Colorado4wheel]

The press has to work first. The LnL has a disappointing habit of not working with some primers. That is why the Dillon is the safer choice.

[jmorris]

Ease of use and volume of a press does not impress me.

I would stick with a single stage if I were you. Costs less than any progressive and loads ammunition that is just as good.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

The press has to work first. The LnL has a disappointing habit of not working with some primers. That is why the Dillon is the safer choice.

The Dillon 550 I had never worked with any brand of primers. The LnL I had for ten years required polishing, adjusting and loctiting when I first got it, then never had a problem with any brand of primers after that.

Most of the folks who have problems with the Hornady primer system haven't polished it, adjusted it correctly and loctited the parts. Because of the design and price point, you do have to do that. But once done, it's typically trouble free.

Those who've owned Dillons have had problems with primers as well and have had to tune them to get them right. The 550 I had ended up appearing to have a machining flaw in the casting. When Dillon replaced the basic press for my buddy, the problem went away. I think if it had been manual advance, I might have sent it in, but I hated the manual advance feature as well.

Point to all this is, all these presses have a price point and the companies have to manufacture them within that price point. ALL brands have problems, failures and design features that aren't so great.

But it's ridiculous at this point to run in and say to a guy, when he has a problem with his press, that he oughta buy some other brand. Fact is there IS NOT enough quality difference to make it worth it to get rid of one brand to get another if you have a problem with the original brand.

Now if you're just tired of one brand, like one gets tired of one type of shooting and sells one rifle to get another, then rock on.

[noylj]

Love mine. No complaints.

[jmorris]

Fact is there IS NOT enough quality difference to make it worth it to get rid of one brand to get another if you have a problem with the original brand.

I see you have never owned a LEE 1000.

[Colorado4wheel]

The Dillon 550 I had never worked with any brand of primers. The LnL I had for ten years required polishing, adjusting and loctiting when I first got it, then never had a problem with any brand of primers after that.

Most of the folks who have problems with the Hornady primer system haven't polished it, adjusted it correctly and loctited the parts. Because of the design and price point, you do have to do that. But once done, it's typically trouble free.

Those who've owned Dillons have had problems with primers as well and have had to tune them to get them right. The 550 I had ended up appearing to have a machining flaw in the casting. When Dillon replaced the basic press for my buddy, the problem went away. I think if it had been manual advance, I might have sent it in, but I hated the manual advance feature as well.

Point to all this is, all these presses have a price point and the companies have to manufacture them within that price point. ALL brands have problems, failures and design features that aren't so great.

But it's ridiculous at this point to run in and say to a guy, when he has a problem with his press, that he oughta buy some other brand. Fact is there IS NOT enough quality difference to make it worth it to get rid of one brand to get another if you have a problem with the original brand.

Now if you're just tired of one brand, like one gets tired of one type of shooting and sells one rifle to get another, then rock on.


My LnL fed primers fine. It just would not seat them deep enough to work with my light weight striker spring Glock. Both my 550 and 650 did this with zero issues. Others have had the same issue. The Dillon is a superior design from a leverage point of view while priming. Even Hornady told me that. The hornady has a really short primer punch. So if the punch bottoms out before the primer is fully seated you will have issues. If it doesn't, your fine.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3513.jpg

If you own a LnL the above picture will look familiar. It's the subplate. That small hole is what the primer punch goes into. On top is a 650 primer punch. It's 5X the size, with a lot more stroke then the LnL primer punch. That is the issue with the LnL primer setup.

550 primer setup needs to be kept clean. If that doesn't do it then you call Dillon and get them to send you a new primer housing. 550 needs to be kept clean and it does get dirty in use. LnL is better in that regard. But if you follow proper setup on the 550 it will work. And the 550 also has much longer stroke on it's primer setup so it can seat primers deeper.

[noylj]

Nope. Looks sort of like the base plate and the primer seater, but I have never seen them like that.
Used a Hornady progressive since the first model came out. Dillon at the time had a 4-station press and cost more then Hornady's new 5-station press. Never had a problem with any of the models and, until the L-N-L, I kept mine updates for a fairly nominal cost.
I had a time when the primers weren't seating completely. Found the shell plate had worked loose. Found that the unit would feed and seat every primer but the last one. Got a Dillon rod for the primer tube and that was fixed.
Sorry, I look at my press and just have to wonder what press the complainers actually have, as it can't be like mine.
I have had more problems with each of my 1050s feeding and seating primers than I ever had with my Hornady. However, in all cases, it can be tracked down to dirt or the primer hole in the slide needing just a slight chamfer.
There is no progressive press that is 100% reliable with feeding and seating primers and any one who claims otherwise is not being truthful to themselves or others.
Likewise, I can't understand the complaints about the Hornady powder measure. Great measure. The PTXs go in the powder die and you adjust the powder die in or out until you get the amount of flare/bell desired. You then lock the powder die to the bushing (with a case in the die with PTX activated). Then, you can remove the whole assembly and place it in the press at the angle you want. I have always been able to position it to eliminate any interference with the primer blast shield. Another plus for the bushings--you can set the powder measure at, I think, six different positions.
I do admit that with the Dillon powder measure, it sits in a slot that runs around the powder die so you have an "infinite" number of positions to set the measure. However, the powder measure itself is simply a large Lee Pro Auto-Disk--a really good powder measure, but nothing earth-shaking (and I have one for each toolhead for my 1050s).

[Lloyd Smale]

noylj I agree with you that no progressive will ever be a 100 percent reliable. MY hornadys do a good job. Id say half the trouble i have with them is the piss poor designed case feeders. I have had primer troubles with mine. Like any press dirt or powder will gum up the primer feed about instantly no matter what colar the press. One of my 3 hornady had the primer not seating properly problem when i got it but a bit of grinding and a few new parts and it was good to go. Only other problem i have is ejection. I have one of the old style wire ejector presses and two of the newer ones with the boss. Both give me troubles. Not enough to really worry about though but if your comparing to a dillon that has to be factored in because ive never had an ejection problem with a dillon other then the square deals. As to the measures my hornadys dont flare. I do it with a flaring die. that said id take a hornady measure hands down over a dillon. there much easier to ajust more accuarate and give you the option of having ajustment bushing set at differnt weights ready to just swap in and go. YOU can do the same with the dillon slides but there much more of a pain to swap. Heres my take on it When comparing to a 550. The 550 is more reliable. Theres not even an argument there. If a guys main consern isnt absoulte production its a better choise. Ive been loading 38s and 40s on mine for a couple weeks and its the first time ive used it in a year or so and it amazes me as it just keeps going and going. After loading on the lnl im just not used to that as im allways stopping to tweak something. thing is though if production is your main goal i can still hands down load more ammo over a two day period with a lnl and a case feeder. After running a lnl or a 650 using a 550 is like that dream where your trying to run in cement.

[Colorado4wheel]

Nope. Looks sort of like the base plate and the primer seater, but I have never seen them like that.

Go look at the underside of your subplate. That is the newer version with the casefeeder projection. You can see the recess around the center pillar. Hornady sent me several version of that part in a effort to fix the priming issues.

Here are some pictures of the other side. You can see how they changed the depth of the recess to move the primer punch higher. Perhaps this will help someone who is having the same issue.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3487.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3486.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3485.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3484.jpg

[KYCaster]

Excellent pix of the LnL primer punch.

Here's the other major part of the system, the shuttle...it runs in and out in the slot to position the primer on top of the punch....

41287


The first thing I noticed in your pic is your priming assembly protrudes above the surface of the shell plate carrier by a substantial amount...on both my presses they are slightly below flush. Seems to me that would interfere with the shuttle travel unless the bottom of the shuttle was relieved to clear the punch.

A few problems I found with my presses that need to be addressed:

1) The nose on the end of the shuttle fits very snugly into the radius at the end of the slot. The shuttle had a sprue on the end of the nose that had not been properly finished and prevented the shuttle from lining up with the punch. A few minutes with a needle file removed the offending sprue and allowed the primer to line up with the punch.

The top of the hole in the shuttle had a very sharp edge on it that wouldn't allow the primer to drop into the hole if everything wasn't lined up just exactly right. A little deburring and chamfering cured that.

The shuttle acts like a little bulldozer that pushes everything in front of it into the end of the slot. Any dust, flakes of powder or other debris will quickly accumulate to hold the shuttle away from the end of the slot and prevent the primer from lining up with the punch. File an angle on the bottom of the nose of the shuttle, that will create a space where the crud can accumulate without interfering with the shuttle travel.

2) Compare the Dillon primer seating assembly to the Hornady and the most obvious difference is the relative sizes of them. The diameter of the threads and the size of the hole it screws into really doesn't make a bit of difference. The assembly screws down against a shoulder at the end of the threads and any pressure is supported by the shoulder and not the threads. The important difference is the size of that knob on the end of the Dillon punch....that's what supports the force of seating the primer....it looks like it's a half inch diameter. The same part on the Hornady is .140 dia...and it's rounded on the end, not flat...BIG difference.

On the Hornady, where the punch bears against the frame of the press when seating the primer, it doesn't take long for that small, rounded surface to wear an indent into the press frame, effectively reducing the punch stroke. Screwing the assembly higher into the shell plate carrier doesn't change a thing, the punch still ends up at the same place at the end of the stroke. Cut a piece off the end of a .010 feeler gauge and lay it over the indent on the press frame....problem solved.

3) Little, tiny parts...Getting that Hornady priming assembly apart isn't any big deal, just remove one E clip and parts fly every where. Getting it back together is the challenge.

The problem here is that any crud that finds it's way down inside the assembly will prevent the punch from returning to the down position and interfere with the shuttle travel. Since it's such a PITA to put it back together, it's best to clean it without taking it apart.

Remove the assembly from the press. Hold it upside down and push the punch in as far as it will go. Take a stiff, small dia. wire (torch tip cleaner works well), insert it between the punch and nut and scrape the crud loose so it will fall out. Lube to prevent corrosion and reinstall. This is a good place for a teflon lube with evaporating carrier that won't stay wet and attract dirt.


A few other observations........

Most of us here reload as a hobby or reload to support our shooting hobby. If I were going to bid on a multi-million dollar government ammo contract I certainly wouldn't waste my time comparing $600.00 manually operated presses. On the other hand I'm not going to spend $100,000.00 on automated equipment to feed my 200 round per week shooting habit.

The presses we're debating here all have one thing in common.....THEY'RE CHEAP!!. Some just cheaper than others. They all have design flaws because....THEY'RE CHEAP!!

You can load good ammo on any of the presses available.....even the Lee Load Master..[smilie=s:..........just kidding...( kinda [smilie=1:)

Anyway, don't get too torqued out cause somebody's dumpin' on your favorite press.

Have fun
Jerry

[KYCaster]

HEY....where'd the pic go???????????

Oh, here it is......
41289

Jerry:oops:

[truckmsl]

Love my lnl ap. No problems with any brand primers. Over 25k rounds through it so far. Got 4 buds that love theirs too. Can't understand all the hate. If you cant make it work maybe just stop whining and get a press you can deal with.

[Colorado4wheel]

The first thing I noticed in your pic is your priming assembly protrudes above the surface of the shell plate carrier by a substantial amount...on both my presses they are slightly below flush. Seems to me that would interfere with the shuttle travel unless the bottom of the shuttle was relieved to clear the punch.



No it did not. It was flush. They made the channel deeper to get it flush. I never had any issue with the shuttle. Just getting the primers to seat deep enough.





2) Compare the Dillon primer seating assembly to the Hornady and the most obvious difference is the relative sizes of them. The diameter of the threads and the size of the hole it screws into really doesn't make a bit of difference. The assembly screws down against a shoulder at the end of the threads and any pressure is supported by the shoulder and not the threads. The important difference is the size of that knob on the end of the Dillon punch....that's what supports the force of seating the primer....it looks like it's a half inch diameter. The same part on the Hornady is .140 dia...and it's rounded on the end, not flat...BIG difference.

On the Hornady, where the punch bears against the frame of the press when seating the primer, it doesn't take long for that small, rounded surface to wear an indent into the press frame, effectively reducing the punch stroke.



It's all about stroke of the punch. Dillon has way more stroke. Hornady put a cheap looking metal thing on my press to get rid of the divot. Consider how the press had less then 2K rounds in it and still had a divot. That seemed lame to me. Didn't solve the problem either. Simply not enough stroke. I also trimmed the nut down a little to get more stroke as well.

Press worked fine with Federal. Nice and soft. Easy to seat. Remember I had a light weight striker as well in a Glock. Not the ideal setup. But the 550 and 650 did not have issues with the same setup. That is my point. Sometimes design differences really mater.

[dauntlessdave]

Seems to be either love or hate with the L-N-L. I've had two of them, one with and one without case feeder. My first problem involved the correct advance with the pawls. My stupidity which I finally overcame and figured out. The other problem which I never was able to completely solve was the correct and easy seating of primers large or small. I ended up ordering 10 primer slides simply because I was going through them so quickly. Probably through my own inadequacies BUT somehow I've never had any similar issues with my Dillon 550's which just keeps plugging along. Slower than the L-N-L but totally suitable to my needs. I cringe when I read of someone inexperienced picking up a new L-N-L because to my experience it just equals frustration.

I'm happy for those who've had success with it. I think it's innovative but still in need of some further engineering......or me in need of more tinkering skills.

[40Super]

I have always primed by hand so any press mounted priming system is ok with me ,I don't use them. As far as anything else , Ive tried many of the various brands and they all had things that I didn't care for and would have to "redesign". They are not made to be 'factories", they are made for hobbists, and so they are designed to be "good enough" for most, but not all.

I settled on the LNL , mostly because it has the bushings to change individual dies around without resetting them. I load several "recipes" in each caliber , so I have to change seaters frequently(and PTX's, I make my own stepped ones for lead), but the rest can stay. Plus for some I expand seperate from powder dropping. Thats where I prefered the bushings. Thus far no other problems have crept up and I enjoy it quite a bit.

[jcw1970]

The LnL I had for ten years required polishing, adjusting and loctiting when I first got it, then never had a problem with any brand of primers after that.

Most of the folks who have problems with the Hornady primer system haven't polished it, adjusted it correctly and loctited the parts. Because of the design and price point, you do have to do that. But once done, it's typically trouble free
.

That's why I don't have any problems with my LNL. I bought it off Dave. I just picked up another used one with the case feeder with all 4 feeder plates, 4 shell plates, 12 bushings, a powder cop die, a ptx die, and 2 quick change powder dies. For less than a new basic 650.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

jcw1970,

I've had a good handful of problems with the RCBS Pro 2000 press I bought to replace that press I sold you. Apparently I was one of the unlucky ones in that I received a press with an improperly located primer punch hole drilling. RCBS sent me a new sub plate and I ended up having to readjust everything else on the press before things started running smoothly. Now I'm finding the primer seating rod has a bit too much slop in it's mounting bolt and I have to rotate it to prevent off set priming.

I've gotten things to work out and will resolve the primer seater assembly issue with RCBS, but I've surely missed my LnL. I wish I could mix and match the two presses. I'd like the RCBS shell plate advance and primer feed system, the Hornady LnL bushings and primer seating assembly and I'd like both Dillon and Hornady case activated powder measure systems.

How's that for being brand insensitive?

[dauntlessdave]

Most of the folks who have problems with the Hornady primer system haven't polished it, adjusted it correctly and loctited the parts. Because of the design and price point, you do have to do that. But once done, it's typically trouble free

Actually i did do a lot of polishing on the primer slides and constant blowing out of the collected grit. Just not enough I guess. I also found it necessary to smooth the surface where the casings would travel to the shellplate with the case feeder. Maybe the engineering is fine, it's the fit and finish that needs more attention with the L-N-L.

[Lloyd Smale]

I could never see doing that. With all the handling pulling the case out to prime it and putting it back in to continue your taking about all the advantage of loading progressively away. Ive got lnls and dillons and have used all the dillons and yes the primer feeds may not be perfect but they can be made to work just fine on all of them and even if i have an occasional stoppage due to primer misfeed it still is a hell of a lot faster to clear it and get back going then it is to run my brass through the press twice and prime by hand. to me its about like my dad with his first automatic transmition car. It was a 2 speed powerglide chev and for years he insisted on shifting that car even though it was an automatic.
I have always primed by hand so any press mounted priming system is ok with me ,I don't use them. As far as anything else , Ive tried many of the various brands and they all had things that I didn't care for and would have to "redesign". They are not made to be 'factories", they are made for hobbists, and so they are designed to be "good enough" for most, but not all.

I settled on the LNL , mostly because it has the bushings to change individual dies around without resetting them. I load several "recipes" in each caliber , so I have to change seaters frequently(and PTX's, I make my own stepped ones for lead), but the rest can stay. Plus for some I expand seperate from powder dropping. Thats where I prefered the bushings. Thus far no other problems have crept up and I enjoy it quite a bit.

[40Super]

LLOYD: I deprime and size in a single stage,Why? because I like to clean my brass,primer pockets and all.Then I just hand prime them. Why would you think anyone would put a case in the prgressive,deprime,then take out to prime,then put back in to finish the round? Think about it

[gefiltephish]

I performed two tweaks to my LNL which now works perfectly. Primers would not always seat deep enough and the underside of the slider would occasionally hit the primer punch.

I solved the slider hitting by pulling the brass spent primer tube and slipping a washer under the spring. Pulling the tube without destroying it was not the easiest thing, but it can be done. I had to grind a flat on the washer to clear the ram. Better yet if you can find a smaller od washer. This keeps the carriage riding just a bit higher in its static position so the punch pin is not being compressed. Hope that makes sense.

I solved the not-seating-deep-enough issue with an excellent suggestion by someone on the thr forums (http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=7257586&postcount=2). Basically you take the primer punch apart and sand the nut to allow for more travel. It's easier to see than to explain, so just pull the punch and look at it. I did this with large and small punches and it worked for me.

[Colorado4wheel]

I did that. Didn't solve the issue 100%. I was able to make mine better but not as reliable a primer seater as my Dillons. I simply hate having ammo that is 99% at a match.

[Lloyd Smale]

i guess i dont see whay anyone would size and prime before putting them in a progressive when a its one of the biggest advantage of loading progressively. I can see it maybe if your anal and want to clean primer pockets but i havent cleaned a primer pocket in 20 years and did actually test many times and found cleaning them did nothing. I can see doing it for rifle brass you want to tumble the lube off of but even then a guy can get by with oneshot for progresively loaded ammo or tumble the loaded ammo for a hour or so and again i did test and it hurts absolutely nothing. I guess anything thing other then .223 308 or 762x39 gets loaded on a single stage. Especially if im using stick powders that have to be dispensed on my electronic dispensors. If i was going to load like you do i wouldnt waste my money on a progressive of any kind. the differnce in running that brass back through to charge and seat bullets and charging with a dispensor on a loading block and seating on a single stage is sure not enough time savings to justify a 600 dollar press. Only time i pull them out of a progressive is the first time loading 223 or 308 with crimped pockets. Ill set one lock and load up with a small base sizing die and a dillon case trimmer. Ill size, deprime, trim and then take them off and tumble them. After that i swage pockets on my dillon swager then put them back on a press and prime, charge, and seat bullets. to each his own i guess but if im paying for equipment its going to get used to save me as much time as possible. if it wont feed primers right it will get fixed till it does or ill get rid of it.
LLOYD: I deprime and size in a single stage,Why? because I like to clean my brass,primer pockets and all.Then I just hand prime them. Why would you think anyone would put a case in the prgressive,deprime,then take out to prime,then put back in to finish the round? Think about it

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Actually i did do a lot of polishing on the primer slides and constant blowing out of the collected grit. Just not enough I guess. I also found it necessary to smooth the surface where the casings would travel to the shellplate with the case feeder. Maybe the engineering is fine, it's the fit and finish that needs more attention with the L-N-L.

I think you spent too much time on the fit and finsh side of thought. Your issue is probably your primer slide cam bar is improperly adjusted. There is a bolt on the bottom of the press and a screw on the top. You'll need to adjust the primer slide in three directions - X, Y and Z. X - horizontal - for this you need to loosen and swing the bar left/right until the primer slide travels right down the middle of the of the slot it rides in. Y - vertical - for this, you need to loosen the bolt on the bottom of the press and move the bar up/down until you get the primer slide hole the primer rides in is perfectly centered until the primer tube base hole. Z - crossways - for this you need to loosen the bolt at the top and insure the primer slide is moving back and forth smoothly in the slot. Generally speaking, when the plastic is aligned with the slot cut for it in the top of the press, you're good. If you have to remove it out of the slot, you're likely not properly adjusted somewhere else. Once you've got it adjusted, blue loctite everything down.

If at this point, with the primer slide moving properly and cam bar adjusted properly, you shouldn't be getting a lot of nastiness in the primer slide/seating area. If you are, you doing something else wrong or the environment you have the press in is allowing too much dust into the area. The mechanism isn't that sensitive unless something is adjusted wrong.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I solved the slider hitting by pulling the brass spent primer tube and slipping a washer under the spring. Pulling the tube without destroying it was not the easiest thing, but it can be done. I had to grind a flat on the washer to clear the ram. Better yet if you can find a smaller od washer. This keeps the carriage riding just a bit higher in its static position so the punch pin is not being compressed. Hope that makes sense.

Hornady makes an aluminum punch pin they give you with their ezject subplate upgrade kits that allows one to easily remove the brass tube and reinstall it without damage. I'm sure a phone call to Hornady can get one of these mailed out.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I did that. Didn't solve the issue 100%. I was able to make mine better but not as reliable a primer seater as my Dillons. I simply hate having ammo that is 99% at a match.

Sounds like you need to call Hornady for another punch pin assembly or do a bit more work on the one you have. If you've improved it, but it's still not a 100%, then you probably didn't go quite far enough in your adjustments/tweaks/mods.

[30cal]

Mine still goin strong at about 70000 rnds

[gefiltephish]

Sounds like you need to call Hornady for another punch pin assembly or do a bit more work on the one you have. If you've improved it, but it's still not a 100%, then you probably didn't go quite far enough in your adjustments/tweaks/mods.

Thanks for the heads up on the Hornady punch for the brass tube. I'll second the suggestion that he may not have sanded the punch body far enough.

I don't recall the measurement, but after working on both the large and small punch bodies, they both wound up measuring exactly the same (with a caliper). And yes I did have to go through several cycles of disassembling/sanding/reasembling each of the punches. Unfortunately there is no guarantee that it will work on every press.

Also, I think Hornady should have embedded a piece of steel into the aluminum frame where the punch pin hits it. It would probably not be a bad idea to drill a shallow hole and slip a piece of steel round stock into it. The hard part is getting a drill in there and keeping it squared up. Hmm, how about drilling and reaming a through hole (for an interference fit) from the bottom using a drilling/tapping block, then red locktite the round stock in place. I'd make sure the round stock was long enough to hit the bench top. Perhaps better yet is drilling/tapping a through hole and screwing a fine thread set screw in from the bottom, business end ground flat. This would make it adjustable. This is probably what I'll consider doing if I notice the divot getting any deeper than it is now, but I really don't expect it to become an issue. Alternatively, I know that some epoxies are extremely hard (devcon steel?) and a small blob could be used to fill the divot. This is no doubt the easiest thing to do.

I keep reading about people having issues with powder jamming up the primer shuttle. I'm guessing they have the powder meaure in station 2. Mine is in station 3 and I don't have this problem. I have an m die in station 2.

The only priming issues I've had since almost always involve S&B brass, which are known for tight pockets and has nothing to do with the press. Of course that issue is easily solved by swaging the pockets on every piece of S&B brass in the first place, or just don't use 'em.

[Colorado4wheel]

Sounds like you need to call Hornady for another punch pin assembly or do a bit more work on the one you have. If you've improved it, but it's still not a 100%, then you probably didn't go quite far enough in your adjustments/tweaks/mods.



Thanks for the heads up on the Hornady punch for the brass tube. I'll second the suggestion that he may not have sanded the punch body far enough.


Just so you know there is a point of diminishing returns on cutting the nut on the primer body down. After you go just a little bit you end up with the spring inside the assembly coil binding. So you end up with a erratic setup because the spring does not coil bind the same every time. I never tried clipping a coil from the spring. That would have been my next move had I kept the press. You can easily see the spring coil bind because the punch bottoms out before it touches the nut. The problem is the LnL setup just does not have enough stroke. That is why I say the press is flawed. If your primer/subplate doesn't look like the top picture call Hornady and get a new subplate.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3484.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/98sr20ve/DSC_3485.jpg


ALSO,

The next spring that will coil bind as you shorten the nut is the one over the primer tube. You need to take the tube off and shorten it a little as well. You will need to check your press and see what it's doing to be sure. But springs don't behave the same every time. They move around (spin) and "bind up" different in different spots. Just something else to be aware of.

I would hazard a guess that I traveled farther down this rabbit hole then anyone else posting in this thread. I tried everything and worked with Hornady for MONTHS.

[blaser.306]

I had the same clearance issue with mine and a call to hornady resulted in a new sub plate being shipped to me free of charge ! That is the good news , the bad news is the one that was sent to me requiers that I have to get about half of my shell plates up graded to the EZ ject model ! Any one need a non EZ ject #2 ( 30/30 case head ) As I have a spare shell plate ?

[gefiltephish]

Just so you know there is a point of diminishing returns on cutting the nut on the primer body down. After you go just a little bit you end up with the spring inside the assembly coil binding. So you end up with a erratic setup because the spring does not coil bind the same every time. I never tried clipping a coil from the spring. That would have been my next move had I kept the press. You can easily see the spring coil bind because the punch bottoms out before it touches the nut. The problem is the LnL setup just does not have enough stroke. That is why I say the press is flawed. If your primer/subplate doesn't look like the top picture call Hornady and get a new subplate.

ALSO,

The next spring that will coil bind as you shorten the nut is the one over the primer tube. You need to take the tube off and shorten it a little as well. You will need to check your press and see what it's doing to be sure. But springs don't behave the same every time. They move around (spin) and "bind up" different in different spots. Just something else to be aware of.

I would hazard a guess that I traveled farther down this rabbit hole then anyone else posting in this thread. I tried everything and worked with Hornady for MONTHS.

Good point about the coil bind. It is actually something I had considered at the time, but I only had to take maybe .006 (definitely less than .010) off the nut to get mine to work. Since coil bind was an issue for your press, it's got me wondering if some of these issues aren't caused by Hornady getting springs from different suppliers.

A given spring rate can be achieved by juggling several variables such as wire thickness, coil diameter, coil pitch, number of coils in the spring, wire material and heat treatment. It's conceivable that Hornady specified a spring with a minimum id, minimum and maximum uncompressed length, spring rate of xx, but not minimum compressed length. Given that, it's possible that an in spec spring from one supplier may have a compressed length of say .5 while another supplier's in spec spring may have a compressed length of .6. This of course is just a shot in the dark but it could make all the difference.

Funny though, I added a washer under the primer tube spring and still don't experience coil bind that I'm aware of. But you can bet I'll be taking an even closer look at it when I get home. ;-)

[Colorado4wheel]

From what I can tell some tolerances on the LnL are really tight (ram). But some things seem to vary a lot (bushings tightens for instance). You make a good point. And perhaps someone else with this issue will find this conversation helpful.

[djohncline]

My LNL AP has serial number #00146 and has loaded several 100,000s of rounds! Drive hub is fine! I've had to replace the indexing pawls (which I broke with negligent excessive force) and the primer slide (same thing there). Hornady replaced both, no questions asked. I actually received a whole new indexing assembly for the first fault, that was really impressive!

The only thing I'm not impressed with was the brand new shell plate I bought for the .45 ACP (shellplate #45). It was clearly a case of badly done MIM technique as the air voids and cracks could be seen on the rear of it. I tried to get it replaced, but they wouldn't as they said it hadn't broken yet and was just a cosmetic error. So far it works good, but I don't trust it one bit.

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/9903/20110907001004.jpg

I have had two #16 shell plates fail this week, I would expect the brass to fail first. Got me so pi**ed boxed it up put it on Craigslist. I'll probably keep it and set it up for pistols and get a 550 for rifle.