Unique and powder measures

[PacMan]

Any of you guys know of a powder measure that will throw consistent charges of Unique and other flake type powders.

I have two RCBS uniflo's and they wont do it.I can deal with .1 gr variation which really equals up to.2 grs but i am getting as much as .4 grs variation which is more than i really like.

Looked at the RCBS Lil Dandy and they have charge chambers for diffrent charges but not sure how accurate they are. I am willing to pay for a good measure if i know what i am getting will work.

Any help is appreciated as always.
Dwight

[Shooter6br]

i find Unique does vary in my Hornady pistol measure. i prefer Universal but could not get it locally see i have 4 lbs of Unique.I really shoot pistolwith it so I dont shoot that well to notice the differance. When i shot benchrest I needed to be within a few tenths of a grain. H322 for rifle measures great.

[Black Prince]

Dwight

I use a lot of Unique in lower velocity loads for 44 mag and 44 Special. I have a Lyman 55 and I have no problems loading accurate ammo using Unique. I also have a Dillon and it too, loads accurate ammo using Unique. I also have a Little Dandy and it does not throw charges any better than the 55 or the Dillon. One way to increase the consistency of your charges is to double tap the measure (any measure) when the cylinder cavity is open to the main powder hopper. That way you get a full chamber and more consistent charges.

I think you are more concerned with the variances you are getting than you ought to be. And I'll bet you won't notice any accuracy difference if you weigh evey load charge and just load from your powder measure. You can prove or disprove that real easy. But Juliam Hatcher, Elmer Keith and many other have already done that 60 years ago. Check them out in the books they wrote about it. Then run your own comparison and prove them correct once again.

[Wally]

Here's what I do that allows me to obain 0.1 grain varienace with lighter charges of Unique...I use an ancient Herters Powder Measure (PM) that is no better than a Std Lyman or RCBS. Pour the Unqiue powder into the powder measure--filling it. Cap it and give the a no. of gentle taps with your hand to get it to settle a bit. Then throw 10-20 charges after you have it set for the desired charge weight..I pour into the Unique powder container..then get down to business...when you cycle the lever down give the PM a slight tap with your hand, then when you charge a case do the same thing..try to tap it the same way and with the same effort...this works surprisingly well.

[PacMan]

Thanks for the advice guys.Will give it a try
Dwight

[Wayne Smith]

I use the Bear pistol measure - a rotating cylinder with a hole in it and you weigh to see how much powder comes out of that hole. Very similar to the Little Dandy, I believe, but I think it slides rather than rotates. I have no problem getting accuracy within .2gr with this, and if I carefully settled the powder as per Wally I'd probably be more accurate.

[unclebill]

i like to keep the level of powder the same in the hopper.
i dont know if it really helps or not.
but i like to think having a consistant weight bearing down on the powder does some good.

[Bradley]

Most of my powder measures were made by RCBS. I use Unique in all of them without any problems.

[Black Prince]

Most new measurers and all of the Dillons now come with a powder "baffle" that maintains a constant powder pressure until the powder gets down to the baffel. You can see one here--> http://www.amazon.com/Ellett-Bros-POWDER-MEASURE-BAFFLE/dp/B000NTNJ8S You can make one from a coke can and a pair of sisors, or even cardboard from the back of a legal pad or similar pad. While that is a consideration, the most important thing to consistent charges once everything is set, is a consistent movement of the throwing arm on the powder measure. Only practice can bring that about. You can use the little "hammer" on the Lyman 55 to tap on the up and down strokes, or more simply and faster, bump the throwing arm against the stop twice on the up stroke and twice on the down stroke. The down stroke bumps are to keep the powder from bridging in the drop tube. You really don't need that with Unique, but I am in the habit of doing it every time, so I just automatically do it with all powders. Get a set way of loading and stick to it. It's when you don't follow your set pattern that you make mistakes.

[Kevin Rohrer]

The B&M works fine. It's just a bit slow to use.

[MtGun44]

I think you should try an experiment.

Load up 10 rounds of your favorite load with Unique with your RCBS measure.

Load up 10 rounds of the same load using a scale, getting every one dead on.

Shoot both on a good day, 5 rds on one target with measured, then 5 rds on a
different target with scale weighed. Then back for the second 5 rds on the first
target and the last 5 rds on the second target.

You will have two 10 shot groups, one with Uniflow measured variation and one with
no variation.

See if you can tell the difference. If you can, continue your quest for a better
measure. If you cannot, you can now officially relax.

Bill

[btroj]

I am with Bill. Don't over worry or over think this. The variations you mention will most likely never show on paper. I have no idea how consistent my measures throw unique. I have used it in my Dillon, Lyman 55, and an RCBS. Never checked for consistency. Don't care.
I load and I shoot. No problems.

[PacMan]

I tend to agree with you guys on most of what you are saying.
I have tried all the taping,settling and filling advice and still get .4 to .5 grs variance.Not ever time but more often than i like.
Will that much variation make a real world diffrence. I have worked up two loads using Unique and same bullet. 8.5 grs shoot almost as accurate as 9.0 grs but groups average about 1" lower and 1 1/2" to the right.Now that is from a solid rest at just 25 yards.Can i ever tell the diffrence from a off hand-no ,from a field rest maybe.
Now move those numbers to 50 yards and things get worse.
Could be my gun/bullet combination is a little to finiky and i may do better with a diffrent powder.
but iam working with what i have.

Why do people show loads that they use and like that have tenths of a grain listed? Most of those loads were worked up weighing every load and when they hit the weight that shoot the best they write down that load and proceed with it.
Knowing that your gun,bullet and load will shoot where you want it to every time if you do your part is the reason we work up the best load we can. Not knowing that the first and only shot you take at 50 yards will be 3" off is not the reason i reload.

Hey guys i am not wanting to argue here but just food for thought.

Dwight

[MtGun44]

No argument. I was just suggesting an interesting experiment. I do not
actually know the answer, it would be interesting to do.

So far, I am OK with the variation I get with my Uniflow measures, but if I
get around to doing the experiment myself, maybe I will get a bit more
worried!

Bill

[btroj]

I am not a good enough shot in most cases to notice the difference that .4 gr of powder would make. If I wanted more accuracy at longer ranges I would most likely be looking at a hunting load and that means I would not be using unique.
You also may be looking at this from the wrong point of view. Rather than try to find a measure that gives you the charge consistency you want why not find a powder that goes thru the measures you have? Unique is hardly the only handgun powder out there. I would try AA5, a nice ball powder that has a similar use range to unique. As a ball it should measure much better too.

There is almost always more than one way to solve a problem.

Brad

[1hole]

"Any of you guys know of a powder measure that will throw consistent charges of Unique and other flake type powders."

No.

[PacMan]

btroj-i alluded to the fact that another powder would do better in my last post. And that will be the answer if there are no measures that will through Unique more accuratly.

1hole-thanks for an answer to my question.

[perotter]

A Pro Lee Auto Disk will. I've never seen a .4 variance with it or with my C&H with any powder & most of what I've reloaded has been with Unique.

FWIW, the Ammo Load commercial reloading setups use 3 powder measures for each round.

[Fredx10sen]

Dwight

I use a lot of Unique in lower velocity loads for 44 mag and 44 Special. I have a Lyman 55 and I have no problems loading accurate ammo using Unique. I also have a Dillon and it too, loads accurate ammo using Unique. I also have a Little Dandy and it does not throw charges any better than the 55 or the Dillon. One way to increase the consistency of your charges is to double tap the measure (any measure) when the cylinder cavity is open to the main powder hopper. That way you get a full chamber and more consistent charges.

I think you are more concerned with the variances you are getting than you ought to be. And I'll bet you won't notice any accuracy difference if you weigh evey load charge and just load from your powder measure. You can prove or disprove that real easy. But Juliam Hatcher, Elmer Keith and many other have already done that 60 years ago. Check them out in the books they wrote about it. Then run your own comparison and prove them correct once again.

+1 on the double tap

[Fredx10sen]

Any of you guys know of a powder measure that will throw consistent charges of Unique and other flake type powders.

I have two RCBS uniflo's and they wont do it.I can deal with .1 gr variation which really equals up to.2 grs but i am getting as much as .4 grs variation which is more than i really like.

Looked at the RCBS Lil Dandy and they have charge chambers for diffrent charges but not sure how accurate they are. I am willing to pay for a good measure if i know what i am getting will work.

Any help is appreciated as always.
Dwight

I have two of the Uniflows ( 1 set with large drum and 1 with small drum) and they have always worked for me. I also have the Little Dandy with all the rotors. What size charge are you wanting to drop. It has always worked well also. One thing to keep in mind is that you have to crank the handle or rotor the same way every time to better the consistency in your powder weight. My 45LC cowboy loads with 7.0 Unique are very consistent. Hope that helps.

[mroliver77]

I second the Lee Pro Disk measure I have a couple of them and really like them. I do hand fit the hopper to the base so that the seal on the hopper fits the disk tight and smooth. Even H110 does not leak after fitting. The Dillon measures on my Square Deal presses seem to drop consistent charges. I will have to test Unique in them.
I have never tried with handgun rounds but with rifle loads I tested dropped against weighed and found no difference. I used to do the tap tap regiment but now just shoot for consistency and I load some pretty accurate ammo.
Just one observation. Dwight states that people list their favorite loads to the tenth of a grain. Well most of the "standards" from Elmer, Skeeter etc are like 12.5 gr. , 11gr or 13.5gr. I have found that if a gun is set up right and boolits are fit properly that it is much less picky about small changes in loads. I hate picky guns!
Jay
Jay

[buck1]

I do hand fit the hopper to the base so that the seal on the hopper fits the disk tight and smooth. Even H110 does not leak after fitting.

How did you do that? Thanks buck

[rcbarry]

I use a uniflow with a baffle in it and it works great for me

[selmerfan]

I run a pair of Lyman #55s, both with baffles. Both of them throw charges with Unique that are dead-on. I loaded as low as 5 gr. with them, but haven't gone less than that. Once they were set and filled, a consistent rhythm of handle up, flip the "knocker", swift handle "down", flip the knocker, repeat. I an convinced the "knocker" is the key.

[Smoke-um if you got-um]

For most of my life I've used the dippers for pistol powders w/o much thought about the measures. After reading this I tested an RCBS Uniflow and a well used Lee for consistancy. I set both to throw 10 grains. After set-up I then threw 15 loads apiece and indivdually weighed each. The RCBS went +- .3, the Lee went +-.2. I didn't have a dipper that would dip 10 gr so I modified a Lee dipper to dip 10 grains and did the same thing. If I had been smart I would have started with the dipper and then set the measures to throw the dippers charge, but my Daddy didn't call me son because I was bright. Anyway...... 1 swipe through the powder with a little shake at the end and it avg'ed +- .2. Couldn't get that magic +- .1
Gave me something to do for about an hour or so instead of frying braincells watching the boob tube.
:drinks:
Mike