Is it really that simple?

[WayBeau]

So I've been trying to get info on a rifle for a buddy of mine and have decided that I will most likely buy it myself. From what I've been told by the knowledgeable people here on this site and what I've been able to find out on my own, I believe it to be an old Enfield that was sporterized. In my research, I have found replacement stocks for it. The person selling the stock says that all it will need is a final fitting and some sanding then you can just drop the action/barrel in, tighten the screws and be ready to hit the range. Is this true? Could I really just make some minor adjustments to the stock, sand it, then put it all together and go fire it?

Now before you light the fires and start the flaming, let me say that I'm 100% ignorant in these matters (thus why I am here, because I'm interested and want to learn). I'm interested because my brother and I are thinking of trying to make a replacement stock for an old 8mm that has been ruined by modern technology and it would be good to know what we'd be getting ourselves into before we started.

I value the information that I'm given on this site, so please give me any and all advice that you feel might help.

Thanks in advance.

[crabo]

The person selling the stock says that all it will need is a final fitting and some sanding then you can just drop the action/barrel in, tighten the screws and be ready to hit the range. Is this true? Could I really just make some minor adjustments to the stock, sand it, then put it all together and go fire it?

.

It's not much work if you say it real fast. Without knowing who the stock is coming from, it is hard to know if they are telling the truth.

[WayBeau]

I guess the real question I have is, what does replacing a stock usually entail in the way of gunsmithing? Aside from the obvious making sure it fits properly, what other steps must be taken in order to ensure the safety of the rifle?

The stock I'm referring to is a Herter's walnut stock.

[elk hunter]

It depends on a number of things. Since you are dealing with an Enfield and the trigger guard still has the step in it at the front, is the new stock made for the step or is it for one that has had the step removed?

The fitting of a stock to any military rifle can be a challenge, but is generally within most peoples ability if they have any sense of how it's supposed to look and fit. As Crabo pointed out it's easy to do if you say it real fast.

[bradh]

You may need all the metal work from the old stock, shouldn't be a big deal.

[swheeler]

The last semi finished Herters gunstock I did was about 1971. If memory serves inletting was pretty well done in the action area, similar to Bishops, Fagen and RMF of recent, barrel channel was 1/2" full length. I liked the prices back then better though, full figured rosewood ran 30.00IIRC, hard as a rock and heavy as iron.

[WayBeau]

My ever so reliable method for determining whether it would work is to compare the pictures of the stock to the pictures of the rifle as it is now. From what I can see, they look like it'd be a pretty good match.

Here's the link to the stock. Tell me if you think I'm a fool and should find another hobby.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=205454981#PIC

So once the stock is made to fit, what's the next step? Is there additional work that must be done, or can I simply put it back together?

[Multigunner]

My ever so reliable method for determining whether it would work is to compare the pictures of the stock to the pictures of the rifle as it is now. From what I can see, they look like it'd be a pretty good match.

Here's the link to the stock. Tell me if you think I'm a fool and should find another hobby.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=205454981#PIC

So once the stock is made to fit, what's the next step? Is there additional work that must be done, or can I simply put it back together?

Looks good to me.
If after getting it you run into a problem you could pay a qualified smith to bed the stock properly, the workman is worth his hire.

There should be tutorials available on stock finishing. All you need to finish a stock is very fine sandpaper, #0000 Steel Wool, and the stock finish of your choice.

[swheeler]

WayBeau; It is listed as 1917/P14 so I'm sure that is what it was inletted for, but can pretty much guantee you it will not be drop in fit, which is fine, that's the way it was designed. It also appears to be for a straightened trigger guard. The price seems very reasonable too, buy it now for 30.00, I would if I needed it! That ugly roll over cheek piece can be altered to a monte or completely removed for a more classic look. .02

[WayBeau]

Here's a pic of the actual rifle. Will the trigger guard match?

Here's the link to the thread about the rifle.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=100148

[waksupi]

Just for a frame of reference. I stock quite a few firearms. My basic charge at the time for a "drop in" stock fitting, bedding, shaping, and finish is $300. If the economy was better, I would be getting around $700 for what I do. Add more for an exhibition grade finish and checkering.
I actually do not make any money at the current price point. There is a bit more to it, than putting the metal in the wood. You need to know how to do a neutral bed of the metal and wood, before the actual bedding begins. If you don't have that, you will always be wondering why your rifle doesn't shoot consistently.

[nicholst55]

Your rifle has the original 'stepped' trigger guard and six-round magazine box. The stock is inletted for a straightened trigger guard, five-round mag box (and shortened trigger). They are NOT the same, and your rifle would require extensive metal work to be able to utilize that stock.

ETA: This stock (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=205459287) is inletted for your rifle; it's made of maple, and maple can be difficult to work with. That stock needs a good deal of work done to it before it will resemble a nice, slim sporter stock, but the price is right!

[Bret4207]

That is NOT a drop in stock. You have several ( at least) hours, if not days, of work ahead of you.

I took a quick google look for drop in stocks, nuthin showing.

[WayBeau]

I'm not looking for a quick weekend project. I'm just interested in getting all of the facts before I get myself in way over my head.

I appreciate all of the help that I've received so far. It seems like it may be easier to just make a custom stock myself. I have all of the basic woodworking tools, are there any special tools that I'd need?

[koehn,jim]

You might also google Richards micro fit stocks in Sun Valley Their stocks need very little fit to drop in. The big question is do you have the wood rasp and chissels to do the final fit. Also dont forget patience it is very rewarding and fun in the end but a lot of work and sweat in the doing.

[WayBeau]

You might also google Richards micro fit stocks in Sun Valley Their stocks need very little fit to drop in. The big question is do you have the wood rasp and chissels to do the final fit. Also dont forget patience it is very rewarding and fun in the end but a lot of work and sweat in the doing.

what kind of rasp will I need. I have a few. My father has all the chisels I could need.

[madsenshooter]

Once you google Richards, don't just go to his site, read some of the feedback from other sites. I'd be leery, judging from what I've read. So that stock is maple? I'll bet it's pretty heavy, I have one that looks to be the same wood, it's a for Krag, the inletting isn't nearly as finished as the one above. The blank weighs in at 3.25lb! It came from a WI company too, was made in the 50's, really dry now!

[swheeler]

WayBeau did you buy the stock? How did this walnut stock mysteriously turn into maple? magic?

[waksupi]

My most used rasps are #49 and #50 cabinet makers rasps, and a Vulcan rasp from Brownell's. I consider all indispensable. Not cheap though, you will pay over $50 each for these.

[WayBeau]

WayBeau did you buy the stock? How did this walnut stock mysteriously turn into maple? magic?

I haven't bought anything yet. There were two stocks listed on Gunbroker, both look the same (in the for sale list), one was walnut and the other I GUESS is maple. The description actually reads, "it is made from male". After looking at both and looking at the picture of the rifle some more, I too believe that the "male" stock is the one that would work better. But I'm still not sure.

[swheeler]

OK I get the same picture, but says auction has ended with buy it now option, then has been relisted? Still shows 1917/P14 stock, target moldel Walnut.
Like I said before it is not a drop in fit, but would make a good project for you. Get yourself a set Jerry Fisher scraper, and a candle to smoke the metal with, take you time and enjoy life. I've made barrel channel rasps out of sureform rasp refill and old screw driver handles, works better than Trimline JR my brother uses. Try it you might like it.

[WayBeau]

Here is a link to the one that was mentioned. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=205459287
I'm actually getting fairly excited. I know a gunsmith will help me out with the stuff that I can't do on my own. My only reservation is that I'm afraid the rifle isn't worth going through the trouble for. I don't want to simply throw money down the drain if there are better options out there.
What do you mean by "smoke the metal"?

[swheeler]

Got it, yep MALE must be MAPLE. You smoke the barreled action as you are fitting/pressing it into the stock, contact places show up black. There are probably many good reference books in your library that could be very helpful, gunsmithing/stockmaking. You cannot beat the price they are asking for this stock. And NO, I'm not the seller. Scot

[waksupi]

Got it, yep MALE must be MAPLE. You smoke the barreled action as you are fitting/pressing it into the stock, contact places show up black. There are probably many good reference books in your library that could be very helpful, gunsmithing/stockmaking. You cannot beat the price they are asking for this stock. And NO, I'm not the seller. Scot

Scot, something I started using a few years ago, is plain old motor oil. I paint on a thin layer with a brush, and it shows up very well for inletting. Remnants can be washed away with thinner before bedding.
When I used inletting black, or carbon, I always looked like I had worked a shift in a coal mine by the end of the day!

[swheeler]

Scot, something I started using a few years ago, is plain old motor oil. I paint on a thin layer with a brush, and it shows up very well for inletting. Remnants can be washed away with thinner before bedding.
When I used inletting black, or carbon, I always looked like I had worked a shift in a coal mine by the end of the day!

I may have to give it a try, I've got 3 or 4 roundtoits in the closet right now.

[WayBeau]

Got it, yep MALE must be MAPLE. You smoke the barreled action as you are fitting/pressing it into the stock, contact places show up black. There are probably many good reference books in your library that could be very helpful, gunsmithing/stockmaking. You cannot beat the price they are asking for this stock. And NO, I'm not the seller. Scot

I will definitely see if I can find a book at the library. In the mean time, let me see if I understand the general idea (note: I said GENERAL IDEA as I'm sure there's more to it).


So you "smoke" the metal, or get enough of a carbon build-up to leave a mark, then you press the metal into the wood. Wherever there is contact between the wood and metal there will be a mark from the carbon build-up. You then use your tool of choice and remove only enough wood so that there will not be a mark the next time you press the metal into the stock. Is this somewhere in the ball park of correct?

[Bret4207]

Yes, but you aim to eventually end up with the action showing equal contact all along it's length, or at the action screw areas if you're doing a pillar type bedding. It's a lot more complex than just chiseling away the dark spots. You have to get it to seat deep enough to look right. Plus, as you bed the action you have to bed the barrel.

Get Dunlops book on gunsmithing or any other book that shows whats involved. It's work.

[WayBeau]

Yes, but you aim to eventually end up with the action showing equal contact all along it's length, or at the action screw areas if you're doing a pillar type bedding. It's a lot more complex than just chiseling away the dark spots. You have to get it to seat deep enough to look right. Plus, as you bed the action you have to bed the barrel.

Get Dunlops book on gunsmithing or any other book that shows whats involved. It's work.

I need something that is going to be work, I need something to do at night.

When fitting the action to the stock how much room, if any, do I leave for the bedding compounds to be applied? On that note, which bedding compounds are the best to use and what type of bedding is the best to do?

[Hamish]

First time posting, have been lurking for a while. I cast 7mm, 357,44,45, 12 ga. slug. Actually bought this same stock in left hand to cut off butt for no1 mk 3, but will be turning it into a rifle for SWMBO it turns out. Had never planned to restock my fathers '41 K98 but scout scoped it awhile back and for laughs tore it down and trial fitted it to the P14/17 stock. The action length, pillar location, trigger location is so close as to be laughable. I believe that I can make this stock work. The only downside I can see is the air gap around the magazine will be about 1/8th inch. Have truly appreciated this site for info for future CB info for .303, 8mm, and MN. Truly enjoy casting for T/C Contender, but silhouette shooting has petered out here and have been itching to load boolits for the rifles. Great website, guy's! @(:^]# (If anyone is interested when I do the stock retro I will take pics and post)

[WayBeau]

Hamish,
I'd be interested in seeing the final result. I decided not to go through with this project. The rifle didn't check out so well and I don't have the resources to get it to the point that I would like. . . .so it got sidelined. Hopefully, I'll be able to find one that I can turn into a project.