3 to 1 WW and monotype

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I have thousands of boolits cast up using WW and also 50/50 WW and PB. Last night I decided to try something different. I took 15 lbs. of WW and 5 lbs of monotype and melted them together in my bottom pour. I noticed that the mix melted at a lower temperature and was hard to get fluxed. I cast some boolits and had a problem with fill out for awhile. The sprue seems to take longer to harden than WW. I cast at 600 deg and it still took longer than regular WW. I am anxious to see what the BHN is of this mix. I am casting using a Lee 158 RNFP and they weigh 152 with this mix. Interesting. I'm not quite sure what I have. Just an experiment. I guess I will have to wait a week or so to find out.

The WW boolits weigh 162 and the 3 to 1 weigh 153

[lwknight]

I guess you will get a 16.5 bnh if you are using clip on weights.
You made roughly 2.5 % tin + about 7% antimony. More less that is.
The WWs and monotype can vary in composition.

[runfiverun]

the easiest way for me to figure out a mix of alloys is to add the percentages.
for ww/ lino i use a 3-1 quite often and figure it like this.
3+3+3+12 = 21/4 =5.25% antimony.
and the tin is.
.5+.5+.5=4 =5.5/4 1.35% rounded.
i add more tin to get close to a 4/5 mix. i can carry it out and add more lino to get to 4/6 with the tin addition.
it's close enough for my needs and i can predict my outcome.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Thanks guys. I was really surprised at how much different the mix acted when casting compared to regular clip on WW.

[WHITETAIL]

When ever I smelt I mark the batch with a steel stamp.
That way I can use the same lead for the load of boolits.
Then when I make my first batch of boolits and check the
Bn. I now know what kind of boolit it will be.:castmine:

[Charlie Two Tracks]

It's been a couple of weeks and I tested the boolits tonight. The boolist that were cast with WW+2% Tin added were a BHN of 14 and the 3-1 mix tested out at 20.9 BHN. Does that sound about right?

[lwknight]

I would add one more lead or 2 more wheel weights unless you want really hard boolits.
The hardness is entirely plausible.

[John Boy]

I am anxious to see what the BHN is of this mix.
Charlie, if the WW is a Bhn of 12, your 3:1 mix will be about 13.27 (4.96 Sn - 4.67 Sb and 90.38 Pb.
The WW's with Bhn 13.5 is Bhn 14
The WW's with Bhn 15.4 is Bhn 15

[GLL]

Charlie Two Tracks:

My calculations for 3/1 match those of lwknight. I get about 3%Sn 6%Sb 91%Pb which would be approximately 16bnh.
I will mix up a small batch and see if it checks out.

Give us an update on your experiment as well !

Jerry

[Charlie Two Tracks]

They came out at 20.9 BHN. This was in a garage that was 70 deg. at the time. The wheel weights (plus 2% Tin) came out at 14 BHN. The wheel weights are mostly large truck weights. I'm using a Lee tester and being as careful as I can.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Just as an update to this topic, I decided to cast up some boolits from the monotye? that I have. I want to find out what the BHN is, just so I know. I cast 12 boolits and will check them in a week to see what they are. I poured the rest of the mixture into a little frying pan that I have and let it get cool. When it was room temperature, I hit the middle of it with a hammer. The plate broke into three pieces. It was about 1 inch thich and 6 inches in diameter. The stuff sounds like steel when it hits the floor. Very, very hard.

[Bullshop]

I mix monotype with ww at 6 ww to 1 mt and get,
ac bhn 15
quenched bhn 24
The 6/1 alloy flows very well.

[sargenv]

Bear in mind that straight monotype bullets will be very brittle. I have a friend who thought he was using Linotype and it was actually Monotype.. they were 38 super bullets that snapped in two when they hit the feed ramp of his 1911.

[fredj338]

The higher antimony content is taking longer for the sprue to set. I mix lino/lead 3-1 for a 14BHN or so alloy. WW are fine as is, adding monotype is certainly going to harden it further. Try 5-1 or even 6-1 mix if you just want a slightly harder ww allot w/o water dropping.

[bumpo628]

According to my spreadsheet, mixing the following two alloys:
5 lbs - Monotype Alloy, 9.0% Tin, 19.0% Antimony, 72.0% Lead, Brinell 26
15 lbs - Clip On Wheel Weights, 0.5% Tin, 2.0% Antimony, 97.5% Lead, Brinell 12

gives you:
20 lbs - Mixed Alloy, Tin % = 2.63%, Antimony % = 6.25%, Lead % = 91.1%, Est. Brinell 15*

*Using Rotometals formula: Brinell = 8.60 + ( 0.29 * Tin ) + ( 0.92 * Antimony )

[Charlie Two Tracks]

This is what is making me wonder. I have wheel weights that test out air cooled at 14.3 BHN. I have this monotype that I melted and really don't know what BHN it is yet. I mixed 15 lbs of WW with 5 lbs of mono and got AC boolits that after a week tested 20.9. This was all done in a room at 70 deg. I will know in another few days what the mono. tests out at. The BHN test was done with a LEE tester and I tried to be as careful as I could and made more than one test on each piece.

[semtav]

Used a mix of 5 ww and 2 mono for a while. didn't have a bhn on it. might see if i have any left and test them.

[GabbyM]

In your first post you mentioned fill out issues.
I’d keep the temp up to at least 700 * F.
If it takes to long to cool go to your local Dollar Store and grab a six inch fan to blow across your drop table. The fan blowing across your dropped bullets will add about one BHN from a heat treat also.

An aluminum plate heat sink to set your mould on in front of the fan helps also. The plate will cool under the fan as you are filling your mould. Most of all it lets you set the mould down without burning a towel.

[lwknight]

This is what is making me wonder. I have wheel weights that test out air cooled at 14.3 BHN. I have this monotype that I melted and really don't know what BHN it is yet. I mixed 15 lbs of WW with 5 lbs of mono and got AC boolits that after a week tested 20.9. This was all done in a room at 70 deg. I will know in another few days what the mono. tests out at. The BHN test was done with a LEE tester and I tried to be as careful as I could and made more than one test on each piece.

If you don't want them that hard , add 1 more lead to it and you should be real close to hardball 2-6-92 and around a 15 bnh.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I cast about 10 lbs. of them up and will just save the hard boolits in case I want something hard to shoot in the future. The rest of the mix I will mix with some pure lead and get the BHN down. I'm just experimenting with different alloys right now.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Three days into hardening the mix test out at a BHN of 33

[9.3X62AL]

Wow--VERY hard stuff. You might have Foundry type rather than Monotype. Sounds like half/half mix with unalloyed lead would give you some good usable casting alloy.

[Wireman134]

You may have case mono type as I do. As is BHN 32+. I make this high Sb alloy last and use only approx. 11oz of this type metal and 1oz. Sn, with remaining Pb to make a 10lb batch. Water dropped after 24hrs. Bhn is around 15 plenty hard for my pistols.