non-toxic deer hunting bullets

[Ballistics in Scotland]

And all Japan for it is to be one of those countries where people are hardly ever killed in hunting accidents or by criminals. That doesn't seem a negligible consideration.

[tomo]

Whiterabbit,
I might need to support only one domestic company that make copper bullets, but I don't know their product is better or not even it looks nice.
I think US companies do great because they have big market and experience. They provide good bullets and at affordable price.



Ballistics in Scotland,
It can be the fact that few guns makes few victims. But I think the gun is laid under American spirit.

[lobowolf761]

lobowolf761, I have never seen Hornady's at local gun shop. But I will ask about it them and try if possible.

The Hornady GMX bullets are a bit pricey but are lead free and have worked very well for me in .243 and .308. I recently purchased some in .323 to work up a load for my 8mm mauser for use as a hunting load. Good luck and great hunting.

[jhalcott]

Tomo, I am in the habit of testing bullets BEFORE I hunt with them. A 2 foot stack of wet newsprint set out at the range you expect to shoot game will tell you a lot about its performance. Its NOT perfect but does give an idea how well the bullet expands(or does not!). It also shows an approximate depth of penetration you will get.

[Whiterabbit]

If I see one more post about societal gun culture, I'm unsubscribing, I hope others do too. I thought this was supposed to be a thread about hunting and shooting lead free bullets.

[Ronnie Dale]

I find this thread fascinating.

I love reading about hunting cultures abroad and up till I saw this post I didn't even realize Japan had one.

Thank you for posting Tomo

[tomo]

lobowolf761, I have only a few options for non-lead bullets here. But I will try Hornady and Nosler someday if possible.

[tomo]

A 2 foot stack of wet newsprint set out at the range you expect to shoot game will tell you a lot about its performance.

Thanks for great idea. I want to check terminal behavior of copper bullets but every shooting ranges here don't permit such a target.
Just a paper target on thin wood board is available.

[Whiterabbit]

lobowolf761, I have only a few options for non-lead bullets here. But I will try Hornady and Nosler someday if possible.

Does ITAR or some such prevent you from mail ordering bullets, particularly from the US? If so, can your dealer mail order from the US for a nominal fee?

What about hand carry? If you happened to be on a plane on a business trip, would that be a no-no?

[tomo]

I love reading about hunting cultures abroad and up till I saw this post I didn't even realize Japan had one.

Thanks for a comment, Ronnie
I do like to see foreign hunting culture too. But it might need different thread.
In Japan, gun-related market is too small and we have only a few choices.
I am happy if I could find nice material for non-toxic bullet casting.

[NavyVet1959]

If I lived in some sort of restrictive environment like that, I suspect that I would be tempted to just buy one of those mini lathes and make my own bullets from copper rods.

[Whiterabbit]

The problem with buying non lead that is castable, is that by the time you get an alloy that is suitably dense, you are at 2000 yen a pound anyways. So the economy is not much better than buying the expanding copper bullets. Then you have to worry about expansion, load development is totally different, terminal ballistics. Typically solved by going to more meplat and more weight, which shortens your range and further reduces the economy.

The way to achieve economy is by using zinc, but casting zinc is a real pain, and again you have very little to go on for load development. All for boolits that are too light again, requiring upsized calibers.

It's a tough game.

I suggest avoiding tin and zinc. Were I to try again, I would go to bismuth. But I can't recommend that for or against due to lack of experience.

[tomo]

Does ITAR or some such prevent you from mail ordering bullets, particularly from the US? If so, can your dealer mail order from the US for a nominal fee?

What about hand carry? If you happened to be on a plane on a business trip, would that be a no-no?

When I buy them personally, I can get import permission from Japan government if I fill some documents and just send facsimile to them.
But online shop in US needs export license to ship bullets, brasses and so on. Of course, some shop has the license but they sell at a price.
I have a chance to visit US frequently but I am not sure that I can carry bullets on board and get back without any problems.

Fortunately, Barnes TTSX costs not so expensive at local gun shop (1 USD/piece) even though there are a few choices.

[Whiterabbit]

I ask because shooter's pro shop is a great source for nosler E-tips. I do not know if they have an export license.

Furthermore, I know that I can buy bullets and travel with them in my carry on luggage within the US. I expect to get hassled by TSA but it is never rejected when I explain that bullets are no different than fishing sinkers. Sometimes I have to open the box to show them it is not loaded ammo. This is also no issue for me. I have done this in Boise and in Portland, travelling to San Jose.

I do not know what hassles you would get in immigration on the Japanese side. How would they even know? Personal use, so I wouldn't declare them. That's me not having any understanding of Japanese law of course.

But I would DEFINITELY ask. Especially if you can have a friend mail order for you so you can take advantage of internet or warehouse pricing.

you don't happen to shoot 7mm, and travel to the SF bay area when you come here, do you? I think I have some 140 gr E-tips lying around....

[tomo]

If I lived in some sort of restrictive environment like that, I suspect that I would be tempted to just buy one of those mini lathes and make my own bullets from copper rods.

Yes! I dreamed that I can use a lathe to make bullets. Before I buy a lathe, I must make more space for it.
Using lathe must be fun that making a lot of designs and talking about it at this forum.

[NavyVet1959]

Yes! I dreamed that I can use a lathe to make bullets. Before I buy a lathe, I must make more space for it.
Using lathe must be fun that making a lot of designs and talking about it at this forum.

Yeah, I understand that your homes tend to be a bit more compact over there. When I was there, I never made it past the bars.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

If I see one more post about societal gun culture, I'm unsubscribing, I hope others do too. I thought this was supposed to be a thread about hunting and shooting lead free bullets.

Oh, post 58 wasn't that bad. It is very hard to distinguish the legal and practical aspects from attitudes Japan is entitled to have.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I ask because shooter's pro shop is a great source for nosler E-tips. I do not know if they have an export license.

Furthermore, I know that I can buy bullets and travel with them in my carry on luggage within the US. I expect to get hassled by TSA but it is never rejected when I explain that bullets are no different than fishing sinkers. Sometimes I have to open the box to show them it is not loaded ammo. This is also no issue for me. I have done this in Boise and in Portland, travelling to San Jose.

I do not know what hassles you would get in immigration on the Japanese side. How would they even know? Personal use, so I wouldn't declare them. That's me not having any understanding of Japanese law of course.

But I would DEFINITELY ask. Especially if you can have a friend mail order for you so you can take advantage of internet or warehouse pricing.

you don't happen to shoot 7mm, and travel to the SF bay area when you come here, do you? I think I have some 140 gr E-tips lying around....

I think there is a difficulty on the US postal export side. I know Buffalo Arms can't export rifle or pistol cases to countries where they are uncontrolled, but did send me some 24ga brass shotgun cases, because the legal situation is different for shotgun components.

[bobob]

I am the author, Robert O. Burgess, M.D., of post # 58.

The topic of this thread, 'non-toxic deer hunting bullets', made me want to read it to see where it led and then came the reference to eagles dieing because they had eaten a meal that had been killed with a lead bullet, said Mr. Tomo. This lead myth came from Rachel Carlson's, "Silent Spring," about 1947, where she trashed DDT and that book caused DDT to be banned in the U.S. DDT kills eagles and thins falcons' eggs she said.

Now the politically correct want to ban all lead.

I thought this site was about cast boolits, lead, antimony, tin. Not toxic lead and eagles.

[tomo]

I think there is a difficulty on the US postal export side. I know Buffalo Arms can't export rifle or pistol cases to countries where they are uncontrolled, but did send me some 24ga brass shotgun cases, because the legal situation is different for shotgun components.

According to a US regulation, shotgun hulls can be exported from the states without any license. But it needs export license to ship rifle-related bullets and cases. They are US side matter. On the other hand, there are no need to have import license at Japan side. Just fill some documents and send facsimile to ministry of trade. that's it.

If I carry them on board with me, I can show my gun license at custom. I don't know whether or not I have a problem when I get out of the US. And I can buy Barnes copper bullets here. Instead of such risks, I want to bring back a bunch of souvenir instead of many boxes of bullets which occupy large part of weight allowed if I have a trip to the US.