Biggest possible .30.06?

[StrawHat]

I used to drink the 45-70 kool aid and while it is a good cartridge, there are certainly better ones. For big animals, the 50-70 hits harder and has a bit less recoil. For smaller stuff, the 405 WCF (or if you want a bolt rifle the 40 Whelen or the 411 Hawk) hits harder and flies flatter than the 45-70.

That said, the 30-06, properly loaded, is suitable for anything on North America. Look at some of the loads for the 220+ grain boolits.

[Moonie]

What was it Colonel Townsend Whelen said? I load my 30-06 from 155gr to 245gr. With 35gr of H4895 that 245gr boolit is moving at 1,950fsp, with its sectional density it will shoot through any animal I'd want to point it at, and it does have a nice flat point and is quite accurate.

[MarkP]

I would consider a 35 cal -- 358 Win, 35 Whelen, 350 Rem Mag. I love my 350 Rem Mag's.

[seaboltm]

9.3x62 and a 30-06 can be rebored by JES

[Dan Cash]

200 to 220 grain paper patched bullet over a healthy dose of 4320, Reloader 19 or similar for a muzzel velocity of 2200 to 2400 fps from your -06 will do any thing in this hemisphere and likely the world. Sectional density of a heavy .30 bullet will enable very deep penetration.
Some counsel bigger diameter but they do recoil and, like you, I find that unpleasant and un necessary. If I were to take my .45-70 Marlin, it would be a black powder load with a 450 grain bullet pushing 1400 fps. Recoil not too bad and power out of proportion to the velocity but range is restricted. Your -06 loaded as above will enable you to easily hit game out to 250 yards.

[dh2]

the biggest in an 06 case would be the 9.3mm x 62mm Mauser what is not to like about a 286gr boolit going 2400FPS, but the 35 whelen is probably easier to deal with as far as getting components for.
and the 45/70 what can't you stop with 405gr. of lead

[Jevyod]

I will throw in my $.02! I recently bought my first 45-70, and I was concerned about the recoil. Turns out it is not as bad as you would think! If you stick with mid-level loads, it is very pleasant to shoot! Far more pleasant that my 7mm Mag!

[rr2241tx]

In a suitably strong action 45/70 is awesome but problematic to get it to feed reliably from anything but a tube magazine. Heavy cast boolits have penetration to spare. If you are going that way, put a .458 barrel on a P-17 and open up the bolt face to hold a .450 Marlin. The .450 Marlin will do everything a 45/70 will do AND feed reliably from a box magazine that is long enough that seating depth is not an issue.

[Lonegun1894]

I have both, and will say that well, it depends on what you want. Either caliber is plenty for anything in North America, but the diference is in how you plan to use it. If you can handle the recoil of either of these two, then the other won't be any problem either, so I wouldn't worry about recoil in the least bit. If you were used to a .22LR only, or a .223 Rem only, then I wouldn't be saying that regarding recoil, but you understand. Now as to how you hunt. I have done a lot of long range shooting, and it is lots of fun, but I prefer to hunt in close. For my uses, a .45-70 is tough to beat, and I use it a lot, but I also use everything else I have and push my limits to see what I am really capable of. I would say, that just due to trajectory, I would recommend the .45-70 if most of your intended use is inside of 150 yds or so, and the .30-06 if you intend to hunt out further. Keep in mind though that with cast, unless you do a lot of work to paper-patch or really work up a good alloy, the vast majority of us keep our .308/.30-06 loads to the 2200-2400fps limit, and many times slower, so the .30-06 doesn't give you nearly as much of an advantage on trajectory using cast as it would if you were sending jacketed rounds down range.

Just did a quick check on the handloads.com calculator and came up with this, and feel free to change the values as you see fit, cause this was just the first thing that came to mind:

First a .308 RN at 2400 fps sighted in at 150yds:

0	2400	-0.5	0	0	3070	0
25	2337	0.65	0.26	0.03	2911	0.5
50	2280	1.41	0.91	0.07	2770	0.71
75	2224	1.74	1.98	0.1	2636	1.06
100	2168	1.63	3.5	0.13	2505	1.56
125	2113	1.06	5.48	0.17	2379	2.2
150	2058	0	7.95	0.21	2257	3.01
175	2005	-1.58	10.93	0.24	2142	3.97
200	1952	-3.69	14.45	0.28	2031	5.1
225	1901	-6.38	18.55	0.32	1926	6.41
250	1850	-9.67	23.25	0.36	1824	7.9
275	1800	-13.6	28.59	0.4	1727	9.57

[Lonegun1894]

Then a 405gr .458" at 1600 fps also sighted in at 150 yds:

0	1600	-0.5	0	0	2302	0
25	1531	2.19	0.54	0.05	2108	0.61
50	1468	3.96	2	0.1	1938	1.15
75	1408	4.72	4.47	0.15	1783	2.05
100	1352	4.37	8.05	0.21	1644	3.33
125	1299	2.83	12.82	0.26	1518	4.99
150	1250	0	18.88	0.32	1405	7.03
175	1205	-4.22	26.33	0.38	1306	9.45
200	1164	-9.94	35.28	0.45	1218	12.26
225	1128	-17.27	45.84	0.51	1144	15.42
250	1096	-26.3	58.1	0.58	1080	18.93
275	1067	-37.15	72.18	0.65	1024	22.76
300	1041	-49.9	88.16	0.72	975	26.89

[Lonegun1894]

If you'll notice the drop figures in the third column, the .30-06 only gets you out an extra 25ish yards before you have to hold high to stay in the kill zone on a deer, but does it with just over half the bullet size and weight as what the .45-70 gives you. So I would choose based on how you hunt, or maybe on if you prefer a specific rifle that is available in one caliber but maybe not the other. Maybe a certain rifle just fits you well. For example, I have a Rem700 in .30-06, and it is comfortable to shoot. My last range session was 100 rounds of full power ammo and it never got uncomfortable. I used to have a MarkX Mauser .30-06, and that thing HURT to fire even one round. It was just a matter or stock shape and how it fit me. So make sure the gun fits you when you shoulder it, and recoil won't be an issue.

[tuckerdog]

if you are comfortable with a heavy 12ga load you will have no problem with a 45/70

[Forgetful]

You should be able to get 2500fps from a cast 220gr in a 30-06. I didn't like the mold offerings in .30 for 200-230gr but I ended up narrowing down on the lyman site and found a nice RN 220gr iron mold.

[Blackcat]

Wow all these options now and they are all looking great!
some of these calibers like the .35-40 Whelen and so on how are they for availability on the shelves ? To throw another monkey wrench in this. How would .454 or .50 alaskan fall into this ?
IM set up for reloading .454 thats why I ask. Ive noticed some of these seem pricey im thinking bush rifle. In the range of 600-1000 dollars.

[Char-Gar]

The 30-06 is a fine rifle for all American game.

The 45-70 is a fine rifle for all American game

It is far easier to hit game past 200 yards with the 30-06 because it shoots much flatter than the 45-70.

This is about all you need to know. Pick a rifle and stick to it and learn your range limitations and adapt your hunting to your limitations. That is all....

I have killed lots of game with both cartridges and I never noticed one killing the animal deader than the other.

[W.R.Buchanan]

+1 on what Char-Gar says. You are over thinking this. Both are probably the most versatile cartridges there is.

Pick one and learn to use it. You can't go wrong either way.

Randy

[Elkins45]

The 35-38 caliber rifles just seem made for cast. Plus, it just seems easier to obtain good performance with bigger cast calibers as opposed to 30 or below. 358 Win or 35 Whelen and the RCBS 35-200 bullet are a VERY strong combination.

[leadman]

I have shoot the Lyman 314299 in my Savage 110DL with a healthy charge of H4350 and gotten excellent accuracy at 100 yards. Velocity was just under 2,600 fps and groups were all around 1 1/2". It takes a hard boolit to do this so it would be best to make softnosed boolits for hunting.
I do think the 35 Whelan would be a great cast boolit shooter but have never shot one. I have shot a 45-70 and it could do what you want in the proper rifle.

[1Shirt]

Like btroj said! A 375 H&H with a 265 gr. HP at 1800 is an awesome bang/flop deer killer.
1Shirt!

[MarkP]

This is a picture of my wildcat --- 300 WSM parent case, necked up to .416, shoulder pushed back to create a long neck, loaded round, 400 gr, 315 gr on right. This is the top rifle in my avatar picture, Rem M SEVEN SS 20" bbl with HS stock 6.25 lbs fully dressed. I wanted to have to have big bore lever gun performance and compactness but in a scoped bolt action rifle. Once the 400 grainers get above 1,800 fps they are not too pleasant shooting from a bench with a T-shirt on. A full case of Trailboss yields 1,325 & 1,450 fps with the 400 & 315 gr which are very nice to shoot.