03a3 question

[randyrat]

I have a NatL Ord sporterized rifle good 2 groove barrel. I had the receiver tested and it is SOFT,,,head space is perfect so far. It was test by a very good gunsmith. Can this be heat treated to harden it? Or is a good parts gun. If that's the case I'm thinking about destroying the receiver so no body gets hurt someday. No stripper clip slot, no idea when it was made. It would be fine to shoot light cast with it, but who is to say someone may get this gun down the road and BOOM the receiver stretches and gives out.
Any Ideas?

[FAsmus]

Randy;

Your title is "03-A3" ~ Is this is really an 03-A3? With the peep rear sight and all? Saying that the receiver is "soft" (relative to what?) doesn't help much.

The 03-A3s are made of nickle steel and thus are not really supposed to be "hard" as they are plenty strong enough through the nickle alloy they're made of. A knowledgeable smith should know this and not equate softness to "weakness".

The virtual only drawback of 03-A3s is the "stickiness" of their action's function as compared to the old double heat treated M1903s. This is simply another way of describing the "softness" of the material compared to the carbonized steel used in the older M1903 rifles.

Plenty strong ~ shoot it forever.

The two-groove barrels are usually quite nice for cast bullet shooting too and many are right on specification for bore & groove sizes. Mine is right at 0.300/0.308 and shoots wonderfully well with RCBS 30-180-SP.

Good evening,
Forrest

[wiljen]

there were no soft O3-A3s that I have ever heard of so as long as it is truly an O3-a3 you are fine unless someone let it live through a house fire or something and took all the heat treat out of it. I'd have somebody else look at it.

[NVcurmudgeon]

If your rifle is marked, "National Ordnance" it is not an 03A3. All 03A3 rifles were made by Remington and Smith-Corona. All 1903 rifles were made by Springfield Armory, Rock Island Armory, and some by Remington. Any receiver marked with any other name is bogus and questionable for safety. The National Ordnance is the perfect parts gun IMO. The receiver is likely to be junk, but the other parts are honest military surplus. There was also a Federal Ordnance brand that falls into the same category. I wouldn't shoot either on a bet.

[35 Whelen]

If your rifle is marked, "National Ordnance" it is not an 03A3. All 03A3 rifles were made by Remington and Smith-Corona. All 1903 rifles were made by Springfield Armory, Rock Island Armory, and some by Remington. Any receiver marked with any other name is bogus and questionable for safety. The National Ordnance is the perfect parts gun IMO. The receiver is likely to be junk, but the other parts are honest military surplus. There was also a Federal Ordnance brand that falls into the same category. I wouldn't shoot either on a bet.

Whoa...back up a little.
First, National Ordinance DID make 03A3's. Here's one that sold on Gunbroker recently: National Ordinance 03A3 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=199696783) They cast their own receivers and assembled the rifles from surplus parts back in the '60's.
Second, I wouldn't condemn them as junk. We have a member here on the boards (RU Shooter) who shoots a Nat'l Ord 03A3 in his local High Power competitions and evidently does quite well. He's a great guy. PM him if you want to know about your rifle.
35W

[Bob S]

National Ordnance, Santa Fe, Federal Ordnance ... and I might be missng yet another trade name ... made reproductions of US M1903A3 receivers. Quality varies, but they are definitely not in the same class as a Remington or Smith Corona. My friend Dave Yankus used one to make the Massachusetts State HP team in 1973, and he didn't seem to have any problems with it. But I own a receiver from a Nat'l Ord rifle that had a catastrophic failure a couple of years ago. I own the receiver because I purchased it for examination. It was soft as mush, and had been "sporterized". The bolt set back into the receiver locking surfaces .009". A case head failed, ruptured the stock and injured the shooter. Since I didn't get the barrel, only the stripped receiver, I can't judge whether the fit-up of the barrel contributed to the failure ... but I suspect it did. Based on what I have seen, I don't think I would want one. YMMV.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[randyrat]

So far I'm not ready to part it out just yet. One thing I know for sure is it is soft. The gunsmith (very good one) said it would shoot lower pressure rounds all day long, but didn't recommend full house 30-06s. It is close to 50 years old now, I've shot a bunch of cast threw it and the head spacing is still good/perfect. I'm going to call it my lead thrower and put a permanent scribe on it somewhere saying "don't shoot full factory loads" somewhere on the receiver. Maybe 50 years from now someone will say; Who was the idiot that wrote that on a perfectly good gun.

Any more info Please fill me in. Thanks so far.

[RU shooter]

As 35W said I too have a Natl. Ord. I got about 3 yrs ago for the pricely sum of 75 bucks off some guy on AR15.com who was told it was "dangerous" to shoot them,Mine was near if not new unfired cond. when I got it. since then I have put nearly 3-4K of cast loads through it and a whole 35 rds of Greek ball for the jacketed rds. While I dont think its a bomb waiting to go off I have no want to shoot thousands of full house 30-06 though it either. I accept it for what it is .And thats my cast bullet shooting rifle. Last thing I would do would be part it out . And if you want to you can easily mod them to reload via stripper clip. Heres some pics of the clip guide mod. just need to move/form a little metal around the clip ,May not be pretty but functional and I have no problems reloading in a rapid fire string.
28903

28904


Tim

[Ben]

Ditto X 10 BobS

[randyrat]

Thanks Bob, I may play with the stripper clip idea. There it is now my OFFICIAL cast boolit gun.

I would like to have the original stock and hard ware, so I can shoot it in some of the military shoots around here.

[35 Whelen]

Hey Tim, how do those 311467's (looks like that's what they are) shoot? I've not had any luck with them in anything.
35W

[RU shooter]

Hey Tim, how do those 311467's (looks like that's what they are) shoot? I've not had any luck with them in anything.
35W Yep Thats them, they shoot very well in that 2 groove of mine size to .311 and my go to 17.5 grs of 2400 ,My swiss did OK with them but not the best .

Tim

[MtGun44]

I have a Nat Ord that has a black polymer upper handguard. Good shooter, but definitely
much less nice cosmetically. Of course, I paid about $125 for it a few years back, too.

Bill