k98 8mm mauser

[mto7464]

What size do most of tend to slug out? I notice Lee only has a sizer for .323. I'd like to keep it simple but I doubt they all will work with just the Lee sizer 323 size.

[Dutchman]

You can't generalize about that. Would do you no good to know what somebody else's rifle slugs at. With about 17,000,000 there's nobody alive who can answer what "most" of them slug at.

I'm sizing .325". I got a RCBS .325" size die for my Lyman 4500 as I have multiple 8mm.


Dutch

[azrednek]

Gotta agree with the Dutchman. I have several 8MM Mausers and the few cast loads I put through most of them were sized .323 with a Lee push through sizer. Most were tumble lubed, sized and lubed again. The only one that gave me problems with leading was my 1950's Spanish Mauser. I also shot a hundred or so just tumble lubed with no sizing and didn't see any significant increase or decrease in the mediocre accuracy. A couple of years ago I picked up a bunch of the Turk 8MM surplus ammo and haven't cast for 8MM since.

[Buckshot]

..............I have 4 Turkish 8x57 rifles. The M88/35 and a M38 both have their cast boolits sized to .323". A M38/46 and another M38 get sized to .325". I have a VZ24/47 with a .316"x.325" barrel and a .328" throat so it gets it's slugs sized to .327" (and have to use the Lee C329-210R for it).

...............Buckshot

[dualsport]

Take a fired case from that gun, measure the inside neck diameter. That's about where I start, or a thousandth less. I have several 8mms too, they're all over the place. Generally I use the fattest bullet that will chamber easily.

[Dutch4122]

Take a fired case from that gun, measure the inside neck diameter. That's about where I start, or a thousandth less. I have several 8mms too, they're all over the place. Generally I use the fattest bullet that will chamber easily.

Ditto on this method.

[beemer]

I shoot my M48 sized at .325, the groove is a little over .323. You can lap out the Lee to .325 very easily.

Dave

[Larry Gibson]

What size do most of tend to slug out? I notice Lee only has a sizer for .323. I'd like to keep it simple but I doubt they all will work with just the Lee sizer 323 size.

Concur with Dutchman. Out of over 118,000,000 M98s made I wonder if he is indication only 17,000,000 were made in 8x57?

However, regards sizing of cast bullets for the 8x57; it is the throat diameter that is important to size to, not groove diameter. I have been using .325 for 40 years of shooting cast bullets in milsurp M98 8x57s. Depending on alloy the sized bullets comout at .3245 - .3255". I have yet to find a M98 milsurp 8x57 that this sizing was not a almost perfect fit for in the throat. I have heard that some M48 require a .323 sizer but I have not seen one yet. As always they can be out there but I've not found one that would not chamber an actual .325 sized cast bullet. BTW; I prefer the Lyman Lovern 323470 and 323471 cast bullets. Thedriving bands of both fit well into the throat up to the leade. Both are exceptionally accurate bullets in every M98 8x57 I have shot them in.

Larry Gibson

[Mike Venturino]

I have a K98k from 1937 and another from 1942. Both shoot .325" cast bullets nicely.

MLV

[Char-Gar]

I have two Persian 98/29 BRNO rifles and they both run .323 in the grooves and I size and shoot the bullets .325.

[Dutchman]

Concur with Dutchman. Out of over 118,000,000 M98s made I wonder if he is indication only 17,000,000 were made in 8x57?

118,000,000? Are you sure about that, Larry? Was I thinking Mosin-Nagant at 17million?


118million is an awful lot of rifles.


Dutch

[dualsport]

For a guy who has collected milsurps as long as I have I should know this, but I'll swallow my pride and ask the experts, I see that some of you have studied while I was at the beach party. Which non-German made Mauser is the closest thing to a real German 98k? Thankyou, and thanks for not laughing. You're not laughing, right? Mr. Humble Himself

[Nelsdou44]

I have one of those post-war k98s assembled by the Czechs and imported by Samco that shoots jacketed fine but will not chamber a .325 boolit. The only Mauser I have that won't.

[jonk]

118,000,000 Mausers were made, but not all 98 8mms.

I also find that in most guns, a .325 shoots fine. The standard Lee 175 gr bullet is excellant; mine drops at .325 right out of the mold. I run it through a .325" Lyman die and away we go!

The group buy version of this bullet but with a flat nose also works fine.

I too have yet to see a gun that won't chamber a .325" bullet. The throat on my 24/47 is a bit abrupt but I can still manage if I seat a bit deeper.

I also have one of the 8mm Maximum molds. It's hit or miss. In my 88s it shoots better than anything. In my 98s, in some guns it's great, in some it is worthless.

I don't entirely agree with the idea that you size to the throat and not the grooves but will agree it is a good place to start. I have found ONE gun that this didn't work well in- an M95 with a .331" bore but a throat that permits chambering a .338" slug. It doesn't HURT anything to do this but I find I get better accuracy sizing to .334" or so. So except for that oddball it has always worked well- when I've bothered to measure the throat that is. My usual operating method is to load a few with some bullets (gug....boolits) and try it out. 70% of the time all is well. If not, then I slug the bore and make a chamber cast.

[azrednek]

Which non-German made Mauser is the closest thing to a real German 98k?

The Yugo and Israeli K98's are near carbon copies.

[Char-Gar]

Jonk... The is for the record and for any newbies following this thread.

Larry is correct that the throat is the cricital dimension when considering cast bullet size in rifles. In any type of quest for rifle accuracy, straight and uniform is the name of the game.

YOu want to introduce the bullet into the rifling straight and not hit at any kind of angle, no matter how slight. A cast bullet the size of the throat or not more than .0005 under has a better chance of starting down the barrel dead straight.

This assumes the breech face and chamber are also 100% straight with each other. This also assumes the throat is larger than the groove diamter of the barrel.

With loading and shooting cast bullets there will always the the occasional problem child of a rifle that follows it's own rules. But as a maximum of cast bullet shooting Larry is dead on.

[Larry Gibson]

118,000,000? Are you sure about that, Larry? Was I thinking Mosin-Nagant at 17million?


118million is an awful lot of rifles.


Dutch

Yes that is accurate and I've read several numbers in that range as the amount of M98s produced worldwide in numerous publications over the years. When you stop and think that the M98 was made for many, many countries worldwide for many years plus being really cranked out during both World Wars the number isn't that surprising. That figure has been quoted for some years. Most often it is used to counter the statement that the AK is the most prolific firearm made. The AK may soon supplant the M98.

Larry Gibson

[Dutchman]

Ah.... you're talking "all" 98 rifles. I was referring only to World War II K98k made by the nazi pondscum.

Ok, I can get with 118 million for all 98. I've tried to corner the market but I've fallen short by about 117,999,960.

Dutch

[jonk]

Hmm. I hadn't considered the possibility of a slightly crooked breech face to barrel fit in that 95. Thinking that way it makes sense that my experience with that gun is out of the norm.
Look I'm not disputing what Larry says, just that I have one oddball gun that doesn't follow the rules. I generally seat my bullets to either touch or be just off the lands so as to take up the most throat as possible (when I can, I have some milsurps with truly cavernous throats) and fit diameter wise as best as possible, i.e the fattest that will chamber without hammering on the bolt handle.

Kind of makes you wonder why the heel base bullet isn't more popular. It would allow an even tighter throat fit and yet acceptable chambering. That nixes any gas check of course but for plinker loads it would be a treat.

[GrizzLeeBear]

I too have yet to see a gun that won't chamber a .325" bullet. The throat on my 24/47 is a bit abrupt but I can still manage if I seat a bit deeper. .

Jonk, you and Larry can come over and see my 24/47 then! A .324 boolit might fit, but it won't chamber the Lee bullet sized .325. It will try to shove the front driving band into the case. Size them to .323 and they feed and shoot great! It has a nice tight barrel, too. The bore slugs a little over .322. Guess I got an odd one, but in a good way!