Soliciting experiences/opinions pre-war 32 acp pistols

[uscra112]

Only pre-war .32 I've ever had is a German Ortgies. An odd beast with it's peculiar grip safety. Wants its' food fairly spicy or I get failures to eject. As accurate as anything with such tiny sights can be. But if you haven't planned ahead, it's capable of ejecting the striker spring and guide rod into low earth orbit when taking it down, and I finally had to make a special tool and drill a hole to let me reassemble it without help. It was an estate auction find, and I should have passed it up. I'm on only the second box of ammo, though I've had it for seven or eight years now.

[Outpost75]

Any idea what distance the Colt 1903, Cz 70, and Beretta 81's are sighted for? I find they hit very high at 25 yards.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Most were targeted at 20 metres to strike in a 10cm circle above the aiming point, so nominally 2 inches high at 20+ yards. The low velocity US 71-grain ammo strikes higher than Euro-CIP heavy ball.

[timinpa]

Experience with two.

Colt 1903 - just a joy to shoot.

Remington 51 - mine was a 380, but they made 32's. If you just want it to shoot, don't bother. Almost strictly a carry pistol. They feel good in your hand, point really well, and recoil is minimal for the caliber, but. The sights are almost non-existent, and the trigger pull is very heavy. It would be very difficult to improve the sights, and i don't think the triggers can be improved, a design feature. They are very well made and very good for their intended purpose, but lousy plinkers.

[rintinglen]

I happen to own at least one of each of the guns that Shoestring lists, plus a Remington 51, and a 1910/1955 Browning. Though the last two are 380's, I have to say that my favorites are the Remington and the Colt 1903. The 1910 and the 1922 are too small for my hand, the trigger reach is short. I also like the Mauser 1914, especially the 1934 version. I had a Beretta 1934 years ago, but the one I had was not reliable. I had a CZ 27 which was excellent, both accurate and reliable, but I was drinking the 45 coolaid in those days and sold it. Sigh, you can't own them all.

The white pasters are 8 shots at 25 yards, 2 hands slow fire with the Mauser.

[charlie b]

The 1903 I had is one of the few guns I wish I had not sold. Colt did a nice job rounding it all off so it carries nicely. Don't even need a holster and nothing digs in. One of those guns you can forget you are carrying.

Mine was not a collector as someone had refinished it and then bulged the barrel. Got a new barrel from Numrich and had hi vis sights put on it. Made it easy to shoot little groups with it. The new sights were 'on' at around 15 yd.

[MFGordon]

Another .32 worthy of consideration is the Browning model 1900, the grandfather of them all. What I especially like about it, are the sights which are better than any of those on all my older handguns and it's very thin compared to other guns if the era. Here are the results of a magazine full of Lee 94 grain TL bullets and 1.9 grains of Bullseye at 50 feet.

[Battis]

Savage, Meloir, Dreyse, Mauser, Ortgies, all in .32 ACP. I have a 1903 Colt HAMMER in 38 ACP but not .32. They kept popping up and I kept buying them.
I have an Ortgies (no pic) in .32 acp that also has a .380 acp barrel. Same mag - just remove the slide, and switch barrels. Good option.

[GhostHawk]

I'm one of those who jumped on the Italian trade in Beretta's. I got a good used in like new condition for 210$. For a few dollars more I got 2 more mags and a holster.

This one shoots great, looks like it spent 30 years in a desk drawer. I'm tickled pink with it.

My best .32 prior to this was a H&R 732 snub nose with swing out cylinder. The Beretta carry's double the loads for very close to the same weight. And it will put them all into a nice tight group. Tis a joy to shoot. I'd say you'd have a hard time going wrong with one.

Just as an FYI, once you break free of that 38spcl or 9mm or larger for carry.
Even the lowly .22mag starts looking good along with the .32's.

NAA has a whole line. I have a Ranger II which is a top break and easy to reload. I also have an earl which is a nice 5 shot revolver, but it is a total pain to reload.

Sidewinder is the other one I would look at.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Der G,
So why Spanish guns?
What about them makes you smile?

A fair question. I've never been able to precisely diagnose my illness.

I am a bit of a history buff, and found the Spanish Civil War fascinating. My first Spanish pistol was a Llama IX-A .45, and I really liked it. Cost me $68.50 back in 1969. I was wanting another 1911, but they were running around $200 at the time, so the price was right. Although for most of my earlier life up to that point I heard over and over again, "Spanish guns are junk--do not buy them!" I found it to be a good buy for the money, well made, and shot it often.

I didn't pursue them with any purpose though, and they just gradually came my way. The dictator of Spain, Generalissimo Francisco Franco, closed all but 4 of the handgun manufacturers down after their Civil War ended, and one of those soon closed, leaving only the 3 best which were Astra, Star, and Llama. They were imported into the US for many years by such companies as A.F. Stoeger and Garcia, and it was hard not to admire the photos and text in the annual Shooter's Bible catalog. Isn't it interesting how dictators and democrats are always interested in gun control? I think armed citizens make them feel insecure.

Then an immense number of surplus Spanish semi-autos began to be imported. Some were military surplus dating clear back to WW I, such as the Ruby-types, Star Model B's used by the Axis, and Spanish military and police surplus. The price was right, the quality good, and I guess my gun collecting nature took its course.

I did learn that they are not junk, but really rather excellent firearms, especially within the area of those 3 manufacturers. Back when the 1911 was cutting edge technology (WW I) it was apparent that it was what the militaries and citizens of the world wanted, and the Spanish jumped in to make a profit. It is really interesting to examine their products and see what they did to provide externally similar pistols while using internal differences to avoid patent infringements, especially Llama and Star. No less a pistol shooting authority than Col. Charles Askins, once National Pistol Champion with a 1911, wrote more than one complimentary article about Star pistols.

My interest focused mainly in the area of 1911 lookalikes, and not much before or after those eras. I acquired a dozen or so Astra 400s, 600/43s, but they are very unique. I came by Star A, B, Super A & B, and BM pistols.
Almost the entire 1911-looking line of Llamas of all calibers and sizes.

The Llamas remained the most interesting to me. When I first acquired that IX-A back in 1969 I sat down at the kitchen table and tried to interchange parts with a G.I. 1911. Nothing at all would exchange, although visually the parts were hard to tell apart. l never pursued the matter further-- why should I, as I had examples of both? Extra magazines were always hard to come by, with the main source being Triple-K, but somewhere in the 1980s some of the large frame Llamas would accept 1911 magazines if you didn't mind a gap around them at the base of the magazine well, as the Llama magazines had a wider base plate and the 1911 mags were narrower.

Then the Gabilondo company (Llama) finally was dragged kicking and screaming to the reality that their product was going to have to be more parts compatible if they were to compete in the vast 1911 market. Sadly, that time had started downhill already by the time their Max-1 series hit the market. They bore about 90% parts interchangeability, but the age of the Glock had arrived, and 1911s had become passe'. They did attempt a couple of updated pistols such as the Omni, but beyond the scope of my interest. New money, reorganization, moving the plant, all failed and they went under shortly after we entered the new century--the last of the great Spanish pistol makers gone.

Oh--so I was perusing Gunbroker a while back and bought an IX-A that someone customized into a Colt! After that one experiment many years ago I never pursued it, but whomever this person is installed a Commander hammer, a beavertail grip safety, a target trigger, and a full length recoil spring system. I removed this latter feature and went back to the original recoil plug, spring, and guide, as it was so tightly fitted that it was very difficult to apply the slide stop. So, with some desire and persistence it could be done after all (pre-Max-1 series) and the former owner has my compliments on a job well done.

Guess that's the best I can answer the question. I guess they make me smile because they are historical, interesting, still relatively inexpensive and going up in price as an investment like all firearms.



Top, my first. Bottom, as modified by former owner.


DG

[FergusonTO35]

Colt 1903 Pocket Hammerless, Savage 1907, Mauser 1914, FN 1922…

It’s a genre. Getting curious about them as a fun way to get some use out of my stock of 32 acp brass. Not interested in carrying one. I’ve got better, safer options with firing pin blocks.

But I’m interested in good, fun plinkers and shooters. Not into collecting. Not up to buying one of each and exploring their differences or strengths.

So…what do y’all know about them? Are any of them “better” or are there any that have inherent “problems”? Trigger pulls?

I can give that .32 brass a good home! Unless, you're just looking for a reason to buy another gun?

[shooting on a shoestring]

Actually, I placed an order for brass with Starline first. That my “reason” for shopping for a good 32acp. Not wanting a carry piece. Got plenty of those. I do appreciate good old world gun construction. So that’s my impetus for shopping for a plinker 32acp pre-war vintage. Currently keeping an eye out for a Colt 1903 or an FN 1910. Or maybe a Beretta or Mauser. Soon as I can slow down the work schedule I’ll find pick one and take the plunge.

[shooting on a shoestring]

Dear G, a big thank you for the write up about your Spanish gun habit. Your bit reminded me of gun magazine articles in the 1970’s. Very cool. Good read.

[Tall]

The first handgun I ever shot was a Savage Model 1907 in 32 ACP. Horrible sights. Never wanted one.

Later I got a Browning model 1922 with Nazi proof marks in 32 ACP. It was a very accurate shooter and the sights were decent. I would still have it except it was stolen in a burglary.

[rintinglen]

If you just want a good gun to shoot 32 ACP's, hunt up one of the Beretta 81's. Yeah, they're big for a pocket pistol--mine's bigger than a Sig-p365, but they have a lot going for them. With 12 round magazines, pretty good SA triggers (though the DA is nothing to write home about), and sights that are much better than those found on most of the pre-WWII guns, coupled with the hand-filling grip, you will find them easy to shoot. Plus, if you are one of those drive-it-to the-redline fellows who want your 32 to be a 380 and load accordingly, they are pretty well constructed and will stand up better than their smaller brethren.

My Brother and I ordered three of them when they were cheap, and mine has never bobbled with either Fiocchi, Magtech or my own handloads. 2.2 gains of WW-231 under a Ranch Dog 32-75 loaded to an OAL of .910" makes for an accurate, good-functioning load.

[Thumbcocker]

+1 on all points.

[shooting on a shoestring]

I’m still shopping.
Leaning towards a Colt 1903. There’s a couple local that are buyable and would make good shooters for me.
But….there’s a Beretta Puma 70 with the funny cross bolt safety that’s a bit less money and looks like a decent plinker. And….a Walther PP has popped up at a buyable price. I expect if I don’t move on it soon it’ll be gone.

[Outpost75]

Beretta M1935 is also worth considering. Most common of the WW2 bringbacks. Simple, rugged and reliable.

[shooting on a shoestring]

Making progress.
Just ordered the Accurate 31-090B that Oupost75 designed.
It’ll probably get a chance to be launched from 32 SWL and 30 Super Carry too.
Hope to get an old timey reciprocating pistol bought this coming week.

[Bigslug]

If you've got an opportunity for a decently priced PP, I'd go for it. DA trigger aside, they are elegant as hell and very accurate. And you can say pithy things like "B****, please. . . I'm James Bond's daddy!"

Outpost has done a lot of this and won't steer you wrong, but if you want something closer to traditional .32ACP weight, NOE has the tumble lube Ranch Dogs in stock as the 314-78-RF-BD5. Running them in .32, .380, 9mm, and .45 and working toward TL's in the revolvers as well. Being able to set the lube sizer aside is very liberating.

[shooting on a shoestring]

Too much work this week to buy a pistol.
Bigslug…..hahaha……yeah. You’ve got a point.
This is going to be a toy. Just for fun. PP sort of fits the criteria.