Compact .45 acp

[leftiye]

Hi, I'm thinkin' about a concealed carry peestol. It seems to occur to me that a .45acp is all the a$$ kicker you can get in a short gun, and that an automatic will both carry more rounds than a compact revolter, and won't lose power due to a cylinder gap. Even the .44 special takes up a lot of effective barrel length with the cartridge. A snubby .44 mag probly only sets your surroundings afire in terms of doing more.

I'd be interested in any experience you'd like to share concerning small pistols/revolvers. At present I have a Charter arms .44 bulldog, and a S&W 9mm compact.

Also, are any of these small autos strong enough for sum sooping up? I'm not really wanting to go .45 super, etc. - only wanting to load so as to make up for the short barrel with light wadcuttersand high pressure. Thanks Ted

[35remington]

If considering a 1911 variant, be advised the shorter you make it, the greater the probability it will malfunction compared to the pistol with the longer barrel and slide length.

There is no room for argument on this point. Trying to state otherwise is a lost cause, and an indication that the person involved in trying to make the case doesn't know much about 1911's.

It is commonly advised not to go significantly shorter than 4 inches in barrel length in 1911's for this reason.

In looking at automatic pistols, be sure to assess breechface travel past the magazine well as an indicator of a design that allows the proper amount of time for the pistol to function correctly.

The hotter you load a shorty automatic, the greater chance it will malfunction if it was not specifically designed as a short design from the beginning. This is common to many automatic designs that have questionable magazine spring strength by trying to fit too many rounds in the magazine or that have slick, smooth followers.

Combine rounds with greater recoil with these things and you have a malfunction waiting to happen at the worse possible time.

[AnthonyB]

Ted:
I have been down this road. The Star Firestar was too heavy, and the Kahr P45 was not reliable (I'll buy another once I'm convinced it works; that is the ultimate carry gun for me). The Kimber Compact is great, but heavier than I wanted. I have shifted to the Glock 30SF for most of my use.
Tony

[Finster101]

I'm 5'10" and carry a Combat Commander. I have no trouble concealing it inside my waistband. It fires anything I throw at it. A little ramp polishing is all that has been done. I find any of the double stacks leave much more of an imprint ot tell tale than the very flat 1911.

[Kraschenbirn]

'Nother Commander here; 'cept mine's a Series 70 lightweight..."duty" trigger job, Heinie (fixed) sights, flat mainspring housing, recoil spring guide, etc. Of course, I'm just over 6' and 195 lbs so, with a decent high-ride holster, it makes a fairly discreet "carry."

Bill

[twotoescharlie]

Star PD 45 cal. if you can find one.

TTC

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

Colt Combat Commander 1911 .45 4" barrel, 7 round mag . . . 80 series
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/Colt%201911%20Combat/6.jpg

Ruger Super Redhawk Alaskan 44 Mag 2.5" barrel . . . it is kinda heavy and bulky, but it packs a PUNCH!
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/Ruger%20Alaskan/Inyourface.jpg

[Arisaka99]

I see bad safety there!!!! Get that finger out of the trigger guard!! ;)

[Bill*]

I'da been more comfortable with that picture pointing at me without yer finger on the trigger!

[Matt3357]

Timer on the camera. Seen it before and he explained it. But definitely yes I agree, it made me nervous.

Matt

[leftiye]

:mrgreen::mrgreen: If'n it'd gone off, you wouldn't have known anyhooz! (he wouldn't have had a camera anymore) :mrgreen::mrgreen:

[Dale53]

Actually, I think that is a GREAT picture!!

It's hardly a prime choice for a CCW, tho'.

My daily carry is a 642 with #305 CT grips with .38 +P FBI load.

However, I have a Kimber CDP Ultra II that is presently in "reliability trials". Early on, it looks VERY good. I'll tell you one thing, tho' - that little sucker really shoots well. We'll see:

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/DalesPistolsRevolvers5Selects-0210.jpg

To be honest, the Commander length 1911's are the high percentage marker for reliability. However, the shorter grip of the CDP Ultra II makes it much less likely to "print". If it passes my reliability trials it may replace my 642.

When you talk self defense and considering it's a close range affair, the relatively small velocity loss of the 3" barrel vs the 5" barrel will not generally make a difference (often less than 60 fps in actual tests). Using a bullet of the proper configuration should actually give BETTER performance than a standard military length 1911 with issue hardball.

Dale53

[arjacobson]

glock model 36... ugly/reliable/perfect for me

[leftiye]

Course, - then, you like that cat too.

[Lee W]

I carry a Para Ordnance P12 with a 4.25 slide and barrel. I find this to be the best carry configuration when it comes to a 1911. It is the same as a CCO. Look here for a more versions .


http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCatalogProductDetails.aspx?categoryid=25&productid=165

http://forum.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=296909

[trickyasafox]

I carry either an Officers sized 1911 (3.5 in) or a commander (4.25)

35 remington is right that the officers can get picky- but mine seems to be doing fine so far. For me i just choose HPs that have a fairly FMJ like profile or are TC like and I haven't had any problems. Ironically, Hornady TAP didn't run in my officers 1911. Fiocchi, golden saber, silvertip, and hydra-shok did.

[2wheelDuke]

I believe in the Glock for a carry gun as well. Sure it's blocky and ugly, but it's also tough and reliable and shoots well.

I carry a Glock 30 for off-duty carry and the girlfriend carries a Glock 36.

[arjacobson]

Course, - then, you like that cat too.

yeah!!!:kidding:

[bobthenailer]

well hears my opinion , for probley 20 years i carried a all steel combat commander , then in 1993 i bought a para ordance P12 alloy frame , 3 1/2 inch barrel and carried that until 2009 then i bought a khar pm9 in 9mm 3 inch barrel for summer carry , excellent pistol , very shootable , accurate , and with about 1000 rouds through it, with most being reloads only 1 failure to feed . then i got to thinking khar makes a CW- 45 3 1/2 inch barrel with a full length grip , same as the 1911 for $459.00 and weighs 19 oz . so in 2010 i bought one, now thats my winter carry gun. so far i have put about 500 rounds through it with the same results as the PM9. i still have the P12 and will keep it , but the satin nickel commander is gone . i still have my OMC 380 back up and a keltech 380 for extra deep cover but i have found the PM9 is just as consealable ! sometimes i forget i have it on.
i have found if its lighter you are more likely to carry all the time ! with the khars it makes things eaiser !

[BD]

A lot of us have been down this road. I went 5" 1911 - 3" 1911 - 4" 1911 myself, and settled on an alloy frame Kimber 4" Pro Tactical with a bobbed grip at the end of the day, when clothing allows it. A lot depends on how you're built. Some guys conceal short and fat better, while others need long and flat.
BD

[Dale53]

>>>A lot depends on how you're built. Some guys conceal short and fat better, while others need long and flat.
BD <<<

BD has hit on something that we often fail to take into consideration. There is no "One size fits all". I find that many make this mistake in many areas of human endeavor.

Dale

[saltydog452]

Bob, I am lazy. Trying to muddle through run on sentences and lack of punctuation to decode intent is beyond my abilitiy and inclination. Communication is tough, understanding is tougher. I, for one, need all the help I can get.

A much as I am fond of the working of the 1911 platform in the Commanders and Combat Commanders, there is an evil Glock 36 on standby.

salty

[Moonie]

I carry a full size 1911 but then it isn't illegal to print in NC.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

I see bad safety there!!!! Get that finger out of the trigger guard!! ;)

It's actually on the trigger! How else is one gonna shoot? That's what I got it for!


I'da been more comfortable with that picture pointing at me without yer finger on the trigger!

Don't tell me that you really think that if I actually pull the trigger here in Arizona at my camera, that you somehow feel "uncomfortable" in Joisy with that? It is not really a long range gun!:groner: Nor is it likely to send that 242 gr hp through the wire and have it come out your screen!


Timer on the camera. Seen it before and he explained it. But definitely yes I agree, it made me nervous.

Matt

Awwww, come on now, not you too! :p

Having a viewing screen that I can actually monitor (even though it is small) makes it easier to get things lined up, and once I push the button I have 10 sec to do that . . .
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/Camera.jpg


Actually, I think that is a GREAT picture!!

It's hardly a prime choice for a CCW, tho'.

<snip>

Dale53

Thank you!

I actually bought it to carry concealed, and have for over six months, my biggest complaint is the weight . . . the size is not a problem, I carried it through the summer under just a "T" shirt, but I have switched back to my 357 SP101 . . . I still have not shot my Colt much, so I carry what I know, eventually I hope to get to use to the 1911 more, as I like larger caliber, even if it is a bit slower . . .

[dla]

Hi, I'm thinkin' about a concealed carry peestol. It seems to occur to me that a .45acp is all the a$$ kicker you can get in a short gun, and that an automatic will both carry more rounds than a compact revolter, and won't lose power due to a cylinder gap. Even the .44 special takes up a lot of effective barrel length with the cartridge. A snubby .44 mag probly only sets your surroundings afire in terms of doing more.

I'd be interested in any experience you'd like to share concerning small pistols/revolvers. At present I have a Charter arms .44 bulldog, and a S&W 9mm compact.

Also, are any of these small autos strong enough for sum sooping up? I'm not really wanting to go .45 super, etc. - only wanting to load so as to make up for the short barrel with light wadcuttersand high pressure. Thanks Ted

I went with the Kimber Stainless Pro Carry, alloy frame. I love how nice it rides, how flat it lays IWB. It is a 4" barrel, which is large enough to enjoy shooting.

[L1A1Rocker]

I've been carrying a stainless Officer's model since Texas got it's CHL back in 95.

If Para had made the P-12 in stainless at that time I would have bought that. I also run (the now hard to find) the Aguila I.Q. ammo in it.

[Lloyd Smale]

ive owned 2 cdps and still have one. the 3 inch gun i had was very accurate and relible. I sold it only because i needed money at the time. The one i have know is a 4 inch gun with an officers grip frame and its my hands down favorite carry gun. It is as reliable as they come and outshoots many of the 5 inch target guns ive owned. I also have a comander size kimber with an aluminum grip frame that is a real good gun. Believe it or not its one of the old external extractor guns. After some tuning it just doesnt miss a beat and i know kimber will upgrade it to an internal extractor for free but that gun runs so good ive never been able to bring myself to do it. Ive had two springfields both commanders. One didnt run for **** no matter what i tried and the other was a rattle trap that was as loose as a goose. It ran fine but was a 4-5 inch gun at 25 yards at best. ive owned one colt commander and it was the same as the springfield. It was reliable but accuracy was dismal. Had one 3 inch springfield GI and that one should have been thrown in the lake!
Actually, I think that is a GREAT picture!!

It's hardly a prime choice for a CCW, tho'.

My daily carry is a 642 with #305 CT grips with .38 +P FBI load.

However, I have a Kimber CDP Ultra II that is presently in "reliability trials". Early on, it looks VERY good. I'll tell you one thing, tho' - that little sucker really shoots well. We'll see:

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/DalesPistolsRevolvers5Selects-0210.jpg

To be honest, the Commander length 1911's are the high percentage marker for reliability. However, the shorter grip of the CDP Ultra II makes it much less likely to "print". If it passes my reliability trials it may replace my 642.

When you talk self defense and considering it's a close range affair, the relatively small velocity loss of the 3" barrel vs the 5" barrel will not generally make a difference (often less than 60 fps in actual tests). Using a bullet of the proper configuration should actually give BETTER performance than a standard military length 1911 with issue hardball.

Dale53

[HeavyMetal]

If your not right handed go find a Star PD 25OZ empty! 7 round capacity.

Carry a lot shoot a little, load with 165 Grain Cor-Bon +P

[Dframe]

My first choice in a bottom feeder is a Colt Defender. It is perfectly reliable with it's 3 inch barrel and the 45 acp needs no help as a defensive calibre.

[knifemaker]

I'll second that on the Colt Defender. Just got one due to wanting a lighter gun for conceal carry . My full size 1911's and Browning HP in 40 S&W has a tendency to drag the pants down.
Has some hiccups at first on several fail to fully extract. The extractor was not tuned and failed to hold the cartidge in the slide. I tuned the extractor and so far no more failures for the past several hundred rounds of reloaded ammo. That includes both ball and flat point boolits.

What impressed me with that 3 inch gun was the high level of accuracy due to the no bushing bull barrel. 1-1/4 inch 6 shot group at 15 yards shooting off hand.

Guys with small hands do not like the factory wrap around rubber grips, with my big paws I love them and recoil is not an issue with such a light weight alloy frame gun.:Fire:

[Shooter6br]

Have Sig 250 c in 45 ACP. It is DA only( double action) Little hard getting use too by nice for carry.I like the 1911 but not happy with lock and load. 26 oz empty vs 38 oz

[steve in kc]

I have a Taurus 24/7 pro c ds in .45 acp. 3.5" bbl 6.25" overall length. 23oz empty. 12+1 shot capacity. I'd reccomend one.

[saltydog452]

It wasn't brimming with complimentary comments.

There was no insult intended to bobthenailer.

My bad, my apology for any unintended insults.

salty

[2wheelDuke]

Hi, I'm thinkin' about a concealed carry peestol. It seems to occur to me that a .45acp is all the a$$ kicker you can get in a short gun, and that an automatic will both carry more rounds than a compact revolter, and won't lose power due to a cylinder gap. Even the .44 special takes up a lot of effective barrel length with the cartridge. A snubby .44 mag probly only sets your surroundings afire in terms of doing more.

I'd be interested in any experience you'd like to share concerning small pistols/revolvers. At present I have a Charter arms .44 bulldog, and a S&W 9mm compact.

Also, are any of these small autos strong enough for sum sooping up? I'm not really wanting to go .45 super, etc. - only wanting to load so as to make up for the short barrel with light wadcuttersand high pressure. Thanks Ted

Having re-read your post, it sounds almost like you're looking for a Glock 29. 10mm in a sub-compact package really does make for an "ass kicking" little gun.

[SkookumJeff]

+1 on the compact Kimber .45. A buddy of mine has carried one for several years now, and trained heavily with it. It's a very good pistol. I've shot it quite a bit myself and love it. I carry a .40 S&W (CZ) or I'd have a Kimber myself.

That said, when my buddy first got it, it gave him a lot of trouble jamming. FTE IIRC...but it was all because of his wimpy wrist. Man did it take me a long time to convince him that was the problem LOL...Once he manned up, it's never given him any more trouble. Never jammed on me.

Happy trails...SkookumJeff

[Catshooter]

salty,

Good for you to step up to the plate like that. The written word is not like the spoken.


Cat

[leftiye]

10mm glock huh? Actually, I wonder if that isn't too much ctg. for that small of a gun???? What say ye? I did look at the glock 27 in .40 S&W, but I kinda want a hammer , and single/double trigger. Whatcha think about the .40 S&W guys?

[DCM]

I really like a quality officers 1911 with Cor-Bon 200g JHPs, but I have been strongly considering a G36 Glock as it is lighter.

[Shooter6br]

My Sig 250c isnt bad A bit blocky but 26oZ empty

[DeanWinchester]

I've been carrying a PT145 Taurus for over a decade now.

[Markbo]

My personal carry is a Kimber Pro CDP - commander size. My 'drop in pocket' that stays in the vehicle all the time is a Kel-Tec P11. It is strictly for short runs though. The only other choice I would make is Kimber Ultra CDP. The kimbers are lighter, have the 'melted' finish with no sharp angles and every kimber I have ever shot is surprisingly accurate.

I have a Springfiled V10 that is of the ultra cdp size but it is WAY heavier and not nearly as accurate with any ammo I have tried, so it stays in the safe. All my Kimbers are dead nuts reliable and extremely accurate... I have no reason to believe an Ultra CDP would not be the same.

[bigboredad]

123DieselBenz
I love that pic very nicely done and great choice on bullets to load up. I see we think a like about the whole dangerous pics that are out there.:roll: Personally if a pic makes a person nervous that kind of person make me nervous.

Leftiye

I carry a Springfield XD compact for me its very easy to hide and not too heavy. Put the 10 mag in the gun and carry one or two 13 rounders and you should be very well heeled

[MtGun44]

Light wt Commander.

Turns out, at least for me, that FLAT is worth a BUNCH for CCW. I have a number
of really nice revolvers but even the 396 Night Guard is pretty FAT, sorry to say.
I'm a small guy (32" pants and 5'6") so even a 5 shot .44 looks bulgy on me. A bigger
guy could maybe make it work, altho I could hide anything in winter - so OK then.
In summer the 1911 will go under a loose T shirt or Hawaiian shirt no problem.

Bill

[Paul105]

I recently bought a Kahr CW40. It is one of the easiest shooting small pistols I have had the pleasure to shoot. They also make in in .45 ACP -- CW45.

Jeff Quinn did a review:

http://gunblast.com/Kahr-45s.htm

[Groo]

Groo here
The larger the bullet the less loss with a shorter barrels.
The shorter the barrel the more picky the gun is to feed.
The shorter and lighter the gun the more often you will carry it.
My 45acp carry guns are all kimbers, the Pro is a joy to carry [alumium frame 4in barrel]
and I shoot it so well that a friend said " Just put every thing back in the safe and carry that!]
And the RCP II is just smaller [ P.S. no sights to hang up!]
I also have decided to use only Mil-spec FMJ rounds in anything shorter than a Commander
[ 4 1/4 in]