From wheel weights to ingot??

[oneone]

Hi all, I'm new here. I did some searching, but you could imagine the number of pages I found in regards to wheel weights. I'm new to casting, and I have great access to free WW. What I'm wondering is if anyone knows of a page that explains the process of going from WW to ingot. I have a Lee bottom pour melter, but I'm only assuming that I wouldn't use that to "refine" my lead.

Sorry for such a newb question, but we all start somewhere right? :oops:

[imashooter2]

Welcome aboard! This page covers the basics pretty well:

http://goatlipstips.cas-town.com/smelting.html

[oneone]

Perfect. Much appreciated. Now I begin. :)

[imashooter2]

Safety tips:

1) Water and melted lead don't mix. Get water under the lead surface and you will suffer a steam explosion and have melted lead everywhere, including on you.

2) Do not melt lead in an aluminum pot. Aluminum weakens considerably at lead melting temperatures and can fail without warning. Standing in a puddle of molten metal is generally regarded as a bad thing.

3) Cooking pot handles are not designed for the weight of lead. They will crack, break, come off if you try to lift the pot by them. See above regards standing in molten metal.

3) Cotton or wool clothes. (Synthetics melt to you if covered by molten lead.) Long pants, long sleeves, leather shoes/boots with the tops covered by your pant legs. Heavy gloves. SAFETY GLASSES!

[Springfield]

I always wear a ballcap also. I have had lead splatters fall down inside my glasses and burn my cheek. With the ball cap that all ended. Keeps the hot lead outa my hair, also. It is not if, but when, that hidden drop of water will cover you with tinsel. Here is my set-up part way through a big batch. It helps if you can get it all off the ground too, saves your back.

[Rooster]

Yowza! How many lead corn pones can you make at one time Springfield? Also, is that pot SS or Al?

[bbs70]

Nice looking setup there Springfield, wish mine was that neat.
But then if it was I probably couldn't find anything anyhow.:bigsmyl2:

[elixin77]

Hey guys,

I was casting for the first time last week. I was able to get a small batch of WW for the going rate (1/3 of a bucket for $10 - from what I've read, most full buckets go for about $30), to get me started.

After I heated everything up, I started fluxing the lead. When I started stirring, this weird gold like substance was on top, and after a while, it would turn to blue, then purple. I tried scooping it out, but it seemed like I was just scooping out more lead than whatever this is.

It stuck around after I poured the lead into ingots:

http://i54.tinypic.com/4jx36o.jpg

Sorry for the low res. The only camera I have is on my iPhone 3G, and its pretty dismal, to say the least.

Any ideas on what this is?

[lylejb]

Elixen,

Look here

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=63550

and welcome aboard.

[Matt_G]

Welcome to the madness oneone. :drinks:
That page by Goatlips is a good start.

Getting into specific equipment, here is what I use. I bought a Fish Fryer (http://www.basspro.com/Bass-Pro-Shops-Propane-Cooker-with-Aluminum-Pot/product/10205245/-1631022) at Bass Pro. Looks like they are $29.99 which is a good deal. As mentioned; do NOT use the aluminum pot that comes with it to melt lead in! Cast iron is your best bet. Like this dutch oven (http://www.harborfreight.com/12-inch-cast-iron-dutch-oven-44705.html) at Harbor Freight.

Once your melting lead, keep the temp down so you don't get any zinc in your lead. You'll find that clip on wheel weights tend to be molten at roughly 570 degrees Fahrenheit. I usually let it get up to about 620, turn the heat down, then skim, flux, and start pouring ingots. Pure zinc melts at 787 F, so as long as you watch the heat, getting zinc in your lead is a non issue. Sure beats sorting by hand.

[elixin77]

Elixen,

Look here

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=63550

and welcome aboard.

From what I've gathered, I have my pot temperature too high. Is that what I'm looking for? Wouldn't surprise me, because after I scooped out all the stuff that wasn't melted, i turned the heat up to max so I could melt a bit faster.

Thanks a bunch!!!

[leadbutt]

Yea.... i wasted bout 60# pounds of lead and a day of smelting because of zinc. Make sure you get a thermometer before you start.


L. Bottoms

[jsizemore]

If you've got the heat too high you'll see a skin of light gold on top of your shiny silver melt. The first thing to do is bring the temp down by dropping some more ww in or an already cast ingot. Give it a light stir and then turn your heat down.
The melt will respond immediately to the heat reduction provided by the cold ww's or ingots.
Good Luck.

[leadbutt]

I think that if he gets the heat too high in the 1st place chances are a newbie would already have melted a zinc or 2 and his batch is runed. Just get the thermo till you figure out all the experenced tricks. The money you spend in a thermo will save you the same amount of money in lead. If all else fails put your finger in it to see if its hot enough. Lol jk dont try that at home. Good tek for cooling your pot fast though.


L. Bottoms

[jsizemore]

When your new to this casting and smelting thing you can only learn the equipments capabilities by doing. Hard to read the thermometer when your fluxing and stirring and the top of the melt is covered with clips.

Watch out for the zinc boogeyman!!!

Good Luck.

[leadbutt]

If reading the thermometer is too difficult i dont think this is really the hobby you should get into. You can flux and stir after your temp is where you want it. You can learn the capabilities of your equipment without wasting metal.

L. Bottoms

[jsizemore]

I don't remember getting any zinc in my melt. Oh yeah, that was you.

I bow to your obvious expertise.

[imashooter2]

I've got a casting thermometer and I've never even considered using it in my smelting pot. Zinc is solid for a long time after lead is liquid. Skim the stray zinc weight off the top along with the clips.

Seems like every problem that comes up on this board anymore, someone chimes in with (as jsizemore so eloquently put it) the zinc boogeyman.

[*Paladin*]

I'm a noobie (I've smelted only 600 or so lbs) but I just stand next to the pot and when the WW's go molten, I scoop out whatever is floating. I've found a couple zinc WW's that I missed when sorting. They were obvious, just floating on the surface with the clips. The zinc "boogeyman" had me really stressed when I first started smelting. Now, I don't worry about it so much...

PS: I don't use a thermometer when smelting either. Haven't needed it, so it stays in the 4-20 pot.

[jsizemore]

I throw in a piece of candle or parafin to get the good stuff to flux back into the melt before I skim the clips and dross. I would dump my clips from my dross bucket/coffee can and there would be a clump of lead/tin/antimony stuck to a couple of clips in the bottom. Fluxing before I skim clips cuts down on the size of the clump.

[imashooter2]

Use a wire strainer to pull the clips and trash off and you'll find it a lot easier to flux...

[elixin77]

I haven't been able to cast recently - been busy with school.

As for the zinc comment, I look for any WW that have 'Zn' stamped on them - this means that the WW is made from zinc, and I don't put those in my smelting pot.

So far, I've only come across one Zn WW, so all's well right now. I keep an eye out just in case, and when I melt my next batch of WW, i'll make sure I keep the temp a bit lower than what it was so I avoid the gold/blue/purple hueing effect.

I use a SS spoon with slots in it to scoop everything out, and thats been working for me. I flux with paraffin wax, as others have said it works well. I might be able to smelt a bit tomorrow, but I don't know right now.

Thanks a bunch for the help so far though!

[*Paladin*]

I haven't been able to cast recently - been busy with school.

As for the zinc comment, I look for any WW that have 'Zn' stamped on them - this means that the WW is made from zinc, and I don't put those in my smelting pot.

So far, I've only come across one Zn WW, so all's well right now. I keep an eye out just in case, and when I melt my next batch of WW, i'll make sure I keep the temp a bit lower than what it was so I avoid the gold/blue/purple hueing effect.

I use a SS spoon with slots in it to scoop everything out, and thats been working for me. I flux with paraffin wax, as others have said it works well. I might be able to smelt a bit tomorrow, but I don't know right now.

Thanks a bunch for the help so far though!

Just keep an eye on your melt, because I came across several zinc WW's the other day that didn't have Zn on them. They were grey painted and looked like any other painted lead WW. They felt different when I was sorting and when I put the cutters to them: rock hard and "tinked" when I smacked them on my vise. Not to worry tho, because as long as you watch your WW's when they go molten, you'll see the zinc floating on top...

[jsizemore]

elixin77 where in the eastern nc are you?

I've been sorting since I started casting and there are some new styles/manufacturers out there. I had one pot this past week with 4 zinc ww with no Zn and not a cast I recognize. None were the same.

[leadbutt]

Well maybe its just my fear since ive melted zinc into lead before. Aint like its that hard to mess up a batch of lead your 1st time melting wws. There isnt really alot to skim off when your unknown temp is actually 800 degrees. Well except the steel. Im just sayin it takes out the guess work for a 1st timer. Thermometers arent the enemy. Whichever way you feel comfortable oneone is the way you should do it.

L. Bottoms

[mold maker]

I found lots of zinc stick on weights when I sorted them last time.
The clip on are mostly lead and iron (Fe). Only 2 zinc in 7 gal.
I sure wish there was a market for valve stems, cores, and caps.

[imashooter2]

There isnt really alot to skim off when your unknown temp is actually 800 degrees.

The point is the pot doesn't go from 500 to 800 degrees in a minute or even 5 minutes. If you're going to be standing over it to read the thermometer, you'll be there to note when 90% of the melt is liquid. Then turn down the heat, give it a stir, skim off the steel and zinc, flux, skim the dross and pour.

[elixin77]

elixin77 where in the eastern nc are you?

I've been sorting since I started casting and there are some new styles/manufacturers out there. I had one pot this past week with 4 zinc ww with no Zn and not a cast I recognize. None were the same.

Pitt county.

I've only seen one that was stamped 'Zn', but I have scooped out whole WWs from my first cast. I took those out when everything else was melting down, so figured they weren't lead. I didn't get a chance to inspect them, for somewhat obvious reasons, but I do keep an eye on my pot when I'm melting stuff down, so I don't ruin my batch. And I only put a handful of WW in at a time - since I'm new to casting, it helps me figure out what to do, without too much of a loss if I do mess up

[jsizemore]

Nothing wrong with using a thermometer. I started with one. I use it less and less. I still keep it handy since I don't know everything.