Imr4198

[henryb]

Iam used to loading 9mm .but today i loaded a round of 7.92x33 .is it the difference in the shape of the powder that seems to cause my powder thrower to move .like its stiff and almost like its sticking when i was trying to set it up for the proper weight of 20.3 graines of imr4198 powder?:?:

[Rocky Raab]

Probably. Stick-like powders like 4198 and drum measures don't get along well. The sticking you are feeling is the drum cutting powder kernels that get caught between the drum cavity and the measure body.

The added shaking doesn't affect the load you ae throwing (usually) but it can play hob with the NEXT charge, simply because the powder will have settled and packed itself tighter. The next charge can be heavier than you expect.

Hodgdon's version of 4198 uses a much shorter kernel that flows better. You might consider trying it the next time you buy powder. In the meantime, it is probably best to throw a slightly light charge and trickle up on a scale. Tedious, but safe!

[AZ-Stew]

Well, you didn't tell us what kind of powder measure you have, but generally, the extruded (stick-type) powders (the ones that look like little sections of mechanical pencil lead) are more difficult to measure than the usual pistol powders that have small round or flake-type granules. The small sections of the stick powders actually get caught in the rotating parts of the measure and are cut as you force the handle into the "dispense" location. This is the resistance you feel. It is also the cause of inconsistencies from charge-to-charge. It is best to set your measure to dispense a grain or so less than your intended charge into your scale pan, then use a powder trickler to bring the weight up to the value you want.

Regards,

Stew

[AZ-Stew]

I was typing while Rocky was posting.

Regards,

Stew

[Rocky Raab]

That "great minds" thing again, huh?

[knifemaker]

IMR-4198 is my main powder for my loads in 45/70. I use a RCBS uniflow powder measure and have found the following procedure works bests in loading stick type powders like IMR-4198.
I set the weight charge by throwing 3-4 charges using a double tap system at the up stroke and also down stroke of the handle. This helps to settle the powder where it will throw very consistant charges.

After you get the powder measure throwing the charge you want, keep using the top & bottom double tap stroke for every charge and I have been able to keep my charges within one grain or less. I have shot many minute of angle groups with three different 45/70 rifles using this methold. It will not eliminate all the cutting of kernels, but will keep it to a bare minimum. This should work with most, if not all, drum type measures like the RCBS.

Just in case you do not understand what I mean by double tap. When I swing the measure handle up, I will tap it twice, using the handle, against where it stops at the upswing. I then do the downstroke and tap it twice at the bottom. Tap it hard enough to settle the kernels in the measure. The upstroke taps settle the powder into the drum for maximum fill and the downstroke taps settles the powder in the powder reservoir and keeps the powder from bridging and hanging up in the neck resulting in a light powder charge in the case.

[Down South]

+1 to what AZ Stew and Rocky Raab said. I set my power measure to throw just shy of the desired load then trickle to the desired weight when using stick powders. Stick powers are hard to use with any powder measure and get consistent charges. I've seen some charges that would be plus or minus 2 grains. Doing the tapping deal helps but when I'm only loading 20 or so rounds for hunting, I want the charge to the .10 of a grain.
Most of my stick powers are for for my rifles and I like to weigh each charge anyway.

[runfiverun]

my lyman dpms don't have that problem.
i use an old pacific thrower that won't keep ball powder within 2 grs to drop the main charge then push the button, same load every time.
powders like rl-19 and 7828 are why i bought it.
it's fast too.
dump powder,set on scale, push button,seat bullet/boolit, grab pan and dump.....repeat.

[Kraschenbirn]

I use a lot of IMR4198 and IMR4350 and, while my Lyman 55 doesn't like either, my old B&M will drop +/- a couple of tenths so long as I keep the hopper more than 1/2 full. If I'm going for all-out "Match" loads, I'll set up the B&M to drop a grain or so light and trickle-in the rest. (And don't even mention trying to obtain accurate charges with stick powders in a Dillon measure...[smilie=b: )

Bill

[Rocky Raab]

That's probably why Dillon rather strongly suggests using sphericals, huh? ;-)

[btroj]

And that is why I just avoid 4198. After one pound I swore it off forever. I just use RE7 instead.

[No_1]

For stick powders I use a dipper and powder trickler. The "dipper" is made from rimless cases with safety wire wrapped in the extractor groove to form a handle. The smallest dipper is a 25 auto case and the larger ones are rifle cases trimmed way back. My procedure is to find a case that "dips" an amount shy of what I am after then trickle the rest. It is easy to keep my loads +/- .1 (without even trying) using this method although it is a little time consuming.

R.

[Kraschenbirn]

That's probably why Dillon rather strongly suggests using sphericals, huh? ;-)

Rocky...

Yeah, NOW they do but, thirty years ago, when I got my first Dillon (an RL450), the whole manual that came with it (including, parts lists and exploded drawings) was only 10 pages and the set-up/operating instructions for the Dillon measure didn't say a word about powder selection. I think the "suggestion" you mention first appeared in the RL550 manuals, several years later...by which time, for rifle rounds, I'd long before switched to measuring charges with the B&M and dropping them through an spring-loaded powder funnel mounted in Station 2.

Bill

[henryb]

its a rcbs that i have on my horandy pro7 .I bought 8 pounds of this powder so when i am dead and gone my son will still be loading with it.

[Rocky Raab]

Dillon has had the spherical suggestion on their website FAQ for so long I can't remember when they started it - probably was on their first website, whenever that was. But it had to be after 1990, when the first webpage of any kind was created. 1995 perhaps?

(Hard to believe that websites as we know them are only about 15 years old, isn't it? I have stuff in my refrigerator that old ...)

[onondaga]

I use the Lee Perfect for stick powders. The Lee actually likes stick powders and handles them fine. For fine ball powders, I use a Lyman #55.
Gary

[Rocky Raab]

Or just get a digital dispenser. Problem solved. No crunching, no bridging, and every charge is weighed while your two hands can do other things. Magic.

[AZ-Stew]

Or just get a digital dispenser. Problem solved. No crunching, no bridging, and every charge is weighed while your two hands can do other things. Magic.

Ditto.

I bought the Lyman DPS 1200, version II, with the version III speed upgrade solely for the purpose of dealing with stick powders. My Lyman #55 has handled the ball and flake powders perfectly for 35 years. The DPS 1200 works very well with the sticks. Regardless of what others have reported about it, mine works perfectly. My only regret is that I was too cheap to buy the version III in the first place because it dispenses the next charge automatically when the user puts the pan back on the scale. With the version II, I have to hit the "Go" button each time I put the scale pan back, which I occasionally forget to do. No matter, it only takes a few seconds to drop a 40-50 grain charge.

As Henryb matures in his loading practice, maybe he'll add an electronic dispenser to his tool set. No rush. The drop-short-and-trickle method will cover things till then.

Regards,

Stew

[EOD3]

You can mitigate the problem by installing a powder baffle near the bottom of the tube. It'll take weight off the powder column so it packs together less.