Teen girl, honor student, cheerleader about to have her life ruined

[Trey45]

This was copied in its entirety from another forum, the entire gun community needs to come together for this.


Sixteen-year-old Demarie DeReu is an honor roll student, a member of the Columbia Falls (Montana) High School Student Council and a varsity cheerleader. Although she has no intent to break any rules or laws, or harm anyone, Demarie is at risk of having her college education derailed and maybe even being identified forever as a domestic terrorist.

Why? Demarie went hunting over Thanksgiving with family and friends. She forgot that her unloaded hunting rifle was cased and locked in the trunk of her car. When she arrived at school, she parked in the school parking lot because to park anywhere else is an expulsion offense at CFHS. Upon hearing that the "contraband dog" was to be working the school parking lot, Demarie remembered her unloaded hunting rifle secured in the trunk of her car AND she voluntarily informed school
officials.

Next monday, December 13, at 6 PM, Demarie will face her expulsion hearing before the local school board. She will possibly have her life derailed because a bunch of school idiots insist that she must be subject to an irrational, "zero tolerance" policy about guns in schools that does not countenance lack of bad intent. The theory that people with malice will be intimidated into good conduct if people without malice are punished in lieu of them is idiocy at its finest.

At the upcoming hearing, education officials will tell school board members that they have no choice - that state law and good gamesmanship require the school board to levy harsh and record-destroying punishment against Demarie. They will be wrong!

The controlling Montana law about this is 20-5-202, M.C.A. <>http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/mca/20/5/20… , which says about expulsion for bringing guns "to school," "... the trustees may authorize the school administration to modify the requirement for expulsion of a student on a case-by-case basis." Further, "to school" is not defined in 20-5-2-202, but is at 45-8-361, M.C.A. <>http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/mca/45/8/45… as "... in a school building." Demarie's hunting rifle was cased and locked in the trunk of her car in the parking lot, but not "in a school building."

What can you do about this outrage?

Forward this message to every gun owner you know, in Flathead County, in Montana, or elsewhere.

Send messages to school officials and school board members. Use your own words and be
polite. Remember, they think they wear white hats, even if you don't think so. It IS okay to say you feel very strongly about this, but no profanity and no name-calling, please.

School Dist 6, 501 6th Ave W. Columbia Falls, MT 59912
406-892-6550

Mike Nicosia Superintendent mnicosia@sd6.k12.mt.us
Alan Robbins Principal arobbins@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Gaiser Asst. Principal sgaiser@sd6.k12.mt.us

School board Members
Jill Rocksund jrocksund@sd6.k12.mt.us
Dean Chisholm dchisholm@sd6.k12.mt.us
Barbara Riley
briley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Darrell Newby dnewby@sd6.k12.mt.us
Gail Pauley gpauley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Jim Henjum jhenjum@sd6.k12.mt.us
Larry Wilson lwilson@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Emmerich semmerich@sd6.k12.mt.us

Copy to the local newspaper. The local daily newspaper would very much like to receive a copy of whatever you send to these folks. Please copy the Kalispell Daily Interlake at:
editor@ <mailto:editor@dailyinterlake.com> dailyinterlake.com <mailto:editor@dailyinterlake.com>

Email suggestions. For your
emails, I suggest a Subject line of: "Free Demarie DeReu"

In addition to whatever else you recommend to administration and school board members, I suggest you include the following:

1) Demarie DeReu should be given no more than a verbal warning that she should not in the future pack her hunting rifle to school (I think she's learned that by now);

2) Demarie DeReu should be given an award for being honest and volunteering to school officials about the unloaded and cased hunting rifle locked in the trunk of her car;

3) Demarie DeReu should be held out as an example to other students for her participation in essential wildlife management in Montana; and

4) That when the Legislature considers education funding in the upcoming legislative session, legislators will consider the outcome of this case as an example of
how schools are using taxpayer resources in Montana.

Thanks loads for your help with this.
Gary Marbut, president
Montana Shooting Sports Association
http://www.mtssa.org

[stainless1911]

Hope you dont mind, Im going to cross post this over on OpenCarry.org

[Trey45]

It needs to be posted EVERYWHERE. Please do!

[stainless1911]

Done.

[leftiye]

Our shools - demonstrating the "Peter principle" at it's most extreme (and finest).

[steg]

The real sad part is that if she didn't mention it, it more than likley would never have been known, so much for teaching our young'uns honesty...................................steg

[stainless1911]

In Michigan, it is illegal to carry a gun on school premises without a CPL. Even with a CPL it is illegal to conceal a gun, parking lots excluded, if you are picking up or dropping off a student at the school. This means that a person with a CPL can carry openly in or around any k-12 school, but the students can still find themselves in the same sort of trouble for having a toy gun, or a T-shirt *see US Constitution* with a gun on it.

[Recluse]

I have forwarded this to every e-mail list I have. Will be calling several of these bozos Wednesday morning, and in the meantime, I sent the following e-mail to every address listed up above in Trey's post.



Regarding Sixteen-year-old Demarie DeReu, your honor roll student and member of the Columbia Falls High School Student Council and a varsity cheerleader--

I support a Zero Tolerance Policy, believe it or not.

I support a Zero Tolerance policy for dismissing administrators who simply lack the ability to apply common sense and proper judgment to a case such as the one involving Ms. DeReu.

I support a Zero Tolerance policy for keeping school board members in their seats who continue to allow (so-called) administrators to exercise draconian "no tolerance" policies without any thought or review of ALL of the facts. Such people who hold such positions of responsibility and who are elected to oversee our public education system and who blindly support these nefarious no-thought zero tolerance policies deserve to have their asses kicked right off the school board as they are UNFIT to serve in such a role.

The purpose of our education system is to offer our young people a quality education. Within that education falls the ability for our young people to learn and polish values such as honesty and integrity. Admitting a mistake is a virtue of both honesty and integrity. Punishing a young person for holding forth to such values sends not only the wrong message to the young person in question, Ms. DeReu, but the entire student body--and in fact, every single young person in America.

In essence, you are teaching them it is better to lie or to be dishonest and then take their chances.

Nice going. Great use of our public tax dollars.

That is why I support a Zero Tolerance for school administrators who take the easy way out holding forth to a "zero tolerance" policy rather than acting like the educated adults we trust you to be and looking at the situation from all angles, considering all factors--including the young lady's otherwise exemplary history--and making the right decision regarding her future.

Should you find yourself unable to do this, please be advised that we, the taxpayers and supporters of your education system, WILL take note and we WILL work to remove you from your position.

Because you see, we have a Zero Tolerance for administrators who are incapable of exercising proper and fair judgment and acting in the best interest of the student involved.

Just last month, the entire nation witnessed how fed up we the people are with pig-headed bureaucrats who look out for themselves more than they do those they are elected and/or hired to serve. We sent those people to the unemployment line.

Do the right thing. Let Ms. DeReu continue her education and commend her for being forthright and honest about having left her legal hunting rifle in her car. She had zero intent to do anything illegal or immoral. Do not make this into something it obviously is not.

Sincerely,

xxx xxxxxxx

I'm tired of being polite and PC and "urging" in such communications. All that gets us is more of the same garbage. It's time to let these bozos know that there will be consequences for their poor decisions.

:coffee:

[spqrzilla]

Zero tolerance has always meant that school administrators are too stupid to be given discretion.

Sadly, its the only truthful thing about such silly policies.

[S.R.Custom]

...Upon hearing that the "contraband dog" was to be working the school parking lot, Demarie remembered her unloaded hunting rifle secured in the trunk of her car AND she voluntarily informed school
officials...

That's a shame...

There's something to be said for practicing your best steely-eyed Clint Eastwood squint in the mirror while uttering those three words that make rent-a-cop thugs everywhere shake in their sensible shoes: "Get a warrant."

[hickstick_10]

I dont understand why she would tell the school officials. Dont get me wrong, the schools over reacting, but what would posses her to tell the school about a cased and locked rifle in the trunk of a car?

Makes no sense.

[hiram]

This was my response:



To the following:

Mike Nicosia Superintendent mnicosia@sd6.k12.mt.us
Alan Robbins Principal arobbins@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Gaiser Asst. Principal sgaiser@sd6.k12.mt.us

School board Members
Jill Rocksund jrocksund@sd6.k12.mt.us
Dean Chisholm dchisholm@sd6.k12.mt.us
Barbara Riley
briley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Darrell Newby dnewby@sd6.k12.mt.us
Gail Pauley gpauley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Jim Henjum jhenjum@sd6.k12.mt.us
Larry Wilson lwilson@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Emmerich semmerich@sd6.k12.mt.us

The action of Ms. Demarie DeReu was without malice. She voluntarily informed authorities of a loaded, cased, rifle in the trunk of her car. She was not hiding anything and had no devious plans or she would not have made this situation known.

Can you with a clear conscious ruin the life of an above average, academic achiever, college bound student, because you don't see past the end of your noses? Four years of high school, down the tubes--good going administrators.

Respectfully,

Hiram Golden
retired teacher,
NYC DOE
31 years+

[waksupi]

Montana code says that firearms are only restricted in the buildings, not the grounds. I sent the law to all of the parties involved. I know Larry Wilson, and he is a very strong 2nd Amendment supporter. Hopefully, this dies a quick and quiet death.


This was my response:



To the following:

Mike Nicosia Superintendent mnicosia@sd6.k12.mt.us
Alan Robbins Principal arobbins@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Gaiser Asst. Principal sgaiser@sd6.k12.mt.us

School board Members
Jill Rocksund jrocksund@sd6.k12.mt.us
Dean Chisholm dchisholm@sd6.k12.mt.us
Barbara Riley
briley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Darrell Newby dnewby@sd6.k12.mt.us
Gail Pauley gpauley@sd6.k12.mt.us
Jim Henjum jhenjum@sd6.k12.mt.us
Larry Wilson lwilson@sd6.k12.mt.us
Scott Emmerich semmerich@sd6.k12.mt.us

The action of Ms. Demarie DeReu was without malice. She voluntarily informed authorities of a loaded, cased, rifle in the trunk of her car. She was not hiding anything and had no devious plans or she would not have made this situation known.

Can you with a clear conscious ruin the life of an above average, academic achiever, college bound student, because you don't see past the end of your noses? Four years of high school, down the tubes--good going administrators.

Respectfully,

Hiram Golden
retired teacher,
NYC DOE
31 years+

[waksupi]

Dear Sir,

I'm afraid you have found yourself in a sticky situation.

Montana Code 45-8-361 specifies firearms within school buildings, not in vehicles in parking areas.

45-8-361. Possession or allowing possession of weapon in school building -- exceptions -- penalties -- seizure and forfeiture or return authorized -- definitions. (1) A person commits the offense of possession of a weapon in a school building if the person purposely and knowingly possesses, carries, or stores a weapon in a school building.
(2) A parent or guardian of a minor commits the offense of allowing possession of a weapon in a school building if the parent or guardian purposely and knowingly permits the minor to possess, carry, or store a weapon in a school building.
(3) (a) Subsection (1) does not apply to law enforcement personnel.
(b) The trustees of a district may grant persons and entities advance permission to possess, carry, or store a weapon in a school building.
(4) (a) A person convicted under this section shall be fined an amount not to exceed $500, imprisoned in the county jail for a term not to exceed 6 months, or both. The court shall consider alternatives to incarceration that are available in the community.
(b) (i) A weapon in violation of this section may be seized and, upon conviction of the person possessing or permitting possession of the weapon, may be forfeited to the state or returned to the lawful owner.
(ii) If a weapon seized under the provisions of this section is subsequently determined to have been stolen or otherwise taken from the owner's possession without permission, the weapon must be returned to the lawful owner.
(5) As used in this section:
(a) "school building" means all buildings owned or leased by a local school district that are used for instruction or for student activities. The term does not include a home school provided for in 20-5-109.
(b) "weapon" means any type of firearm, a knife with a blade 4 or more inches in length, a sword, a straight razor, a throwing star, nun-chucks, or brass or other metal knuckles. The term also includes any other article or instrument possessed with the purpose to commit a criminal offense.

History: En. Sec. 1, Ch. 435, L. 1997; amd. Sec. 6, Ch. 581, L. 1999.

I urge you to drop any actions on this case. Considering the great interest taken by firearms rights groups on this event, I beleive it is fairly sure that there will be law suits against you personally, and the school district.

Sincerely,
Ric Carter

[Bullshop]

That auta get thier attention. I just love happy endings and I think we are going to see one.

[Echo]

Done and done.

[August]

Did any of you verify this story before spinning the propellers on your beanies???

If so, how did you go about verifying it???

Here's what I found at NBC in Columbia Fall:

Columbia Falls Student Faces Expulsion For Gun On School Grounds
By Jessica Headley
POSTED: 6:53 pm MST December 7, 2010
EmailPrint
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COLUMBIA FALLS, Mont. -- A Columbia Falls High School honor student faces expulsion after she accidentally left her unloaded hunting gun in the trunk of her car. She voluntarily notified school officials that she had forgotten it was there when the school announced it was doing a routine check. The school says it has to follow federal mandates and is holding a hearing to discuss whether she will be expelled.
The school district says it has the best intentions for the student and that federal lawmakers would do well to consider revisions for special, unintentional situations like these.

Doesn't sound like the the school officials and board members are evil, narrow minded, parochial, or incompetent. Sounds like DeMarie got all of them involved in something they'd rather not be involved in. You guys do remember Columbine, right??? You do know how we got here as a civilization governed by law, right?? Why complicate the lives of the school officials with your email???

When I was a kid, half the pickups in the High School parking lot had a gun rack in the back with guns in it. Many of those trucks had their windows down. We didn't think twice about it. I wish it was still that way. But, sadly, it isn't. I understand why it isn't. But, none of that has to do with the actions of the staff, administration, or board of the Columbia Falls High School.

[Recluse]

Did any of you verify this story before spinning the propellers on your beanies???

The school says it has to follow federal mandates and is holding a hearing to discuss whether she will be expelled.

Now why the hell would a LOCAL school district in a SOVEREIGN STATE have to follow FEDERAL MANDATES regarding a law that DOESN'T EXIST? (firearms on school parking lot)

Sounds to me like the school district's spin-person is doing damage control.

This thing should never have even become an issue in the first place, and the school district had that ability to make sure it never became an issue. They're trying to play both sides of the street--but now there's a significant backlash.

To hell with them. It's that kind of administration mentality that cripples the good teachers.

:coffee:

[waksupi]

Well, since I live about 20 miles south of there, and got the story from the local broadcast, I think I'm as sure of the story as possible. NBC in Columbia Falls? I'm not sure they even have an affiliate up here anymore.
They did move the scheduled meeting to a larger venue, to handle the expected crowd.

[QUOTE=August;1080541]Did any of you verify this story before spinning the propellers on your beanies???

If so, how did you go about verifying it???

Here's what I found at NBC in Columbia Fall:

[crabo]

I dont understand why she would tell the school officials. Dont get me wrong, the schools over reacting, but what would posses her to tell the school about a cased and locked rifle in the trunk of a car?

Makes no sense.

You would be suprised what some dogs can find. I had a student get busted for 30/30 ammo, no gun, and a filet knife in his tackle box, in his truck. He had to go to Alternative school for a while.

[redneckdan]

In high school during a drug dog search the dog keyed really hard on a specific locker. The officials went and pulled the student in question out of class. Upon the student opening the locker the drug dog surged forward pulling the handler off balance. The dog proceeded to extract the kids back pack from the locker, shred the ever loving piss out of it and devoured the peanut butter, grape jelly and banana sandwich that he brought for lunch.......I'm pretty sure that one got sent back to training school.....

[DragoonDrake]

I dont understand why she would tell the school officials. Dont get me wrong, the schools over reacting, but what would posses her to tell the school about a cased and locked rifle in the trunk of a car?

Makes no sense.

When I was a senior in high school, I made it very plain and clear that I worked in a gunshop in my spare time.
One day some 22lr brass was found. I was wearing my work shoes and figured that it came from me. I was held in the office until it was found out that somebody else had brought the brass in in his jacket. I informed the principal "...that the next time I bring brass or a knife in on accident don't expect me to inform you. Actually next time just bring the damn cop in. "

Honesty does not get you anywhere in schools. Sad but true.

[AZ-Stew]

Now why the hell would a LOCAL school district in a SOVEREIGN STATE have to follow FEDERAL MANDATES regarding a law that DOESN'T EXIST? (firearms on school parking lot)

Sounds to me like the school district's spin-person is doing damage control.
:

Recluse,

Do a search on "gun free school zones act". Look at the Wikipedia and Gun Owners of America entries.

It's virtually impossible to travel in any developed area with a gun in the car.

Regards,

Stew

[firefly1957]

These stories really tick me off it would be fine IF it was not just politics but it is . Last year there was a story out of Seattle were the school was involved in getting a 15 year old girl a abortion. Problem they ignored the very same laws that apply in a firearms case that girl is to young to consent to having sex in Washington so she was raped. Even if she wasn't it is still child abuse which by law must be reported to law enforcement. Instead the girl had an abortion her mother was not notified and law enforcement was not either. Now the abortion doctor destroyed the fetus which should of been evidence in a criminal case and he/she also did not report a crime of a 15 year old girl being pregnant. If she had a gunshot wound no matter how minor I bet law enforcement would have been involved . I wonder if a school has ever made abuse complaint for a bruise from recoil I bet they would if they knew about it?
I hope you see the point I am trying to make this is strictly politics and has NOTHING to do with the law or many pregnant girls would be turned over to law enforcement. There is no law against having a picture of a gun but how many kids get expelled for that each year ? I have heard a few parents have won law suites against schools for expelling kids for non-weapons but they also had gag orders if they settled out of court.
My goofy son had a T-shirt said "BOMB TECH IF YOU SEE ME RUNNING TRY TO KEEP UP" fortunately he never got into trouble but one teacher did make him wear his jacket in her class.

[firefly1957]

PS all public schools should obey the constitution so legally possessed guns would not be banned!!!

[Jal5]

I sent one to all the people listed. I hope this helps the student. We are in a bad way in our country...nobody can think situations through anymore and apply wisdom to situations like this.

Joe

[Trey45]

Did any of you verify this story before spinning the propellers on your beanies???

Yes, I did, thanks for asking.....

The young girl about to have her life ruined probably appreciates the "spinning the propellers on your beanies" sentiment displayed by almost everyone responding to this thread. It's those spinning propellers that fan the winds of change.

[MT Gianni]

When my wife worked at our local school the dogs would sniff through the parking lot. Any action resulted in having questions asked about forearms in the truck and students or staff being asked to move their rig off of school property. This was 2006-2008. Common sense can prevail but it needs to be in small towns IME.

[sargenv]

We had the same thing happen to a young man here in Cali.. up inthe valley near where I hunt waterfowl.. the kicker was that he wasn't even parked on school property and they discovered an unloaded shotgun and ammo (since he hunted in the morning before school) and they raised all sorts of stuff about it.. pretty lame if you ask me.

[old turtle]

I bet that school has a lot of sharp knifes in their kitchen just waiting to attack. It is true, common sense in America is dead. Most school administrators are bureaucratic weenes who know they can not get in trouble by not making a decision. There is no reason for it, it's just our policy.

[Jarhead68]

What a sad day in this once great nation!

[leftiye]

What a bunch of weenies. (school, not youse guys)

[outdoorfan]

Sad. Really hope it works out for her. Just another reason for parents to keep their kids out of the cess pool government fool system.

[Murphy]

Just found this thread.

Emailed everyone on the list with a polite few words and the 4 suggestions. Hopefully this one will turn out good and some commonsense restored.

If it doesn't? I figure due to the massive amount of emails they've all received by now...they hope they never have to face another dilema such as this one.

Murphy

[geargnasher]

Makes me sick to think every time I see a white cross over a US serviceman's grave what has become of what they died for.

When I was in high school 15 years ago there were a dozen pickup trucks out of maybe fifty total vehicles in the Junior/Senior parking lot that routinely had at least a loaded .22 rifle in the gun rack, windows always down. Many of us carried large folding knives openly in belt scabbards, removed our hats when we walked indoors, and were respectful to each other and the teachers/administration. As you would expect, no terrorists ever invaded the school, and none of us shot or cut each other. I'm afraid this country is about to get legislated back to the stone age.

Gear

[waksupi]

I saw the local paper today, and this topic is the lead item on the first page. It looks like the administration is back peddling at full speed. Apparently the wienie administrator doesn't appreciate all the email he has received.

http://www.dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_ba86d8ca-040d-11e0-9e13-001cc4c002e0.html

[stainless1911]

The open carry.org forum has had quite a bit to say about this.

[a.squibload]

Assuming the guy who commented on the article is correct, she did not even break the Federal Gun-Free School Zones Act.
He posted this section of Montana State Law:

"M.C.A. 45-8-360. Establishment of individual licensure. In consideration that the right to keep and bear arms is protected
and reserved to the people in Article II, section 12, of the Montana constitution, a person who has not been convicted of a violent, felony crime
and who is lawfully able to own or to possess a firearm under the Montana constitution is considered to be individually licensed and verified
by the state of Montana within the meaning of the provisions regarding individual licensure and verification in the federal Gun-Free School Zones Act."

If school policy is stricter than state law, something is wrong.
Of course, this could be corrected in court.
The administrator(s) are probably ignorant of the law, but don't care enough
to find out that their policy is wrong.

Also, from the article, this quote is evidence that the administrator has already caved
to the Politically Correct crowd:

"... I’m sure in a case like this, a student would be allowed to make up their work.”

Maybe I'm picky, but "a student" is singular, and "their" is plural.
Oh well, don't wanna inadvertently offend anyone, er, I mean anybody, uh, no that's wrong, any person? No, that leaves out animals.
PC is harder than I thought.

[outdoorfan]

I saw the local paper today, and this topic is the lead item on the first page. It looks like the administration is back peddling at full speed. Apparently the wienie administrator doesn't appreciate all the email he has received.

http://www.dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_ba86d8ca-040d-11e0-9e13-001cc4c002e0.html

GOOD! Pricks!

Gear, you got it. When the moral compass is out of whack, no good thing can come of it. That's just about where we're at these days.

[Bloodman14]

Just the other day, I gave a speech in my Human Communications class about concealed carry on campus; it was a rehash of the research paper I did for English Comp. 101 on the same subject. They both got the attention of the students. I have had several ask me about the subject after class; hopefully, I have some converts! OTC is currently a 'no guns' campus.

[Frank]

From the article
a member of the Columbia Falls (Montana) High School Student Council and a varsity cheerleader.
What does her position in the school have to do with anything? Does that make her some kind of a super citizen? She did an incredibly irresponsible thing, forgetting her rifle in the trunk. Where were her parents? How come that rifle wasn't taken home after hunting and put in the safe? We're talking about a minor here. Someone who just got a driver's license. She's obviously forgetful and exercises poor judgement. Was it loaded? Was the car locked? These kind of people are going to get us all in trouble. Little girl needs to pay the price for her error. Who cares if it puts a bad mark on her career? Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up. And if she can't do that, then she shouldn't have a gun.

[Heavy lead]

From the article
What does her position in the school have to do with anything? Does that make her some kind of a super citizen? She did an incredibly irresponsible thing, forgetting her rifle in the trunk. Where were her parents? How come that rifle wasn't taken home after hunting and put in the safe? We're talking about a minor here. Someone who just got a driver's license. She's obviously forgetful and exercises poor judgement. Was it loaded? Was the car locked? These kind of people are going to get us all in trouble. Little girl needs to pay the price for her error. Who cares if it puts a bad mark on her career? Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up. And if she can't do that, then she shouldn't have a gun.

Stop inhaling Frank

[Suo Gan]

From the article
What does her position in the school have to do with anything? Does that make her some kind of a super citizen? She did an incredibly irresponsible thing, forgetting her rifle in the trunk. Where were her parents? How come that rifle wasn't taken home after hunting and put in the safe? We're talking about a minor here. Someone who just got a driver's license. She's obviously forgetful and exercises poor judgement. Was it loaded? Was the car locked? These kind of people are going to get us all in trouble. Little girl needs to pay the price for her error. Who cares if it puts a bad mark on her career? Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up. And if she can't do that, then she shouldn't have a gun.

I get that you are a negative nelly, a fellow that looks at life as the glass is half empty, being contradictory at the drop of a hat suits you just fine. If your assinine statements tick people off all the better for you. I bet if you went to some other gun hating site on the net and they were saying that this girl got what she deserves, and I hope they throw the book at her, you would say, Wait a minute, things happen, she in fact did not break any laws, and she is a good kid. But I get that you need to ALWAYS take a contrary view of anything being said that the majority of us agree with here. This was an innocent thing, done by someone with good character, she told them about her mistake, locking her up and throwing away the key is clearly NOT the answer to this situation. A punishment of some sort maybe, but putting a bad mark on her career, and taking the right of gun ownership away??? C'mon now, come back to earth!

[shooterg]

Geez, Frank.. I've had at least one firearm in my trunk or truck toolbox every day, everywhere for the last 40 or so years, starting when I could first drive. Guess I have terrible judgement too - or maybe the rules/regulators are what's wrong in this politically correct age ?

[jcwit]

Frank, go chew on a lead boolet.

With your compassion frank, I hope you're not a Dr.

[waksupi]

No kidding. The county this is in, is considered the most heavily armed area in the United States. I'm sure not many even have a gun safe. Since this is a serious hunting area, it would be more strange for people to not have guns. Mom's pick up their kids from school, with rifles in the rack in the back window.

[Trey45]

Now I remember why I have Frank on my ignore list.

[swheeler]

From the article
What does her position in the school have to do with anything? Does that make her some kind of a super citizen? She did an incredibly irresponsible thing, forgetting her rifle in the trunk. Where were her parents? How come that rifle wasn't taken home after hunting and put in the safe? We're talking about a minor here. Someone who just got a driver's license. She's obviously forgetful and exercises poor judgement. Was it loaded? Was the car locked? These kind of people are going to get us all in trouble. Little girl needs to pay the price for her error. Who cares if it puts a bad mark on her career? Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up. And if she can't do that, then she shouldn't have a gun.

This kind of thinking is what makes these piss ignorant laws pass in the first place. .02

[Frank]

From original post:
Trey45:
3) Demarie DeReu should be held out as an example to other students for her participation in essential wildlife management in Montana; and

Sorry, that's a little on the corny side if you ask me. ;)

[Frank]

waksupi:
Mom's pick up their kids from school, with rifles in the rack in the back window.

I had no idea. If that's true I can see how she would think's it's alright. But why the worry when she heard about the dogs sniffing? Why did she automatically feel something was out of place then?

[jcwit]

Sorry, that's a little on the corny side if you ask me.

Nobody asked you, you volunteered your opinion such as it is.


I had no idea. If that's true I can see how she would think's it's alright. But why the worry when she heard about the dogs sniffing? Why did she automatically feel something was out of place then?

Only she can tell us what went on in her mind at that time, anything other than that is pure speculation.

[Frank]

Suo Gan:
This was an innocent thing, done by someone with good character, she told them about her mistake, locking her up and throwing away the key is clearly NOT the answer to this situation. A punishment of some sort maybe, but putting a bad mark on her career, and taking the right of gun ownership away??? C'mon now, come back to earth!

Did all that happen? I doubt it. What I find puzzling is why do all these grown men here make such a big deal over a little girl and put her at the center of a gun rights topic. If you want to make an issue for gun rights, do it yourself. Don't hide behind the skirt of this young female. Maybe she doesn't want all your attention. Leave her alone and let her grow up. The school too probably hopes this will all go away.

[stainless1911]

This is a gun rights issue. The .gov has decided to extinguish gun rights by using the schools to teach the next generation that guns are bad. This is a product of their work.

[jcwit]

Maybe she doesn't want all your attention. Leave her alone and let her grow up. The school too probably hopes this will all go away.

So you have put yourself in the position as to just what she wants and how her future goes?


big deal over a little girl

Little girl? She's old enough to drive, 2 years from being a full fledged adult, little girl, I like to hear her response to that statement!

I guess if nothing else frank, once again you've found a topic you can stir the pot with and create controversy, seems to be what you're best at.

[a.squibload]

Hearing about the search dogs probably jogged her memory.
Same as when I approach a building with a "no guns" sign, a building I may have visited before.
Not absolutely necessary that I go back to the car as nobody yet has detected my pistol (not that I know of anyway!),
but I do the right thing and "turn myself in", leaving it in the car according to the wishes of the management.
No bad intent, no harm except to my pride due to bad policy supported by state law.
I vote to give her a break, there was no need for such a dramatic reaction in the first place.

[Recluse]

Now I remember why I have Frank on my ignore list.

Ditto.

:coffee:

[Frank]

jcwit:
Little girl? She's old enough to drive, 2 years from being a full fledged adult, little girl, I like to hear her response to that statement!

Look at teen drivers. Do they know what they're doing? Look at the accident rate. Do you have confidence in a teenager to do the right thing? I don't. I see them all the time at the range and it's chaos. I've seen teen girls at the range with Dad. All they did the whole time was laugh and giggle after every shot. I would shudder to think what it would be like without him, let alone having any one of them having their own gun. She forgot it was there? What if she forgot it when she took it to the car wash and it got stolen?

[jcwit]

frank, your world seems to wonder around "what ifs".


Do you have confidence in a teenager to do the right thing? I don't.

I see many teenagers conducting themselves in a responsiable manner and yes I have confidence in our future generation. In fact I have as much if not more than in the older generation of drunks and drug users we also have of the roads.

frank, you only seem to have confidence in those that you pick as abiding by what you think as the right thing to do.

If you expect to find this perfect person you expect to be talking about that never makes a mistake, PLEASE do not look in the mirror, for that image is flawed.

But keep stiring the pot, you are in the minority.

[waksupi]

The meeting starts at 6PM. Gary Marbutt did a bit more looking at the laws, and it appears the school was completely in the wrong. This may turn out good, as he is presenting new legislation to prevent any thing like this happening again in Montana.

I'm sure Frank would prefer she would have rolled over in a submissive position. That is what the government wants everyone to do.

[leftiye]

Amen.

[MtGun44]

"laugh and giggle after every shot."

God forbid that someone would enjoy shooting.

Bill

[Frank]

leftiye:
Don't retreat, reload - Sarah Palin

jcwit:
In fact I have as much if not more than in the older generation of drunks and drug users we also have of the roads.


Yeah, she's reloading allright. I don't have much confidence in the older generation either. :mrgreen:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HW0Xx4DXkYk

[jcwit]

Then you have a recourse left. Go off and live by yourself, you may even be happy as it seems you're not at present.

frank,are you trying to show us how the first rifle wasn't sighted in?

And he's off and awaaaaay to stir the pot elsewhere!!

[.357]

I sent out emails and made phone calls. We had a similar incident once at the very first school i taught at. Kid reported it to me, so i told him to have his mom call in and check him out for an appointment, and go put the .243 that was his grandfathers in the safe. Reminded him that guns at school were no good and that he could loose the rifle. he turned really white (hard to do for this little latino kid) thanked me and scampered out of the room to call his mom.

Crying shame that this would happen in Montana of all places, I'm looking at picking up property in Montana for recreation/retirement. I'll be watching this with some interest.

[Frank]

jcwit:
Then you have a recourse left. Go off and live by yourself, you may even be happy as it seems you're not at present.

frank,are you trying to show us how the first rifle wasn't sighted in?

And he's off and awaaaaay to stir the pot elsewhere!!

C'mon. Can't you be nice? It's after hours. Time to let all grudges go.

[swheeler]

Unanimous decision by school board, Demarie DeReu will not be explelled. Smart move!

[jcwit]

Fantisic!!!! Mayhap there still is some common sense out there after all.

[DIRT Farmer]

That gives me a little more confidence in elected officals. Bad policy needs a recourse.

[shooterg]

They did the right thing in the end. Sometimes the system works and common sense triumphs.
Probably a different outcome if in some other states though.

[Bad Water Bill]

Personally FRANK THE TROL has been on my ignore list for a long time. One of these days I hope he goes back under his rock and someone steps on it.

As far as her not being old enough at 16 well how old was AUDIE MURPHY when he and MANY more teen agers stepped up and signed the check. Did you Frank?

[The Double D]

For what it is worth.

Based on what has been reported the Kalispell Newspaper this morning I don't think we have heard the last of this.

My assumption is based on what was reported http://www.dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_96a4baac-073d-11e0-a8e8-001cc4c002e0.html

If what was reported is accurate it appears that this young ladies action was lawful under federal law.

The paper reports that federal law specifically stated that sporting, recreational or cultural purposes were not weapons under that law.

If that is true, since State and school district policy are based on the federal law then the action of the school was outside the law.

It will be interesting to see how this shakes.

A comment also on Frank and his remarks. Do not be harsh on him. His position is widely accepted in urban areas especially the east coast where there are more strip malls and parking lots, than places to hunt and shoot. It points out the difference between urban lifestyle and a rural life style. And it is a plank of the Democratic Party.

[waksupi]

She is still on probation, and from a communication I got, her lawyer is going to pursue the matter, to have her record completely cleared. The school board may have really screwed up by not making a clean sweep of this. Rights violations lawsuits are now wide open.

[leftiye]

When dealing with bureaucrats, dumbocraps, etc. Teddy Roosevelt had it right. Don't leave 'em any way to get away with doing the stupid alternative, and they'll act wisely.

And P. S. - School management types fear a lawsuit above all else.

[luvtn]

Frank wrote: "Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up." The gun was locked up in the trunk. She did the right thing.
luvtn

[hickstick_10]

I will say I'm guilty of leaving a boomstick in my jeep, but I never went to a school or college that had dogs. And was, and am a firm believer that a man can get away with almost anything if he doesn't tell anyone (although I suppose I'm busted now :()

Honestly I'm glad the girl got her life back, but I hope she's learned something valuable from the mess, like maybe NOT TELLING PEOPLE EVERYTHING, or at least parking off the school grounds, if old faithful is in the car.

I know nothing about smell hounds, but I can say that I have went through airports and my bags have never been flagged even though I went shooting with some of the clothes packed in them, so how the heck can you train a dog to smell blued steel, oil and brass?

I honestly can't help but think this could have all been avoided if she just kept it to herself.

[jcwit]

how the heck can you train a dog to smell blued steel, oil and brass?



The same way you train a dog to smell out most anything else.

[shooterg]

Never did hear if the dog did sniff anything out - in a hunting community, bound to be a few cars kids use(Mom's/Dad's/brother/sister) with the smell of ammo/etc. in 'em even if the kid doesn't hunt/shoot. I'm sure they'd stop and sniff all 4 of our vehicles ! We had a HS kid here "caught" with a .44 mag handgun his older brother left in the vehicle after returning from a deer hunt. In their family, any car on the outside got used by first come(small driveway), so the teenager was busted for it. Zero tolerance is the worst form of intolerance. Intent should be considered, but the "one size fits all" mentality has taken over.

[Frank]

luvtn:
Frank wrote: "Maybe she needs that mark to remind her to do the right thing next time, to lock it up." The gun was locked up in the trunk. She did the right thing.
luvtn
The trunk's not a place for a teenager to keep a rifle while they are at school. I don't agree with the overreaction that is taking place against her by the school, but she is not without fault. There needs to be special rules for young people. Not all teenagers are as responsible as this one.

[jcwit]

The trunk's not a place for a teenager to keep a rifle while they are at school.

I left my .22 rifle in the back seat of my car while in class at school. We do not know but its possible the rifle was in a rifle case and the case even might have been locked. This was not brought out at all by the news story, so who knows.


There needs to be special rules for young people.

With this logic we need special rules for all different age groups, which one do you fit in frank?

[Trey45]

Once upon a time there was a troll, the troll lived for annoying people and aggravating them to no end. This troll fed on the attention it was getting. One day, people stopped feeding the troll, and the troll left for another feeding ground.

Moral of the story:

Stop feeding the troll.

[hickstick_10]

The same way you train a dog to smell out most anything else.

Every car made has oil, steel and brass in it. Think about it.

I imagine they can be trained to smell the powder, but then wouldn't you also be busting any car that's ever been to a gun range?

[Frank]

Trey45:
Once upon a time there was a troll, the troll lived for annoying people and aggravating them to no end. This troll fed on the attention it was getting. One day, people stopped feeding the troll, and the troll left for another feeding ground.

Moral of the story:

Stop feeding the troll.

The way it works here is I can be called names, but when I return the insult, I get reprimanded. I take a lot cheap shots on this board. Why all the name calling? I'm just stating an opinion. I can't drive with a rifle within 1,000 ft of a school, that's the law where I'm at. This 16-year old has the right, so I questioned that. Big deal. I explained teenagers are immature. I see them all the time at the range being unsafe. So I don't have a lot of confidence in them. Same with their driving. There are different rules for that. Teenagers have curfew laws for driving where I'm at, and I'm all for it. But why the insults? Can't you have a civil discussion without being hateful? If you can't maybe you're the one with the problem.

[jcwit]

Every car made has oil, steel and brass in it. Think about it.

I imagine they can be trained to smell the powder, but then wouldn't you also be busting any car that's ever been to a gun range?

Most if not all gun oils and barrel cleaners have smells entirely different than motor oil or tranny fluid. And yes the dog may hit on all these smells and those cars be checked out at that time.

As you say. Think about it.

[blackthorn]

Well---if she broke no law---there should be no harrassment of any kind from anyone! If she was my kid and some self important Liberal moran threatened her future I would get a good lawyer and woe be unto him/her (being PC dontcha know)! When I was a kid we were held accountable if we screwed up and we knew that. These days if you want the protection of the law you have to break it first! Rant off!!!

[waksupi]

I would bet most cars in this area would show traces of gunpowder, and gun oil. Especially if dad drives it at all.

[waksupi]

I saw no names mentioned about trolling.

[Trey45]

Ric, I didn;t mention anyone by name about trolling, why did I miss something?

[Frank]

So how did it ruin her career? She's only got a 3.0 GPA. That'll get her in UM, University of Mongrels, but she can forget Med School with those grades. [smilie=1:

[waksupi]

She dropped to 3.0 because of missing two tests while on suspension, receiving an F for each one.

I don't know Trey, didn't see a thing at all with a name about trolls. Wonder who that could be? I suppose someone will speak up if they think it applies to someone in particular.

[jcwit]

Will she be able to make up those tests and bring her score back up? It would seem to be the right thing to do for the school.

[waksupi]

Yes, they are supplying tutoring, and re-testing.

[jcwit]

Good to hear that. Good things do happen, its the right time of year for it.

[AzCaesar]

She dropped to 3.0 because of missing two tests while on suspension, receiving an F for each one.

That's not what the article said. "Normally a 3.0 student, DeReu now has two F’s due to her suspension."

That would imply that she is normally at 3.0, but is now lower due to the two F's.

[waksupi]

That's not what the article said. "Normally a 3.0 student, DeReu now has two F’s due to her suspension."

That would imply that she is normally at 3.0, but is now lower due to the two F's.


I've heard it reported both ways on the local news. I was going off a report from the MSSA.

[onceabull]

Can The resident education "expert" in this thread give us the name of ANYONE who ever went directly from high school to medical school.. 3.0, 4.0,or whatever in high school doesn't matter, & 3.0 GPA in Montana is likely 4.00 ++ in Kalifornia public school system... Onceabull

[felix]

Bull, I would say that it is POSSIBLE. Typical medical schools have an entrance exam of sorts that must be passed before entry to the school. Some medical schools MIGHT require a specific type of degree from an accredited institution even before the medical school exam is given. However, most state medical schools only require that the exam be passed with no prior experience, schooling or otherwise. I had a room-mate who passed the medical exam in MO while he was a Junior in the University taking Biology as a main undergraduate degree course. His name was/is Allen Spitler, was/is living in Cape Girardeau MO. Not only that, I saw, on TV PBS about five years ago, a whole slew of very young folks getting all kinds of full-ride scholarships to MAJOR universities to get various advanced degrees in the field(s) that they were recognized as prodigies in. ... felix

[onceabull]

Felix: I note that Allen S had 2+ yrs of post high school ed.before that exam..!! That's perhaps the equiv.of the was the standard "pre-med" education in Caifornia circa late 50's early 60's(when I left for good..) The lad who finished 2nd to me in that course in '59 was eventually in the first grad.class @ U.C.Davis Med. school after failing 3x to make the cut @ their Med.School in SFO. Daughter & SIL got $78,000 gross plus full ride tuition first year of graduate school (took best bid out of 7 from Univ.across the country,including Stanford,Cal Tech. & Yale) ..Major changes took place twixt 1960 and 1989 in competitive environment at that level.... Onceabull

[felix]

Major changes... you got that right! Universities are more than happy to get students who can simply read, write, and do arithmetic any more. What they call advanced credit courses in high school today is equivalent to what every student had to do to graduate back in the 50's. ... felix

[abunaitoo]

Remember a few years back when a child was suspended from school for drawing a picture of a gun in class????
This is just another example of what is wrong with the school system these days.
Most of these kinds of teachers believe it's their calling to teach their way of thinking to students.
Only their way of thinking is correct and everyone else's opinion need to be changed.

There are still a few good teachers out there.
There's still hope.

What's wrong with frank????
He seems to be mad all the time.

[stainless1911]

so, when should they learn to use a gun then? 30, 35, the police academy? 3 months before deployment? The bedroom in the dark, at 3:30am?

[Dannix]

The real sad part is that if she didn't mention it, it more than likley would never have been known, so much for teaching our young'uns honesty...................................steg
Honesty =/= speaking your mind. Honesty is being truthful when you do speak, and she should have never said a thing. The bill of rights is there for a reason! Even if she was "found out", she should still keep it muzzled at until she could testify before a court of law, on record.

[Recluse]

Remember a few years back when a child was suspended from school for drawing a picture of a gun in class????
This is just another example of what is wrong with the school system these days.
Most of these kinds of teachers believe it's their calling to teach their way of thinking to students.
Only their way of thinking is correct and everyone else's opinion need to be changed.

Up to a point. There is a curriculum that the teachers are required to follow, plus, the teachers do not get to choose their textbooks.

All of the above are reasons why I'm a huge proponent of private school vouchers.


What's wrong with frank????
He seems to be mad all the time.

He's been on my Ignore List ever since he showed up. Not sure if he even owns a gun, has been in LE or the military, or if he even reloads or casts boolits.

And quite frankly, I don't even care.

:coffee:

[stainless1911]

In todays schools, I would prefer if she had a gun on her

[Down South]

Ah, don't be too hard on Frank. Frank most likely grew up walking on concrete everywhere he went and probably still lives as an urbanite. His views are pretty common with some others in those living conditions. They live mostly in a world of their own and think that everyone else should be like they are. They never seem to be able to grasp the whole picture.
The kid did no wrong and had no ill intent. She forgot that she had a rifle in the trunk. No big deal to someone like me. Heck, there is a rifle in the back seat of my truck now. It’s been there for over a week. There is a revolver that rides in my driver’s door side compartment and it goes where I go.
I’m glad the school board had enough sense not to expel the kid. Hopefully she will be cleared of any wrong doing.
I'd be surprised if a search was conducted on our school ground parking lots around here and no guns were found, especially during hunting season.

There was a comment made about girls just giggling and laughing when shots were fired at a range. To me that sounds like the girls were not capable or willing to take shooting seriously? Maybe I misinterpreted that, I don’t know.
My daughters learned to shoot when they were 12 yrs old or earlier. Both are avid hunters now. My youngest has four deer so far this year with the last white tail buck scoring 172 3/8. My oldest has a 10-point on her wall that she took about five years ago.
I wouldn’t say that either one didn’t take shooting seriously when I was training them. I’m sure they laughed and giggled when they hit their targets or when I hit mine.

[Frank]

Down South:
Ah, don't be too hard on Frank. Frank most likely grew up walking on concrete everywhere he went and probably still lives as an urbanite. His views are pretty common with some others in those living conditions.
I think you're right. I must be a city boy who likes to hang out with the peasants! [smilie=l:

[OBIII]

Quote: "Do you have confidence in a teenager to do the right thing? I don't."

Frank,
You are certainly an individual with a keen sense of observation...When you arrive at your final destination (wherever that may be), please be sure to ask all of those 17, 18, 19, and 20 year olds just what the hell they were thinking when they volunteered to serve their Country, and in doing so gave their lives. I'm so happy that with the modern all volunteer army that we only accept "Mature" individuals who can be counted on to do the right thing.

Semper Fi!

[jcwit]

But now he has an excuse!

[azcruiser]

My friend lives within 1000 ft of a school no problems coming or going he has min 40 guns .With
AZ open carry and now everybody can carry concealed would think would guess 1 in 10 driving by a school has a gun on board.

[82nd airborne]

Dear Down South,
173" white tail!!! You may take me hunting anytime. Thankyou.
Aaron

[Murphy]

Down South:
I think you're right. I must be a city boy who likes to hang out with the peasants! [smilie=l:

Frank,

I want to thank you for reminding me of just how great this group of people I'm a part of truly happens to be.

I have seen wonderful acts of kindness, forgiveness and understanding beyond that of what most would ever believe.

There is always the new guy, his 1st post starting with 'Okay, I know this is going to seem like a dumb question', only to be taken in and treated like a brother and a friend.

I've seen people get a well deserved kick in the butt and tossed from this site for being less than honorable as well.

And finally but far from least, without your posts Frank? Most who enter the doors here would never believe just how tolerant this wonderful group are and can be.

Best wishes,

Murphy

[leftiye]

I appreciate Frank too. If it weren't for him I'd probly get a LOT more flaming for my obtusity.

[Frank]

OBIII:
Frank,
You are certainly an individual with a keen sense of observation...When you arrive at your final destination (wherever that may be), please be sure to ask all of those 17, 18, 19, and 20 year olds just what the hell they were thinking when they volunteered to serve their Country, and in doing so gave their lives. I'm so happy that with the modern all volunteer army that we only accept "Mature" individuals who can be counted on to do the right thing.

I'll tell you what they were thinking. They did it to improve their lives, to get an education or to see the world. For many it was a way to get away from idleness or some miserable condition at home or in their town, so they fell prey to the recruiter who made promises. And when he comes home, the young kid isn't skinny anymore, but stands in the doorway with broad shoulders now and the voice is a little deeper, his face is a little sunken in from a heavy workload and no sleep, but his actions are deliberate and well thought out, not the reactions of a kid. The young boy becomes a man.

[stainless1911]

Typically not, we lock them. I don't consider Canadians to be heathens, but rather victims.

In Michigan, if you have a CPL, it is legal for the licence holder to openly carry in pistol free zones with the exception of casinos post offices, federal buildings courts and secure areas of airoprts or jails. I only open carry, so I don't really have to think about it, If I need to go into a school, I just go in.

[OldSchool]

I guess I have to brag, then. I know two young kids very well (yeah, back where we came from, you were a "kid" until you started losing your hair...). (An aside: While growing up, both very mad with me about moving from our old ranch (because of the Cali invasion) to a big city.)

They both felt the personal need to join JROTC, and went on to join the military (the older one while still in High School). Each has been deployed in combat areas more than once. Each is Expert in every weapon.

One came back with three stripes, medals and shrapnel, and a strong sense of having done a necessary job (and is currently sailing through his first college classes).

The other just now qualified for a rocker to add to his three stripes, and recently re-upped (and is also sailing through his college classes as he can pick them up).

Yeah, need to watch out for them kids -- so why did that gray-haired old guy slam into my car the other day....

[waksupi]

Kids are good enough with guns, that we have separate classes in the competition for them. The main reason is,the teenagers can out shoot many of the adults, so we like to win one occasionally.
It isn't at all unusual to see vehicles in this area with rifles and shot guns in the back window, a pistol on the seat or in the windshield, with the vehicle unlocked, and the windows down. Kids don't bother them, nor anyone else. You are more likely to go missing a chain saw from the back of the truck.

[9.3X62AL]

I'm glad to read here that the young lady has begun to get this nightmare over with. I imagine at least one poster in this thread is inconsolable that she wasn't drawn and quartered, but a little flexibility in the law isn't intrinsically fatal to justice. Most of the time.

[alamogunr]

I appreciate Frank too. If it weren't for him I'd probly get a LOT more flaming for my obtusity.

I've been rolling this around in my head for almost 24 hours. I'm no closer to understanding than I was yesterday. I know what an obtuse angle is. I just don't know what your angle is.

John
W.TN

[OldSchool]

I've been rolling this around in my head for almost 24 hours. I'm no closer to understanding than I was yesterday. I know what an obtuse angle is. I just don't know what your angle is.

John
W.TN
You just figured it out. [smilie=l:

[leftiye]

Probly another word for crypticity? ( with maybe some smart a$$osis threwn in)

[Dannix]

I've been rolling this around in my head for almost 24 hours. I'm no closer to understanding than I was yesterday. I know what an obtuse angle is. I just don't know what your angle is.
That was an acute observation John. Some may not like the slant of your post though.