marlin 1894 .44 mag

[hawken54]

Today I purchased a new marlin .44mag..I took it out of the box,cut the ti-wrap apound the lever and proceded to TRY to load it. My rounds were win. reloads w/ a 240 gr. 429421 (?) bullet. It would not go in the loading gate. My question is...Is this common for marlin or did I get a bum rifle? I took the rifle back and got my money back but, I am puzzled. These loads fit in 3 different pistols and a ruger semi auto. They mike as standard factory. What is going on? The rifle was an 1894 Marlin .44 mag. A new one with the cross bolt safety.

[No_1]

Could you explain the hangup in detail? Would it not start or would it go part way or did it hang on the rim? We need a little more info to help.

Robert


It would not go in the loading gate.

[Denver]

Just a thought, but seems like it would have been better to ask your question before you returned the rifle. Kinda hard to diagnose the problem without having it in hand. I'm curious as to what the dealer had to say when you returned it.

[imashooter2]

Silly question, but you didn't have the lever open when you tried to load did you?

[Ricochet]

I've got a 1970 1894 Marlin in .44 Mag. It'll jam up tighter'n Dick's hatband with a 429421, because the nose of the bullet is too long. It's designed for the short factory jacketed bullet loads. Mine won't even work with the original factory lead semiwadcutters.

[Woolybooger]

I have a crossbolt safety 1894 and had a pre cross bolt. Both loaded 429421s with out a hitch. The one I have now has only had 429421s , 429244s and the hp devastater lyman,run through it. I kinda wondered about the big h.p., but it cycled them ok also.

[longbow]

I have a 1894 Marlin with microgroove barrel 1984 vintage and it has shot quite a number of Lyman 429421 bullets but...

- they are sometimes a little awkward to load due to the shoulder
- they sometimes hang up and won't feed due to the long nose
- sometimes the shoulder hangs up on the chamber mouth
- accuracy isn't great

If you look in the loading manuals you will find that if crimped in the crimp groove they are over length for the Marlin - they have to be seated deep and crimped over the front driving band. Even then they hang up on the chamber mouth on the front edge of the shoulder or cartridge

Personally I don't like the bullet and wouldn't recommend it. It has only given me mediocre accuracy and lots of feeding problems. I now use a round nose flat point with no shoulder, loaded to the right length and have no feeding problems and good accuracy.

Another thing is mine has 1:38 twist microgroove rifling and I have not been able to get bullets heavier than about 265 gr. to stabilize. As long as they are no longer than 0.7" I get great accuracy - any longer (heavier) and accuracy suffers. Both cast and jacketed give me the same results though others here claim good accuracy with bullets up to 300 gr.

Ranchdog has a nice design of round nose flat point at 285 gr. (I think) that seems popular. I wouldn't mind trying it but it has to be over the magical 0.7" at 285 gr. so I would want to sample before buying a mould. The Lyman 429421 is also over the 0.7" max. length for my gun too by the way.

You might want to order a few bullets of different design and weight to try to see what your gun likes then buy a mould to suit.

Another point - if you are handy and want to shoot longer loads you can quite easily modify the bullet stop to allow longer overall length to feed. I wouldn't do it for a 429421 though!

Longbow

[hawken54]

To clerify the problem a little more. The manual did say that o/a length is 1.61 as I remember ,so I ground my bullet down to 1.5 o/a. It would still jam with about 1/4 to 1/2 in of case sticking out. I did manage to get one round in the magazine with much effort. It fed and ejected just fine. I have owned quite a few marlins from an 1881 to a model 39. They all worked fine. I can't believe that marlin would build a rifle that was dedicated to a non standard bullet. 240 gr semi wadcutter was the first .44 mag ammoI bought in 1956. I hope the rifle just had a problem that should have been caught at the factory. The salesman looked for another 94 but that one was the last one they had. I did notice the box had been opened prior to my purchase,if that means anything

[madcaster]

You also may want to push the nose way over toward the left side of the gun as you are loading the magazine tube,this may help???

[Lloyd Smale]

the rcbs 240 swcgc shoots like a house of fire out of two of mine!

[Bass Ackward]

You can't tell what you are going to get until you try really. Mine cycles Keiths out to .173 without ever being modified.

If you ever decide that you want to get a lever, I would take what I want to shoot in a dummy capacity to save all the hastles and frustrations. That might be several rounds so you know what works and what doesn't.

My mind tollerates failure better before I buy for some reason.

[Dixie Slugs]

Friends All......I like the Marlin 1894 series a great deal, but they can be tempermental for bullet nose design. Three years ago, friend John Anderson (Rock Island Ballistics) and I decided to tackle the problem. After many sessions on a lathe and testing feeding, we came up with a 265 gr bullet designed for the 1894's. It is called the Truncated Cone Wadcutter and can be seen on the Rock Island section of Dixie Slugs (dixieslugs.com) or the attached jpg. It feeds perfect and has a larger meplat that the #429421. Loaded with 24 grs of WW296, it's accurate and hardhitting! It is a gas check bullet and is lubed with Rock Island Red.
Regards, James

[78CJ]

I know what you are talking about and had the same problem with my Marlin of '76 vintage. I bought it used and when I got it home I had a hard time feeding factory win 240 grainers through the gate. I was able to surmise that the rounds are so short that it seems that while tensioning the loading gate with the cartridge you end up pushing in too far toward the other side of the tube and binding the round in the whole mess. Since I started tensioning just enough to get the nose started I have not had a problem.

[NVcurmudgeon]

My Marlin 1894 Cowboy didn't like to feed the RCBS 250 Keith until I shortened the cases to 1.265" (.010" shorter than trim-to length.) When beginning to close the lever the nose of boolit would jam against the front of the receiver. It works fine now. I'm guessing that the RCBS boolit is similar to the Lyman 429421. The RCBS 240GC feeds good in unaltered cases.

[Howie38]

Only problem I've had with my M1894 is chambering the really wide metplates. Seems like they hang up a little. Just needs a little more curve in the nose to slide in on.

[Bender]

hi, I'm new here. was referred here by a member of thehighroad.org.

I just bought a marlin 1894 44 mag also, but have not received it yet (should be in sometime this week).

Although I've been handloading for several years, I don't really have any lead bullet experience.

Since marlin's website describes the rifle as having "deep cut Ballard style rifling" I thought it would be ok to buy some .431 diameter bullets for it. I bought some Oregon Trail Laser Cast .431 200gr bullets last time I was at Sportsmans Warehouse. Hope they are ok.

I'm confused about the "microgroove" discussion here, and what the marlin website says ("deep cut").

If the bullets I bought aren't the best for it, I can use them in my taurus 44mag revolver anyway.

thanks for any comments.

PS: this will be my first levergun also. It's the regular model rifle, not the "Cowboy" version.

[Howie38]

Ok let’s see if we can solve this loading gate problem. The same thing happened to me last week with a brand new right out of the box 444XLR. Got it that morning, ran a few patches down the barrel and went to the range. That’s when I discovered I couldn’t get the rounds into the mag. Fortunately I had other Marlins to play with, but I was PO’d !

At home I discovered the problem. The “Carrier” (that little thing that lifts the round up, to be chambered) was not dropping down far enough for the loading gate to open all the way. It was just a fraction of a difference but enough to hang it up, unless I pushed it down by hand. I striped it down blasted it out with some cleaner. Took a fine file to any edges that may come in contact with the sides for good measure. Then sprayed the hinged area (of the Carrier) with some light oil. Works fine now.

My verdict : The hinge was probably gunked up with a little factory grease.

[Howie38]

Oh BTW, Bender,

Bought my Marlin 1894 last year, It’s the ballard type grooving. There’s been some discussions about weather “micro-groove” (which BTW, is excellent for jacketed bullets ) is good for cast. Most say it's fine. But I guess with all the “Cowboy Shooters” out there Marlin decided the old “Ballard” type would be more appealing.

Laser Cast bullets are “hard cast” which is supposed to keep the leading down. Specially with moderate loads. As for mine. 19 grains of 2400 behind 240gr LC’s get’s me 1.5" groups at 75yds.
I’ll take that. :mrgreen:

[Bender]

thanks howie. My 1894 came in today, and I picked it up. as I said above, I have already bought a 500 box of Laser Cast 240gr hard cast bullets. My 44mag dies (Hornady) also came in today from Midway.

So the .431 diameter is ok for this rifle? I notice that other lead bullet companies use other diameters, such as .429 or .430, or even .432.

[Hunter]

I have a Marlin 1894 CS in .357mag/.38 Special and so far no trouble with a various of bullet designs in feeding. I understand this to be a different caliber but I am happy with mine.

[Bender]

I shot my marlin 1894 44mag yesterday for the first time ever. Used the Laser Cast 240gr .431 lead bullets. This was my first time ever shooting a lever gun. The rounds loaded ok, chambered ok, and shot ok.

I'm not sure about the accuracy. I was only shooting at 50 yds, but my eyesight in my old age (47) makes both sights blurry and targets blurry.

I plan to try some Penn bullets after these Laser Casts are used up.

[Howie38]

I only got a year on ya, but my eye sight’s ok. As long as I don’t have to read the fine print. But remember the 44mag is a pistol round used at pistol ranges. So if you can hit a silhouette within 75 yards, your doing ok. I can group’em into the chest area up to 75yds “Quick firing”, off hand with the ghost ring. If this is the first time it’s been fired, It’ll start tightening up over time. Took something like 500 rounds to “break in” my 336C 30/30. But the 1894 seemed to shoot pretty tight right away. I think jacketed bullets will break it in a little quicker than cast though.

[Old Ironsights]

... But remember the 44mag is a pistol round used at pistol ranges. So if you can hit a silhouette within 75 yards, your doing ok.

Ummm... not really. Both the .357 and .44 (and .45LC) become somthing totally different when put into a closed chamber situation (no cylinder gap).

Out of the box my .357 Rossi '92 was giving me 6" groups at 100yds with iron sights.

A levergun in a pistol caliber is a solid deer getter at quite a bit more than "pistol ranges".

[Char-Gar]

I have two Marlin 1894s. One in 357 Mag and another in 44 Mag. Both are/were very, very picky about OAL of rounds. I modified the carriers on both and now they feed the heavier bullets just fine.

[Chuck 100 yd]

Imade up two dummie rounds today for my .44mag. using brass trimed to 1.275
(speer suggested trim length) and seated Lyman 429421`s in them and crimped into the crimp groove. O.A.L. is 1.710 . They fed without a problem in both of my Marlins. 1894 cowboy (2002) and 1894 SS (2005) . I was under the understanding
,from reading the manual that max length that would feed was .610 also. this opens up new avenues to make a cast shooter out of these rifles. Both are very accurate with jacketed bullets but dont do well with the Lee cast bullets that I have tried.

[Bender]

max COL per Marlin is 1.61". I also crimped my Laser Cast 240gr in the crimp groove, and the COL came out to 1.565", I think.

Regarding the ballistics, I was looking over some ballistics tables for 44mag (rifle) and I was really surprised.... it was pretty dang impressive. At least up to 200yds or so.

Next time I'm gonna try shooting rifles without my glasses. I can see close better without glasses. So maybe the sights will be clear, but the target will be blurry. That'll be better than everything being blurry.

[Poohgyrr]

:::: but my eyesight in my old age (47) makes both sights blurry and targets blurry. :::

I'm 50, and have discovered my eye doctor was right.. :roll:

Receiver sights help me, and tang sights are better. :Fire:

[lovedogs]

Saeco mould #431 was designed to eliminate feeding problems in .444 & .44's. It's a RNFPGC design. When I bought a mould for my .44 pistols I got this one because some day I hope to have a .44 lever gun and want to use that bullet. I used the bullet cast from a #2 alloy this fall in my .44 Contender to fill one of my whitetail doe tags. It worked real well and I can't wait to get a '94 Cowboy to try it in.

[mtngunr]

Just chiming in from recollections...many articles about cast bullets in leverguns have come from the pen of John Taffin, him being pretty much the only mainstream guy covering such until relatively recently...and it seems all of his contained a caution about that bullet being a problem in many guns, especially Marlins....and I'm sure his fixes, and those of other folk, wouldn't work in all guns...I very much like Keith bullets in handguns, but with all the problems I've read over the years of folk having when trying to shoot more modern designed bullets covered with sharp corners and long noses out of leveractions, I never even bothered to try....traditional designs are all I've loaded, and I've never had a hint of trouble out of them....if a larger meplat is wanted, the solution is simple....go to a larger caliber (wink)......

[mag44uk]

In the UK Marlin 1894`s took over from when we had our hand guns taken off of us. I shoot a standard 1894 in 44 and use a variety of home cast and commercial boolits.
The one I use most,and cast, is the Lyman 429421 Keith. I have never had a problem with the gun feeding this boolit. Some of the competitions we use these guns in are relatively fast and furious. For example:Twelve rounds ,standing ,in 30 seconds starting with only six in the gun.
These guns have proven to be very reliable.Some of us are shooting in excess of 5000 rounds a year out of them!
The only boolit mine wont feed too well is a Lee 210 grain full wad cutter!
The 429421 from a bench rest will clover leaf 5 rounds at 50 yards.
Just a pity I cant achieve the same freestyle!
I shoot mine out to 300 yards using 240 grain silhouette boolits. About the best I can get is 15 inch group.The 357`s do better at this distance using 35 caliber rifle boolits individually loaded. So long you have to shoot em cos they wont come back out!!
Regards,
Tony

[Four Fingers of Death]

With a name like Hawken, you wern't tring to stick it in the end of the barrel were you? :-D Just Joshin!

I have bought one and and in on the 429421 GB :-( I also picked up a new RCBS 240 gn mould for $AU25 the other day, so I should be good to go.

Most of it's fodder will be 200Gn RNFPs for cowboy shooting, it will be seeing squillions of these!
Mick