How accurate do I need to be?

[armednfree]

I have the 125 pounds of lead pipe my neighbor gave me. I just received 6 bars of 70- 30 super-hard from Rotometals. I also have a 50 pound lead pot and a large ladle.

Each bar would be 1.5 pounds of antimony and 3.5 pounds of lead. If I buy a 1 pound roll of no lead solder and cut it in half that's .5 pounds. Mix that with 19.5 pounds of my lead pipe (after I smelt and clean it) and I come out with 25 pounds of 92-6-2.

So how accurate do I need to be on that lead? If the weight floats from 18.5 to 20.5 is that going to make much of a difference in how it performs?

This is all handgun, 40 S+W, 9mm, 45 colt,38 special, 357 magnum and some 405 HB 45-70. Fired in handguns (except the 45-70), but also in a 45 colt and a .357 rifle.

This is also is going to be made in 25 pound batches, so the final products will be mixed when they hit the casting pot.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Something else to think about, some Lead Pipe has a little antimony in it.

[Yodogsandman]

It will probably perform just as well but, that's an expensive way to go about it.

The roll solder alone is about $35 and can be had for a lot less if all you want is tin. Look for pewter bars sold in the "swap and sell" section or 50/50 bar solder on evilbay. Plan on about $11/lb for tin.

To get the correct alloy mix that will suit your needs, research the Los Angeles Silhouette Club's web page on mixing Rotometal's Superhard. For your applications, I'd say any more than about 3% antimony would be a waste.

http://www.lasc.us/SuperHard.htm

[runfiverun]

why so hard?
about half the antimony and half the tin is more than enough for your list.
the only one on your list I harden up past .5/2.5ish/96.5ish, is my 9mm's and they get a light bump of lino-type mixed in at 8 to 1.
I usually cut my ww alloy 3 to 1 with soft [whatever] lead so use the lino to bring it up a tick again.

[white eagle]

its nice to know what is in yer mix
as for the exactness of it it is really up to the maker
I do not think it would make a big diff but that would be yer call
good luck enjoy

[armednfree]

What I'm looking at using the lead pipe, the 70-30 and the solder is $1.12 or so a pound. The same alloy from Rotometals is $3.11 a pound. I expected something around $1.30 so I am well below budget.

I could shave a bit by scrounging but that is not worth the effort. Time is money and I work so much overtime I don't have it for scrounging around.

Looking at Oatley Safe-flow lead solder ASTM B32. I see a small amount of copper, bismuth and silver. Is that OK to use?

[runfiverun]

no worries, the amounts will be so low you'll never know they are there.

[armednfree]

Well, change that. Roll solder came out to $79.43 for three pounds. Those cut ends from Rotometals were $67 and change delivered. Too bad I didn't know that or I could have saved the $10.99 shipping. Still $12 less even with the shipping. Guess I'll just have to weigh out 6 parts at 3500 grains to do 25 pounds a batch.

[skeettx]

You average mix should be just fine, cast and enjoy and do not look back
Rave on dude!!

Mike

[armednfree]

I wish the pot would come. I'm going to smelt this pipe and clean it and cast it into ingots. Then do my mix. I sprayed the mud off the outside so I'm wondering how much weight I will loose from what's on the inside. I don't know if calcium and iron build up inside lead pipe very much, I know it can't be like in steel pipe. We have somewhat hard water around here, comes from Lake Erie

[Bigslug]

I wish the pot would come. I'm going to smelt this pipe and clean it and cast it into ingots. Then do my mix.

Glad you came to that conclusion before I made the suggestion. I would probably melt or break the Superhard into smaller bits before starting the mix as well, and then get those and your pipe lead ingots sorted into your 25# batches that are as alike as possible. While not always critical, it's nice to have it all the same. Good lab technique if nothing else.

[armednfree]

I have been using range scrap for a long time now. It is mostly cores of jacketed bullets. Unknown alloy and unknown hardness. Since I give them two coats of 45-45-10 I have 0 leading. Generally I shoot the 45 colt at around 1100-1200fps in both the rifle and the pistol. That doesn't matter if it's the 250 grain bullet or the 300, same speed. If I want power I go heavier rather than faster. The biggest thing I shoot is deer and unlike what some people seem to think mine do not have Kelvar hide. They simply don't take that much killing. I'd like to say I know that that bullet is doing but I have never actually recovered one. Always a dead deer with an exit hole. I'm not much on jacketed hollow points, when I used them I was not impressed. Give me a heavy in a 44 or a 45 with a big flat nose and I will kill critters all day long with confidence. I'm not a big believer in the KE formula, experience shows me that a big hole punched all the way through vitals kills stuff just fine.

[Handloader109]

Agreed, for handguns, range lead or ww lead is plentyb hard enough. I'd add that solder since you have it to the 125lbs and say enough, 92%lead is at too hard

[Retumbo]

Consistency is the key if you want to be able to reproduce results.

[bruce381]

I keep each cast batch of cast Boolits seperate as one batch. that said if they cast sharp and easy I do not care what alloy is.
Oh yeah pistol only

[RogerDat]

A recent thread pointed out you want to mix the tin and antimony before the plain gets added. It was explained that the tin and antimony will join into an Sn/Sb alloy better if the concentration is higher due to less lead in the mix. Once joined adding in the plain won't disturb or break up the alloy. Was in the context of COWW's and tin being cut with plain but the metallurgy seems to apply.

Also pointed out that adding tin percentage beyond the antimony percentage was a waste. This meant that if you have 2.5% Sb in the original alloy and there is say 10# of it then you want to add Sn to get a 2% Sn ratio in that 10# of alloy. Not add tin to get 2% in the 20# pot you make by mixing that alloy 50/50 with lead. 2% of that 20# combined pot would be more tin than there is antimony to alloy with. Thus the extra tin is wasted.

2.5% antimony being typical of COWW's those were the figures used in that threaded discussion.

You really might want to download the Lead Alloy Calculator from the sticky in this forum. Lets you plug in your ingredients and gives you your final alloy percentages and approx. BHN. Great way to play with the mix and see what it would result in.

[armednfree]

A recent thread pointed out you want to mix the tin and antimony before the plain gets added. It was explained that the tin and antimony will join into an Sn/Sb alloy better if the concentration is higher due to less lead in the mix. Once joined adding in the plain won't disturb or break up the alloy. Was in the context of COWW's and tin being cut with plain but the metallurgy seems to apply.

Also pointed out that adding tin percentage beyond the antimony percentage was a waste. This meant that if you have 2.5% Sb in the original alloy and there is say 10# of it then you want to add Sn to get a 2% Sn ratio in that 10# of alloy. Not add tin to get 2% in the 20# pot you make by mixing that alloy 50/50 with lead. 2% of that 20# combined pot would be more tin than there is antimony to alloy with. Thus the extra tin is wasted.

2.5% antimony being typical of COWW's those were the figures used in that threaded discussion.

You really might want to download the Lead Alloy Calculator from the sticky in this forum. Lets you plug in your ingredients and gives you your final alloy percentages and approx. BHN. Great way to play with the mix and see what it would result in.

Not sure I understand. The total lead will be 23 pounds (19.5 from the pipe and 3.5 from the ingot) Antimony will be 1.5 pounds from the ingot and tin at .5 pounds. That would be 92-6-2 hardball alloy. The 5 pound ingot is 70% lead and 30% antimony.

[41mag]

You really might want to download the Lead Alloy Calculator from the sticky in this forum. Lets you plug in your ingredients and gives you your final alloy percentages and approx. BHN. Great way to play with the mix and see what it would result in.

I started out only a few years ago, about when Bumpo posted his first or second upgraded calculator. At the time I had COWW and a little pure and a coworker gave me a bunch of rolls of 95-5 solder. After a month or so of searching and finding out I was in an area abundant with casters who already had most of the tire shops sewed up, I started purchasing alloy from folks on here. I picked up a hundred or so pounds of COWW, some Lino, some pure tin, and some Iso Cores. I also downloaded the calculator and started playing with it as mentioned above.

I wanted a easy repeatable recipe for my alloy which I could duplicate pretty easily. So I ended up stocking up on the Iso Cores which were showing around a 1/3/96. From this I started to use the calculator to find what I needed to add in to come up with something to use as COWW, as well as an alloy which would give me good results with my HP's without being too brittle.

It is very easy to input what you have on hand using the calculator, and then simply weigh out the needed amounts. A bathroom scale and a small postage scale will get you well within the ranges needed to replicate your best alloy over and over again. I also use a shareware program called Convert for Windows, which allows me to input my decimal amounts in pounds and have the output in Oz's which I then weigh out on my postal scale. In one recipe I use a 32#Iso core, 20# of pure, and 9.6oz of pure tin to end up with basically a 1.75/1.75/96.5 alloy that I use for just about all of my HP bullets. It holds up well and is plenty malleable to allow the noses to roll back into mushrooms, and holds up to loads up into the magnum range as well.

Anyway that program is a good one to tinker with and will get you well within where you want to be with your alloy if you give it a try. It already has most of the alloys which Rotometals sells listed in it as well as plenty of other metals which you would use to blend with. So you just basically input the amounts you want to come up with what you are looking for then go weigh and smelt it up.

Hope that helps.

[62chevy]

Not sure I understand. The total lead will be 23 pounds (19.5 from the pipe and 3.5 from the ingot) Antimony will be 1.5 pounds from the ingot and tin at .5 pounds. That would be 92-6-2 hardball alloy. The 5 pound ingot is 70% lead and 30% antimony.

You really need to get the calculator and play with that as it will answer more of you questions. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...oy-calculators

[fredj338]

IMO, you can OCD this kinda stuff all day, but if it's just plinking bullets for your handgun, 10% off either way doesn't matter much. The vast majority of my service pistol bullets are made with mixed range scrap. They shoot way better than I do.