Trail boss and 45-70 - max loads in hi wall

[45coltnut]

Happy new year castboolit friends. This cold weather has me doing some casting and wanting to try new loads. I've got some trail boss and have wanting to try this in my 1885 winny hi wall. The boolit of choice will be a 385 grain cup point from my NOE mold.

From what I've read, I have two options. Stick to the IMR load data or I can also use a method that was published by IMR some time back.

The method is mark your case to the level of the boolit you're using, fill with trail boss and use this for the max load. They also recommend starting at 70% of this.

Has anyone here ever done this? Over on the Marlin site, someone loaded up to 15 grains for 1200fps in their Marlin lever gun. I'm sure with the strength of my hi wall I'll be fine starting at 16. But, I'd rather obtain more data first.

Thanks for all the help.

[1bluehorse]

Happy new year castboolit friends. This cold weather has me doing some casting and wanting to try new loads. I've got some trail boss and have wanting to try this in my 1885 winny hi wall. The boolit of choice will be a 385 grain cup point from my NOE mold.

From what I've read, I have two options. Stick to the IMR load data or I can also use a method that was published by IMR some time back.

The method is mark your case to the level of the boolit you're using, fill with trail boss and use this for the max load. They also recommend starting at 70% of this.

Has anyone here ever done this? Over on the Marlin site, someone loaded up to 15 grains for 1200fps in their Marlin lever gun. I'm sure with the strength of my hi wall I'll be fine starting at 16. But, I'd rather obtain more data first.

Thanks for all the help.

I've shot quite a few 405gr home cast with 16gr of TB both in a Sharps and an 1886. Pretty soft shootin' load. Never chronyed them, didn't see the point, they are just for "fun"....It's been awhile so I don't recall what I determined the 100% load to be. Might be that 16gr. load but I don't believe so.

[45coltnut]

Thanks 1bluehorae,

I failed to mention that I did this max load test this morning and found it to be 17.3 grains with my boolit. Which is a from a 405 mold. But with the cup point it weighs in at 385.

Also, I could have probably gotten an even 18 grains to the line. But, I didn't want to push it.

You stated this is just a plinking load. But wouldn't it still be effective at 100 yds if it was pushed around 1250 fps?

[NSB]

I personally don't like Trail Boss in any of my 45-70s. Never got very good groups with it and there are other powders that will generate the same velocities and perform better. As far as 1250fps, it's not a "plinking" load. Check to see what the original loading was for this cartridge and you'd be surprised at the anemic velocities compared to today's loads. In spite of that, it killed a lot of hostiles and a lot of buffalo. My hunting loads are a 400g bullet at around 1400fps and I have yet to recover even one bullet out of a deer regardless of the angle or distance. If you want some "plinking" loads, try some Unique powder which is cheaper and easier to come by. It's also not sensitive to position or case volume.

[44 WCF]

We had good luck in an original trapdoor of a friends using Accurate # AA 5744. We shot the 405 gr and the ideal 1881 round nose mould seems was 500+ gr. Another friend had an Italian 45-70 double rifle we used same load. Our shooting was informal gong and charging buffalo game

[MarkP]

Hodgdon has data listed within the Trapdoor section; 16.0 gr of Trailboss with a 385 gr Cast 23,200 CUP.

[plainsman456]

14 grains will get you started.
This powder is easy to figure out and the loads are good for hunting.

I have used so far up to 16.5 grains with a 325 grain cast,groups well at 100+- yards and i would not be shy of taking a shot at a longer range.

Those little Cheerios sure make for some easy pushing loads and they will go through 3 water heaters at 100 yards without stopping.
So they should do good on deer and hogs.

[flint45]

I got very good acc. using 15.5 gr. trail boss with 405gr. boolit in my 1895 Marlin at 50 and 100 yards a mild shooting load.

[theleo]

What you are trying to do can be achieved with other powders at much lower pressure. I'd never tried pushing any max loads using Trail Boss, if it gets compressed the pressure spikes really rapidly. Trail Boss is meant for plinking loads that can not be double charged in a case and my personal preference is to use it according to what they manufacturer meant it for.

[220]

What you are trying to do can be achieved with other powders at much lower pressure.

+1

In my experience I have always been able to get better velocity at lower pressures with better accuracy using conventional powders.

[MT Chambers]

I would not use TrailBoss for high end loads in your 45/70 and I would not experiment with any higher or compressed loads with TB, that's not what it was meant for. 4198, RL-7, H-322, even Varget will take you where you want to go and beyond with good accuracy. The fastest I could safely go for velocity was with H-335 although I would not recommend it for any reduced loads.