Blackhawk 45 Auto Rim

[Trey45]

I have a Blackhawk 45 Convertible, I mainly shoot 45 Colt through it, I recently had the ACP cylinder faced off to accept Auto Rim. I just got back from picking it up this morning. This is the first cylinder modification I have ever had done, I was a little anxious about it, but the machinist did a great job on it. Now I get to do more load work ups! [smilie=w:

Happy Saturday!

[MtGun44]

Please explain the reasoning behind this change. Can't see what the benefit
would be.

Bill

[Trey45]

So I can shoot auto rim in it. It doesn't stop me from shooting acp in it. All it did was allow me to use auto rim in it as well. Does everything have to have a reason?

[theperfessor]

I've thought of converting a beat up old SBH I have into .45AR/ACP. I was thinking about cutting back the face of the cylinder a bit and extending the barrel back into the frame to match. I have about 9" of a Shilen .451 barrel blank left over from another project that could be used.

The reason to face off the back of the cylinder of any SA revolver to use AR as well as ACP brass is the with AR brass you can use a roll crimp and still get positive headspacing, just like any other rimmed revolver case.

[S.R.Custom]

The reason to face off the back of the cylinder of any SA revolver to use AR as well as ACP brass is the with AR brass you can use a roll crimp and still get positive headspacing, just like any other rimmed revolver case.

Yep, in hot & heavy 275 gr bowling pin loads, it's all about the roll crimp. :D

[Trey45]

Roll crimping

I don't shoot bowling pin matches, nor overly heavy boolits. I mainly got it done so I can shoot 4 of the 45's in one gun, 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, 45ACP and 45AR. I spent a minimal amount of money to face of the back of the cylinder, which allows me to use 45AR and 45ACP in the same cylinder. In all honesty, I think there's a major "coolness" factor in having a pistol that will shoot 4 different cartridges. Not to mention there's a major "coolness" factor to 45AR all by itself. I dunno, there's no real reason I had it done, I just did it, I like it, it's "cool" and it's fun.

[9.3X62AL]

Having had a couple convertible Blackhawk 45s previously, it dawned on me as I read the OP's text that facing off the cylinder in this way would have zero effect on the use of 45 ACP ammo, and would allow use of the 45 Auto Rim. That is a cool upgrade, in my view.

I'll be trying a similar thing with a Blackhawk in 30 Carbine--using reworked 32-20 brass to enable roll crimping of boolits. There should be no need for cylinder mods. I think.

[S.R.Custom]

...In all honesty, I think there's a major "coolness" factor in having a pistol that will shoot 4 different cartridges....

Yup. We've been trying to goad AL into getting a .327 Federal using the same, irrefutable logic ever since they came out. So far... no joy.

[Onty]

I've thought of converting a beat up old SBH I have into .45AR/ACP. I was thinking about cutting back the face of the cylinder a bit and extending the barrel back into the frame to match. I have about 9" of a Shilen .451 barrel blank left over from another project that could be used.

The reason to face off the back of the cylinder of any SA revolver to use AR as well as ACP brass is the with AR brass you can use a roll crimp and still get positive headspacing, just like any other rimmed revolver case.

Yep, those who tried 45AR liked it much more than 45 Colt for number of reasons. I will add to this better accuracy when pushing boolit like Lyman 454424 up to 1100 fps. I have somewhere article about 45AR in later S&W M25 loaded at noted level, great hunting load according to writer, with less blast and recoil than comparable load in 44 magnum or 45 Colt.

[theperfessor]

I've thought a lot about this conversion. I'd cut the cylinder back to be long enough to allow for a 270 or so gr SWC seated out far enough to allow a little more powder room and allow 1000+ fps with safe pressure levels, maybe 1250+ with a 200 gr SWC. With an 8" or so barrel I can't imagine the recoil would be at all bad, and it shouldn't be hard to develop an accurate load of some type.

I might make a mold for a 270 gr SWC with three lube grooves. Use the top groove to crimp into with Long Colt loads and lube the two lower grooves. Use the middle groove in .45AR and lube the bottom and top groove (if necessary).

Got a couple more ideas that haven't quite worked their way to the surface yet but before I whack on any parts I'm going to do a little more (hopefully creative) thinking.

[9.3X62AL]

Yup. We've been trying to goad AL into getting a .327 Federal using the same, irrefutable logic ever since they came out. So far... no joy.

When the brass gets to "general availability" status, I'll make the move. An L-frame 7-shot with 6" barrel might do the trick. too.

[Guesser]

I was thinking of having my ACP cylinder faced for AR. I asked about it over on Rugerforum and found out that there are short 45 Colt cases being manufactured so that you can use AR style loads in the ACP cylinder because of the thin rim on the Colt cases. Gave me pause, haven't decided yet. I have a Colt New Service that I use ACP and AR in. Decisions, decisions, rats!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dale53]

Guesser;
Those cases are called .45 Cowboy Specials and are available here;

http://www.cowboy45special.com/cowboy45brass.html

The .45 Cowboy Special works in both the .45 Colt cylinder AND my .45 ACP cylinder. All without altering the original parts. Before anyone orders up a bunch of .45 Cowboy Specials to use in their .45 ACP cylinder, you might want to try a couple first. They work in my cylinder but the tolerances are very close. Mine works fine but I can't guarantee YOURS will.

I have a couple of S&W 625's so regularly use the Auto Rim cases (I have had another thousand cases on order since January - I notice that Starline has moved the Auto Rim availability back ANOTHER month:evil::evil::evil:

I, personally, don't have a desire to alter my .45 ACP cylinder for Auto Rim cases, but if that spins your propeller, more power to you. It's all about pleasing yourself - I am sure I make some decisions that have others scratching their heads (and it worries me terribly, too[smilie=1:).

Dale53

[Bass Ackward]

Guesser;
Those cases are called .45 Cowboy Specials and are available here;

http://www.cowboy45special.com/cowboy45brass.html

The .45 Cowboy Special works in both the .45 Colt cylinder AND my .45 ACP cylinder. All without altering the original parts. Before anyone orders up a bunch of .45 Cowboy Specials to use in their .45 ACP cylinder, you might want to try a couple first. They work in my cylinder but the tolerances are very close. Mine works fine but I can't guarantee YOURS will.

I have a couple of S&W 625's so regularly use the Auto Rim cases (I have had another thousand cases on order since January - I notice that Starline has moved the Auto Rim availability back ANOTHER month:evil::evil::evil:

I, personally, don't have a desire to alter my .45 ACP cylinder for Auto Rim cases, but if that spins your propeller, more power to you. It's all about pleasing yourself - I am sure I make some decisions that have others scratching their heads (and it worries me terribly, too[smilie=1:).

Dale53


The advantage of the Cowboy 45 Spc brass, besides NOT having to modify your ACP cylinder for your Blackhawk, is that if you have a lever action in 45 Colt, that you can use the same brass / loads in both guns just as if you were shooting 38 Spc in a 357.

Basically it is a cheaper, more convenient way to have a companion set up in a 45 bore without the disadvantages of ignition problems that come with using light loads in HUGE cases.

[9.3X62AL]

The advantage of the Cowboy 45 Spc brass, besides NOT having to modify your ACP cylinder for your Blackhawk, is that if you have a lever action in 45 Colt, that you can use the same brass / loads in both guns just as if you were shooting 38 Spc in a 357.

Basically it is a cheaper, more convenient way to have a companion set up in a 45 bore without the disadvantages of ignition problems that come with using light loads in HUGE cases BEFORE TRAIL BOSS POWDER BECAME AVAILABLE.

There, fixed it for ya, Bass. :D

[Bullshop]

How much faceing was required? I mean by how much was the cylinder length reduced?

[Trey45]

Somewhere around .034

[GLL]

Guesser;
I have a couple of S&W 625's so regularly use the Auto Rim cases (I have had another thousand cases on order since January - I notice that Starline has moved the Auto Rim availability back ANOTHER month:evil::evil::evil:
Dale53

Oh man ! :( I ordered another 500 in January as well ! Now they will not be here until May !!! :(

Jerry

[MtGun44]

OK, I see the flexibility now. I was forgetting that it would not affect the use of the ACP
brass. I was initially thinking you would only be able to us the Auto Rim brass, which can
be hard to come by at times.

Bill

[BoolitBill]

Trey45, If you don't mind my asking, how much did that cost you? I was considering having that done to my 45 acp cylinder also. Can any machinist do it or do you recommend a particular gunsmith?

[Trey45]

It cost me $40 to have it done, I think any good machinist should be able to do this. I took in an ACP dummy and an AR dummy and a set of calipers, I measured right there in front of him and explained, this is what we have for over all length, this is what we need to have for over all length in order for this AR to fit. I left him the cylinder, the pistol and both dummy rounds, plus 6 empty AR cases for him to use for fitting. He took a set of feeler guages and measured the gap between the ACP case head and recoil plate and gave me the same clearance with the AR cases. His final cut was an "aircut" of .0015 and he finished it with a scotchbright polish. Make sure if you have a machinist do this, that you explain to him not to get carried away with the deburring tool in the chamber mouths, a little bit of a chamfer is ok,too much of one is not. If I had to guess, I'd say I have a 128th of an inch chamfer, just enough really to knock the machine burrs off the edges.

[Shooter6br]

SR. i love the 327 Fed in the Blackhawk . I use 32 acp, 32 long ,32 Mag and 327 Fed. Good gun after the zoobie plague I guess LOL( Need lots of ammo )