Reloading The 43 Beaumont Need Help

[Gee_Wizz01]

I am the proud owner of Dutch Beaumont Vitalli 71/88 in excellent condition. I have acquired a set of CH dies in 43 Beaumont. I also made 20 cases from Starline 50-90 Sharps. I several questions that I haven't found much info on the Beaumont. The first question; Has anyone made 43 Beaumont cases from the Mag Tech 32 Ga brass, and if so how did it work out? The 2nd question: Does anyone have any good loads for this round? I reloaded some of my reformed 50-90's with 28 gr of IMR 4198 and the RD 460-350 boolit sized .459" (My bore slugged .458 slightly above the chamber). These round grouped about 1.25" at 25 yds. I also have the Lee 457-340 RF, just didn't have any cast up. I am also looking for some other good loads including 777, Black, or Pyrodex (Yeah I know- but I got several cans for $2.50 each at Wally World end of season clearance). I am just looking for pointers, ideas and advice. I have been reloading for over 40 years, but never played around with these old timers.

G

[elk hunter]

I have no experience with this cartridge, but "Cartridges of The World" 5th edition lists two slightly different Beaumont rounds. One, the 11x52R Netherlands Beaumont M71/78 lists the following:

345 grain bullet, 60 grains of Fg, 1476 FPS, military load

400 grain bullet, 55 grains Fg, 1360 FPS

400 grain bullet, 31 grains 4198, 1430 FPS


The second round, the 11.3x50R Beaumont M71 lists the following loads:

336 grain bullet, 58 grains Fg, 1378 FPS, military load

360 grain bullet, 55 grains Fg, 1300 FPS

360 grain bullet, 35 grains of 4198, 1420 FPS

Hope this is helpful.

[Gee_Wizz01]

Thanks Elk Hunter, I have the 71/88 and I appreciate the help. I am also trying to find out if anyone has tried forming the cases out of Magtech 32 Gauge brass shotgun shells.

Gary

[Hogpost]

I only use black powder in these old girls. The BlackDawge 350 grain/458 dia bullet comes with SPG blackpowder lube, and works fine for me.

[BudRow]

Becareful with the Magtech brass - I don't think it is good for much more than "Shotgun" pressures.

[waltp]

GeeWiz01

I have one of these I bought about 10 years ago. I have stamped marked brass produced by N.D.F.S. ,11X52 R. I forgot who I ordered it from. It lasts a long time.

Mine is in the white ( as issued) all matching with the bayonet. It shoots 2 1/2 " groups at 100 yards with the Lyman 185 grain, 45 cal mould #457124, with 26 grains of 4198, Chronyed at 1250. It has a very slow twist of 1 in 29. Slugged at 455.

This combo worked best for me and I tried lots. Good luck!!

Walt

[Buckshot]

.................According to Keith Doyan's website: http://www.militaryrifles.com/ the cartridge is the 11.3 x 51R. While I cannot comment on that cartridge I can on the utility of the Mag-Tech brass shotshells. I use the 24ga in 2 British .577 Sniders, and the 32ga in a M74 Brazilian Comblain carbine, below:

http://www.fototime.com/8EB6F06398ADE0D/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/FE594EF8E3CC151/standard.jpg

LEFT: The carbine. RIGHT: Chamber cast. As you can see, there is no neck in this chamber cast. It is a straight taper from the rim, to a definate point. From this point it angles sharply down to the throat (if you can call it that!). The case ID at the end of the taper is .493" and the groove of the barrel is .465" here at the chamber. The land diameter is .433" from breech to muzzle. At the muzzle the groove is .454" so the groove depth is progressive.

In order to hold a boolit, there HAS to be a neck. The cartridge designation is the 11 x 42R a picture of which may be seen here: http://www.militaryrifles.com/Comblains/ComblainCart.htm as cartridge #CO 4 and it does have a neck. Not much of one, but it's there.

http://www.fototime.com/34EA4235E0A4A6D/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/FB833F810B2C0FE/standard.jpg

The LEFT above were my early renditions that were mangled into a shape that would fit into the chamber. I used all manner of dies and IIRC even some front end suspension tools! The 2 labeled 'A' are "As mangled", and those 2 marked 'B' are as they ended up after firing. RIGHT: These were the early Berdan primed cases, and I'd converted them to use 209 shotshell primers. The casehead above the rim is just a tad too small, so the paper takes up the windage. There was never a problem with them splitting but the paper held them centered so they'd upset evenly all the way around. Once fired and expanded the paper was removed as they were only necksized afterwards. The boolit is the 292gr Lyman in both photos.

http://www.fototime.com/FEB48295FDD2804/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/7C6776752B29618/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/FFFE588D94713CE/standard.jpg

LEFT: I finally broke down and made myself a size die, seater die and a shellholder. The dies were made out of the front strut rods from a '87 Chevy Celebrity. No, the sizer isn't a perfect match for the chamber but it creates a case that will chamber. CENTER: Pretty self explanitory RIGHT: On the left is a fired case and on the right a sized one. I have 10 cases that have been fired 5 times, and not one has died yet. I think it's rather remarkable due to the work the brass is put through. I haven't fired it in quite some time, but the testing with the 10 cases was to give me an idea of how long they'd last without any annealing. I have a considerable amount of the Berdan primed brass as Graf & Son began selling them cheap when the boxer primed brass became available. I bought 100 boxer cases a few years back but haven't messed with them yet.

..................Buckshot

[Gee_Wizz01]

GeeWiz01

I have one of these I bought about 10 years ago. I have stamped marked brass produced by N.D.F.S. ,11X52 R. I forgot who I ordered it from. It lasts a long time.

Mine is in the white ( as issued) all matching with the bayonet. It shoots 2 1/2 " groups at 100 yards with the Lyman 185 grain, 45 cal mould #457124, with 26 grains of 4198, Chronyed at 1250. It has a very slow twist of 1 in 29. Slugged at 455.

This combo worked best for me and I tried lots. Good luck!!

Walt

Walt,
Thanks for the info. The N.D.F.S. brass is basically non existent these days. I made some up out of 50-90 brass and 32 Ga Magtech. My latest tests, back in early March, I used a group buy 454190 JWCusey boolit from a mould that throws .457-.458. The boolits drop at 268 gr from isotope lead. I used a load with Trail Boss and it shoots about 2" groups at 50yds, but about 10" at 100 yds. I haven't chrono'ed the loads yet, but my calculations indicate it should be about 1100 fs. I have some of the lee 340 gr pb boolits, but due to health issues, I haven't been able to shoot for the last 7 weeks.

[Gee_Wizz01]

I only use black powder in these old girls. The BlackDawge 350 grain/458 dia bullet comes with SPG blackpowder lube, and works fine for me.

Hogpost;

How much BP are you using? COTW says 65 gr, but that leaves a LOT of airspace even in my cases made from Starline 50-90. I was considering using 50grs of BP with Cream of Wheat filler. I have had several surgeries and have been out of action since late March and lost track of this thread.

G

[Gee_Wizz01]

Buckshot
I thoroughly enjoyed your post! Your Comblain is very interesting, I may have to look for one of them. Since my original post I have done some backyard engineering and also tried several die sets to make brass. After ruining some really expensive brass, I succumbed and bought a set of C-H dies for the Beaumont. I have formed cases from the Starline 50-90 Sharps cases which are a little small at the base, and the 32 Ga Magtech shells, which are much closer at the base diameter. The small rims on the 32 Ga cases don't extract as positively as the starline cases. The Magtech 32 Ga don't appear to be as strong as the Starline cases, but I don't think I am running over 14,000 PSI with my loads and the brass appears to be safe with these loads. Hopefully my medical conditions will improve to the point I can get out and shoot the Beaumont soon. Thanks again for the info.

[d43p]

I just finished forming another box of 32ga Mag Tech brass for the 11mm. Have had great success with useing them. I trim the caes first, then anneal them. Then I run them into a 8mm Lebel die to taper them, then into my 41 Swiss die to get the shoulder and neck formed. I then fire form them, finished product comes out great. They are right on with extraction, rim is a tad to small.

[Gee_Wizz01]

d43p I use the same procedure you are using for case forming, except I just use the CH Beaumont dies. I trim again after forming to get the final length. Those 32ga Magtechs form perfectly every time for me. The 43 Beaumont rounds extract fine, but if there isn't another round in the magazine, they don't eject. They eject as long as another round is coming up from the magazine, otherwise the round drops out of the extractors grasp. The rounds made from Starline 50-90 Brass have a larger rim and eject well even with an empty mag.

Gary

[d43p]

Gee Wizz01, I'll have to give the 50-90 brass when the Mag Tech stuff goes south. I just fire single shot, haven't tried any in the magazine so don't know if the extraction would be any better. Rifle shoots fine though, I'm still playing with loads and bullet dia.

Don

[sdalcher]

Good stuff! I recently bought one and I saw another post looking for info! BTT

[skeettx]

MagTech brass is no problem.

Sized start of case with seater die of 450 Alaskan,
this to allow mouth of hull to enter the 45-75 die.

Trimmed first case to length

Then took a Lyman 45-75 sizing die with decapping rod out
and took the neck/shoulder down to allow case to chamber.

Then, after dies were set, trimmed last on the other cases.

RCBS #31 shellholder.

Used RCBS A-2 press and Imperial Sizing Wax.

Mike

[Abert Rim]

Old thread, but I just came into a sportered Beaumont Vitalli. So maybe what I need is a set of Lyman .45-75 dies, and something to reduce the initial case mouth diameter. Trying to go cheap here ...

[skeettx]

Worked for me :)
Mike

[Gee_Wizz01]

You might want to check on the cost of the 43 Beaumont dies at Buffalo arms. I played with other dies and combinations to begin with, and messed up some expensive 50-90 brass during the learning curve. When I bought the Beamont dies, life was much easier. I now ux

[Abert Rim]

The Beaumont dies run $195 at Buffalo Arms these days. I think if I stick with 32 gauge brass, annealed, and the .45-75 dies, I might just get by.

[Gee_Wizz01]

The Beaumont dies run $195 at Buffalo Arms these days. I think if I stick with 32 gauge brass, annealed, and the .45-75 dies, I might just get by.
At that price I agree with you! They have really gone up in price since I got mine. I also agree with you on the magtech 32 gauge brass. I am going to try FFG BP in the near future. I have best results with 4198 so far, but I really want to try black powder in the old gal. Best of luck.
G

[TreeKiller]

Try CH4D they were about $185 last spring. Tried using 8mm Label and 45-70 dies. Wasted the money trying to go cheep and then bought the CH4D dies. You can use 50-90 brass also.
Dan

[Abert Rim]

Gee, have you had a chance to the try the Lee 340 in your Beaumont yet? That's the mold I plan to use. I have a Hornady case trimmer and the hole in the bottom of my RCBS #31 shellholder is a few thousandths too small for it, dang it.

[smkummer]

I used the 32 gauge brass to form 43 Egyptian for a rolling block. I used several different dies to form a neck along with annealing the neck. I only lost one case. I did get the 50-70 shell holder. 50-90 sharps brass would be better to use but this brass with work. I am using Lyman's 45-70 bullet of 385 grains sized down to .451 and about 13 grains unique. I can hit a 16" metal plate at 200 yards about 95% of the time and even a 10" plate if I do my part. Still have the not to easy to use factory sights.

[Gee_Wizz01]

Abert, I have been using the 340gr Lee with very good results. I have used several different lubes and a number of powders. The best results were obtained using IMR 4198, LEE Liguid alox, and using the bullets as cast. I was getting 4~5 inch groups at 100 yds. I never was able to get decent groups with faster powders like unique. Iam hoping to try black powder and paper patched bullets in the near future. My biggest problem is working with the poor sights and bad eyesight. Good luck and let me know how it works out.
G