7x57 questions

[Plinkster]

Ok I acquired by default a sporterized model 93 mauser in 7x57 that upon first inspection had a Tasco 3-9x mounted with .22 scope rings and an improperly clocked bolt handle. After some careful filing upon the stock and bolt handle the action was in firing order. Threw some weaver mounts on and left the cheap scope for the initial range test. The gun shot pretty well, about 2 MOA after Zero @ 100yds with factory Remington 140gr SPTCL. I thought that was pretty good for a rifle that had who knows how many rounds through it with **** factory low end loads. I judged the loads be low end because there are weak actions that folks shoot in and that some of the case necks were powder fouled. After I got home and tumbled the brass I found that the cases looked as though they were too long (to me, nil experiance reloading). The case neck to me looked like it had been formed into the throat. Thoughts, suggestions,errors, any advice appreciated.

[elk hunter]

Can't see the pictures very well, but I think what you're seeing is the remains of the Remington factory crimp. Look at one of the unfired loads to see if it has the same marks.

[MtGun44]

Better pic would help, but I tend to agree with elk hunter. Look closely at the ammo
and see if you don't see similar crimp marks.

Why would you think that the Rem loads are "XXXXX", or whatever derogatory comment
that got blocked out? IME, Rem factory ammo is good quality and well made. It
is loaded to SAAMI specs specifically for old sporterized military rifles, exactly like
you are using. I would not go whoomping up high pressure loads, that is a 45,000
CUP rifle and the SAAMI ammo is set up for 45,000 CUP. They guy with a brand new
Ruger or similar modern design can choose to load a bit hotter, but for any of these
old milsurps, keeping in the intended original pressure range is the right thing to do.

Bill

[doubs43]

No question about it: the markings at the case mouth are factory crimp marks and not the result of your rifle's chamber.

IF your '93 is German made, it began life as a quality arm. IF it's been given reasonable treatment, it's still a safe rifle but you'd be wise to have a gunsmith check it over.

The 7x57mm cartridge is one of the best. The Remington factory 140 grain load will take any deer that's ever been or will be and do it cleanly. Enjoy your new rifle.

[Dutchman]

No question about it: the markings at the case mouth are factory crimp marks and not the result of your rifle's chamber.

IF your '93 is German made, it began life as a quality arm. IF it's been given reasonable treatment, it's still a safe rifle but you'd be wise to have a gunsmith check it over.

The 7x57mm cartridge is one of the best. The Remington factory 140 grain load will take any deer that's ever been or will be and do it cleanly. Enjoy your new rifle.

+

Yep, nothing wrong.

Dutch

[Multigunner]

Ok I acquired by default a sporterized model 93 mauser in 7x57 that upon first inspection had a Tasco 3-9x mounted with .22 scope rings and an improperly clocked bolt handle. After some careful filing upon the stock and bolt handle the action was in firing order. Threw some weaver mounts on and left the cheap scope for the initial range test. The gun shot pretty well, about 2 MOA after Zero @ 100yds with factory Remington 140gr SPTCL. I thought that was pretty good for a rifle that had who knows how many rounds through it with **** factory low end loads. I judged the loads be low end because there are weak actions that folks shoot in and that some of the case necks were powder fouled. After I got home and tumbled the brass I found that the cases looked as though they were too long (to me, nil experiance reloading). The case neck to me looked like it had been formed into the throat. Thoughts, suggestions,errors, any advice appreciated.

You should check the OAL of the case against specs, since they usually stretch some when fired.

Were that 93 mine I'd probably stick to the older 175 grain bullet loads, those worked fine in my 95 years ago.

[MtGun44]

Got a real laugh there. " 95 years ago" . . . . . . . . How old ARE you?

Heck I only was shooting my first 7x57 45 years ago. :bigsmyl2:

Bill

[Multigunner]

Got a real laugh there. " 95 years ago" . . . . . . . . How old ARE you?

Heck I only was shooting my first 7x57 45 years ago. :bigsmyl2:

Bill

My 95 years ago. Guess I should have added a coma.

I'm old enough to have outlived any enemy worthy of consideration, and almost all my vices, but not old enough to have outlived all my friends.

I bought my 95 Mauser in like new condition for $24.95 along with a like new commercial Browning P-35 for $60. So thats a hint.

[MtGun44]

Not bad phraseology, it just struck me funny. Sounds like you're a bit older than
I am. My 95 Chilean cost $35 in NRA Excellent condition and I was torn (couldn't
afford both) between that and a mint Astra 600 for $36.

Bill

[doubs43]

Not bad phraseology, it just struck me funny. Sounds like you're a bit older than
I am. My 95 Chilean cost $35 in NRA Excellent condition and I was torn (couldn't
afford both) between that and a mint Astra 600 for $36.

Bill

IIRC, my NIB Astra 600 was $19.95 from "Ye Olde Hunter" about 1960 or 1961. Came with two mags. The guns were imported by Interarms. They were part - or all - of the Nazi contract that wasn't delivered during WW2. Mine had a horrible trigger but I still managed to shoot it quite well. They bring quite the premium today.

My first Chilean 1895 Mauser was bought from a hardware store in Tacoma, WA, in early 1968. The store had 50 or more to select from. IIRC, I paid $18.95 for it. I had the bolt bent, D&T with Weaver bases and the barrel cut to 24". A 4X Bushnell scope and rings were added to bring my total cost to $56.25. I cut, sanded and refinished the stock myself. I reloaded for years using one of the Lee Loaders and surplus 4895 powder. I once hit a groundhog in the head - the only part visible as it looked over a fallen tree - at 250 yards or more, causing my father to exclaim incredulously "I think you hit it!" I finally sold it about 1980.

[MtGun44]

I still have my 1895 Chilean, all original, bore has some damage due to some idiot
teenager (who shall forever be regretful) who didn't fully under stand corrosive ammo.
It still shoots really well. Bought it in 1967, just before guns became contraband and
could no longer be mail ordered. A sad day.

I finally bought the Astra 25 yrs later, cost about $120 then, still have it too. A weird
but interesting design. L-head pins holding everything together.

[Plinkster]

I am sure you are more knowledgeable about his than I, since most of you started shooting before I was born. Yes that picture is poor and doesn't show what I'm seeing clearly. It is more pronounced than the factory crimp on the unfired rounds I have. The factory crimp looks like a nice sloped crimp and what I got on my cases is a sharp step with 4 evenly spaced bars running vertically. (I thought this might be impressions of the rifling. Either way I just got some cerro safe type alloy from roto metals and will be making a chamber cast very soon and have the gun checked out by a smith before any more firing.

[MtGun44]

Do you have 4 groove rifling? If so, you may be right. You are on the right
track to be safe. Good thinking.

And yes, without a good macrophoto capable camera it is pretty hard for us to
diagnose long distance. Keep using your head like you are and you will be OK.

Bill

[Typecaster]

95 years ago" . . . . . . . . How old ARE you?
Not speaking for myself (I'm 58 and shooting for more than 50), but my dad comes close to the 95 years of shooting. He turns 100 next month, and started shooting a .22 well before age of 10. So that at least would be 90+ years ago. He did stop shooting a couple of years ago, but still spots for me when I go to Prescott. A couple of years ago he deprimed and sized several thousand .308 cases for me, and a couple of buckets of 5.56 mil, so he's still in the reloading camp, at least.

Richard

[Plinkster]

I do believe I have 4 groove rifling (early memory slippage takes hold here) however after inspecting some 30-06 cases that I will be re-working I found that they too carried the suspicious "4 bars". I am convinced that everyone is correct in the conclusion that they are indeed factory crimp marks. After looking at my Lee factory crimp die I can see how those "4 bars" could be impressed. Also they don't have the even spacing between positive negative impressions that rifling would leave. Mystery solved! Thanks for all the help, I love the HUGE knowledge base on this forum.

[L Ross]

Here's another possibility. Again it is hard to see from the photo but my Remington #5 1902 Rolling Block has the old 7m/m Spanish Mauser chambering and fireforms the brass with a two step neck. Modern 7x57 bass has the shoulder too far back, and the rifles act as though they have excess headspace. After fire forming we carefully never size the shoulder back to modern specs. Might not a 1893 Spanish Mauser have that old style chamber? I vote for a chamber cast.

Duke

[Von Gruff]

All brass for my 7x57 gets necked up to 8mm then sized to my chamber so cases are fireformed without stretch.

Von Gruff.