New miracle bore break-in method

[onondaga]

I have a method that works for me with rifles and avoids the chore at the range of cleaning every shot and then every few shots. I used to to that for the first 100 rounds. NO MORE! Here is what I do at home before even firing a new rifle since Hoppe's put the Bore Snake on the market:

I drop the Bore Snake cord down the bore till the rope part is at the chamber, then I fill the chamber with Chrome polish. I just used Turtle Wax chrome polish and rust remover, but have used buffing compound paste wax also or SemiChrome or Flitz. Next I pull the bore snake through slowly drawing the polish with it. Then I continue to make 10 pull throughs without adding more polish till the 11th pull through. Start again and drop the cord in till the rope and fill the chamber again with polish and take 10 more pull throughs. I continue till I have done this procedure 6 times with 60 pull throughs.

Finish up buy not adding anymore polish and do 30 pull throughs. This polishes the bore and breaks it in better than shooting and cleaning for me. When I go to the range after this, I just shoot like any one of my old guns and the point of impact doesn't change about as with the clean and shoot method of break-in.

This really works and if your bore was a little rough like so many new guns, you will have improved your bore finish for better consistency of accuracy. This method can be used on old barrels too and will help accuracy if your bore was rough. New NEFs and Remingtons really need this to start out well. Savages are pretty good but this will break them in well.

Gary

Fine rifles are never really owned.

[Molly]

Look up "Fire polishing" in this forum. Does about the same thing in as little as 6 or 8 shots.

[onondaga]

I am familiar with fire polishing and it certainly is faster if you only consider the trigger time. Fire polishing does require gunfire and usually low velocity hand loads also and a thorough clean-up when done . I honestly like the hands on method I present better and feel it is very effective although a little time consuming but it delivers a much finer shine than fire polishing.

Gary

[stubshaft]

I wonder how well this would work in J-word guns that have seen Moly boolits?

[Molly]

I am familiar with fire polishing and it certainly is faster if you only consider the trigger time. Fire polishing does require gunfire and usually low velocity hand loads also and a thorough clean-up when done . I honestly like the hands on method I present better and feel it is very effective although a little time consuming but it delivers a much finer shine than fire polishing. Gary

Hi Gary,

You're quite correct that fire polishing requires spending a few minutes putting up some low velocity jacketed handloads. It will also cost you a bore mop (?$1.25 or so?) and it does have the disadvantage of requiring a cleanup afterwards. All that you say is correct. And if you're happy and content with the method you describe, more power to you.

But I think fire polishing has a serious advantage over using bore snakes, patches and other flexible 'carriers' for the polish: The jacketed bullet will not expand and compress with variations in the bore like flexible carriers will. As a result, firepolishing tends to polish out the tight spots in the bore, while flexible carriers tend to polish everything.

In and of itself, this might seem like it leaves the bore rough in loose spots, but it doesn't: Swabing the bore with a bore mop coated with polish means that the entire bore surface gets its share. Passage of the bullet seems to builld up a dam of abrasive as it goes, polishing everything. It's just that the tight spots seem to get a little extra polish from the closer fit of the bullet.

Now some of the above is personal speculation, based on the experiences of slugging a bore before and after. Also on visual comparisons, before and after: I've had a very rough bore come out gleaming like it had been coated with mercury, and the passage of a slug was much easier. Not only that, but hot 'normal' loads gave distinctly lower pressure signs (less primer flattening, less case bulge) after fire polishing than they had before.

Like I said, if you're happy, more power to you. But I think fire polishing has some serious advantages that I for one don't want to give up.

[felix]

With well moly-ied barrels, I would simply shoot "high antimony - low tin" boolits to my heart's content at max velocity commensurate with ZERO leading. Sooner or later the moly will go deeper into the pores (ideal) and the excess scraped away. Yes, antimony is an abrasive! ... felix

[mroliver77]

With well moly-ied barrels, I would simply shoot "high antimony - low tin" boolits to my heart's content at max velocity commensurate with ZERO leading. Sooner or later the moly will go deeper into the pores (ideal) and the excess scraped away. Yes, antimony is an abrasive! ... felix
I am pretty sure this is what I experienced with a recent aquisition,a Peruvian Mauser 1935 model. After a quick wipedown I started shooting some high antimoney 311284 boolits. At first it did not shoot well, 3" - 4" at 90 yards. I kept at it and groups tightened up by halfafter 30 rounds or so. After 50 rounds it was shooting a steady 1-1/2" groups at 90yards. This thing has the smallest opening in the rear sight as I have seen on a Mauser but if I waited each shot for eye to adjust I shot it well. I assumedthat the copper fouling had shot out of it. It did have something filmlike in the bore when I got it (Hoppes?) so mebbe fouling was loosened.This is probably the best shooting Mauser I have owned and in 30-06!
On topic, I hate to put abrasives in a barrel followed by a soft tight object. I believe it wears the edges (corners)off the rifling. I have firelapped and fire polished guns with problem barrels and improved performance.
Just my opinion and it is worth no more than Garys'.
Jay
Jay

[Von Gruff]

When I built my 404 Jeffery I was getting a bit of copper fouling for a start when I was doing J word load work up so I loaded a about 30 cast boolits with Autosol (a chrome polish) in the lube groove and before chambering I put some orround in front of the front band as well. Seemed to lessen the Cu fouling when I gave it a good cloan and went back to the J words. It is used almost exclusively with CB now with a 350gn GC at 2365fps and or a plinker 350gn GC at 1900fps.

Von Gruff.

[c3d4b2]

I use the method recommended by Gale McMillan

http://yarchive.net/gun/barrel/break_in.html

[Von Gruff]

Duplicate post deleted. I hit the submit button then got distracted and hit it again a bit later.

Von Gruff.

[Molly]

I use the method recommended by Gale McMillan
http://yarchive.net/gun/barrel/break_in.html

I can't argue with the guy who has a record like that, but I can tell you for a fact that if you do NOT have the high quality barrels like McMillan turns out, firepolishing for a few rounds seems to help a great deal. The bore will be brighter, it will foul less, it will be easier to clean, and it will develop lower pressures than it did before. Furthermore, it is the ONLY way I know of recovering the usefulness of a barrel that has been neglected and rusted slightly.

[B R Shooter]

Why not lap the bore by hand? That way, you can feel where the tight spots are and concentrate the efforts there.

A good cleaning rod, an old bronze bore brush and some lead is all that's needed. I strip off the bristles from the brush and flux it. Wrap the shaft of the rod with cotton patches to act as a stop that fits snug in the bore. Bring the brush/rod up to the muzzle and pour lead into the bore (pre-oiled bore). It will contract and move freely. You can "charge" the lead lap with whatever you want and have at it.

This also gives you the option of staying away from the leade if it isn't tight so the leade isn't moved forward. The leade usually isn't the tight spot on a barrel that has been fired. I would also suggest using a good rod guide to keep the rod in line with the bore.

[JIMinPHX]

I've used a bit of Simichrome on a cleaning rod a few times where a particular barrel seemed to need it. I never thought to try a bore snake. I think that would be an improvement in some cases. Thanks for the idea.

[B R Shooter]

A bore snake does nothing to address tight spots, it flexes. You need a solid gauge.

[looseprojectile]

I am in the camp of hand lapping. Anyone with the equipment to cast boolits has the means to pour a lap. Most of the finest quality new barrel makers hand lap their barrels.
I have restored quite a few old abused and neglected barrels to near new condition with the simple application of a poured lap. Hand lapping is my first choice when the bore is Visibly rough, pitted or rusty. A smooth bore seems to shoot better and is way easier to clean after shooting.
Hand lapping is not the ONLY way to smooth a gun bore and firelapping will get you part way there. It is best left to the gun owner as to what the gun needs according to what he wants.
Sometimes I find that all that is needed is a little J&B bore paste on a tight patch.
If a bore snake will do the job it doesn't need to be lapped.
The OP uses a method that will probably not uniform the bore dimensions. Won't hurt much either. I have never owned a bore snake. A tight patch with some kind of grit/polish will most likely do the same thing.
Use what works for you.

Life is good

[Dave Bulla]

Tell me a bit more about this method of pouring a slug of lead on the end of the cleaning rod please. Sounds interesting.

Pictures would be even better!

[Molly]

Tell me a bit more about this method of pouring a slug of lead on the end of the cleaning rod please. Sounds interesting. Pictures would be even better!

No pictures, but the process isn't hard to understand. Clean and dry your bore, and insert a steel cleaning rod from the breech. Be sure to use a guide so the cleaning rod is centered in the bore. Now push a small bit of oily rag or cotton ball past the end of the cleaning rod, and down the bore about six inches below the muzzle. This will wet the bore with oil and keep the lead from soldering to the bore when you pour. It will also act as a stop to keep the lead from pouring out the other end of the barrel.

Now set some lead on to melt (it won't take much) while you warm up the muzzle of your rifle with a propane torch. The warm barrel will make a better casting of your bore, but frankly, I used to just pour cold and let the wrinkles hold abrasive. Seemed to work ok. At any rate, once your lead has melted, use a dipper or something similar to control the flow as you pour it into the bore past the cleaning rod. (BTW, it's best if your cleaning rod has a METAL sloted tip to retain the lead lap.) Let it cool, and push / tap the cleaning rod to expose an inch or two of the lap you just poured. DO NOT push it completely out of the bore, or you will have to start all over again.

Coat the lap all around with a very fine, very soft to semi-liquid abrasive like JB compound, or something in the 1000+ grit range. You need very little, so go easy. If you put too much on, or use too coarse a grit, you won't be able to pull the lap back inside the bore. If so, you'll have to push it out, melt it off and try again. Some guys like to cut small shallow grooves around the lap with a knife or hacksaw to hold the abrasive. It does seem to make it easier to pull the lap back into the bore.

Pull the cleaning rod and lap back and all the way to the other end of the barrel. Push and pull it in long, smooth strokes, not short back and forth strokes like you are scrubbing the sink. You should be able to feel a spot or two where the pull is harder than at other spots. These will be the tight or rough spots in your bore. Make a note of where they are, and give those spots a quick back and forth before continuing the rest of the full length stroke. Keep this up until you feel a smooth drag the entire length of the bore. Then stop, remove the lap, clean the bore, and oil it. You're done.

Notes:
1. Some guys prefer to pour their lead into the breech to form the lap. Great in theory, as it tends to keep the throat bigger than the bore. A bore bigger than the throat can cause poor accuracy, leading and other problems. I always managed to get the lap hung up by pouring a bit too much lead, and filling the neck area, making it impossible to pull through the bore, so I worked from the muzzle. I'd cut the base off of a cartridge whose neck would go into the bore and use it as a rod guide to keep from making an oval muzzle. A 6 or 7mm case works fine for a .30 or .32 bore. This is a try and cut operation, but very simple: If the neck goes into the bore, cut the base off and slip the rest of the case over your cleaning rod.

2. Lapping is an abrasive process, and will abrade the soft lead lap a lot faster than the hard steel bore. If you feel this happening, you can either pour a new lap and start over, or you can stand the rifle muzzle down on a bit of hardwood and rap the lap against it a few times. This will upset the lap to a slightly larger diameter, and you can continue the work.

3. Understand before you begin that this is VERY labor intensive. If you're not accustomed to physical labor, you could develop some fine charlie horses in your biceps. Also understand that you are in essence, wearing your bore out with abrasives. If you over do it, you could be buying a new barrel. You won't try it on too many barrels before you try fire polishing.

[jmh54738]

I agree with Molly. Marlin barrels in particular, are so rough that I first make a BORE sized split expandable brass lap to remove all the burrs from the tops of the rifling and lap the bore to a uniform size. For the lead lap, I drill a clearance hole through 2 or three round balls. These I place upon an 8-32 socket head cap screw, with about 1/4" of thread extending beyond the balls. After tapping the ball/screw assembly into the bore from the muzzle, from the breech, a cleaning rod is screwed onto the assembly in the bore. During the lapping, a small turn of the screw will expand the lap. A very smooth bore will result even though 90% of the tool marks remain. John

[Molly]

I agree with Molly. Marlin barrels in particular, are so rough that I first make a BORE sized split expandable brass lap to remove all the burrs from the tops of the rifling and lap the bore to a uniform size. For the lead lap, I drill a clearance hole through 2 or three round balls. These I place upon an 8-32 socket head cap screw, with about 1/4" of thread extending beyond the balls. After tapping the ball/screw assembly into the bore from the muzzle, from the breech, a cleaning rod is screwed onto the assembly in the bore. During the lapping, a small turn of the screw will expand the lap. A very smooth bore will result even though 90% of the tool marks remain. John

Hey! I like the balls on a socket head screw approach. Wish I'd thought of that back when.

Just a thought: You can save yourself a WHALE of a lot of time, work & trouble if you just tap a piece of buckshot into the muzzle and push it through an oiled bore with a cleaning rod. If it goes down the bore smoothly, buy that rifle. If it goes down like the bore was full of sand and grit, pass on it, and check out the next rifle. Might have to do some sweet talking to the gunshop owner, but if he won't allow you to slug the bores, go the the next shop down the road. If it's a new gun, ask for a 3 day return privilige if he won't let ou slug the bore there in the store. The shop owner will holler, but most of them would rather make the sale than not! True of buying used guns too. Or go to a gunsmith's shop. HE'LL let you slug the bores.

[jmh54738]

Molly, that is a very nice wishful thought to slug the bore before you buy the gun. Have you been able to do it? Personally, not knowing the mechanical skills or limitations of someone coming in off of the street with such a request, I would flat out deny it. Heck, if every bore was perfect and every shot flew to the center of the bullseye, there would be no fun at all. Have you successfully obtained a three day return privilige on a new gun? Again, a nice thought, but I would never allow it. If it came back in fired, it is a used gun. If it would be a quality issue, then the resolution would be with the manufacturer, unless the seller was an authorized repair station. Some of the Wisconsin deer seasons are for three days. Sort of like buying an expensive dress for the dance and returning it the day after. We consumers always get the short end of the stick. Returns, with time, distance and postage are a pita.

[Molly]

>Molly, that is a very nice wishful thought to slug the bore before you buy the gun. Have you been able to do it? Personally, not knowing the mechanical skills or limitations of someone coming in off of the street with such a request, I would flat out deny it.

Actually, I have. But I'll admit that the store owner knew me and my skills pretty well, and I was a good customer. The average guy might do better by asking to run a tight patch down the bore. Not as good, but you can still feel tight and loose spots.

>Have you successfully obtained a three day return privilige on a new gun?

Again, I have returned a new gun (unfired) that was defective. I once bought a M94 winchester in 30-30 whose action locked up solid when the lever was thrown the first time. The lever could not be fully closed or opened. It went straight back, and I took home another new gun.

>If it came back in fired, it is a used gun.

Actually, once sold at retail, it is (in most states) legally a used gun, whether it's been fired or not. But if not so in your area, simply make your offer contingent on the gun being unfired when returned. It's not hard to tell.

>If it would be a quality issue, then the resolution would be with the manufacturer, unless the seller was an authorized repair station. Some of the Wisconsin deer seasons are for three days. Sort of like buying an expensive dress for the dance and returning it the day after.

You've got a point there. But a three day warranty has expired at the end of a 3 day season, and the gun couldn't be returned anyhow. Or make it a two day return privilege, or a one day. Or 12 hours. But give the customer a chance to satisfy himself that what he bought was represented.

I'm not trying to be a legal eagle here. Defective guns DO slip through the factories, and not by any fault of the final customer either. I once saw a new Ithica shotgun whose bore looked like it was rifled, because it hadn't been reamed and polished after being hammer forged. I've had a 7x57 Mauser brought into my shop whose clean, shiney bore would have taken a .308 bullet without any strain. (Deepest rifling you ever saw!) I've seen an American 32-20 whose bore slugged 0.321" instead of 0,312. I've seen a Taurus revolver returned from their authorized repair station whose cylinder was visibly out of allignment with the barrel.

Not only that, but I've seen some of the worst rusted wrecks with rusty, pitted bores made to look almost new by some of the old fashioned 'horse traders'. They'd steam the dents out of the stock and rub them down with some oil, scrape and steel wool the outside metal and cold blue it. Then they'd steel wool the bore to remove the loose rust so they could bust a thermometer and coat the bore with mercury so that it would gleam like a new penny. The mercury would fill in the pitting, and it would look like a new gun. Sometimes, they'd swab the bore with black shoe polish wax, let it dry, then polish the bore with a few patches. Many a young shooter has been taken in by such tricks at flea markets and yard sales - not to mention a few gun stores!

Nowadays, there's a legal concept that says that any article has to be as represented and suitable for the purpose for which it is sold. You can't sell a beatup sedan to some yokel who wants to compete in the Indy 500 with it, without incurring some serious liabilities. You can't sell butter that is 20% axle grease. The days of Caveat Emptor are long dead in the American legal system. The days of lemon laws and 'theft by deception' are here, and seem likely to stay. ANY customer has the right to a square deal. And that includes a decent bore on a brand new rifle!

And if he does somehow get stuck, he has the right to a free and immediate refund or exchange from the dealer without a lot of 'restocking fee' nonsense. He shouldn't have to fight with the dealer or the manufacturer either: He doesn't have the leverage for it. He's only one person, and the big companies won't give a BLEEP. That job properly belongs to the dealer, who can say "Until this is fixed, you won't sell any more trash through my store! And I'll see to it that all the dealers in this end of the state learn about it too!" It's absolutely amazing how a statement like that will clean the wax out of the ears of a salesman, who will then understand perfectly.

[John Boy]

Badger makes some of the finest barrels made. Why not just use the break in procedure that they recommend ... http://www.badgerdefense.com/closed/procedure.pdf Besides, it's more fun to be shooting your rifle while breaking it in! :wink:

[stubshaft]

With well moly-ied barrels, I would simply shoot "high antimony - low tin" boolits to my heart's content at max velocity commensurate with ZERO leading. Sooner or later the moly will go deeper into the pores (ideal) and the excess scraped away. Yes, antimony is an abrasive! ... felix

I don't mean to hijack the thread but just wanted to thanks Felix for this tip. I would'a tried to scrub the moly out of the bore before shooting cast. I's the first time I EVER used cast boolits to remove condom fouling and the bore sparkles.

[jmh54738]

Molly, you are absolutely right, and I agree wholeheartedly, Amen
Regards, John

[zuke]

I found paper patched bullet's smoothed out my Pedersoli bore.

[Char-Gar]

There are no miracles is the gun game. Short cuts and half measures quite often backfire. Just saying.....

[onondaga]

My mileage varied on this miracle. The rifle is new and the slightly rough bore was improved very noticeably. I have since slugged the bore again to check the feel of driving a slug through the bore. It met noticeably less resistance and had a much smoother ride. It slugged at the same size. That is what I wanted. No tight spots were felt the first time I slugged the bore. I believe I succeeded in getting a better bore finish and likely this will make a difference in pressure lowering and velocity increase. The shoot one and clean routine will not be used at the range for a break-in of this new rifle because I believe it would be pointless after the polishing of the bore. That is the intent of the 'Miracle".

I used the word "Miracle" in the post title to attract attention and get readers to give a look. I like to get my posts read and have responses with discussion. Thank you.

The Hoppe's Bore Snake I used was new and not an easy pull through the bore. Those snakes have a short section of bronze bristle brush within their braid and this carried the polishing compound well into the rifling while twisting along with the rifling on each pass. This is a significant difference from running patches on a jag as the whole length of the snake also carries the polishing compound also and fits very snugly. I have to wrap the pull cord around a dowel section as a handle for drawing the snake through. If you haven't tried one of these snakes, they are terrific at the range between groups. I have since cleaned the compound off the snake with a rinse in de- greaser/detergent and it has cleaned and rinsed out like new.

Gary

Gary

[Chicken Thief]

Gentlemen it seems you're all comparing apples and oranges!

McMillan, Heart, Lilja and the rest of the super pros deliver unblued barrels.
Once a barrel is blued it is done without the bore plugged and thats the big difference between benchrest guns and working guns.

Rusted on the outside and rusted on the inside, and that inside rust is what needs to be smoothed out!

So some breaking in on "mortal" guns are defenetly in order to remove the bluing in the rifling.

[B R Shooter]

I won't comment on whether a CM barrel is blued on the inside or not, although I strongly think they would not be.

From a custom barrel standpoint, very little needs to be done. The bores are lapped when you get them. There is always a small amount of tooling marks left from chambering, and that needs to be done.

On a non-custom barrel, there are variances in bore/groove dimensions as well as tooling imperfections from rifling. Here, a proper lapping, and/or breakin can help. Breakin is nothing more than letting the bullet do the lapping. But you have to kep on top of the cleaning while breaking in to avoid a build-up of fouling.

Some initial time spent shooting a round and cleaning then repeating until it quits fouling will mean a barrel that will give great service down the road.

[David2011]

I won't comment on whether a CM barrel is blued on the inside or not, although I strongly think they would not be.


B R Shooter,

Yes, CM barrels are blued on the inside. If they're bright, they've been polished. They can't be plugged when heating them to the bluing temp of 292 degrees. Parkerizing is done at around 150 degrees and the bores are plugged. Parkerizing would make a bore very rough. Bluing leaves the finish as it was before bluing. The outside of the barrel, if polished beforehand, remains polished after bluing. The same thing occurs inside the barrel. Yes, bluing is a form of rust but it occurs at a molecular level and isn't going to materially change the texture of the bore.

(Wearing my flameproof clothes, waiting for the metallurgists to pitch in.)

David

[PatMarlin]

Besides, it's more fun to be shooting your rifle while breaking it in! :wink:

Ditto!

[shootzemm58]

Many Thanks Gregorious for links, I felt certain the member was from NY. I`ve just purchased a new Savage Axis in 6.5 creedmoor and will use this method to polish the barrel.

[country gent]

I save the end of a new barrel usually 3"-4"With this I can pour a lap. With this I can ream the shoulder and neck and throat into and use to set dies for optimum bump back. Every rifle should have this handy piece with it.

Paper is abrasive and will polish and when wrapped around a lead bullet does a very good job. Look at a barrel thats fired a lot and the corners will be have a radius on them. They will also shoot a mild taper into the barrel over time.

Lapping a barrel or polishing it it does remove metal and can create an over sized bore. with cast bullets you can cast bigger to an degree. With jacketed your stuck with whats available. I remember an article that described "Lapping " a barrel with jags and sand paper in I think an american rifleman. This like a jag and patch or bore snake dosnt get as even coverage in the corners or on exposed corners.

I have smoothed throats and crowns with lapping compounds and polishes. With lead or brass lapps, I usually finish with simichrome, flitz or red rouge.

[jonp]

I'm glad this thread was resurrected. Great tips in it.