Leatherwood Malcolm scopes

[Kitika]

G'day Its my first posting here and I have a question to ask :)


I've looked and read many articles about the leatherwood malcolm scopes and some people love em and others hate em. I'm looking at getting the 18" 6x short scope for my new pedersoli rolling block with a 26" barrel.
The new rifle is going to see some target use but will mainly be a hunting rifle. So will the scope hold up to heavy recoil or will it fail miserably? I've read so many different opinions on the scopes and the supplied mounts i'm not sure who to believe and if it'll be a worthwhile investment. I have seen that a recoil ring can be used to hold the scope in place too which i'm thinking of getting.

Cheers for any info on the scopes!

[45nut]

Can't offer advise on the scope,, but welcome to the board!

[Don McDowell]

I have one of the 18" leatherwoods. The optics are very clear and sharp. I have not mounted it on anything bigger than my lowall 22 yet, but hopefully next week we'll get it mounted on my 45-70.
The mounts that come with that short scope would leave alot to be desired for target work. A set of unertyl type mounts are much better.
I do know of one fella that mounted the long scope in a set of MVA mounts and has shot that combo for several years on his 45-70. The mounts that came with the scope kept cracking, but the optics themselves have held up well enough.

[Kitika]

So what is wrong with the mounts themselves that make them bad for target work? Is it the adjustments or the actual strength of the mounts not being able to handle the repetitive recoil from target use? I have seen that buffalo arms offer the leatherwood scope with unertyl mounts would this be a stronger outfit or just easier to adjust?

[Boz330]

Yes.
Leatherwood has a beefed up mount that you can buy extra but it is really huge and clunky looking. The graduations on the original mounts lack a lot and they don't allow enough elevation for much past 200 or 300 yds.
The scope is held solid in the Leatherwood mounts and that is a lot of recoil to withstand in a 45-70. I believe that the Unertyl mounts allow the scope to slide during recoil like the MVA mounts. Much easier on the mounts, scope, and your forehead.

Bob

[Don McDowell]

The mounts that come with the short leatherwood are plenty stout, but there's no reference point for the elevation and windage adjusmtents. Even tho there are numbers scribed on those dials there's no "zero" point to know how much you have moved it one way or the other.
Those Unertyl type mounst sold by buffalo arms are extreme highquality and there will be no backlash in the adjustments as with the Mva and other "rabbit ear" mounts.
The eye relief on this short malcolm is more than generous enough you should never have a problem with bruised eyeballs...

[nitroproof]

28616

I have a 3X on my .38-55 Whitney roller.
Yes, the scope is wonderful and yes the mounts are rather poor ;-)

I bought mine when they first came out so there weren't a lot of accessories offered. The cheap screws were soft and had to be replaced.
The front ring clamp allowed the scope tube to move under recoil, I fixed this with a strip of masking tape under the ring.
As for the rear cage mount I've read complaints about repeatability but I shoot mostly 200 yards so it's not an issue.
In the defense of the design I saw a Winchester Low Wall at the NRA Firearms Museum in Fairfax, VA with identical mounts.
I understand lock rings are now available to prevent the tube moving under recoil, so I would say they would work for a hunting rifle.

[32ideal]

Cannot speak to the 6x version as I have two of the 3x Leatherwood Malcolm scopes, they are perfect as is even the mounts are OK for a hunting rifle where you set the scope for your ammo/reloads for a specific distance and leave them alone, it takes a while to get them set but once set and locked in they stay set. Have a 3x on a Winchester Low Wall in 22 K-Hornet that has been on the rifle for 3+ years now and the settings have never moved. Have the other 3x on a Stevens M44 in 25-20SS and have worked with it for a couple years now and have found that although kind of slow I can move the V-H adjustments with good repeatability.
I really like the Malcolm’s I have for the Hi-Lux lenses and would consider the 6x Malcom, but heard that MVA has come out with a very accurate copy of the 5A scope, have not seen one only learned there was a review in the Black Powder News, think I will wait and look at them as they come with much better mounts and for less than $600.
32ideal

[Don McDowell]

Yes if MVA gets that short scope on the shelf, it would likely be the better arrangement.

[doubs43]

Yes if MVA gets that short scope on the shelf, it would likely be the better arrangement.

I have an original Lyman 5A and the mounts are clearly superior to the Malcolm mounts. If MVA makes their scope mounts to original specs, it will be a nice arrangement. I would point out that the eye relief of the original 5A is rather short so hopefully MVA will change the optics to give greater relief. But, if the scope is allowed to slide forward in the mounts, the short eye relief may not be an issue.

[mattbowen]

Kitika;

I have the leatherwood malcolm 6x scope and I like it, I have it on my 45-70 sharps. The only problem that I have is the base isn't high enough I have it sighted in at 110yds and the rear adjustment is maxed out. The rear adjustment isn't designed for quick adjustment it is more like the scopes the you adjust with a coin or a small screw driver, it is more for hunting use.

[NickSS]

I have a 6X short malcolm scope and have it mounted on one of my 45-70 sharps rifles. Once zzeroed and the lock ring tightened it seams to hold zero just fine. I hav found that with a sight base setting of 7 inches center to center one line of adjustment equals about one minute of change. My scope has enough elevation with the bases it came with for better than 200 yards. As all my shooting will likely be at 200 yards the mounts are satisfactory to me. I have only put around 200 rounds through my rifle with the scope mounted so far but it seams stable enough but only time will tell. A friend of mine has the Unertle type mounts sold by Buffalo arms and I intend to buy them as soon as I put the money aside to afford it. They are definately superior mounds but then they cost more than the scope cost me.

[nitroproof]

mattbowen~
I had the same issue with my initial installation. I added a thin brass shim to under my scope block. Now the scope tube is centered at 200yds. The gunsmith that did the drill & tap put the blocks 8" apart, I only learned later that 7" was the correct spacing. Would have been nice to have better/more instructions included withthe scope.

[Don McDowell]

You can get different height blocks from Brownells, or DZ arms.

[nitroproof]

Steve Earle specializes in scope blocks he will even make up special blocks upon request:

http://steveearleproducts.com

[Kitika]

Thanks for all the replies fellas! So it sounds like it should be able to withstand the recoil of the 45-70 with the standard mounts or at least as much as I can as my rifle only weighs 7lbs.
Just another question about the sliding mounts like the unertyl style wouldn't they knock the scope out of adjustment with the sliding movement quite easily? I've never seen a sliding scope and don't really understand how it can move and hold its zero???
Sorry for all the dumb questions but i'm learning and want to get the best combo first time round :smile:

[doubs43]

the sliding mounts like the unertyl style wouldn't they knock the scope out of adjustment with the sliding movement quite easily?

The tube on the Lyman scope has a precision bar that slides through the front mount in a corresponding slot. That maintains alignment. Some scopes have a spring around the tube that absorbs recoil and returns the scope to it's proper position.

[mattbowen]

Nitroproof;

Thanks for the info on Steve Earle's web site. I wanted to take the base off and shim it but I have to get a smaller star bit in order the remove the base.

Kitika;

The Unertl mount has been around for ages as a matter of fact it was used in Nam by their snipers, ones was even mounted on a 50 cal. BMG. by Carlos Hathcok.
The scope maintains its zero because after you fire the round it comes out of battery and before you fire your next shot you have to push the scope back into battery were it locks in and the zero is regained.

[Kitika]

Thanks for all the info fellas but now i'm thinking of spending more on the unertyl mounts! I suppose they can be put on later if the standard mounts fail which is probably a better bet for me but they have to be SAS legal so I can compete in the long range shoots.

[Boz330]

Not sure what SAS legal is but the BACO DZ mounts have the detent stops removed so they are NRA BPCR legal.

Bob

[Kitika]

SAS is single action. I think thats what you guys call it over there too. The design has to predate 1895 i'm pretty sure. BPRC could be the same concept but we don't have that shoot over here as far as I know.

[nitroproof]

http://www.nramuseum.com/the-museum/the-galleries/the-new-prosperity/case-45-early-target-practicethe-era-of-schuetzenfest/winchester-model-1885-single-shot-rifle-(1).aspx

This is the rifle I refered to in reply #7. Zoom in on the rear mount... it's exactly like Leatherwoods.

[doubs43]

http://www.nramuseum.com/the-museum/the-galleries/the-new-prosperity/case-45-early-target-practicethe-era-of-schuetzenfest/winchester-model-1885-single-shot-rifle-(1).aspx

This is the rifle I refered to in reply #7. Zoom in on the rear mount... it's exactly like Leatherwoods.

Looking at both mounts, the Lyman mount appears to be more substantial to my eye.

[Don McDowell]

The leatherwood mounts are not really shiny. Work alright probably for getting it set and forgetting it, but as far as changing settings there's probably not much chance of easy return to previous settings.
Adding the DZ mounts and then you've got something to work with.

[Kitika]

Is there any where else that sells the leatherwood and the DZ mounts? Buffaloarms don't seem that good at replying to there emails...

[Boz330]

On another forum one of the guys from Oz was having trouble getting an answer from BACO via e-mail on an order. One of the guys here interceded for him and it turned out that they had answered all of his e-mails but they were kicked back by the server there in Australia. I don't remember what the problem was or how it was corrected.
I believe the Leatherwoods are available from Optics Planet and you might try direct to DZ mounts and see what you get.

Bob

[Don McDowell]

You can get the leatherwood scopes from several places, Cabela's,Powder Inc, Natchezz , Midway, and Optic's Planet, and also Cimmarron sticks their sticker on the leatherwood box.
The DZ mounts you can purchase direct from DZ Arms, altho , I don't know if Dan would ship overseas or not, but it wouldn't hurt to ask him.
Actually any Unertl mount should work,including MVA.
The mounts that come with the leatherwood are serviceable and the bases are compatable with the Unertl type mounts. So if you have the scope you can always upgrade the mounts later.

[Kitika]

On another forum one of the guys from Oz was having trouble getting an answer from BACO via e-mail on an order. One of the guys here interceded for him and it turned out that they had answered all of his e-mails but they were kicked back by the server there in Australia. I don't remember what the problem was or how it was corrected.
I believe the Leatherwoods are available from Optics Planet and you might try direct to DZ mounts and see what you get.

Bob


They wouldn't happen to be on the forum by any chance would they? I have recieved a few emails back from them but i'm ready to order and they haven't got back to me with the final shipping price! (i'm trying to order sizing dies and a mould etc at the same time to save on shipping)

I'll look at some of the other mobs and see what prices they have on the scope.

[herbert buckland]

On another forum one of the guys from Oz was having trouble getting an answer from BACO via e-mail on an order. One of the guys here interceded for him and it turned out that they had answered all of his e-mails but they were kicked back by the server there in Australia. I don't remember what the problem was or how it was corrected.
I believe the Leatherwoods are available from Optics Planet and you might try direct to DZ mounts and see what you get.

BobThe person you are refering to is me,I never found out what the problem with the e-mails was(contacted my server and they stated there was no problem,even though it is hapening with some e-mails in Australia,it seems my e-mails go into the spam box)I curently have 2 more orders with BACO and am having the same problem again (can not get any feed back)I am starting to think this could be a Australian problem as I have had friend get the same result when it comes to getting
proper feedback

[Kitika]

Apart from the emails are they a good company to deal with? Always got what you ordered etc? The not receiving emails is a little off putting but if they do deliver on time thats all that really matters. Do you know if they accept paypal? Thats all i'm trying to find out from them at the moment but havent got a reply for almost a week.

[herbert buckland]

From what I have been told they are are a very good companyto deal with(but for some reason this has not been the case with me,took 5 months to get my fist order,then only after a jentleman in the US interceded for me,then I was quoted a price for postage and aperently when they recived the payment they decided it was not enough so I have sent another order with the extra payments but have not heard from them since,butt only 2 weeks ago) this may have somthing to do with the way I am paying them,by bank draught in US dollars,in a letter with my order(I do not youse the internet to send money as I have been robed this way before )but I have been told if you set up a acount with them and pay by card every thing works well(something I am not prepared to do just now

[Don McDowell]

Apart from the emails are they a good company to deal with? Always got what you ordered etc? The not receiving emails is a little off putting but if they do deliver on time thats all that really matters. Do you know if they accept paypal? Thats all i'm trying to find out from them at the moment but havent got a reply for almost a week.

Yes if it's instock they ship it. If it's not instock they ship as soon as it comes in.
Don't know about paypal but they do visa and mastercard.
They never have been real good about emails and the info on their website says as much, but Dave Gullo is a bpcr shooter of great reknown and a fine person to know, and has a good solid handshake.

[Kitika]

I'll see how I go with the emails as they have heaps of stuff there that I want to get at the same time as it is all a 1/3 of the price of stuff over here.

[mattbowen]

Kitika;

The e-mail that I got from BACO was that their servers were down and I needed to contact them by phone.

[Boz330]

I have dealt with them by phone and by internet and the service has always been great and by phone they seem extremely knowledgeable and helpful. I have always used a credit card and had no problems. They have a lot of stuff that is tough to find anywhere else. Might be worth the international call to deal direct.
I have tried e-mail with a number of companies and it really surprises me how many don't answer e-mails, BUT as many junk e-mails as I get maybe they get so many that it just isn't practical to sort through them. Good luck.

Bob

[wch]

Go to American Single Shot Rifle Association (ASSRA.COM) and ask your question there-you'll likely get more info from these fellas on that site than you want to hear.

[Gunlaker]

Apart from the emails are they a good company to deal with? Always got what you ordered etc? The not receiving emails is a little off putting but if they do deliver on time thats all that really matters. Do you know if they accept paypal? Thats all i'm trying to find out from them at the moment but havent got a reply for almost a week.

I probably put in almost one order every month with Baco. I have not had any problems at all in the couple of years I've been dealing with them. They are great people. Mind you I have never emailed them, just placed internet orders and talked with them on the phone.

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

Go to American Single Shot Rifle Association (ASSRA.COM) and ask your question there-you'll likely get more info from these fellas on that site than you want to hear.

A search over there didn't yield not as much and certainly not as much info as was contained in this thread alone:groner:

[Kitika]

I completed the order but the DZ mounts are on backorder. I ended up giving baco a call at 6.00am our time to see what the go is with the backorder after I figured out how to phone through to Idaho. Feels weird ringing back in time to someone who is a day behind :veryconfu
I hope these DZ mounts are all they are cracked up to be after all this hassle :)

[Don McDowell]

You won't be dissappointed with the DZ mounts..

If they ship you the scope, go ahead and use the mounts that come with it to get your gun set up for when the DZ mounts show up. Just be sure and set the bases on the 7.2 inch center to get the maximum range from the DZ's

[Jon K]

If you can't get get DZ mounts, why not call MVA for mounts?

MVA front mount has windage and DZ does not.

Jon

[texasmac]

Guys,

Some of you may be interested in the article I authored on BPCR scopes titled SEARCHING FOR A COST EFFECTIVE BPCR SCOPE SOLUTION. It includes an detailed evaluation of the Leatherwood 6X scope and also discusses the D.Z. Arms mounts. Go to http://www.texas-mac.com/Searching_for_a_Cost_Effective_BPCR_Scope_Solution .html

Wayne

[herbert buckland]

Guys,

Some of you may be interested in the article I authored on BPCR scopes titled SEARCHING FOR A COST EFFECTIVE BPCR SCOPE SOLUTION. It includes an detailed evaluation of the Leatherwood 6X scope and also discusses the D.Z. Arms mounts. Go to http://www.texas-mac.com/Searching_for_a_Cost_Effective_BPCR_Scope_Solution .html

WayneThat article is a big help to me,as I get older I have been thinking of geting a scope on a CBP rifle,that puts me on the right track what to look for and what not to try which is more important to me as I can not aford to get it wrong

[Black Prince]

I don't have an ax to grind here, but I've always depended on Buffalo Arms to give me knowlegable answers about various black powder issues and they always have. In the five years I've delt with them, I have had exactly no problems of any kind with them, or their service. I call them, give them my order and credit card number and three or four days later, UPS puts it on my front porch. I'm not special and bet they will do that for anyone who calls them and places an order. If it's not important enough to do that, it's not important enough to come here and put down a good company who serves all black powder shooters with good gear and information.

And I second Don McDowell's experience with the ASSRA (I am a former member) site. You fellas know more about black powder shoooting and you are a heck of a lot more friendly and helpful in giving advice and information.

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Herbert,

If you can only afford to do it right the first time, Better go with MVA, Service after the sale is second to none, BP is correct, but when it comes to scopes or supporting the sport, MVA is second only to Shiloh, At Raton Nationals alone MVA donates on the order of $2500 worth of sights scopes and such to the matches.

I have had stuff worked on rebuilt at MVA for no charge, after years of use my first scope mount "still workinig fine but I wanted a taller Mount" Jim asked me if he could keep the first mount as it was the 4th one he had ever made and he mounted it on a plaque that is on his desk. He also then gave me the New taller Mount at no charge. I also had one of the first 25 soules he ever made and he rebuilt it for me Twice in a 14 year period. I then sold it after the last rebuild and bought more Buffalo Soules. Plus I have one of the XLR Wasserburger Mile soules. I use my stuff a lot over the period of a single year, I have 3 MVA Scopes, one on my 75 Sharps 22, one for Dora and the Hell B--ch Rifle and 1 for my Silhouette rifles.

Reticle changes are snap and cost $160, you wont get that with any of the others, also as was pointed out by another poster the MVA has adjustable windage on the front mount making the Mech Zero and No wind Zero easy to do. Which is a huge issue, unless you shoot long range or Silhouette you wont understand that.

In plan simple English, you will not set World Records, National Records, Win National Championships, Regional Championships, with cost effective tools. YOU Need Precise EFFECTIVE Equipment that works and is repeatable. When you know your center mil-dot is 7/8th MOA In size you can shoot 1.336 inch Groups at 200 yards in the 5@200 Match at Raton. You can see the X at 1000 yards and know that you can make a precise 1 MOA hold off the X ring because your Center Mil is 7/8ths in size or that your Mil's are 3 MOA appart when conditions change rapidly. This allows one to make scores even with Paper Patch bullets that are 96-4X at 800 yards, allows you to beat Doc Keith Lay that day at 800 yards when he had won every single match for the past 3 days, and by the time 1000 yards rolls around you are still tied for sore with him and Michael Rix, two of the best Long Range rifle shots in the world.

Reread that paragraph above again slowly, till that info sinks in, understand that was hard earned knowledge freely shared. If you do not get it then it was wasted words. If you do it will go a long ways in helping you make your choice.

KW
The Lunger

[Don McDowell]

The DZ mounts give you about 60 minutes windage either side of zero.

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Rear windage is not a problem on either sight, MVA has tons of it. I like my Mech Zero's set at no Wind. When you got a 180 change makes for more accurate windage estimates.
KW
The Lunger

[Don McDowell]

:smile: Haven't shot this DZ leatherwood setup very much yet, but it didn't take to long to figure out when Dan said .001 per mark he meant the little marks on the knobs , :groner:not the bigones on the stem[smilie=b:

[herbert buckland]

Kenny : I was leaning tawards the MVA sight,although I will never be in your class as BPC shooter I do not want to be able to blame my tools so I will follow your advice : Black Prince : Not every one lives in the US and can call BACO ,for me it means geting up at 3 in the morning and hoping I do not get put on hold as the call will cost more than the order.I am not running BACO down (I still will buy from them)I am just explaining to another Australian that dealing with them through E_MAILS is almost imposible for me

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Herbert,

A couple years back I shot a Long Range 100 Rod String measure slug gun match with my standard old Creedmoor 45-110 Rifle. I took 3rd place, SPG was in Second and beat me by 3/8 of a inch in string measure to take that second spot. The Rev Robby Roberts was match winner with 1/4 inch lead on Steve. I lost that match by 5/8 of a inch in string measure over 20 shots for record. All three of the top shooters were using MVA scopes. This was a money match with a pretty decent Entry fee, at 3rd I made about double my entry fee. SPG was using a 18 Lb 38-50 and using breach seated Ammo, and I was using GG Bullets. Steve invited me to look through his MVA. This was in Jan or Feb of 2007, I looked in Steve's MVA and used some colorful remarks. Steve looked at me and grinned and made the comment: sucks to get beat by your own reticle don't it? Steve had made the switch to the Mil-dot reticle I used to Win scope at Raton that past summer of 2006. Steve pays close attention, and took to heart what I said when he interviewed me for the Raton Article that year.

Both Steve Garbe and Robby were using foot rests on their barrels and using a front rest near the muzzle I was using a standard heavy bench rest with bags on my rifle, They were not having to deal with the torque like I was with my 45-110. A lesson learned that day.

These are my kind of matches where you have no spotter, you use all the skills you have for doping wind, Judging the Mirage, 100 rods is 550 yards, when your shooting 7-1/2 inch groups at 550 yards and getting beat by groups that are avg 7-1/4 inches and 6-7/8 inches. With that tight of scores you have to be using the best equipment you can buy, you can't afford not too.

4th place was over 10 inches larger group size, with a total of 10 or 12 entries.

It was an excellent learning experience for me, SPG showed me something I had not known at that time, I could adjust Paralex for each yardage with the MVA. Some folks do not think that a big deal, something that I have used to advantage since. Even in Gong matches at Alliance I have won 3 of the scope class at Alliance Neb over the years, last spring was #3, and this past fall I was second behind a very good slug gun shooter, Don Thalheim.

I have over the past few years won 2 of the 5@200 over 40 cal Scope awards in 3 of the matches I have entered. They Frame a World Record Paper Patch Target.

One of my very closest of friends is Jim Herr Kidwell of GA. Jim has won 3 5@200 awards, in 40 and under Scope Class.
Jim uses MVA Scopes, had bought a set of DZM's to try, an since has sold them. Jim Shoots a 40-65 Shiloh Sharps and is A Champion Mid Range shooter a real Hard Holder.

Now that I have finally scratched my itch for a real Muzzle loading Slug gun, I will when Money allows, be putting another MVA Scope on my Slug Guns.

KW
The Lunger

[herbert buckland]

Kenny:as the Aussie dollar is buying well now I am going to order a series 4000 MVA scope and Creedmoor mounts ,as to the rectical I was thinking the G centeless mil-dot as I am very know this system ,or do you think the F 7 Mil-Dot would be better.I want to youse it for booth Mid and long range matches

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Herbert,

The Longer the scope the taller the rear mount must be for Long Range, I use the 23 inch model for all my scopes, yet it can bind at the longer ranges or so they say, yet Jim Gier made mine with a Creedmoor mount. In my opinion get the 28 inch scope with Creedmoor Mount and your good to go for mid to Long Range, the 28 inch model has .005 per MOA, where as the 23 inch is .003 per MOA, each tick mark is .001 adjustment. Just Let MVA Know your going to shoot Long Range and they can provide a taller front block also, for 800 to 1000 yards a taller front block will aid in not needing so much elevation on the rear mount, something else to keep in mind. At those ranges Paralex can induce over a MOA of Error. Say your wind call is off by 2 MOA and you have a paralex error of 1.25 MOA. You will have a miss. Again something to consider.

In plan english the longer the scope-distance between mounts the more you have to move the Rear Elevation to get 1 MOA Of adjustment. The Leatherwood is only 7 some odd inches between mounts So I am betting .001 or .002 Per MOA not bad but I like having 1/3 MOA adjustments especially in Mid Range matches at the 200 and 300 yard lines. And 1/4 to 1/3 MOA adjustments in Elevation are very handy in Silhouette matches at pigs and Turkey and Chickens.

My personal Preference is a Mil-dot in the center As I can hold off with it when needed in fast moving conditions better then just a cross hair. But that is my personal preference, and in silhouette I can see the center dot and place it right where I want it on the animal.

KW
The Lunger

[Kitika]

Finally got the Scope today! Can't wait to get it fitted up but I have found a problem with the dovetail slots. Of the shelf mounts don't really fit the slot in the DZ mounts? Do I need to get custom ones or unertyl specific blocks?

[texasmac]

Kitika,

I have no idea what you mean by "off the shelf mounts" but the DZ mounts are made to fit Unertl Posa-style scope blocks (bases). There are two types of Unertl blocks, standard and Posa. Be sure to ask for Posa-style. For more details on the block styles go to the link below and page about 1/2 way down to the section titled, Unertl Mounts & De-clicking a Unertl.

http://www.texas-mac.com/Searching_for_a_Cost_Effective_BPCR_Scope_Solution .html

Wayne

[Don McDowell]

I think the leatherwood blocks will fit those DZ mounts if you square the bottom of the big notch off.

[Kitika]

I've only got standard dovetail scope block that come in long lengths like the stuff from brownells etc. I'll see if i can modify the shape of dovetail tomorrow as anything like that is very hard to come by in australia.

[Don McDowell]

The notch is the only thing that needs modified.

[texasmac]

Don,

This does not help Kitika, but FYI, the blocks that came with my Leatherwood scope have the standard Unertl notch on one side and the Unertl Posa notch on the other side, but I purchased the scope directly from Leatherwood. Also, when the DZ mounts and Leatherwood scope are purchased together from Buffalo Arms (BACO), I don't believe blocks are included, although they can be ordered as a separate item from BACO.

Wayne

[Don McDowell]

Wayne the blocks that came with the leatherwood I got are not the same notch shape as the ones I got from Zimmerman when I order the mounts and his blocks.
I do know of one fella the simply filed the notch in the leatherwood blocks to fit the DZ mounts, probably take all of a minute to do.

[texasmac]

Don,

I guess Leatherwood quit adding the Posa slot on one side of their blocks since their mounts use the standard (half-moon) slot. Yup, it doesn't take much to convert the standard slot to a Posa. The other way around would be a problem.

Wayne

[Kitika]

Modified the scope blocks which took about 2hours to get looking right and drilled the holes etc and got it all mounted. With my new 26inch barrel pedersoli rolling block I got 3 shots within about 2inches at 100meters without much hassle so I'm very impressed :) I'm hopefully going out to a 800meter range tomorrow so i can see how much elevation I can get out of it

[rbertalotto]

I recently installed a short Malcolm 6X on my Winchester High Wall. Wrote an article about it here:

www.rvbprecision.com

So far it has been an excellent choice. Holds zero extremely well. Perfect for a hunting rifle.

But the rear scope mount is not repeatable for variable range, competitive target use.

Last night I mounted the long Malcolm on my Sharps. A bit of a science project to mount, but seems very rigid.

[Don McDowell]

Kitika you'll likely take all the elevation available to make the 800 meter range with the leatherwood blocks.
Using the DZ 225 rear and 175 front blocks all the available elevation is used to make 1000 yds on my rifle.

[rbertalotto]

Well, I got to the range this AM......Although the optics are clear, the adjustments are near impossible. Especially elevation. Very difficult to move the scope up .0001"......I ordered the Fine Elevation Adjuster and sent an email to Leatherwood telling them that this scope should include this piece. It is nearly unusable without it.

I'm going to take it all apart and stone everything so it moves smoothly.

On the plus side, it held zero very well and has great eye relief. The optics are excellent.

More reports later......

[Doc Highwall]

Hard is not the word. I milled a notch for my Malcolm scope and you have to use a carbide end mill to cut it and go sloooww.

[texasmac]

Kitika,

I'm expecially interested in your long range results. I expect that, with the short scope, the muzzle will partially or fully block the image at 800 to 1000 yds, but that depends on the block heights.

Wayne

[Kitika]

Well it made 800 meters with a little bit of adjustment left. I need to work on my loads as they are all over the place at that distance but i'm new to this long range stuff (only had the rifle since tuesday). Also the scope spacing isn't the optimal 7.2" and still had enough adjustment for the 800m. I will post pics when I get around to taking them.

[XTR]

I'm mounting a Leatherwood Malcolm 6x18 on my 1885 Highwall (45-70) this week. I read enough bad reviews of the standard mounts that I went ahead and ordered the Leatherwood version of the Precision mount to go with it. I thought about any number of other mount options but I was unsure of all the parts needed to get the mounts on the rifle so I went with theirs. I'll post some pictures and range results in the next few days.

[XTR]

Follow up.

I discovered that the mount I had planned to buy required more drilling and tapping. I passed.

The stock mount was complete trash.

The forward mount goes in the dovetail for the barrel mounted buckhorn sight. It is not a drift in mount, it slides in and you tighten a screw to hold it in place. Teh fit was sloppy. All of the screws are flat head screwdriver screws and soft. The heads bugger up very easily.

The front mount is not designed as a slip mount, but it would not hold the scope under the recoil of a 45-70. You need to buy a sliding front mount rig.

In the end I realized that in order to make this work I was going to have to buy a $400 to $500 set of mounts for a $200 scope on a rifle that I am not shooting in period type shoots but that I am using as a hunting rifle. I sent it back to SWFA and put a Swarovski Z3 on it. It looks out of place but at least its just a 42 and not a big bell scope..